CNN: 47% will pay no federal income tax

[Duncan]

Please make sure to include a self-addressed return envelope and a stamp.

Thank you.

[Duncan]

heheh.

Point is, we all pay taxes, in different ways, and we all receive government services, in different ways. People who claim that the rich are milked for a higher percentage than the poor rarely acknowledge the impact of any taxes other than the income tax.

The flaw in your logic is that "the rich" pay all the other taxes as well.

[TheGoodBits]

Wow, 47%? That seems really high. Hell I am a 20 year old college student who worked part-time last year and ended up making under $6k for the whole year, and even I had to pay income taxes (just fed, not state). Maybe because I am considered a dependent, but I'm not sure. Not too familiar with the tax code.

[Predicto]

Erm... I'm gonna be nitpicky here, but wouldn't those be considered flat taxes, not regressive taxes? (Except for Social Security, given its upper limit.)

You are correct, I misspoke. Some payroll taxes (like FUTA) also have an upper limit cut off, but you are right, Medicare doesn't.

However, the rich also receive a percentage of their income as capital gains, which is taxed at only 15 percent, and is not subject to Social Security, Medicare or anything else. Plus, the poor, who spend basically all of their income on food and tangible goods, always pay a higher percentage of their income in sales tax than the wealthy, who can invest some of their income for the future while and spending much of the rest of it on services that are not subject to sales tax. Plus many fees are assessed for basic government services that might otherwise be covered by taxes. A driver's license fee, for example, costs a poor man and a rich man the exact same number of dollars, but that number is a much larger percentage of the poorer man's total income. Those are taxes too.

[Predicto]

Wow, 47%? That seems really high. Hell I am a 20 year old college student who worked part-time last year and ended up making under $6k for the whole year, and even I had to pay income taxes (just fed, not state). Maybe because I am considered a dependent, but I'm not sure. Not too familiar with the tax code.

Did you file a return? You might have had tax withheld, but it would have been refunded if you had filed. :whoknows:

[Predicto]

The flaw in your logic is that "the rich" pay all the other taxes as well.

Sort of. Not social security or FUTA after the income caps, and not as high a percentage of sales tax or fees for basic government services.

[TheGoodBits]

Did you file a return? You might have had tax withheld, but it would have been refunded if you had filed. :whoknows:

Actually I did file a return, but it was kind of like a reverse return. I had claimed exempt, because the previous 5-6 years I had worked I never made enough money to have to pay taxes. So I just claimed exempt and didn't have any taxes withheld so I wouldn't have to bother with a return.

I ended up going over the limit for not paying any taxes (which was around $5,500). So I had to file a return and enclose a check to the government for like $50. Still though, I had to pay taxes, even if it wasn't much.

[Predicto]

Actually I did file a return, but it was kind of like a reverse return. I had claimed exempt, because the previous 5-6 years I had worked I never made enough money to have to pay taxes. So I just claimed exempt and didn't have any taxes withheld so I wouldn't have to bother with a return.

I ended up going over the limit for not paying any taxes (which was around $5,500). So I had to file a return and enclose a check to the government for like $50. Still though, I had to pay taxes, even if it wasn't much.

I think if you had filed a regular return, the Earned Income Tax Credit would have ensured that you paid no income tax.

[TheGoodBits]

I think if you had filed a regular return, the Earned Income Tax Credit would have ensured that you paid no income tax.

Hmm not sure. I think the form I filled out was the EZ something or other. My dad helped me, as it was my first time filing a tax return. I don't think he mentioned anything about an Earned Income Tax Credit. Guess I'll never see that $50 again.

[Larry]

The flaw in your logic is that "the rich" pay all the other taxes as well.

The flaw in your logic is that they pay a vastly smaller portion of their income towards them than poor people do.

[Duncan]

The flaw in your logic is that they pay a vastly smaller portion of their income towards them than poor people do.

Vastly? Would love to see some statistics on that Larry. The earned income tax credit actually pays for FICA so other than sales tax what do they pay?

At least you didn't say vastly smaller percentage and underline percentage.

[Redskins Diehard]

As always, focusing only on federal income tax is going to give you a skewed picture of the tax burdens borne by various levels of our society.

The article mentions those other taxes as well. It doesn't even appear as if you clicked the link and read the article.

The article addresses payroll taxes. When including payroll taxes the percentage drops to 24%.

My question is how will the President lower taxes for those making under whatever the threshold is now(I believe 150k or something)? Will that only cover the people between that 47% and the income threshold? Or is the proposal to not charge them sales tax, or FICA, or anything like that? It appears that 47% of Americans can't have their income tax lowered any more than it already is.

[SnyderShrugged]

A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:

From bondage to spiritual faith;

From spiritual faith to great courage;

From courage to liberty;

From liberty to abundance;

From abundance to complacency;

From complacency to apathy;

From apathy to dependence;

From dependence back into bondage.

Alexander Fraser Tytler, Lord Woodhouselee (attributed too)

(15 October 1747 - 5 January 1813)

[endzone_dave]

You are correct, I misspoke. Some payroll taxes (like FUTA) also have an upper limit cut off, but you are right, Medicare doesn't.

However, the rich also receive a percentage of their income as capital gains, which is taxed at only 15 percent, and is not subject to Social Security, Medicare or anything else. Plus, the poor, who spend basically all of their income on food and tangible goods, always pay a higher percentage of their income in sales tax than the wealthy, who can invest some of their income for the future while and spending much of the rest of it on services that are not subject to sales tax. Plus many fees are assessed for basic government services that might otherwise be covered by taxes. A driver's license fee, for example, costs a poor man and a rich man the exact same number of dollars, but that number is a much larger percentage of the poorer man's total income. Those are taxes too.

I don't mind in the bottom 1% - 30% not paying income tax, they have it tough. It bothers me some that the people in the bottom 30% - 47% don't pay income tax. They aren't spending all of their income on food and tangible goods. They get to buy ipods and flat screens because other people are paying more taxes than they are. Maybe these folks could chip in a little bit and help us make our budget deficit a little smaller.

[Predicto]

A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:

From bondage to spiritual faith;

From spiritual faith to great courage;

From courage to liberty;

From liberty to abundance;

From abundance to complacency;

From complacency to apathy;

From apathy to dependence;

From dependence back into bondage.

Alexander Fraser Tytler, Lord Woodhouselee (attributed too)

(15 October 1747 - 5 January 1813)

I always find that quote to be particularly vapid. No government has ever lasted forever. No government ever will.

[Predicto]

I don't mind in the bottom 1% - 30% not paying income tax, they have it tough. It bothers me some that the people in the bottom 30% - 47% don't pay income tax. They aren't spending all of their income on food and tangible goods. They get to buy ipods and flat screens because other people are paying more taxes than they are. Maybe these folks could chip in a little bit and help us make our budget deficit a little smaller.

As noted above, those 30-47 percent people are paying a good percentage of their income in taxes, just not in income taxes.

[AsburySkinsFan]

Either pay your taxes or risk jail! That is the choices you have!

We surrender to your infinite wisdom and learned way oh wise one....

Now, would you do yourself a favor and actually read at least the OP and perhaps the article before you flip out with some knee jerk and completely unrelated rant.

[Predicto]

We surrender to your infinite wisdom and learned way oh wise one....

Now, would you do yourself a favor and actually read at least the OP and perhaps the article before you flip out with some knee jerk and completely unrelated rant.

Wow that picture is cute. I need to show it to my daughters.

[SnyderShrugged]

I always find that quote to be particularly vapid. No government has ever lasted forever. No government ever will.

so we should strive to make ours end too?

[Destino]

You can't squeeze blood from a turnip. Subtract the taxes those in the bottom portion of the income DO pay from their income and compare it to the cost of living in their area.

Or ignore this.

Consider that wealth disparity in the US is now wider than it was in the 1920's. The worst in a 100 years (during which the US became the super power). The top 10% of income earner in the US now earn 50% of all income. The bottom 90% split the remaining 50%..

Or ignore that as well.

[brianforster]

Does this mean anything to me as a 23 year old single male? No kids, claiming myself for the first time this year. How much of the money I pay the government should I expect in a return? I claimed 0 on my paycheck so that I could get a larger return. I am horrible with money so its kind of like a nice government savings account. I hope.

[SnyderShrugged]

Does this mean anything to me as a 23 year old single male? No kids, claiming myself for the first time this year. How much of the money I pay the government should I expect in a return? I claimed 0 on my paycheck so that I could get a larger return. I am horrible with money so its kind of like a nice government savings account. I hope.

I hate to break it to you, but thats actually the worst tax strategy you could employ.

Your goal should be to claim maximum exemptions throughout the year and then earmark what you would have paid in taxes into some form of interest bearing investment.

Why loan your money to the Feds for free?

[SnyderShrugged]

How come we claim we have a "progressive" tax system, yet it only "progresses" up to a cieling?

Personally, I'm against all income taxes on individuals, especially since a wage is not actually income, it's earned money. But the term progressive taxation isnt truly accurate and I always wondered why.

[Baculus]

Does this mean anything to me as a 23 year old single male? No kids, claiming myself for the first time this year. How much of the money I pay the government should I expect in a return? I claimed 0 on my paycheck so that I could get a larger return. I am horrible with money so its kind of like a nice government savings account. I hope.

I wouldn't have recommended the route that you took for your filing. You may end up owing money at the end of the year if not enough is withheld.

It all depends upon how much you earn and if you are above or below the poverty line. Also, even those who do not pay federal taxes still have to pay payroll taxes, state taxes, and social security.

I am not a tax expert, but this just my .02 on the matter.

[Baculus]

How come we claim we have a "progressive" tax system, yet it only "progresses" up to a cieling?

Personally, I'm against all income taxes on individuals, especially since a wage is not actually income, it's earned money. But the term progressive taxation isnt truly accurate and I always wondered why.

The tax rate increases progressively, hence the term. It is not progressive in the sense of "progress." Maybe that will make a little bit more sense in terminology.