PFT and CSN: Grossman Predicts Skins win NFC East

[megared]

I have not had a chance to see the game yet. ( has not aired on the west coast). But all those extra pounds that you were so adamant about did not seem to make a difference. I have not seen any reports that he is winded.

So yea, you still made mountains out of non-existent molehills.

I did not hear of any seismographs going off when Rex entered the stadium.

I still don't get the connection between his performance and his weight. When did I ever imply that it would affect his performance? Nothing Rex does on the field negates the fact that coming into camp needing to lose '5-6 lbs' is not smart, especially for a free agent. His performance in a preseason game doesn't change that.

[Rudechain]

Oh you certainly have implied it quite vociferously.

from post #`155

"Completely agree. Honestly makes me think he's even dumber than I thought. First he comes back from the lockout looking like he went on a 3 month food binge, as a free agent. Second, he hasn't even won the starting job and now he's making predictions...why don't you predict your play? "

from post #173

"More like 15-20. Considering he was a free agent...that's totally unacceptable. He looks like he hasn't been working out. "

from post #185

"And there's been others that are also onsite, that have said he looks like he's gained weight. Why in the world would he admit to needing to lose "5-6 lbs" if he is the same physique????"

from post #196

"He wants to talk about us being better...well what did he personally do this offseason to get better? Doesn't appear to be much...

Football players get paid to be in shape...their biggest asset are their bodies. If he gets an injury that arises from a lack of conditioning, bet the songs and dances will change. Training camp isn't the place for you to get in shape...especially when you're supposed to be competing for a starting spot."

from post #198

"It's not the function of training camp to get players into shape. Especially not a free agent that should've been working out with a new contract in mind. Of course he can lose the weight...but he's wasting his and coaches' time doing something that he should've been doing all offseason. "

"Him working out at players' workouts for a grand total of 9 days over 3 months doesn't negate the fact that he appears to have gained weight. They had 3 in April, 3 in May, and 3 in June. Funny how Trent Williams can decide to skip them but be in better shape when the lockout ends. I would've preferred that to this. "

You were quite vocal about him being over weight, alluding that he was not working out and was out of shape.

Well, he still managed to show up quite well for an out of shape quarterback.

So yes, you have made mountains out of non existent molehills. It's ok to say that maybe you over reacted.

[megared]

You were quite vocal about him being over weight, alluding that he was not working out and was out of shape.

Well, he still managed to show up quite well for an out of shape quarterback.

So yes, you have made mountains out of non existent molehills. It's ok to say that maybe you over reacted.

Not sure what you're even trying to prove at this point. The entire argument has been that Rex predicting us winning the NFC East = not smart. And I said Rex coming into camp overweight (which he admitted) = not smart. Show me one sentence in there where I tied his weight to his performance, or to the hopes and dreams of this franchise. You can't? Exactly.

You ran in here to post his stats without acknowledging the fact that it was a preseason game, against a team that played some of its starters 1 series. We played ours an entire half. I know you and everyone else are excited, but seriously calm the hell down. Pittsburgh had absolutely no incentive to risk losing starters to injury, especially since they're coming off a season where they won the AFC.

[Rudechain]

I just showed you several instances where you stated he was overweight and had not prepared in the off season. You went overboard about his weight. Obviously, his weight played no factor in his performance from what I have read.

Also from what I have read, he had command of the offense, throwing for somewhere around 70% completion percentage.

You don't get those types of numbers if you have not been study the playbook and put some effort into improving.

Yea it was a pre-season game. ( going with that one now to diminish the fact the offense looked crisp and in sync.

You went on an on about his weight. There were a few that stated this is a non-issue. ( just as the prediction was really a non-issue except in the minds of those who make it an issue such as yourself.)

And now your coming out with the "it's a preseason, and they did not have their starters out there excuse.

Welll, I understand that, but also consider the Skins offensive line is pretty new, the defense has several new faces too. And the practice time was very limited.

I will say it again. His weight issue you harped on is NOTHING.

[megared]

I just showed you several instances where you stated he was overweight and had not prepared in the off season. You went overboard about his weight. Obviously, his weight played no factor in his performance from what I have read.

No offense, but to look at a stat sheet and draw sweeping conclusions from it is misguided at best. What the stat sheet doesn't show is that Pittsburgh didn't blitz. They didn't play their starters long. They didn't come into a glorified scrimmage with something to prove after winning the AFC last season. Clark played like 5 snaps, and Polamalu didn't suit up, neither did Harrison.

We've known Rex is capable of performing well at times. His problem is consistency. Past history has shown that he's capable of executing the offense and having good games. Unfortunately it's also shown that he's also capable of having whole games where his QB rating is in the single digits. To extrapolate that he's improved from a half where he faced second stringers for the majority of it is a stretch at best. Rex struggles against pressure, of which he had none yesterday. For all of the yards he threw, we still stalled in the redzone more often than not, and only had 7 points at halftime (should've been 13).

Find me one statement where I indicated that his conditioning would prevent him from completing a half of a preseason game. Also our O-line had one new starter, two, if you count Cooley being out. Our WRs are much improved, just by the fact that we picked up some serviceable vets...but then again Rex faced NO pressure, and the Steelers corners aren't considered elite by any stretch of the imagination.

[Rudechain]

No offense, but to look at a stat sheet and draw sweeping conclusions from it is misguided at best. What the stat sheet doesn't show is that Pittsburgh didn't blitz. They didn't play their starters long. They didn't come into a glorified scrimmage with something to prove after winning the AFC last season. Clark played like 5 snaps, and Polamalu didn't suit up, neither did Harrison.

We've known Rex is capable of performing well at times. His problem is consistency. Past history has shown that he's capable of executing the offense and having good games. Unfortunately it's also shown that he's also capable of having whole games where his QB rating is in the single digits. To extrapolate that he's improved from a half where he faced second stringers for the majority of it is a stretch at best. Rex struggles against pressure, of which he had none yesterday. For all of the yards he threw, we still stalled in the redzone more often than not, and only had 7 points at halftime (should've been 13).

Find me one statement where I indicated that his conditioning would prevent him from completing a half of a preseason game. Also our O-line had one new starter, two, if you count Cooley being out. Our WRs are much improved, just by the fact that we picked up some serviceable vets...but then again Rex faced NO pressure, and the Steelers corners aren't considered elite by any stretch of the imagination.

No, but you were quite vociferous on his being over weight were you not? You were castigating the man and stating he did not prepare, at least in your eyes, for camp and pre-season.

The guy threw for over 200 yards, completing around seventy percent of his passes. From what I have read and heard, he showed command of the offense.

Once again, I will say it. The weight issue is nothing.

Your making mountains out of non-existent molehills.

Now you can go on and on and keep bringing up facts that have nothing to do with what I have stated. It's still not going to change the fact that the supposedly rotund Grossman performed, and his weight was NOT an issue.

Is that so hard to understand?

The coaching staff felt he was in enough shape to play the game. And now your discounting that performance by saying the Pittsburgh corners are not elite. So he has to face elite corners for you to even consider he just might be able to run this offense? Megared, you are one piece of work. By all accounts he and the entire team played well.

Shanahan summed it up pretty well.

"“I thought [Grossman] did a very good job,” Shanahan said. “He managed the game well. He showed a lot of poise in the pocket.”

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/Grossman-127647818.html

His weight is not an issue that you make it out to be. It's that simple, if you can't understand that, then I suspect your really only happy if you can complain about something on the team.

But keep it up, at least it's mildly entertaining.

[megared]

No, but you were quite vociferous on his being over weight were you not? You were castigating the man and stating he did not prepare, at least in your eyes, for camp and pre-season.

The guy threw for over 200 yards, completing around seventy percent of his passes. From what I have read and heard, he showed command of the offense.

Once again, I will say it. The weight issue is nothing.

Your making mountains out of non-existent molehills.

Now you can go on and on and keep bringing up facts that have nothing to do with what I have stated. It's still not going to change the fact that the supposedly rotund Grossman performed, and his weight was NOT an issue.

Is that so hard to understand?

The coaching staff felt he was in enough shape to play the game. And now your discounting that performance by saying the Pittsburgh corners are not elite. So he has to face elite corners for you to even consider he just might be able to run this offense? Megared, you are one piece of work. By all accounts he and the entire team played well.

Shanahan summed it up pretty well.

"“I thought [Grossman] did a very good job,” Shanahan said. “He managed the game well. He showed a lot of poise in the pocket.”

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/Grossman-127647818.html

His weight is not an issue that you make it out to be. It's that simple, if you can't understand that, then I suspect your really only happy if you can complain about something on the team.

But keep it up, at least it's mildly entertaining.

So again, it's an extrapolation...and a pretty large stretch to draw from a half of preseason. LeBeau doesn't use blitz packages in preseason. After Clark went down, and Ike Taylor broke his thumb, Tomlin had no interest in risking anymore of his players' health...because they have nothing to prove. If they came out in midseason form, and blitzed the hell out of us and showed everything, their record would still be the same as ours...0-0.

Everyone knows Pittsburgh's secondary is based on their safety play. Pittburgh's defense isn't based on shutdown corners preventing plays. It's about their pressure forcing QBs into mistakes. It's about Polamalu flying around the field like a madman. It's about Harrison wreaking havoc. None of those components were present yesterday. Without just Polamalu, they aren't even an elite defense...

It's still a strawman argument. There's a difference between being prepared altogether and being as prepared as you can possibly be. Grossman having a decent half against a team that didn't blitz him, as well as one that had no interest in playing its starters beyond the first series isn't even relevant to that discussion. There's no implications in there about his conditioning. He didn't have to run, and furthermore he didn't even have to move around the pocket to adjust to pressure. It still doesn't excuse him coming into camp needing to lose '5-6' lbs, especially not as a free agent. Nowhere did I mention that having implications on his performance, but it's still a 'stupid' thing for a professional athlete to do. And it's equally stupid to predict your team to finish atop the NFC East when they've finished last the past 3 seasons.

I think maybe you're drawing hope from a preseason game...and for your sake and anyone else's I've got to advise against it. You're setting yourself up to be disappointed. We should look for improvement in a month...not cling onto preseason games like they mean anything

[Rudechain]

There you go again. Why is this a moving target for you? We all know preseason is vanilla. We all know that complex schemes are not involved. You discount the performance because first it was not against "elite" corners and now because the starters were not in the whole time. By all accounts, they did well. No penalties and no sacks are pretty good in my book. But apparently it's not quite enough for you.

The whole premise of our correspondance was you were stating he was over weight. I stated, as did others, that it was not a big deal. But go on and keep up castigating the man because I am sure it makes you feel better.

Nobody on the team seems worried about his weight.

You are just incorrigible and your inane diatribes have grown tiresome. You have yet to provide anything substantive in relation to the discussion.

And for the record, my expectations are for the team to compete with tenacity and intensity every minute of every game. I expect for them to show improvement as the season goes on. Following the team is a hobby, and I don't need nor want to expend negative energy on a hobby.

You however, seem to look at things differently. More power to you, if that's what makes you happy. I just think expending negative energy is a fruitless endeavor. You apparently, have not learned that lesson. I sincerely hope one day you do realize it, because it's really a waste of time.

[The Dude]

200+ yards in a half against one of the best defenses in football. And Shanahan intentionally let up on the gas in the 2nd half in order not to embarrass them. The Skins should have very little competition for the NFC East crown.

[cweed15]

I think you are taking this the wrong way man. Honestly, I think this was a huge win for our boys. Who cares if all their starters didn't play and some didnt play very long. This is about building experience on the field within this system, especially for the youngsters. They went out there and played harder and with more heart than I have seen the redskins have in a long time, and it brought them home a win. Yeah, so we're still 0-0, but this gives the team confidence in their ability to play as a team and win as a team. You can't take that away from them. We're building a team with a strong core, and surely this win only continues to tighten that bond.

[megared]

---------- Post added August-13th-2011 at 11:53 AM ----------

There you go again. Why is this a moving target for you? We all know preseason is vanilla. We all know that complex schemes are not involved. You discount the performance because first it was not against "elite" corners and now because the starters were not in the whole time. By all accounts, they did well. No penalties and no sacks are pretty good in my book. But apparently it's not quite enough for you.

The whole premise of our correspondance was you were stating he was over weight. I stated, as did others, that it was not a big deal. But go on and keep up castigating the man because I am sure it makes you feel better.

Nobody on the team seems worried about his weight.

You are just incorrigible and your inane diatribes have grown tiresome. You have yet to provide anything substantive in relation to the discussion.

And for the record, my expectations are for the team to compete with tenacity and intensity every minute of every game. I expect for them to show improvement as the season goes on. Following the team is a hobby, and I don't need nor want to expend negative energy on a hobby.

You however, seem to look at things differently. More power to you, if that's what makes you happy. I just think expending negative energy is a fruitless endeavor. You apparently, have not learned that lesson. I sincerely hope one day you do realize it, because it's really a waste of time.

I'm not the one that dug up an old thread based upon one half of a preseason game I didn't even watch. I didn't say anything beyond the fact that Rex coming into camp not completely physically prepared is stupid. I made no predictions of his play, or implied that we're doomed. And this is coming from someone that wants him to win the starting job. Rex performed well, but take it for what it is. Shanahan approached the game different from Tomlin. I'm more happy we didn't suffer any injuries, because thats something that would've affected the regular season.

The offense executed against the Cowboys with Rex. Why are we acting like this is some breakthrough? It'll be more interesting September 11th, when we face a formidable d-line and Rex faces pressure. More importantly, the games will mean something.

[Rudechain]

---------- Post added August-13th-2011 at 11:53 AM ----------

I'm not the one that dug up an old thread based upon one half of a preseason game I didn't even watch. I didn't say anything beyond the fact that Rex coming into camp not completely physically prepared is stupid. I made no predictions of his play, or implied that we're doomed. And this is coming from someone that wants him to win the starting job. Rex performed well, but take it for what it is. Shanahan approached the game different from Tomlin. I'm more happy we didn't suffer any injuries, because thats something that would've affected the regular season.

The offense executed against the Cowboys with Rex. Why are we acting like this is some breakthrough? It'll be more interesting September 11th, when we face a formidable d-line and Rex faces pressure. More importantly, the games will mean something.

sigh, Ok, I will try this one more time with you. And I hope that you actually think about the ENTIRE CONTEXT of our conversation.

YOU were the one complaining about the weight right?

I and others said that's it's not really a big deal. He played well in the time he was given, and showed NO ILL EFFECTS of that weight gain.

If you can't comprehend that, then there is simply no help for you...

And this thread was started FOUR DAYS AGO. Just what is your criteria for old?

It's cool though, we all are fans and want our team to win. But you are sadly mistaken about his weight and that was the whole premise of our conversation. Not about starters playing, not about "elite corners", not about how much they played.

[megared]

sigh, Ok, I will try this one more time with you. And I hope that you actually think about the ENTIRE CONTEXT of our conversation.

YOU were the one complaining about the weight right?

I and others said that's it's not really a big deal. He played well in the time he was given, and showed NO ILL EFFECTS of that weight gain.

If you can't comprehend that, then there is simply no help for you...

And this thread was started FOUR DAYS AGO. Just what is your criteria for old?

It's cool though, we all are fans and want our team to win. But you are sadly mistaken about his weight and that was the whole premise of our conversation. Not about starters playing, not about "elite corners", not about how much they played.

Again I never linked his weight gain to the performance of the team...so you're looking for a connection that doesn't exist.

You "read and heard" about a half of football and tried to up this thread in a "told you so" manner. How does anything you wrote change the fact that coming into camp needing to lose weight as a free agent stupid?

You alluded to this game as some kind of evidence, despite not watching it and disregarding the fact that it's the damn preseason.

[Spunkush]

I think the main thing to look at was his accuracy and compare him to what other QBs were doing in preseason, he looked better than most who were also Playin vanilla defenses and 2nd stringers

[rockma2018]

So again, it's an extrapolation...and a pretty large stretch to draw from a half of preseason. LeBeau doesn't use blitz packages in preseason. After Clark went down, and Ike Taylor broke his thumb, Tomlin had no interest in risking anymore of his players' health...because they have nothing to prove. If they came out in midseason form, and blitzed the hell out of us and showed everything, their record would still be the same as ours...0-0.

Everyone knows Pittsburgh's secondary is based on their safety play. Pittburgh's defense isn't based on shutdown corners preventing plays. It's about their pressure forcing QBs into mistakes. It's about Polamalu flying around the field like a madman. It's about Harrison wreaking havoc. None of those components were present yesterday. Without just Polamalu, they aren't even an elite defense...

It's still a strawman argument. There's a difference between being prepared altogether and being as prepared as you can possibly be. Grossman having a decent half against a team that didn't blitz him, as well as one that had no interest in playing its starters beyond the first series isn't even relevant to that discussion. There's no implications in there about his conditioning. He didn't have to run, and furthermore he didn't even have to move around the pocket to adjust to pressure. It still doesn't excuse him coming into camp needing to lose '5-6' lbs, especially not as a free agent. Nowhere did I mention that having implications on his performance, but it's still a 'stupid' thing for a professional athlete to do. And it's equally stupid to predict your team to finish atop the NFC East when they've finished last the past 3 seasons.

I think maybe you're drawing hope from a preseason game...and for your sake and anyone else's I've got to advise against it. You're setting yourself up to be disappointed. We should look for improvement in a month...not cling onto preseason games like they mean anything

I believe at least the Redskins are making good process in building the teams up. I know that the preseason games don't really mean anything but it shows that we are better than we were in the last 5 season. So look for a better season better attitudes and no more distraction from unwanted players that don't wont to be here in our organization. Even though Pittsburgh didn't blitz that often help balance us out to see what we need to work on. So don't be hating on my Redskins with your proclaim matters saying that we are setting ourselves up for failure. Because the sky is the limit for a good season.

[Rudechain]

Again I never linked his weight gain to the performance of the team...so you're looking for a connection that doesn't exist.

You "read and heard" about a half of football and tried to up this thread in a "told you so" manner. How does anything you wrote change the fact that coming into camp needing to lose weight as a free agent stupid?

You alluded to this game as some kind of evidence, despite not watching it and disregarding the fact that it's the damn preseason.

Ok, you win. I guess your argument should show Shanny and Allen that Grossman does not care about playing the QB position or is not serious about it.

Again, you were the one who was making a big deal about his weight. Is that correct? We can go back through this thread and take a look at exactly what you said.

And once again, myself and others stated it's not a big deal. " I recall you responding to someone "5 or 6 pounds, more like 15 or 20." And how he should have come into camp in shape.

I agree he should have arrived in shape, but his little weight gain was no big deal. Are you with me so far? We can go back through the thread and look at exactly what was said.

His first real test, even though it's a pre-season game, it's still something to measure with. Other than training camp, and player's only practice, that's all we have to go on. Is this a fair assumption?

So you discount the performance for some reason or another. And no I have not been able to actually watch the game but I do know how to read, and I am able to scour the web to find news about the game last night. So based on these basic abilities, I was able to surmise that Grossman performed well, above some people's expectations, and there was not one shred of new's coverage that his weight gain prohibited him from playing like he did. Even though it was not against "elite" corners, he managed to throw for over two hundred yards, no interceptions and one touchdown.

And yes, I came back into this thread to counter your argument about his weight gain.

So once again, the weight has not made a difference. That's what I have said time and again. You have yet to prove that it makes a difference. Do you understand?

[megared]

Ok, you win. I guess your argument should show Shanny and Allen that Grossman does not care about playing the QB position or is not serious about it.

Again, you were the one who was making a big deal about his weight. Is that correct? We can go back through this thread and take a look at exactly what you said.

And once again, myself and others stated it's not a big deal. " I recall you responding to someone "5 or 6 pounds, more like 15 or 20." And how he should have come into camp in shape.

I agree he should have arrived in shape, but his little weight gain was no big deal. Are you with me so far? We can go back through the thread and look at exactly what was said.

His first real test, even though it's a pre-season game, it's still something to measure with. Other than training camp, and player's only practice, that's all we have to go on. Is this a fair assumption?

So you discount the performance for some reason or another. And no I have not been able to actually watch the game but I do know how to read, and I am able to scour the web to find news about the game last night. So based on these basic abilities, I was able to surmise that Grossman performed well, above some people's expectations, and there was not one shred of new's coverage that his weight gain prohibited him from playing like he did. Even though it was not against "elite" corners, he managed to throw for over two hundred yards, no interceptions and one touchdown.

And yes, I came back into this thread to counter your argument about his weight gain.

So once again, the weight has not made a difference. That's what I have said time and again. You have yet to prove that it makes a difference. Do you understand?

So we're clear we agree: Grossman shouldn't have come into camp needing to lose weight. Not once did I ever say that his weight would impact his performance or hinder him from reading coverages (how would it???) . As a free agent it was a dumb decision on his part. If his weight was a hindrance, do you really think Shanahan would've re-signed him? Or that he would've passed his physical?

You're harping on the pittsburg preseason game like it's an indicator of anything...and I don't agree that it is. By you running back to this thread like a preseason game proves something about his fitness makes me question whether you even believe yourself. Playing a half doesn't change that. What'd you think...that I thought he was going to step on the field and instantly blow out an ACL?

[tiger187126]

So we're clear we agree: Grossman shouldn't have come into camp needing to lose weight. Not once did I ever say that his weight would impact his performance or hinder him from reading coverages (how would it???) . As a free agent it was a dumb decision on his part. If his weight was a hindrance, do you really think Shanahan would've re-signed him? Or that he would've passed his physical?

You're harping on the pittsburg preseason game like it's an indicator of anything...and I don't agree that it is. By you running back to this thread like a preseason game proves something about his fitness makes me question whether you even believe yourself. Playing a half doesn't change that. What'd you think...that I thought he was going to step on the field and instantly blow out an ACL?

never doubt the dragon.

hell fred davis lost 15 lbs and he's playing worse. maybe grossman is just on to something and you're just too jealous to see it.

[megared]

never doubt the dragon.

hell fred davis lost 15 lbs and he's playing worse. maybe grossman is just on to something and you're just too jealous to see it.

Hows Fred Davis playing worse? Because of one drop?