Campbell vs. E.Manning Statistical Comparison

[Whiskey17]

I watch every play of every single Redskins Game.. 62% completion rate for the past two seasons is pretty damn accurate... and that's with our receivers having problems getting open and having the dropsies all year long.

Name 1 quarterback who doesn't throw to a receiver's feet and over their head at least 38 times out of every 100 passes.. Your Madden Football mentality killed any credibility that you have..

There is more to accuracy than completion percentage, especially in a West Coast system. The WCO relies heavily on yards after catch which means receivers must be hit in stride on little slants and crosses. JC is incredibly deficient in this area. Moss is forever leaping or reaching behind to catch the ball on patterns that are not deep patterns. This basically kills the yards after catch component of our offense and is a major reason why the attack is so anemic.

[commyderm2]

There is more to accuracy than completion percentage, especially in a West Coast system. The WCO relies heavily on yards after catch which means receivers must be hit in stride on little slants and crosses. JC is incredibly deficient in this area. Moss is forever leaping or reaching behind to catch the ball on patterns that are not deep patterns. This basically kills the yards after catch component of our offense and is a major reason why the attack is so anemic.

So tell my why he can't improve in these areas after a year or two more in this system?? Nobody can do that, they all just make hysterical predictions that he just won't... His accuracy is incredible on intermediate passes.. Every time he throws a ball over ten yards, I expect it to be caught... But I guess if you get a hard-on every time Campbell makes a mistake then its easier to remember the bad passes..

[SkinsWizCubsDukes]

Why didn't you compare TD's in the original post. The fact is you are biased towards JC but its evident Manning is definately better.

If you put Campbell on that team they would be worse.

WATCH THE GAME FILM! CAMPBELL MISSES WIDE OPEN THROWS ON A REGULAR BASIS

[commyderm2]

Why didn't you compare TD's in the original post. The fact is you are biased towards JC but its evident Manning is definately better.

If you put Campbell on that team they would be worse.

WATCH THE GAME FILM! CAMPBELL MISSES WIDE OPEN THROWS ON A REGULAR BASIS

like I said, its easier to remember all the bad passes when you get a hard-on everytime JC makes a mistake..

[GoCommiesGo]

Your lack of faith is due to a preconceived bias that admittedly was conceived from the day he was drafted. This has lead to many, who like you, irrationally blaming every conceivable problem this team has on him. Your lack of faith is leading to a lack of reason.

I don't blame every concievable problem on him. I think he is part of a large set of problems. Your putting words in my mouth. The OL and DL is a huge reason for the problem as is our FO and so forth.

I am not blinded from other problems by my dislike of him as a football player. From every thing I've heard he is a great person and I wish nothing but the best for him. I personally just don't see that extra "it" when he plays.

And let me make one thing clear, which I appologize if the tone is a bit accusatory, I am sick and tired and of Jason Campbell being compared to every single black QB that ended up being a failure.. Troy Banks comparisons are so bizarre and off base that it kind of makes me suspicious of where all of this resentment comes from.

I compared him to Tony Banks because he played for the Skins and had comparable numbers to him, not because he was black. I also consider Banks, Dilfer, Frerotte and Brad Johnson in the same vain as JC. It has nothing to do with color of someones skin. It has everything to do with the performance on the field.

I have no resentment for Campbell I just look at what I see and look at his past history and his numbers and draw a conclusion. I did the same thing to Brunell way back when breaking down his completions and yardage compared to other QB. His was way off base because his receivers where racking up unheard of YAC stats. Again I disliked the move of signing him from day one. Would you extrapolate a reason from that?

I appreciate your forthright nature and respect your opinion, I don't share it but I understand it.

[sempre_victrix]

Our offensive line is old, broken down, and just plain piss-poor. Between that and the fact that it seems like we run a different scheme every year, it's no wonder JC is not playing well. Contrary to popular belief, we don't have a number 1 receiver and Campbell cannot block for himself. Portis being hurt allows the defense to play the pass or blitz like crazy. Betts is not the answer and does not instill fear into any defense.

Stupid plays and even stupider penalties continue to force us to start deep in our own end. Zorn's play calling has become predictable and without any innovation. Where is the no huddle? Gadget plays?

When we need a clutch play, we have no one to go to. Need a timely deep punt? Forget it. Need to hit a long field goal. Not this year. Basically, the offense can only succeed if Campbell is in top form every game.

Not a JC lover, but I think he has the tools to be a solid QB in the NFL.

[ExoDus84]

So tell my why he can't improve in these areas after a year or two more in this system?? Nobody can do that, they all just make hysterical predictions that he just won't... His accuracy is incredible on intermediate passes.. Every time he throws a ball over ten yards, I expect it to be caught... But I guess if you get a hard-on every time Campbell makes a mistake then its easier to remember the bad passes..

What the hall are you basing his incredible accuracy off of? He struggles with short routes and any timing route. We've seen him throw way too high, way too low, and way too behind on all manner of short passes over the past few seasons. You cant teach accuracy. JC has been playing football his entire life, so if he's inaccurate and short, precise routes now, he probably always will be. His completion percentage is high this year, rather inflated, because we've had so few long passes, and so many damn screens and dumpoffs. Of course that'll raise your accuracy. The issue here is his ability to make plays, to improvise, and get things done. He cant do that. 12 TD's in 14 games. Thats pathetic. I dont give a damn if his TD/INT ratio is 2 to 1 this year, becaus ehe's on pace for just 13 TD's which is, again, pathetic. He doesnt throw a lot of INT's because he doesnt take any chances whatsoever, and likes to wait for a guy to get wide open before he throws. The problem with that is that, in the NFL, VERY rarely is a receiver wide open. His slow as hell release is a problem also, especially in the redzone where your window of opportunitiy is extremely narrow for a passing TD. Thats probably the reason why we settle for so many FG's. JC's instincts and terribly slow release is a problem that isnt a system issue. Those are things he'll have for his career. If he doesnt have it by now, after playing football his whole life, I dont know what the hell makes you think he'll suddenly get it.

[McSkin30]

Why didn't you compare TD's in the original post. The fact is you are biased towards JC but its evident Manning is definately better.

If you put Campbell on that team they would be worse.

WATCH THE GAME FILM! CAMPBELL MISSES WIDE OPEN THROWS ON A REGULAR BASIS

I left TDs out of the mix for a few reasons. Primarily, the offensive systems under Gibbs let the run game take over within the red zone. I would hope we could all agree on that. The other main reason has been mentioned a few times. There is simply not enough time for receivers to get open on a long route due to the crumbling pocket. We have lacked the big possession receiver who can pull down the 30 yarder between the hashes. I love Santana, but he gets open on the long double-stops and similar patterns and has constantly displayed an inability to come down with catches in those situations.

The rushing yards/game have also been overlooked from the comparison. I added that in there as further strength to the argument that the line play is a major factor. NYG averaged better rushing stats consistently, in large part due to the better OL.

[McSkin30]

As if Campbell would have won a super bowl last season if he played with the Giants what a joke.

If he was two years further into his career with continuity of the line age, rushing average, and offensive scheme...who knows? You can't make purely speculative arguments like that and expect everyone to swallow them.

In the same mold: As if Eli would have won the NFC East if he played with our OL, what a joke.

Just making a point.

[snyderhastrillions]

The Giants won the super bowl because of their great defensive line and plaxico abusing the packers secondary in the NFC championship game. They were not all perfect passes but plaxico caught most of them and that helped them get to the super bowl. Eli is solid do not get me wrong but the refusal of the redskins to throw the ball between 15 and 40 yards down the field 1 out of every 4 plays is the reason for our lack of offense. Jason needs to throw it to a spot and just assume his receivers will make plays.

[PorkSkins]

IMO, numbers do lie. How many of these pass completions came against prevent defenses at the end of games. The majority of his passes are 5-15 yard variety. I have been paying attention to this and I have noticed that during a few of these losses, JC was barely over 100 yards passing at the beginning of the fourth quarter. He can't throw a timing route and he still hasn't overcome his habit of staring down receivers. He has had one of the best QB coaches this year in Zorn. His inability to release the ball faster and not overcome bad habits has contributed to the O lines problems. The only real stats that count, IMO are wins and losses.

[AAARedskin]

How do Campbell's stats compare with the stats of Ryan Leaf, David Klingler, and Andre Ware after their first 26 NFL starts?

[mcarey032]

I'd say Campbell = Vince Young

No way is that a fair comparison. VY is nothing more than a glorified running back. He was never known as a throwing QB. Jason Campbell can do whole lot more and has more touch on his throws than does VY. Jason Campbell has a better QB rating, completion percentage, and better overall TD to Int ratio. If you look at their stats Campbell is improving and VY was regressing before taking a seat on the pine.

Jason Campbell

Comp Att Pct Yds Avg TD Int Sck SckY Rate Att Yds Avg TD FUM Lost

TOTAL 639 1,067 59.9 6,942 6.5 34 23 62 401 80.7 101 483 4.8 1 20 9

Vince Young

TOTAL 435 762 57.1 4,909 6.4 22 32 51 289 68.6 179 949 5.3 10 23 6

courtesy of nfl.com

I think that you could say that VY= Michael Vick. To say that Campbell is VY is insulting to Campbell. VY is a player who truly can not read a defense and does not go through any type of progression that I can tell. He loves to run first and throw second. Campbell will try to extend the play. He has been pushed to practically run. So IMO, Campbell is far better than VY at this point. Campbell has room to grow, but to me, there is reason to bench him or draft another QB when we really and truly don't know what we have here. I hope that Campbell is going to succeed, but we will never truly know if we keep getting new coordinators and new coaches every couple of years. Let Zorn stay another year. Let Campbell develop another year and lets see what we have. We need to have patients and not have that hair trigger temper that the Raiders, the Lions and Bengals are known for. We have gone from a class act organization to hanging with the cellar dwellers.

[AAARedskin]

The ONLY stat that ultimately matters when measuring a QB is his WIN/LOSS record. In addition you gotta love a QB that has the moxy to be able to bring his team from behind in the 4th quarter.......

[fire3fighter4]

I watch every play of every single Redskins Game.. 62% completion rate for the past two seasons is pretty damn accurate... and that's with our receivers having problems getting open and having the dropsies all year long.

Name 1 quarterback who doesn't throw to a receiver's feet and over their head at least 38 times out of every 100 passes.. Your Madden Football mentality killed any credibility that you have..

the only reason campbell completes so many passes is because they're either dumps to the backs or 5 yard passes.

he's ranked 23rd in the league for yards per throw.....any decent QB QB should average 62% at the least

our receivers haven't been that bad when it comes to drops despite what people here think. None of them are over drops for 10% of the time. A lot of their drops are also because Campbell fails to put the ball where it should be.

[fire3fighter4]

So tell my why he can't improve in these areas after a year or two more in this system?? Nobody can do that, they all just make hysterical predictions that he just won't... His accuracy is incredible on intermediate passes.. Every time he throws a ball over ten yards, I expect it to be caught... But I guess if you get a hard-on every time Campbell makes a mistake then its easier to remember the bad passes..

accuracy has nothing to do with a system..

either you can put the ball where it needs to be or you can't.

people overrate the whole "new system" thing so much...look at Brees in his first year in NO...Lit things up. Chad Pennington is having an excellent year despite being in his first year in Miami.

The "new system" excuse is a terrible one. New systems having nothing to do with the basic mechanics of a QB, which is where Campbell slacks.

[Spear]

The rushing yards/game have also been overlooked from the comparison. I added that in there as further strength to the argument that the line play is a major factor. NYG averaged better rushing stats consistently, in large part due to the better OL.

The Giants OL is slightly better at run-blocking than our (healthy) OL. The real difference is that teams have to respect their passing game, whereas we haven't faced an honest defense in a couple of months. Campbell's limitations are a big reason why.

[american soldier]

I can only say... Yeah Campbell does have better % numbers then some

QB in this league in past 3 years, but Campbell lacks finding a way to win

games at the end... Or lacking comeback from behind games... Some QBs

have very bad % numbers and still find a way to win games... Of course

it not all JC fault, but he is suppose to be the leader...

Can you say Rothlisburger?

[american soldier]

Don't know if this was said already, but stats are relative and they don't tell the true story......

Example: The Redskins are playing the Colts; Campbell passes 15 times. He completes 7 of those passes (46%), one for a touchdown. Wow Campbell passer rating is a whopping 110!!

Payton Manning passes over 30 balls. He completes 12 of his passes (40%). Manning also throws, two interceptions. Oh but wait, he also throws 4 touchdowns. His passer rating....90.2.

Who wins the damn game?

Compare numbers if you must. Campbell's job is to guide this offense in to the red zone and score touchdowns. He hasn't done it. Maybe he will start next year. But why argue the facts as they stand right now.

[wildbill1952]

Sometimes it works to speak in extremes so people understand.

Put Marino, or Unitas, or Montana on a team with 12 year old linemen and 4'6" receivers and put them up against any NFL team. Do they stand a chance? Now ratchet it up a little bit. Same three QB's, and now 18 year old linemen from a local high school, and 5" receivers. Do they stand a chance now? Same three QB's, and 22 year old linemen from a college and 5'10" receivers? Do they stand a chance now? The QB's have all remained the greats they were. But their chances improved as the members of their team improved.

Put Campbell with 30+ year old linemen made up of a center and guard who are incapable of moving the pile on a goal line stand. Oh, and make sure the center is overmatched by every nose tackle in the 3-4 defenses they face. Give him 2 right tackles: one that can't pass block and the other that can't run block. Play either of them. Make sure that any backup OL you have are the undrafted free agents that every other team passed on. Add in 5'10" receivers, only put every D around putting the only good WR in double coverage. How good are his chances?

Now draft a center and a guard that can push the pile back AND pass block. Go another season and draft a strong OT, any of the top 5. Make sure he can pass block and run block and another guard that can pull, pass block and run block. Are his chances any better?

The point is stats are meaningless because it's a team game. True, fifity years from now (assuming Vinny follows through and never drafts an OL) the stats will say Eli and Romo sits to pee are 10 times the QB JC is. No one will notice who the other players are, what receivers they had, what lienemen they had. It will all come down to numbers and JC will lose.

Unfortunately, stats are meaningless in a team game. Until Vinny pulls his head out of his chubbies and finally figures out that drafting for need occasionally is not heresy we're comparing two Porsches, but one with a Volswagen engine in it.

[commyderm2]

the only reason campbell completes so many passes is because they're either dumps to the backs or 5 yard passes.

he's ranked 23rd in the league for yards per throw.....any decent QB QB should average 62% at the least

our receivers haven't been that bad when it comes to drops despite what people here think. None of them are over drops for 10% of the time. A lot of their drops are also because Campbell fails to put the ball where it should be.

Ok so when JC threw that Bomb to Santana and he dropped it.. that doesn't count... the numerous drive killing drops by James Thrash this year doesn't count.. the touchdown dropped by Mike Sellers doesn't count. all of those balls were perfectly placed and I just scratched the surface..

The earlier Vince Young comparison somewhat reinforces my point about how alot of people on here are comparing JC to just any random black QB who ended up being a failure.. its really disgusting..

[commyderm2]

accuracy has nothing to do with a system..

either you can put the ball where it needs to be or you can't.

people overrate the whole "new system" thing so much...look at Brees in his first year in NO...Lit things up. Chad Pennington is having an excellent year despite being in his first year in Miami.

The "new system" excuse is a terrible one. New systems having nothing to do with the basic mechanics of a QB, which is where Campbell slacks.

Drew Brees had Joe Horn, et al. and Chad Pennington 3200 yard (200 more than Campbell) and 14 TDs (two more than Campbell) 6 ints (same as Campbell), yet you say he's having an "excellent year" but Jason Campbell is a total bust.. riiiiighttt..

[taylorcoreskin]

Don't know if this was said already, but stats are relative and they don't tell the true story......

Example: The Redskins are playing the Colts; Campbell passes 15 times. He completes 7 of those passes (46%), one for a touchdown. Wow Campbell passer rating is a whopping 110!!

Payton Manning passes over 30 balls. He completes 12 of his passes (40%). Manning also throws, two interceptions. Oh but wait, he also throws 4 touchdowns. His passer rating....90.2.

Who wins the damn game?

Compare numbers if you must. Campbell's job is to guide this offense in to the red zone and score touchdowns. He hasn't done it. Maybe he will start next year. But why argue the facts as they stand right now.

This happens because people place too much emphasis on TD to INT ratio rather than TD #s alone. If a QB throws 5 touchdowns and 0 interceptions throughout 16 games, his TD to INT ratio is as good as it gets. It's infinity! Yet 5 passining touchdowns throughout 16 games will hardly help the team's efforts of winning football games or the offense's efforts of actually SCORING POINTS. **** TD to INT ratio!

[commyderm2]

I don't blame every concievable problem on him. I think he is part of a large set of problems. Your putting words in my mouth. The OL and DL is a huge reason for the problem as is our FO and so forth.

I am not blinded from other problems by my dislike of him as a football player. From every thing I've heard he is a great person and I wish nothing but the best for him. I personally just don't see that extra "it" when he plays.

I compared him to Tony Banks because he played for the Skins and had comparable numbers to him, not because he was black. I also consider Banks, Dilfer, Frerotte and Brad Johnson in the same vain as JC. It has nothing to do with color of someones skin. It has everything to do with the performance on the field.

I have no resentment for Campbell I just look at what I see and look at his past history and his numbers and draw a conclusion. I did the same thing to Brunell way back when breaking down his completions and yardage compared to other QB. His was way off base because his receivers where racking up unheard of YAC stats. Again I disliked the move of signing him from day one. Would you extrapolate a reason from that?

I appreciate your forthright nature and respect your opinion, I don't share it but I understand it.

Hey man, your opinion is your opinion... I can't change it... What I can do is offer an opposing viewpoint so that readers who are on the fence can observe and decide.. I don't want JC run out on a rail before he can show us what he can really do... That's the problem with this team.. The ownership appeases the fans way too much.. The Eagles could give a rats ass about its fans and that's why they put quality teams on the field every year..

[commyderm2]

This happens because people place too much emphasis on TD to INT ratio rather than TD #s alone. If a QB throws 5 touchdowns and 0 interceptions throughout 16 games, his TD to INT ratio is as good as it gets. It's infinity! Yet 5 passining touchdowns throughout 16 games will hardly help the team's efforts of winning football games or the offense's efforts of actually SCORING POINTS. **** TD to INT ratio!

Yeah, in fact **** every stat that doesn't appease my agenda.. until it does appease my agenda..