Reed Doughty Might Be An Elite Safety...

[hieverybody]

Nelson has been pretty bad the last two years and Jones was OK this year. The problem with this site is it doesn't take into account pass rush which will make or break a defensive back.

But that should at least be fairly consistent among safeties on the same team. What's more, our pass rush was decent last year. Landry just isn't a good player, and the sooner we realize that and stop trying to justify his draft position, the sooner we can improve our team. It was absolutely embarrassing watching him bounce off players last year.

[gorebd82]

IMO, this Gregg Williams/Greg Blache scheme has asked a lot out of the FS, but put the SS in a really good position to be successful and that has been the largest contributor to his successes and struggles.

Look at how Sean Taylor had struggles at FS and it wasn't until his 4th year that he started to get the hang of the role and blossom. When Sean passed, Doughty had that FS spot and struggled immensely. He struggled so much that Landry was put in that position to end the season. He showed some flashes in the end of the 2007 season so he's been in that position ever since.

On the other hand, Landry has had the most success in his rookie season when he was playing closer to the line and being used in exotic ways as a SS. Doughty making the permanent switch to SS allowed him to emerge as a fan favorite because of his success. Chris Horton, a 7th round rookie, was able to come in an immediately become a difference maker.

So from the pattern I see with the same personnel playing two different positions, the responsibilities of our FS has been a bigger hinder on player success than the actual talents of the player.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

doughty has speed issues and his coverage skills are very suspect.

he is a great run stopping safety though.

[darklight1216]

This makes me wanna start a "I would trade Landry for..." thread. But its not worth the nnt.

How about Landry for Landry?

[BoBoCTiberius]

Pretty easy to get 91 tackles when every other DB is getting beat. He's got a lot of skills, but no athleticism.

[Hitman21ST]

:ols::ols:

took me a second to figure out why

i was like wtf

then it hit me

and i was like

:ols::ols:

I'm still missing it. Why?

Why the hell would we trade Doughty so that Landry can continue to suck at another position? Landry at SS is a ridiculous idea - he is terrible at tackling. He needs to find his spot on the bench or on another team.

We brought LaRon in to be the "monster" back. SS up in the box, making plays. While we still had Sean Taylor (RIP), he could do that and he was good at it. When we put Kareem Moore at Free Safety and LL at Strong, he was back making plays. We need a true Free Safety. Not with the #4 pick, mind you, but a true FS.

[dallasfan]

yeah I don't get it either

steve a****er?

*EDIT*

LOL, i'm slow, but I guess you are too, this should help, figure out what's missing

BTW, if this constitues circumventing the profanity filters I apologize

[Hitman21ST]

ah...I see now. Thanks Dallas

[Hiro]

Reed Doughty is the type of "Ryan Clark" player that we've sorely needed on our defense. A guy who doesn't get that much recognition around the league or nationally, but does his job and is essentially A) a cog in the defense and a leader in the locker room. The fact that Reed actually took Chris Horton under his wing, a guy who eventually took his job, and continued to encouraged him and help him grow speaks volumes as to the kind of player he is.

If Landry could just get his head out of his *** and reach the potential as a FS that his physical abilities would afford him, we'd have a hell of a safety rotation with Horton/Doughty sharing time at SS.

Here's hoping Haslett can knock some sense into LaRon. :beatdeadhorse:

[1972FAN]

Well, dont think he's pro bowl caliber, but he is a Very SMART player with limit speed but very good instincts for the position.

[Flycoach]

Reed's cool with me, but NO WAY (IMHO) is he "elite".

[RandyHolt]

I think Reed is average. But the ranking systems dont take into account the scheme. Blache regularly passes off teams number one WR's onto our flat footed safety sitting 20 yds downfield. Even late in games. No umbrella coverage, no prevent. Cover 1 or bust. Landry had a full plate. Many teams stick their best corner covers to shadow a teams best wideout, all game long. We didnt even do that for a single series.

I'd like to see LL at SS because he CAN rush the passer better than Reed. Reed seems to fly off of QB's despite being the concensus better tackler. For all the missed tackles you are afraid of Laron missing, he will force many more turnovers than Reed. It may all even out.

[hieverybody]

I think Reed is average. But the ranking systems dont take into account the scheme. Blache regularly passes off teams number one WR's onto our flat footed safety sitting 20 yds downfield. Even late in games. No umbrella coverage, no prevent. Cover 1 or bust. Landry had a full plate. Many teams stick their best corner covers to shadow a teams best wideout, all game long. We didnt even do that for a single series.

I'd like to see LL at SS because he CAN rush the passer better than Reed. Reed seems to fly off of QB's despite being the concensus better tackler. For all the missed tackles you are afraid of Laron missing, he will force many more turnovers than Reed. It may all even out.

I care a lot more about tackling from my SS than I do his blitzing ability. And I haven't really seen anything from him to suggest that he's better at it than Doughty, except that he is faster.

[StillUnknown]

any ranking system that reed doughty as "elite" is flawed beyond reason

reed is a solid professional safety who's good to have on the team, but saying he's elite is a joke

[RandyHolt]

I care a lot more about tackling from my SS than I do his blitzing ability. And I haven't really seen anything from him to suggest that he's better at it than Doughty, except that he is faster.

Do you remember Laron at SS as a rookie? Few to no one complained about his tackling ability. I think Laron at SS in his one or two games this past year caused for turnovers than Reed did all year long. I may be wrong. But Laron's game is helmut on the ball, not him floating in open space a deterrent to a deep ball.

Blache had him on an island dead in the water flat footed deep. Alone. Time and time again. Teams figured out how to attack that, and Blache never adjusted, and is out of the league. I dont think any safety can cover doing what Blache was asking him to do at FS. Reed did OK in his FS stint, I must admit. But he wasnt tested IIRC.

[[[ghost]]]

Do you remember Laron at SS as a rookie? Few to no one complained about his tackling ability. I think Laron at SS in his one or two games this past year caused for turnovers than Reed did all year long. I may be wrong. But Laron's game is helmut on the ball, not him floating in open space a deterrent to a deep ball.

Blache had him on an island dead in the water flat footed deep. Alone. Time and time again. Teams figured out how to attack that, and Blache never adjusted, and is out of the league. I dont think any safety can cover doing what Blache was asking him to do at FS. Reed did OK in his FS stint, I must admit. But he wasnt tested IIRC.

Landry struggles because he relies on his athleticism too much.

When he wasn't expected to be the premiere DB on our team, he held his own.

What we need is a DC who takes Landry and maximizes his potential, as compared to expecting Landry to be something else.

[darklight1216]

Here's one way to decide: Can you name 5 safties who are better than Doughty (ten if you are lenient in your analyis)?

[RandyHolt]

];7268163']Landry struggles because he relies on his athleticism too much.

When he wasn't expected to be the premiere DB on our team' date=' he held his own.

What we need is a DC who takes Landry and maximizes his potential, as compared to expecting Landry to be something else.[/quote']

We so misused our personnel its amazing we didnt move Fletch out of the middle. Good points on Laron. I think he is misunderstood. When a guy has talent and struggles, one has to look at coaching. He has been night and day for us, and I think its easy to see Williams got a lot more out of him than Blache. A beast forcing fumbles to rarely even being on the TV screen, is how his transition went as our D coaches changed.

[SkinsBrewCrew]

I'm a big fan of #37! ..but I think that last injury, pretty much sealed his fate. I hope he returns, but only if he returns 100%, which he won't.

[SkinsMaster88]

Definitely one of the reasons that trading Landry makes probably the most sense of any of the possible trades mentioned around here (Cooley, Davis, Campbell, Moss, etc.). He is a recent top 10 pick and should still have some trade value. His benefit to the team hasn't been much, and honestly if he was a FA, I wouldn't bother re-signing him. Misses more plays than makes them. It's a shame, because he is a hell of an athlete.

[VTmike]

Reed Doughty is the most solid of the solid Safeties in the league, lol.

He is not elite, but he's just so solid that he always ranks at the top when it comes to these fancy statistical studies. He just does his job, and does it right. But one thing is for sure, he rarely makes those game changing plays that elite guys in the secondary consistently do.

That's the difference.

Hasn't quite hit that Wes Welker status yet, right?

[Mercuryrising]

I am no expert, but I watch a lot of NFL games and when I watch a game and Landry enters the frame the ball carrier may or may not be going down, when other teams secondary players enter the frame the ball carrier may or may not being going down, but when Doughty enters the frame the ball carrier is going down.....

[LuckyJay]

When we drafted LL30 we had a smash mouth hard hitter turn center field ball hawk ST21 (RIP). With the area 51 combo in tact ST21 lead the league in int's and we had a pretty fierce SS in LL30. Now what we had this year was a smaller FS in LL trying to play center field when he's always been a up in the box type of player. This caused many problems. As we have seen our pass defense is soft and LL, and the corners along with the sceme didn't help. If we can find a servicable FS and coaching we can restore LL career and everyone will be happy!

[The Cowboy Bamma Rocker]

When we drafted LL30 we had a smash mouth hard hitter turn center field ball hawk ST21 (RIP). With the area 51 combo in tact ST21 lead the league in int's and we had a pretty fierce SS in LL30. Now what we had this year was a smaller FS in LL trying to play center field when he's always been a up in the box type of player. This caused many problems. As we have seen our pass defense is soft and LL, and the corners along with the sceme didn't help. If we can find a servicable FS and coaching we can restore LL career and everyone will be happy!

Well, got the same safeties coach, maybe slowik will be able to help

[method man]

At 51st, Doughty is one of the worst starting safeties in the league in coverage by this guy's rankings. I agree with what most others are saying. I like Doughty but he's probably our third best safety. I'd rather see Landry and Moore on the field together.

That 51st ranking is a bit below-average among the ranked safeties. However, I would venture to say that Doughty's coverage rating is average or even above-average vs. other strong safeties.