PK competition

[NewCliche21]

You want to talk post count??? Youre 23 yrs old w/ over 4000 posts already, you should be a senior at college kicking FGs cause they're so damn easy. Sure you have a job??? Or been through an interview??? If post counts = football IQ, you should be the Skins GM. You probably have MAD Madden skills.

1) Post counts don't mean anything.

2) I'm saying that if you're a professional, then you should be making those chip shots.

3) Well, I'm pretty sure I have a job. Or else I've just been showing up in a dress shirt and slacks and doing 8-12 hours of work every day for no reason. Now THAT would be sad.

4) I went through a couple of interviews to get my job.

5) See #1.

6) Eh, I'm okay at Madden. Not as good as I used to be before all of this hit stick and QB Vision crap.

[NewCliche21]

When have you seen a missed EP under perfect conditions/ hold etc.? Its so easy, we should shrink the posts like Arena and play it off the net, RIGHT.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35zXbiEPnKk&feature=related

Whelp, that was pretty easy to find. To put it in perspective: That cost the Saints a playoff appearance.

[gosteelersben]

So if anyone wants to discuss this topic, then PM you? Man, I haven't understood a thing that you've said.

All that I've said is that being a kicker is easier than pretty much any other position. There are, what? Four or five plays to memorize that you've been doing the same way since you were ten? You never hear about a coach coming in and installing a new special teams, do you?

Kicking and punting mistakes are just unacceptable. If someone Romo sits to pee's the hold, then fine, not your fault. If it's really windy and you're 50 yards out, then fine, I'll understand. But missing an extra point? No. Unacceptable.

Being a kicker is the least physically demanding position on the team. Agreed. Do kickers spend as much time memorizing plays and studying plays? Hell no. Do they watch film? Yes.

Special teams replies entirely on execution. Kicking and punting mistakes are going to happen. It is part of the game of football. The teams that LIMIT their mistakes are the ones who gain advantages and win close games.

In regards to missing an extra point. I don't know how many former kickers are on this board. But until you have gone out onto a field(a filled, large stadium) with college/professional uprights with a full rush coming at you, you do not know how small those pipes look even from the 20 yard extra point. You can't understand because you have never been there to experience it nor will ever be there to experience it. Oh well...

[NewCliche21]

Being a kicker is the least physically demanding position on the team. Agreed. Do kickers spend as much time memorizing plays and studying plays? Hell no. Do they watch film? Yes.

Special teams replies entirely on execution. Kicking and punting mistakes are going to happen. It is part of the game of football. The teams that LIMIT their mistakes are the ones who gain advantages and win close games.

In regards to missing an extra point. I don't know how many former kickers are on this board. But until you have gone out onto a field(a filled, large stadium) with college/professional uprights with a full rush coming at you, you do not know how small those pipes look even from the 20 yard extra point. You can't understand because you have never been there to experience it nor will ever be there to experience it. Oh well...

See? Now THAT is a post with some substance! I completely agree with all of it, and now I think that I've seen your perspective.

Don't kickers not look at the rush, though? You're right, I've never been a kicker, but I have a few friends who have and they say that they're taught to ONLY look at the ball.

You keep talking about how I can't understand because I'm not a kicker. Are you?

[gosteelersben]

A kicker does not pay attention to a rush. You are correct. If a kicker is looking at the rush, he shouldn't be kicking in the NFL. Yet, a blocked kick is the same on the stat sheet for a kicker as a 20 foot wide right kick. I had the impression that you feel that a kicker should make any field goal. Be it in a 30 mph wind across the field, or in a blizzard or if a guy gets untouched off the edge when rushing the kick. Thats what they get paid to do? Right? come on...I was taught to look at a predetermined point. The point in which the holder puts his finger down where the kicker puts his kicking foot for the "spot" of the ball. When the holder picks his hand up to catch the snap(when he sees the ball beginning to be snapped), I am going to begin my approach to kick the ball that will be at the spot I told the holder to put it...

Yes, I was a kicker in hs and college...

[flock53]

See? Now THAT is a post with some substance! I completely agree with all of it, and now I think that I've seen your perspective.

Don't kickers not look at the rush, though? You're right, I've never been a kicker, but I have a few friends who have and they say that they're taught to ONLY look at the ball.

You keep talking about how I can't understand because I'm not a kicker. Are you?

WOW someone had to explain the "common sense". Alot of the other positions talk about getting in the grove of the game, getting carries catches and passes early and often to accomplish this. A kicker stands around cold for most of the game, and then has to run out there and make a kick, potentially to WIN a game. Thats not pressure?? I hope a kicker is ONLY looking at the ball. You dont have to be a kicker to know alot goes into the sucess of it, if the seams arent right, that could make it go one way or the other, just like a curveball. Thats not easily seen to the naked eye, just assume its a good hold.

[gosteelersben]

WOW someone had to explain the "common sense". Alot of the other positions talk about getting in the grove of the game, getting carries catches and passes early and often to accomplish this. A kicker stands around cold for most of the game, and then has to run out there and make a kick, potentially to WIN a game. Thats not pressure?? I hope a kicker is ONLY lokking at the ball.

A kicker shouldnt be looking at the ball. He should be focused on the predetermined spot he gives the holder(the spot in which he marks with his kicking foot - where the holder puts his hand closest to the kicker to mark the "spot"). The kicker should begin his approach when he see the holder lift his hand on the "spot" to catch the ball. This is because he knows that the holders instinct is to prepare to catch the ball when he sees the ball being snapped to him. That way, the kicker can focus primarily on the spot where he is going to kick the ball allowing for a more speedy approach thus eliminating his probability of making a mistake(ie picking his head up, wasting time following the flight of the ball from snapper to holder, etc).

[flock53]

A kicker shouldnt be looking at the ball. He should be focused on the predetermined spot he gives the holder(the spot in which he marks with his kicking foot - where the holder puts his hand closest to the kicker to mark the "spot"). The kicker should begin his approach when he see the holder lift his hand on the "spot" to catch the ball. This is because he knows that the holders instinct is to prepare to catch the ball when he sees the ball being snapped to him. That way, the kicker can focus primarily on the spot where he is going to kick the ball allowing for a more speedy approach thus eliminating his probability of making a mistake(ie picking his head up, wasting time following the flight of the ball from snapper to holder, etc).

I understand, you got me, even though the ball is eventually on that SPOT, and kicks the ball, if he kicks the spot, thats like chunking a 9 iron w/ a BIG divit :laugh:

[NewCliche21]

A kicker does not pay attention to a rush. You are correct. If a kicker is looking at the rush, he shouldn't be kicking in the NFL. Yet, a blocked kick is the same on the stat sheet for a kicker as a 20 foot wide right kick. I had the impression that you feel that a kicker should make any field goal. Be it in a 30 mph wind across the field, or in a blizzard or if a guy gets untouched off the edge when rushing the kick. Thats what they get paid to do? Right? come on...I was taught to look at a predetermined point. The point in which the holder puts his finger down where the kicker puts his kicking foot for the "spot" of the ball. When the holder picks his hand up to catch the snap(when he sees the ball beginning to be snapped), I am going to begin my approach to kick the ball that will be at the spot I told the holder to put it...

Yes, I was a kicker in hs and college...

Psh, no way! That's not what I thought at all. TBH, I started this about punting and kickoffs, where the kicker really does pretty much control everything.

An elite kicker could judge the rain drops, wind, etc., but I'm not asking for perfection. I just want a guy who can hit it consistently from 50 yards out. Is that so much to ask? If he has a bad holder or a bad snap, then yeah, not his fault. Just like if a quarterback throws a perfect pass and the receiver lets it bounce off his hands/chest into the arms of a DB, that shouldn't count as an interception. I think that we agree a lot more than you think.

Gotta admit, though, that THIS is unacceptable, even as a kicker:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35zXbiEPnKk&feature=related

[meek]

Ola Kimrin anybody....

[theivorhick]

I do like Suisham, but I agree that we should at least bring in some competition. It's not like it'd cost us much money. It's a kicker... So why not just bring in someone whom we think could push Suisham. It's normal that some people will thrive under pressure. Let's see what Double-S has got...

[Audible_Red40]

Competition is great.

But we're talking about our dumb Canadian, idiot kicker, who will probably just get liquored up and run his mouth off if competition is brought in.

[guinnesscrazy]

Knowing our luck, we'd bring in someone to compete with Suisham, the guy would do great in training camp, Suisham would get the boot and go on to have a solid career with a few pro-bowls peppered in with the Eagles or something......

[kuraitengai]

*Vanderjagt threads in 3...2...1...*

the funny thing about that is that i was bored with my franchise in madden, so i played superstar. and the team kept on signing vanderjagt, then i would use an editor to cut him, then the next week they would sign him again. and that happened like 3 times, and i was like 'screw it, and i just left him on the roster but 2nd string.

[tritx3]

he played well last season. i think not bringing in anyone to compete and letting him know they believe in him now should do lots for his confidence. Real talk... kickers need lots of confidence!

[Hiro]

I personally wouldn't mind us bringing in alittle competition to push Suisham, but I don't expect us to find anyone who could beat him out for the job.

If we were really concerned about Suisham, we probably would've drafted a kicker or something in the 7th round.

[turbodiesel#44]

Didn't we go into camp last year with only Swishy? My only reservation about the guy is the consistency of his kickoff depths. It would be nice to find a guy who could put it in the back of the EZ most of the time. Overall, he is a decent kicker and not one of our weaknesses.

[RammsteinSkins]

Connor Barth!

[bushwack]

Connor Barth!

Barth is already with Kansas City, and the Skins can bring in competition for Suisham, but Suisham will be our kicker week 1. IMO Suisham will also be the solid, reliable kicker the Skins have been lacking for the next decade.

[Muzzah]

Eh, I dunno, he kicked good last year. I think we should let him know that we have confidence in him. Plus who would we cut to bring in another kicker? We just cut Mathis so we could grab an undrafted rookie.

[SkinsMaster88]

Then they would not have re-signed him. Clearly, they want to have a competition. But, taking a punter in the sixth round confunds me, so you could be right. I have no clue. I personally thought Frost was very good last season, and deserved an extension, or at the very least, no competition.

For Suisham, he's still young, but has been solid. Someone pointed out the 80%. Room for improvement? Heck yeah, but it's something we have not had for a while.

The only competition out there is Vanderjact, Morten Andersen, Aaron Elling and John Carney. None compare at all to Suisham, who has the potential to stick with us longer than any of them.

Frost wasn't given that much of a vote of confidence: "Punter Derrick Frost accepted a one-year minimum contract offer..." I don't even think they even gave him any bonus. He was one of the 10 worst full-time punters in the NFL last season and still inconsistent.

The only thing for Suisham in terms of bringing in another kicker is to let him rest his leg so that he doesn't have to do all the kicks during the offseason. Other teams bring up other kickers despite having a main guy that's 99% guaranteed to be on the team.

[RammsteinSkins]

Barth is already with Kansas City, and the Skins can bring in competition for Suisham, but Suisham will be our kicker week 1. IMO Suisham will also be the solid, reliable kicker the Skins have been lacking for the next decade.

I know but they have 3 kickers on their roster so I believe he will be cut June 1st.

[wildbill1952]

Bring in an aging vet or another kicker just so Suisham has someone to pal around with and talk kicking.

Kickers are usually off by themselves at practice. Bring in an aging vet so that Suisham can talk kicking, not necessarily as someone who's going to take his place but as someone we can have in the background if Suisham should get hurt in pre-season. Everyone can learn the game better. Set Suisham down with someone who has been around the league for a while and show him how to block without getting killed when the holder drops the ball. Show him how to tackle without getting killed. Show him how to take an angle on the guy doing the runback so he's in the right place at the right time when someone does peel one off. Suisham doesn't necessaily need competition as much as he needs the same training every other football player needs.

Also, teach Suisham to punt and teach Brooks/Frost to kick an extra point. If either gets hurt in a game, you want someone to be able to step in. The week after the injury, they'll get a permanent replacement, but for the reaminder of the game, the other kicker is the most likely candidate to learn the position. It's all part of being prepared. I don't expect Suisham to boot 70 yard punts and I don't expect Brooks to boot 45 yard field goals, all I want is them prepared to take the other guy's job for the remainder of the game if one gets hurt.

And on Frost vs. Brooks, the coaches said they would look at the numbers and show it to the other guy and the numbers would decide who wins the competition. I think Brooks is going to win hands down barring injury and I think Frost is going to end up with one of the other 14 teams who had punters worse than he was. Just business. I haven't written him off yet, but he is in an uphill battle against Brooks. I wish him all the luck in the world, however it turns out.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

According to that SI article (or ESPN, I can't remember which), the 80 man limit to the training camp roster probably plays a larger part as to why there's no competition for Suisham than we realize.

Does anyone know if Durant Brookes can do kickoffs?

[bushwack]

I know but they have 3 kickers on their roster so I believe he will be cut June 1st.

If Barth can't be out the other 2 kickers on the Cheifs, who are Nick Novak and Billy Cundiff, what makes you think he can even come close to competing with Suisham? Suisham is heads and shoulders better than Novak and Cundiff, if we're going to bring in someone, lets bring in someone who can actually compete with Suisham and maybe make him a little better, not someone who is an absolute joke and is a waste of time and money.