tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, Hersh said: Yes, he was not trying to help those Republicans in coal country in West Virginia that have benefited from the expansion of Medicaid or that had pre-existing conditions. Obama really wanted it to say that only his base would get these benefits. Seriously, what a load of garbage. He certainly didn't make ACA have a cap on the % increase in premium charges you could have based on age. It certainly didn't make it so that an insurance company could only charge the elderly % more than they charge the very young and and healthy, to shift the burden of insurance for old people. I'm sure the old people white people in this country that will help were staunchly in the Obama camp from 2008-2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, tshile said: "fixed all the problems" basically goes to show you didn't read what i actually said. or what others have said and been saying. i'm actively arguing with you about your "do nothing" stance and your response is to say I think it fixed everything and we should keep it the way it is. like I said - there's no conversation to have here. you wont even acknowledge what was said. Pot- Kettle. You've been the king of strawmen attacks lately. There are obvious good pieces of the ACA. Things that could have simply been passed as laws or regulations without the monstrosity and bureaucratic nightmare that is the ACA. But you seem to be happier deciding to argue what you believe those opposed to are thinking rather than reading and listening to what they are saying. Ironic actually. Just now, Hersh said: Yes, he was not trying to help those Republicans in coal country in West Virginia that have benefited from the expansion of Medicaid or that had pre-existing conditions. Obama really wanted it to say that only his base would get these benefits. Seriously, what a load of garbage. It never occurs to Democrats that people dont WANT Govt to dictate their lives. Even if the Dems think it's for their own good. Even when they continue to lose on those issues at the ballot box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacks 'n' Stuff Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 9 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: Yep. Obamacare fixed all of those problems. All of us arguing against it are ignoring the wonderfulness of the product. As I said. If you're happy with it. Keep it. Didn't we just spend a few posts explicitly stating that this is not what we think? GOP everybody... GOP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 1 minute ago, Kilmer17 said: Pot- Kettle. You've been the king of strawmen attacks lately. There are obvious good pieces of the ACA. Things that could have simply been passed as laws or regulations without the monstrosity and bureaucratic nightmare that is the ACA. But you seem to be happier deciding to argue what you believe those opposed to are thinking rather than reading and listening to what they are saying. Ironic actually. It never occurs to Democrats that people dont WANT Govt to dictate their lives. Even if the Dems think it's for their own good. Even when they continue to lose on those issues at the ballot box. Where have I not acknowledged what you said? I hate the way ACA was passed. I was against it at the time. But I don't see the point in using that to, at our current place in history, argue for doing nothing to let it die. Which is what you're doing. I've been reading and listening to people like you for years. I even asked you questions, which you still haven't answered, but it's my fault you're unable to convince me your opinions on it are good? And then your last sentence just goes further to support what I said. You think it's all about the government dictating your life. It's not. It's about stopping people from gambling on their health, and insurance companies from praying on that willingness, and stopping that from screwing it up for the rest of us. But we can't even talk about it because you think it's government dictating your life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 1 minute ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said: Didn't we just spend a few posts explicitly stating that this is not what we think? GOP everybody... GOP. Were they the same posts that claimed the everyone pooled into the GOP side ignored the good parts of the ACA? Or is only one side allowed to use logical fallacies in their ES arguments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said: Didn't we just spend a few posts explicitly stating that this is not what we think? GOP everybody... GOP. Yup. Then they want to claim the rest of us have some elitist attitude, that we don't care about them or their opinions. High bar we're asking them to meet here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacks 'n' Stuff Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: There are obvious good pieces of the ACA. Things that could have simply been passed as laws or regulations without the monstrosity and bureaucratic nightmare that is the ACA. But you seem to be happier deciding to argue what you believe those opposed to are thinking rather than reading and listening to what they are saying. Well when you say one thing and then come back and say something completely different, you don't get to pretend like you never said the first thing. I know this is a popular GOP mind trick but please know that it doesn't work on anyone other than the willfully ignorant. I can go back and look at Trump say that he was in favor of invading Iraq. I can go read Junior's lies before he was outed and then decided to pretend like he was so transparent and honest. I can scroll up just a few posts and see exactly what you wrote. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 1 minute ago, tshile said: Where have I not acknowledged what you said? I hate the way ACA was passed. I was against it at the time. But I don't see the point in using that to, at our current place in history, argue for doing nothing to let it die. Which is what you're doing. I've been reading and listening to people like you for years. I even asked you questions, which you still haven't answered, but it's my fault you're unable to convince me your opinions on it are good? And then your last sentence just goes further to support what I said. You think it's all about the government dictating your life. It's not. It's about stopping people from gambling on their health, and insurance companies from praying on that willingness, and stopping that from screwing it up for the rest of us. But we can't even talk about it because you think it's government dictating your life. What questions have you asked that didnt start with you claiming I hold a position that I do not? When did you stop beating your wife? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 2 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: What questions have you asked that didnt start with you claiming I hold a position that I do not? When did you stop beating your wife? The tactic of dumb people who can't handle their arguments being torn apart. Continue on making up what others say, while they use your own posts, when you can't handle being exposed as an idiot on a subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, tshile said: The tactic of dumb people who can't handle their arguments being torn apart. Continue on making up what others say, while they use your own posts, when you can't handle being exposed as an idiot on a subject. You're describing exactly what you've been doing right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, Kilmer17 said: You're describing exactly what you've been doing right? Yeah because it's definitely not describing the post i quoted because that's how forums don't work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 1 minute ago, tshile said: Yeah because it's definitely not describing the post i quoted because that's how forums don't work Well at least your not hiding your hypocrisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 (edited) Did it implode yet? Edit: My man JK still fighting the good fight. I feel like some of our resident pseudo-cons could learn from his example. Edited July 14, 2017 by TryTheBeal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 I was a vocal Kasich supporter. Man what could have been........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Kasich was such a good candiate the whole women in the kitchen and other comments were disappointing (if for no other reason than the lack of awareness) but on the whole i liked him health care legislation should be the politicians working together to balance the insurance companies, the healthcare industry, and what is best for the people as consumers of healthcare. instead the legislature is waging war against itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 55 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: It never occurs to Democrats that people dont WANT Govt to dictate their lives. Even if the Dems think it's for their own good. Even when they continue to lose on those issues at the ballot box. This is so laughable. The ACA doesn't dictate people's lives but that's not even the absurd part of your post. The same people you claim don't want government to dictate their lives want government to bring jobs back, they want Trump to give them the health care he promised, and they are angry that Washington doesn't "care" about them. (Which is a contradiction) But go ahead and take the Medicaid expansion away from those people. Give them really crappy health insurance under the guise of government not dictating their lives. Heck, you should be against money to fight the opioid problems cause that's just government dictating their lives. Lastly, high marks from pivoting from Obama didn't really want to help anyone to people don't want the government dictating their lives. Can't wait to read what's next. 13 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: I was a vocal Kasich supporter. Man what could have been........ Why do you support Kasich? He supports Medicaid expansion and fixing the ACA. That's government dictating people's lives. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, Hersh said: This is so laughable. The ACA doesn't dictate people's lives but that's not even the absurd part of your post. The same people you claim don't want government to dictate their lives want government to bring jobs back, they want Trump to give them the health care he promised, and they are angry that Washington doesn't "care" about them. (Which is a contradiction) But go ahead and take the Medicaid expansion away from those people. Give them really crappy health insurance under the guise of government not dictating their lives. Heck, you should be against money to fight the opioid problems cause that's just government dictating their lives. Lastly, high marks from pivoting from Obama didn't really want to help anyone to people don't want the government dictating their lives. Can't wait to read what's next. Sure it does. It absolutely forces people to buy insurance or pay a fine. It absolutely has had a devistating affect on the number of options people have for insurance companies and for doctors that are available and willing to take the insurance they are now forced to carry. I do love the constant jabs from the left at the poor folks in the US. Keep it up. It's working for you. And lastly, in true lib form, you took something I said, changed it ever so slightly to make it sound worse, different etc. Par for the course anymore. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 I paid less than $1000 in penalties over two years for not having insurance that would have cost $800/month with a $6000 deductible. The penalty isn't that onerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said: I paid less than $1000 in penalties over two years for not having insurance that would have cost $800/month with a $6000 deductible. The penalty isn't that onerous. For you maybe. But it's there. Is it possible that for someone else it is onerous? My family insurance has gone up 4000 dollars a year in the last 3 years. It's not through the ACA, but the ACA has played a part in it's rise by forcing competition out of the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 13 minutes ago, Hersh said: Give them really crappy health insurance under the guise of government not dictating their lives. The gop supporters begging for insurance companies to pray on a person's willingness to gamble on their health (even if they only do so because they don't view themselves as having another option) is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 You know, I didn't qualify for the subsidy, but there were policies available. My problem was that as a self employed consultant I didn't have consistent monthly income to pay the premiums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 7 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said: It's not through the ACA, but the ACA has played a part in it's rise by forcing competition out of the market. Is this what you really think? That your health insurance is not "through the ACA"? If so, could you explain what that means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 4 minutes ago, tshile said: The gop supporters begging for insurance companies to pray on a person's willingness to gamble on their health (even if they only do so because they don't view themselves as having another option) is laughable. Do you really think that "gop supporters" share this view? 1 minute ago, tshile said: Is this what you really think? That your health insurance is not "through the ACA"? If so, could you explain what that means? I meant through the exchange. We have an employer provided policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, Kilmer17 said: Do you really think that "gop supporters" share this view? When they advocate for catastrophic plans with high deductibles yes, that's what I think they are doing. And the statistics show that people with those plans are the ones that wind up hurt the most by the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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