Republicans voting againt 9-11 responders health bill.

[Kilmer17]

You keep saying this, but this is the third time the Bill has come around and it's been working its way through Congress for over a year. So, this isn't a slapped together bill that no one's had time to review or put their input into. Where are you hearing this "last minute" stuff?

"Their hearts are in a good place. Their heads [are] not in a good place,” Coburn said of the bill’s supporters. “We can do this next year, and we should.”

“This is a bill,” he said, “that’s been drawn up and forced through Congress at the end of the year on a basis to solve a problem that we didn't have time to solve and we didn't get done.”

Coburn doesnt oppose helping 9/11 1st responders. He's been clear in his support to do so. What he wants is proper oversight, proper procedures being used and fiscal restraint if the bill duplicates funding already allocated.

[Burgold]

"Their hearts are in a good place. Their heads [are] not in a good place,” Coburn said of the bill’s supporters. “We can do this next year, and we should.”

“This is a bill,” he said, “that’s been drawn up and forced through Congress at the end of the year on a basis to solve a problem that we didn't have time to solve and we didn't get done.”

Coburn doesnt oppose helping 9/11 1st responders. He's been clear in his support to do so. What he wants is proper oversight, proper procedures being used and fiscal restraint if the bill duplicates funding already allocated.

My instinct is to claim BS. Coburn has had over a year to respond and make his complaints known and get them adjusted. There are Bills that people try to ram through. This isn't an example of one. This is an example of one that has been stonewalled repeatedly and is being given one last ditch chance to get something done now.

One other thought based on having spent too many hours in emergency rooms and nursing homes. If someone is seriously ill and in need of attention and support... waiting a year or six months makes an enormous difference. For example, what's the difference between treating cancer when it is first identified or waiting six months before beginning treatment. So, I don't buy his argument... if he believes that it will get done and it has been floating around for a long, long time... Get it done.

[Tulane Skins Fan]

I get it TSF, any oppostion in your mind is going to be crap.

Coburn provides specific reasons. You might not agree with them, but they are clear and easy to see.

The Dems want to jam this through at the last minute without going through the usual procedures because they want the political benefit, not the actual bill. If they really wanted this Bill, it would have been done months ago if not last year.

---------- Post added December-22nd-2010 at 11:15 AM ----------

Which is EXACTLY what the Dems are doing and the real reason they are going about this the way they are.

Wait, wait, wait.

I went and read the explanation. The explanation was that he doesn't like the cost, and he basically called it a handout program that he could not support. Is there something else? Or are you just going to say, "no there are reasons."

Now, the procedural reasons you are raising, are absolutely not something I would consider "legitimate." Either you are for or against the bill. Its not a brand new idea. This bill has been lurking for months. Get off your ass, read the bill, and take a vote on it.

So, I am asking, what are the "legitimate reasons" for opposition that you are talking about? Cost appears to be the only one. (And I consider the cost "argument" to be embarassing in this situation.)

[The Evil Genius]

So, I am asking, what are the "legitimate reasons" for opposition that you are talking about? Cost appears to be the only one. (And I consider the cost "argument" to be embarassing in this situation.)

Especially when the same party who claims heartburn on the bill over the costs has no problem voting for a continuation handouts to the "rich".

j/k

I think we should stop pretending though. To me, the ONLY reason that the GOP votes against this is because it's a D sponsored bill that makes the D's look more "American".

The GOP can't trump out the tired "look we are more American" rally cry and all the other 9/11 references if this bill passes. It's a total loss of political capital they have had for the past 9 years. And they don't want to cede it.

[Tulane Skins Fan]

Especially when the same party who claims heartburn on the bill over the costs has no problem voting for a continuation handouts to the "rich".

j/k

I think we should stop pretending though. To me, the ONLY reason that the GOP votes against this is because it's a D sponsored bill that makes the D's look more "American".

The GOP can't trump out the tired "look we are more American" rally cry and all the other 9/11 references if this bill passes. It's a total loss of political capital they have had for the past 9 years. And they don't want to cede it.

Exactly. The "politics" of this are that republicans want to pass it when they have control of the House, so they can say "why did Dems not pass this after two years of congressional control?" That's the only reason.

[The Evil Genius]

Looks like the bill might get passed now, albeit 2 billion less.

After a last-minute compromise, the Senate passed legislation Wednesday to provide up to $4.2 billion in new aid to survivors of the September 2001 terrorism attack on the World Trade Center and responders who became ill working in its ruins.

A House vote was expected on the bill within hours as lawmakers raced to wrap up their work for the year.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101222/ap_on_go_co/us_congress_health_attacks

The compromise was reached after Democrats scheduled a showdown test vote for Wednesday afternoon and Republicans countered by threatening to run a 30-hour clock before allowing final Senate and House votes on the bill. That would have required keeping both the Senate and House in session for votes on Christmas Eve.

Backers worried that the bill would face a much tougher fight in the new, more fiscally conservative Congress where Republicans will have a stronger hand.

"Any single senator can hold this up way past Christmas and we know that can kill the bill," Schumer said on MSNBC's "Morning Joe" program Wednesday.

[aREDSKIN]

That was my point in the prior thread bout this bill. $7.6 billion for 10k responders?? That just makes no sense. If you go and read the bill & amendments it looks more like a federal jobs bill with all the "programs", committees, monitoring, research and reports mandated in it. IMO this "bill" will get done but on a much smaller in scope & scale. If it's for the first responders then limit it for the first responders.

.

"The deal lowered the price tag of the bill to $4.3 billion -- about $2 billion less than an earlier version. It will authorize a health benefits program for five years, while placing several restrictions on how the money is doled out."

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/12/22/key-test-vote-senate-health/

Man do we have some smart & insightful people here in the ES tailgate.

[Tulane Skins Fan]

"The deal lowered the price tag of the bill to $4.3 billion -- about $2 billion less than an earlier version. It will authorize a health benefits program for five years, while placing several restrictions on how the money is doled out."

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/12/22/key-test-vote-senate-health/

Man do we have some smart & insightful people here in the ES tailgate.

did you just quote yourself and casually refer to your post as smart & insightful?

[JimboDaMan]

did you just quote yourself and casually refer to your post as smart & insightful?

He sure did. I wonder if he bothered to learn what items were removed from the bill before declaring his shrewdness.

[aREDSKIN]

did you just quote yourself and casually refer to your post as smart & insightful?

[oisn1]

I'm glad this bill has passed in some form, and I hope it provides the 9/11 responders with some comfort in their lives as they deserve it. I hope the reduced price and timeline is enough though I worry about what happens to those with illnesses, such as cancer and chronic pain, that last over 5 years.

Kudos to Congressional leadership for hashing something out so these people can get some help.

Since this was passed, I'll forgive you Kilmer for ignoring my entire post that destroyed your argument (that you continued to make to other people). I regretted making that post right away though because I knew that you would "cleverly" ignore it to continue your baseless posting, willfully ignorant of the fact that you looked like a fool.

[Kilmer17]

Sounds like a fair compromise to me.

---------- Post added December-22nd-2010 at 04:49 PM ----------

I'm glad this bill has passed in some form, and I hope it provides the 9/11 responders with some comfort in their lives as they deserve it. I hope the reduced price and timeline is enough though I worry about what happens to those with illnesses, such as cancer and chronic pain, that last over 5 years.

Kudos to Congressional leadership for hashing something out so these people can get some help.

Since this was passed, I'll forgive you Kilmer for ignoring my entire post that destroyed your argument (that you continued to make to other people). I regretted making that post right away though because I knew that you would "cleverly" ignore it to continue your baseless posting, willfully ignorant of the fact that you looked like a fool.

You didnt refute ANY of it, you disagreed with it. Which is perfectly fine IMO.

As it turned out, the Dems must have thought it had merit as well.

[The Evil Genius]

The D's were faced with two options:

1) Having the GOP likely tieing up the legislation until they gained power in January and then losing the bill altogether.

2) Passing a lesser version that some of the GOP could buy off on.

They chose option 2, it appears.

[Burgold]

The good news if there was a need there's a better chance it will be met. That's more important than politics. Good for the Dems and Republicans for bending and getting it done.

[Fergasun]

My instinct is to claim BS. Coburn has had over a year to respond and make his complaints known and get them adjusted. There are Bills that people try to ram through. This isn't an example of one. This is an example of one that has been stonewalled repeatedly and is being given one last ditch chance to get something done now.

The only Senate hearing was on June 29, 2010, for the Senate Committee on Health Education Labor and Pensions. The Senate and the House have very different priorities. For instance, the financial reform bill was passed in the House 6 months before it was passed in the Senate (not talking about the conference committee bill). It's an abomination that the transcript for that hearing is not available, because then we could see what the Republican members thought of the bill at the time during the hearing. This bill actually passed the House on 9/29/2010. It wasn't a pure party line vote, more Republicans voted for it... in fact Steve King of NY a staunch conservative voted for it (naturally as his area would benefit).

Here are what I think the primary Republican points against this bill:

However, this legislation as written creates a huge $8.4 billion slush fund paid for by taxpayers that is open to abuse, fraud, and waste. That is because the legislation creates an inexplicable and unprecedented 21-year long fund. The case of the bill's namesake, James Zadroga, is indicative of the problems with this bill. Rather than finding that Detective Zadroga's death was the result of exposure to Ground Zero dust, the New York City medical examiner concluded that, ``It is our unequivocal opinion, with certainty beyond doubt, that the foreign material in Detective Zadroga's lungs did not get there as a result of inhaling dust at the World Trade Center or elsewhere.

The bill allows claims to be filed until the year 2031, an unjustifiable length of time. As Ken Feinberg, Special Master of the original 9/11 fund and the administrator of the BP oil spill claims process stated, ``no latent claims need such an extended date.''...It is hard to explain spending billions of additional taxpayer dollars when Special Master Ken Feinberg has emphatically stated that the $1.5 billion in taxpayer money, charitable contributions, and insurance coverage currently available for distribution is ``more than sufficient to pay all eligible claims, as well as lawyers' fees and costs.''

Ken Feinberg, Special Master of the original 9/11 Fund, testified twice before the Judiciary Committee on this legislation. Both times Mr. Feinberg advocated reenacting the 9/11 fund, but doing so on a much more limited basis than is done in this legislation. Why are we ignoring his advice?

All you guys with your partisan bickering.... Congress will do the right thing most of the time, its simply a matter of process... sometimes the process gets messy. Save your partisan bickering for those really big issues where there are large chasms between the country and the parties.