Sticksboi05 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scotty_Bowman ?EDIT: Russell and Cousy weren't the GOAT. Russell is close with Wilt; Cousy's IMO behind Magic, Stockton, Oscar. :doh: He said AT THE TIME. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 15, 2009 Author Share Posted June 15, 2009 Great players make really good coaches great. Phil is really good, but without MJ, he didn't win a title and until Memphis handed Gasol to the Lakers to give them a second great player, Phil didn't get it done without Shaq.Same goes with every coach on that list. But you can say MJ didn't get it done without Phil or Kobe didn't get it done without Phil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACW Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Great players make really good coaches great. Phil is really good, but without MJ, he didn't win a title and until Memphis handed Gasol to the Lakers to give them a second great player, Phil didn't get it done without Shaq.Same goes with every coach on that list. THIS I can buy :yes:And likewise, Really good coaches make great players champions. Look at AI: probably HOF, but not a champion. Same for CP3 (although too early to tell) and LeBron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccsl2 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Great players make really good coaches great. Phil is really good, but without MJ, he didn't win a title and until Memphis handed Gasol to the Lakers to give them a second great player, Phil didn't get it done without Shaq.Same goes with every coach on that list. :secret: MJ, Shaq, and Kobe hadn't won a title until Phil Jackson coached them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACW Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 :doh:He said AT THE TIME. Wilt was only three years after Russell.:secret: MJ, Shaq, and Kobe hadn't won a title until Phil Jackson coached them. THIS I can buy :yes:And likewise, Really good coaches make great players champions. Look at AI: probably HOF, but not a champion. Same for CP3 (although too early to tell) and LeBron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Great players make really good coaches great. Phil is really good, but without MJ, he didn't win a title and until Memphis handed Gasol to the Lakers to give them a second great player, Phil didn't get it done without Shaq.Same goes with every coach on that list. 3 Super Bowls, 3 Quarterbacks............ On top of that the three QB that Gibbs did had were not HOF QB either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Wilt was only three years after Russell. Yeah but he won his first title ten years after Russel and only won two so at the time, before Kareem came along Russell was considered the GOAT. And I am on the side of saying Phil is the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Maybe Rudy would have won more if Jordan wasn't around. The 2 that he won happened to be the years Jordan took off (I know MJ came back at the end of 2nd year but he wasn't up to speed yet). It also goes to show you that in the NBA you really need 2 or 3 great players to make a great team.I am not trying to knock what Phil Jackson has done, but think that coaching football is a largest accomplishment in whole Jordan WAS around, and he was on the Bulls. And Rudy didn't take those Rockets to the Finals any year that Jordan was in the finals, so you can't make that argument either. The Penguins had Super Mario and Jagr and could only manage two Cups. This is a great point. With the "best players" argument, the Pens should have won a lot more championships. Also, Gretzky is to hockey as Jordan is to basketball - yet Gretzky only hoisted 4 cups. Actually, one could make the argument that Gretzky > Jordan in their respective sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Auerbach has Bill Rusell and coached 9 HoFers. The only HoFer/future HoFers Phil has coached are Jordan, Pippen, Shaq, and Kobe. And Shaq is the only one to win a title without him. Who went out and found Russell and drafted him and all those HOF'ers?? Who was the scout and GM that did all that for the Celtics?? That was Red. He was Head Coach,GM and the only scout on the Celtics. BTW, looking at the Lakers coaching staff, Phil has 6 assistants. Red had none. Eight titles in a row, nine in ten years. That will never be matched. Red Auerbach was Head Coach/GM and then just the GM of the Celtics for 43 years. Out of that 43 years only three times were the Celtics ever under .500. Give me the guy who can find his own talent and coach it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACW Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Red Auerbach was Head Coach/GM and then just the GM of the Celtics for 43 years. Out of that 43 years only three times were the Celtics ever under .500.:yikes:How 'bout we agree on this: Red and Phil were two of the (if not THE TWO) greatest NBA coaches (or just coaches in general) of all time :yes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorresA Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 Jordan WAS around, and he was on the Bulls. And Rudy didn't take those Rockets to the Finals any year that Jordan was in the finals, so you can't make that argument either. Point taken As said I don't think you will find that every great coach is coaching a great team, and every great team has great players so every great coach will have great player. I know this is a "Professional coach" debate, but I believe you can really see how good a coach is in the lower level (like college). I more of a UNC fan but I can see that coach K is a Great coach. He consistantly on top and his players look great but not many are superstars in NBA. That is coaching and doing the most with what you got. (I know that Coach K gets McD all americans but they were not NBA stars) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKSkinsFan Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 I gotta give it to Phil, even though it's tough to say no to Gibbs. The whole purpose of the game is to win, and this guy's statistics are incredible. Sure you can throw out the line he had incredible players, but I can practically guarantee you that if you asked those players, they'd say it was Phil that made them better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buenosdiaz Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 bob bradley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 :yikes:How 'bout we agree on this: Red and Phil were two of the (if not THE TWO) greatest NBA coaches (or just coaches in general) of all time :yes: Oh, I wholeheartedly agree. Phil and Red won't be matched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted June 15, 2009 Share Posted June 15, 2009 :secret: MJ, Shaq, and Kobe hadn't won a title until Phil Jackson coached them. shouldn't Tex Winters(the guy that made the triangle offense) get more credit than Phil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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