Who won the VP debates?

[Baculus]

First of all it shows just how strong of a person he is to endure such torment for such a long period of time. Let us not forget that he was in this situtation because he was defending his country. It has prepared him and molded him into the man he is today. What molded Obama? His early education, mentors, Ministers and drug use?

I understand your point - I just do not know if that is enough for McCain to be president.

Of course McCain's service is commendable, but we just can't use that as a fallback talking point every single time. We just shouldn't use his POW litmus test as some end-all of experience vital for leadership.

Let's not act as if being a POW is a desirable experience for a leader: It isn't. Such long-term imprisonment can certainly leave psychological scars, as evident by McCain calling his captors "gooks" during the 2000 campaign. Combined with McCain's known temper and his "bomb Iran" comment, I wouldn't be the first person that would think, "Hmmm, I hope his period of captivity didn't have a negative effect on his judgement," especially if his mindset is still stuck in the 20th century.

[ZoEd]

Well it's bedtime and I think I've ruffled enough feathers. Ya'll have fun now, ya hear?

[Baculus]

I agree with you 100%. If the Democrats would have chosen a better candidate than Kerry to represent them then Bush probably wouldn't have been reelected.

I am glad we could come to at least some sort of middle-ground agreement. That's always good for politics!

[Baculus]

Well it's bedtime and I think I've ruffled enough feathers. Ya'll have fun now, ya hear?

Have a good night, ZoEd - good discussion.

[Henry]

His first wife was affluent. But as someone that's lost a significant other I can tell you that money doesn't amount for **** at the time.

And as a father I cannot fathom how difficult it would be to raise two of my kids by myself while dealing with such a devastating loss.

I can't imagine someone not recognizing what a colossal struggle that would be for the sake of scoring some political talking point.

[TMat184]

Biden won but that was the expectation....Gov. Palin did very well for herself tonight by at least holding her own.

[TMat184]

And as a father I cannot fathom how difficult it would be to raise two of my kids by myself while dealing with such a devastating loss.

I can't imagine someone not recognizing what a colossal struggle that would be for the sake of scoring some political talking point.

I echo these sentiments....This is one of the things that makes Joe Biden such an extraordinary man. The fact that he took a train every night from Washington back home to be with his family is just remarkable to me. Any man that has dealt with that kind of struggle is someone to admire regardless of party affiliation.

[The Sisko]

I respect John McCain and think he would (or would have in 2000) be a fine President.

But, getting captured and being a POW is the biggest BS reason to be President.

"The purpose of war is not to die for your country. The purpose of war is to ensure that the other guy dies for his country." -General George Patton

Our drill seargeant quoted this in basic training over and over again. His point was to be the best soldier possible so that you accomplish your mission and get you and your buddies home in one piece. McCain managed to be at best, a mediocre Naval airman. Somehow, I fail to see how that a qualifies him to be POTUS.

[337]

I echo these sentiments....This is one of the things that makes Joe Biden such an extraordinary man. The fact that he took a train every night from Washington back home to be with his family is just remarkable to me. Any man that has dealt with that kind of struggle is someone to admire regardless of party affiliation.

Agreed 100%. But just like McCain's POW time, I don't measure a presidential candidate by what horrible experiences they've had in their life.

[Special K]

What did you think of Palin's performance?

She did fine. I am even more confident in my vote come this November...even if McCain dies in office, develops Alzheimers, lapses into a melanoma-induced coma, or whatever else people are saying.

I mean, if you've read through the innumerable amount of vitriolic "Palin is a dumb lady with a tight ass" threads here in the tailgate, you would've expected Palin's "pretty little head" to explode within the first 5 seconds of this debate. Absolutely ridiculous, and I think she held her own just fine against a seasoned politician such as Biden. Biden did fine as well FWIW, but Palin was hardly the dumb little hockey mom everyone has tried to make her out to be from clips of interviews, 10th-hand accounts of what she said over a hogie, and stupid-ass threads about newspaper names.

[Siven]

Everyone thought palin was going to get eaten alive and I really think she held her own. She was real, IMO put Biden in his place on a number of occasions and did quite well.

Given Biden stumbled quite a few times during his talking and at one point couldn't pronounce a word, I think Palin won.

Personally, I don't think she was aggressive enough.

Really?

Seriously?

Palin was coached up on every possible comment she made and she still dodged questions.

The woman is an idiot. I'm not saying that because I'm a democrat. John Edwards was an idiot. Sarah Palin is an even bigger idiot. God bless the woman but she isn't ready for anything yet. Alaska prepares you for **** all, it's not even a major state with the concerns that a larger state has.

I was leaning towards McCain for this election, and then he picked Palin.

You think because Biden perhaps stumbled a few times, that Palin won, when Palin dodged questions the whole entire night.

[TMat184]

Agreed 100%. But just like McCain's POW time, I don't measure a presidential candidate by what horrible experiences they've had in their life.

:applause: I just so happen to think Biden is right on with the issues as well. I would also agree that McCain's service to this country is admirable as well.

[Siven]

"The purpose of war is not to die for your country. The purpose of war is to ensure that the other guy dies for his country." -General George Patton

Our drill seargeant quoted this in basic training over and over again. His point was to be the best soldier possible so that you accomplish your mission and get you and your buddies home in one piece. McCain managed to be at best, a mediocre Naval airman. Somehow, I fail to see how that a qualifies him to be POTUS.

Mediocre?

he was ****ing terrible.

he got caught for christs sake

[Special K]

he got caught for christs sake

Unbelievable

[81artmonk]

Add immature to the list.

Oh you mean like you....I agree

[81artmonk]

Dude get the **** out of here. He got choked up when talking about the fact that his wife and child died. He was talking about raising children by himself.

Insinuating it wasn't genuine is flat out insane.

I'm sorry did I miss something. I saw him completely lose his train of thought. Where was the choke up?? Was I watching something else??

[Springfield]

Unbelievable

Agreed. McCain was a hero, he shouldn't be attacked for his military service. That's just wrong.

Of course, I didn't think Kerry should have been attacked for his military service either. I'm just trying to be fair here.

[Springfield]

I'm sorry did I miss something. I saw him completely lose his train of thought. Where was the choke up?? Was I watching something else??

Be fair. He did get choked up. Could've made me cry.

[81artmonk]

38 and a douche bag, awesome.

Palin is a giant piece of crap, and I am now more scared then ever if she is given any sort of power. She is the same as Bush and i'm tired of that *******s bull****. I'm just angry, that people can actually like her, and that is a bad thing to say, but I just can't believe people would let a hockey mom run the ****ing united states of america...and hockey isn't even an entertaining sport.

Yeah I'm the douche bag when I was called the moron and some other cuss word. yeah.......get a life!!

[81artmonk]

No, it's called being choked up. He was talking about the death of his wife and kid. It's ok to acknowledge that these people are human beings too.

Sheesh.

I'm sorry I didn't see it like you. I didn't see him choking up. I saw him lose his train of thought. Your opinion......my opinion, it's what makes america great. just remember that

[337]

I'm sorry did I miss something. I saw him completely lose his train of thought. Where was the choke up?? Was I watching something else??

Yes you missed something. He was talking about his past and not knowing if his son would live or die...What he was eluding to, w/o saying it, was the time when his wife and daughter died in a car accident. And he didn't lose his train of thought, he got noticeably choked up.

[337]

I'm sorry I didn't see it like you. I didn't see him choking up. I saw him lose his train of thought. Your opinion......my opinion, it's what makes america great. just remember that

This is one of those times when an opinion is wrong.

[81artmonk]

This is all BS.

I watched as both candidates dodged questions multiple times.

I'm 38 years old and am very disappointed with politics in this country.

We have no presidential material,much less vice presidential material.

When you can't even answer a direct question.......something is seriously wrong with you.

In fact, I bet if you posed the question:

Do you like Coke or Pepsi?

Nether candidate would give you a straight answer.

:applause::applause::applause:

[dockeryfan]

Maybe my expectations are higher.

I expect questions to be answered, not dodged. Question about economics? Lets talk about energy policy. At least Biden answered the questions.

Palin IMO did nothing to impress me (I listened on the radio, so I missed the visual cues, etc) She would say " the surge tactics will work in Afganistan", then Biden would say,"General McKiernan said just today that surge tactics would not work in Afganistan" It completely refuted her answer and made her look uninformed. Then on rebuttal she said "well the General didn't really say that"

Here's what he did say. Biden 1 Palin 0

General David McKiernan, the US commander in Afghanistan this week said "Afghanistan is not Iraq. .. What I don't think is needed -- the word I don't use in Afghanistan is the word surge."

[81artmonk]

I don't suffer fools well.

That would include Sarah Palin, and you.

You honestly think that "genuine" trumps knowledgeable?

Did you see that debate?

Sarah Palin is clueless, most of the regular contributors to this thread would know more about politics than she does.

They have pulled the entire sheep over your eyes.

Elites usually don't suffer fools well!!