SG: Redskins May Need A Nose Tackle More Than They Need A QB

[Conn]

Where are NTs usually taken in the draft?

It really depends on the quality of the player, but I'd say usually mid-late first, for the really good ones. A flawed, but still good, prospect (like Cody last year) can drop pretty far in the 2nd.

[BKSkinsFan]

This may be a good place to make some aware that Ngata as much as he's touted is actually the Ravens starting DT, Kelly Gregg is their NT. I noticed this recently, they actually list Ngata as a DT but he plays the DE in the 3-4 alignment with Suggs typically rushing from that side. Kind of makes you wonder why Haynesworth wasn't able to play a similar role with Rak rushing on his side.

[VTskins21]

He played well against one of the best OLs in the NFL with the Giants

well to be fair bryant was completely fresh at that point of the season where as the giants oline had played a full season.

Also im not sure but wasnt giants 1st string C injured early?

I loved how he played but as of now he just looks like a rotational player. Especially at that weight

[The Tris]

Bryant's good but I still prefer a blue chip prospect, either our 1st or 2nd rounder should be used for this position. I'd love to have more draft picks, but hey, we can't assume we'll find partners.

What blue chip NT have the Jets have for most of the past two seasons?

[Enter Apotheosis]

This may be a good place to make some aware that Ngata as much as he's touted is actually the Ravens starting DT, Kelly Gregg is their NT. I noticed this recently, they actually list Ngata as a DT but he plays the DE in the 3-4 alignment with Suggs typically rushing from that side. Kind of makes you wonder why Haynesworth wasn't able to play a similar role with Rak rushing on his side.

Gregg (drafted in the 6th round, just FYI) is also a damn fine NT and their best front is with both him and Ngata on the field at the same time. Ngata still does rotate in at the nose, though, and he is equally devastating there as he is pretty much anywhere they line him up.

Haynesworth is physically capable of being one of the most dominant 3-4 DEs in the league. He simply is not disciplined enough to warrant taking any more snaps for us at any position on the field.

What blue chip NT have the Jets have for most of the past two seasons?

Sione Pouha (late 3rd round draft pick, taken when the Jets were still a 4-3 team).

[jflow78]

So, tell me if I'm wrong, but since NTs are normally selected in the late first round or later, can't we still address this issue while using a QB for the top pick?

If not, then I still say go QB if there's one that we like. If there's no QB, then I hope like heck someone wants to trade back and then we can take BPA or the best NT or whatever, but if we like one of the QBs, why not take one of those at #10 and take the best NT in the 2nd where they're normally picked up anyway?

Then, we get both, no?

1st Gabbert or Locker or whoever they like

2nd Powe

[Enter Apotheosis]

So, tell me if I'm wrong, but since NTs are normally selected in the late first round or later, can't we still address this issue while using a QB for the top pick?

If not, then I still say go QB if there's one that we like. If there's no QB, then I hope like heck someone wants to trade back and then we can take BPA or the best NT or whatever, but if we like one of the QBs, why not take one of those at #10 and take the best NT in the 2nd where they're normally picked up anyway?

Then, we get both, no?

In theory, yes. It is also theoretically possible that we take a NT with our first pick and a QB with our second or take neither positions with either pick. It all strongly depends on how the Skins have the players available in this draft graded out, who falls to us, and what our potential trade options are.

[jflow78]

In theory, yes. It is also theoretically possible that we take a NT with our first pick and a QB with our second or take neither positions with either pick. It all strongly depends on how the Skins have the players available in this draft graded out, who falls to us, and what our potential trade options are.

Well, this entire discussion is pointless if we're basing it off of what we know as fact, because no one on this forum, and probably no one in the Skins FO knows who they're going to take with any of their picks at this point. They probably don't even know for sure which player they would like with the 1st yet. So, since everything we're saying here is hypothetical, why not go QB 1st, NT 2nd (or later), since traditionally, thats where they generally get taken.

The more I read about Powe, the more I like the guy, and we could probably have him in the 2nd easy.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=66151&draftyear=2011&genpos=DT

[Soup]

The land shark from ole Miss

POWE!!

Pick that guy up in the second

[The Tris]

Sione Pouha (late 3rd round draft pick, taken when the Jets were still a 4-3 team).

Precisely.

[smakpo]

NT is important, I completely agree, however I actually believe it's MORE important for them to upgrade at linebacker. Plain and simple the 3-4 adds another linebacker to the field, and this season we only had 3 worthy starters on the roster. Rocky Mac looked awful in the new scheme, Andre Carter proved once again he cannot play outside LB, and as much as I like Lorenzo Alexander he was exposed on the outside as well.

If you look at every great 3-4, they have ELITE linebackers. Pitt has Harrison, Woodley, Timmons, and Farrior. Bmore has McClain, Suggs, Lewis. Jets with Thomas, Scott, Harris, and Pace. Packers have Hawk and Matthews.

I will readily admit you need a good d-line to make these guys effective, however I think our d-line is actually in better shape than our linebackers. 2 starters, Orakpo and Fletcher, that's it .. that is all we have. In a scheme that demands elite, you can NOT get away with having 2 out of the 4 pieces. I'm sticking with my dream plan of getting Woodley and Harris from the Jets, Bethea from Indy, and Hoke at NT from Pitt.

This.

LB is the biggest hole on the team right now IMO. Unfortunately, this seems to be a LB-thin draft.

[HigSkin]

Mike Martin (Michigan) is going to be a Jay Ratliff type guy. If he declares, they have him as a 4th/5th round pick and would love it if the Skins grabbed him.

University of Michigan defensive tackle Mike Martin (6'2", 300lbs) is a prized underclassman who is a disruptive force against the run with loads of potential. Martin has incredible strength -- he can bench over 500 lbs. and squats 700 lbs. There are few defensive tackle prospects who can explode off the line like Martin is able to. He run a 4.9 40; for a defensive tackle, that's a quality time.

[mcgraw238]

Do we only have 1 pick in the entire draft that makes this an either/or discussion? When did this happen? Vinny must have snuck into the building and unloaded all our picks. And to think they changed Coach Gibbs key card immediately.

[GaryGreenMonk]

Bryant is probably good depth.. but NT is one of the most important positions in a 3-4 and we need a stud there.

We also need a ILB, DE, and FS more than a QB.

[Soup]

Mike Martin (Michigan) is going to be a Jay Ratliff type guy. If he declares, they have him as a 4th/5th round pick and would love it if the Skins grabbed him.

University of Michigan defensive tackle Mike Martin (6'2", 300lbs) is a prized underclassman who is a disruptive force against the run with loads of potential. Martin has incredible strength -- he can bench over 500 lbs. and squats 700 lbs. There are few defensive tackle prospects who can explode off the line like Martin is able to. He run a 4.9 40; for a defensive tackle, that's a quality time.

Trust me Higskin you don't want anything to do with anything on Michigans defense. That front three were horrible to watch this season. They run this 3-3-5 defense, that made the redskins defense look like the jets. I saw almost every team drive up and down the field on them. Even though Martin is a hard worker and I really like his leadership, the guy gets pushed around way too much to be a Nose Tackle. Maybe he can become a solid 4-3 DT in the NFL but I doubt it.

[tdigle]

We def need a NT. I wanted us to draft Raji that year but he was gone before our pick. Bryant is good but we need elite. That Fairley kid from Auburn is a beast. He may be a lil small to be a NT though im not sure

I'm all with you on Fairley, hombre. Too bad the chances of him lasting past the 6th are slim-to-none.

[daveakl]

LB in 1st

NT in 2nd

[elkabong82]

I just don't see a good NT prospect likely to fall to us at 10. If Shanny thinks Mallet, Gabbert, or Newton is his guy, he'll get him at 10 if that one falls to us. Otherwise I wouldn't be surprised if we took Von Miller at OLB and moved Zo inside. Out of who is likely to be there, I just don't see a pick other than QB/OLB/DE/WR being worth it. I think our interior OL is the most in need of new players, but if we draft Julio Jones at 10 I wouldn't have any qualms, he's a big guy with success in the SEC who can move the chains for us.

[The Tris]

I just don't see a good NT prospect likely to fall to us at 10. If Shanny thinks Mallet, Gabbert, or Newton is his guy, he'll get him at 10 if that one falls to us. Otherwise I wouldn't be surprised if we took Von Miller at OLB and moved Zo inside. Out of who is likely to be there, I just don't see a pick other than QB/OLB/DE/WR being worth it. I think our interior OL is the most in need of new players, but if we draft Julio Jones at 10 I wouldn't have any qualms, he's a big guy with success in the SEC who can move the chains for us.

This perfectly sums up my feelings on this draft, right down to Miller and Jones as solid targets. Add Cameron Jordan in there, and those are the guys (or positions) we need to take if QB is not in play.

[HigSkin]

Trust me Higskin you don't want anything to do with anything on Michigans defense. That front three were horrible to watch this season. They run this 3-3-5 defense, that made the redskins defense look like the jets. I saw almost every team drive up and down the field on them. Even though Martin is a hard worker and I really like his leadership, the guy gets pushed around way too much to be a Nose Tackle. Maybe he can become a solid 4-3 DT in the NFL but I doubt it.

Fair enough but wasn't he banged up the last 4-5 games? I mentioned him because he's a low round prospect.

[GaryGreenMonk]

LB in 1st

NT in 2nd

I agree in order of priority...

however.. a top 10 LB is just not available in this draft... NT is also a tough look in this draft.. you need a stud NT in a 3-4..

there are a lot of top 15 DE's though and a couple that are similar to Orakpo as a DE/OLB in Von Miller and Ryan Kerrigan.

I say we end up DE then LB and address NT in FA

Newton and Locker are both wild cards though... it's hard to tell whether MS will want to try to take a stab at QB this year or wait til next. I hope next if it's a top QB pick.

This year I'm personally hoping for DE, LB, LB, FS, Andy Dalton (QB out of TCU), WR, WR

[Fieldy]

How bout we do the RIGHT thing and use our first round draft pick on another O-Tackle. Bookend offensive tackles for the next 10 years is the way you start building a dominant offense. Once the offensive line is fixed, and we have a good defense again, a blue-chip rookie QB should be able to step in and have success.

As evidence I present:

Joe Flacco

Matt Ryan

Mark Sanchez

Aaron Rodgers

Sam Bradford (though not a playoff QB he certainly had a successful first season)

On the other side of the coin you have:

Every "blue chip can't miss" QB drafted as the "savior" by this and any other franchise that didn't have the majority of the other pieces in place.

---------- Post added January-10th-2011 at 08:13 PM ----------

I agree in order of priority...

however.. a top 10 LB is just not available in this draft... NT is also a tough look in this draft.. you need a stud NT in a 3-4..

there are a lot of top 15 DE's though and a couple that are similar to Orakpo as a DE/OLB in Von Miller and Ryan Kerrigan.

I say we end up DE then LB and address NT in FA

Newton and Locker are both wild cards though... it's hard to tell whether MS will want to try to take a stab at QB this year or wait til next. I hope next if it's a top QB pick.

This year I'm personally hoping for DE, LB, LB, FS, Andy Dalton (QB out of TCU), WR, WR

Just out of curiosity...do you really think the offensive line (and that side of the ball in general) is in such good shape that we shouldn't draft any offensive players until the 5th round? or am I misreading your post?

[Soup]

Fair enough but wasn't he banged up the last 4-5 games? I mentioned him because he's a low round prospect.

He was hurt almost the entire season with nagging injuries, I believe

I actually felt sorry for the guy because you see him try to be a leader and pump up the defense. One thing is for sure the guy has a lot of heart. It didn't matter if they were out of the game. He would fight for everything.

It might also be because he didn't have the surrounding cast to help him. You don't need a genius to figure out how to run on Michigan. They would double team Martin and run right up the middle. It was a pretty bad defense. When they replayed the highlights, you could see how easily they Moved Martin out of the way. It was obvious most teams gameplanned focusing on him because the rest of their defense sucked, really really bad. I'm not a michigan fan but even I was pulling my hair out watching that defense.

He would have to produce an amazing combine to even get a look IMO, I think he's a 7th- FA player.

You can pull up almost any game this season and you'll see what I'm talking about.

I think scouts will look at him more as a 4-3 DT. He might be a solid fit in a 4-3 defense.

[elkabong82]

Fieldy: I don't think there's a top 10 OT in this draft, at least so far based on ratings and mocks. Pl, Brown started looking better later in the season, he came off major surgery that usualy takes a season to shake off, so he could be better for us next season.

[21Knock_U_Out]

IMO I think ILB is a more need position than NT. Lets face it, Fletcher is almost done (i love the guy though) and Rocky will be out of here. I would love to have a Ray Lewis or Patrick Willis in the middle.