Cambl2Moss Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I have edited this thread since many people think it has come down to race. Do not get me wrong, there are players of every race that have been trouble makers. This is the list of players arrested in the last year (AKA "troublemakers): http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sports/nfl/longterm/2006/nfl_chart_12162006.html Although the majority are black, there are "troublemakers" of all shapes and sizes. In past, there have been trouble makers such as Grant Winstrom. I wouldve loved to have him in his prime event though he was a "trouble maker". Why? Becuase he wouldve helped us win due to his skill. So there you have it. I dont care if you are white, brown, purple or green. I care if you can catch, throw, run, or sack. _________________________________________ Alot of people on this message board seem to question the character of players a bit too often in my opinion. Brandon Lloyd being a rapper, now Malcolm Kelly rapping in the locker room after a big win in the Big 12 championship. Ocho-Cinco having gold teeth and being talkative, or Randy Moss and his arrests from nearly 10 years ago. Now although I am a white male, not only do I find this racist to automatically label an individual as a trouble maker if they rap, are outspoken, or have been arrested nearly a decade ago, but I also find it interesting that those of you who question character are the first to complain when we do not put the best talent on the field. Malcolm Kelly has no arrest record. He does have 19 TD's in the last 2 seasons with Oklahoma however. He did average 18 yards a reception in this years Big 12 championship, and he does have the size and stature of a WR that people have created hundreds of threads here during the last few months (6-4, 220 lbs). Now obviously this is just a single case, but this also goes for all of the Ocho Cinco and the Randy Moss conversations prior to his signing with New England. As soon as we discuss the possibility of picking up an elite player, the majority of the posts surround off the field behavior rather than spectacular on-the-field play. What is more important? Winning the Superbowl, or the Man of the Year award?:2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4me58203 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I have been waiting for this post. Skins fans seem to want "saints" instead of players. I don't want a murderer on the team, but I don't care if he's ****y, loud or brash. If he can play bring em in. It's not like Dexter was a saint, or even John Riggins, or Wilbur Marshall. These guys were all loud and bucked authority. And when they played for us, we won, and won Super Bowls. People regard Rock as a "Core Skin". Sorry to tell you guys, Rock isn't taking us to the Bowl. Sign him for life if you want, but he wont be anything but a bench warmer his whole career. He won't even be returning kicks this year. And please don't tell me how he takes the ball to the 30 every time. Thats not that great of a feat, and it's mostly because of blocking. So follow Rock if you want, but it will only take you to a 6-10 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveFromYellowstone Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Haha these are the same people who said, "Grrr we don't need Randy Moss, he's nothing but trouble." Look how that turned out. Good character is a plus, but it is secondary to talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emor09 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Talent has to be #1 i'd put character #2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Adama Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Talent has to be #1i'd put character #2 I would actually have to say the opposite. Character above Talent. I want to be proud of the team we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smooter Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Say TO and Torry Holt are free agents. Both old, but with amazing talent. THAT'S when you can take character into consideration. I would then pick Holt over TO. But seriously, the reason we lost games last year and the years before was because Gibbs only brought in "good characters" and not always good players. It's always great to have good character on your team, but every team needs a superstar, and most superstars are what some of you call "trouble-makers". But they win, don't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4me58203 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I would actually have to say the opposite. Character above Talent. I want to be proud of the team we have. Then don't complain when we go 6-10 every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4me58203 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Character doesn't do anything for you on the field, except help you hold your head up after a loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambl2Moss Posted March 12, 2008 Author Share Posted March 12, 2008 Then don't complain when we go 6-10 every year. EXACTLY...I want to be proud of my team, but I am not proud of losers...I am proud of winners Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambl2Moss Posted March 12, 2008 Author Share Posted March 12, 2008 Character doesn't do anything for you on the field, except help you hold your head up after a loss. I love that...great quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xskin Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 What is more important? Winning the Superbowl, or the Man of the Year award?:2cents: As a person the latter would mean so much to me!!! but since I'm no football player, have no millions invested in it an have only the desire, love and satisfaction of watching the Redskins play every season, I would have to say the :logo: winning the Superbowl. Still, I think i would not justify any redskins player in jail or whatever, just because the have won a superbowl. I think that is not what this franchise looks forward to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfbovey Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Character does more than just help you hold your head up after a loss. It includes work ethic, leadership abilities and all kinds of other things that aren't really measurable. You can have all the talent in the world but if you don't work at your craft and decide to just float by, you'll end up out of the league or sitting on the bench like Brandon Lloyd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4me58203 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Ok...but Character doesn't = talent or skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfbovey Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Ok...but Character doesn't = talent or skill. No, it doesn't. But talent and skill may never meet it's full potential without character and discipline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[[ghost]] Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Then don't complain when we go 6-10 every year. Pretty much. Why don't we just get a bunch of James Thrashes and Jon Jansens and call it a day. I don't think Dallas is complaining about TO. A Happy Player is a Team Player. Of course, Character suddenly becomes a huge thing if a Player has a few character issues, so long as the player is one you don't want on your team. Three Months Ago, Chad Johnson wouldn't have been as ridiculed as he is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Who cares about Malcolm Kelly rapping in the locker room? He's not out beating women and shooting people and he's a hell of a receiver. Consider me on the Kelly bandwagon, if he's on the board at 21 we had better take him, he's going to be a very good NFL receiver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCchillin89 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I'd rather have a crappy team with great characters than a "Jail Blazer" or Bengal team that may win a lot of games, but have more arrests. I think one of the reasons why so many redskins fans address this character issue is because of the fact that we saw a train wreck in the Philadelphia Eagles and the TO saga. He does not have any arrests, but he is a locker room cancer, and we saw that experience firsthand, within the division. Yes, he may have gold teeth, but Your assessment about Chad Johnson only addresses the tip of the Iceberg. He got into fights with his coaches, players, shoved a member of the media. It's also reported that he punched Marvin Williams. Can you imagine him fighting with Zorn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I would actually have to say the opposite. Character above Talent. I want to be proud of the team we have. If they win i dont care what they really do off the field Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkekoa Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 You have to look at the posts. Lloyd was more interested in a rap career than playing football and football was not a priority. Kelly may have only been rapping in a locker room. I think most are saying the rap thing as a joke. In today's game, you have to consider character as a factor. If you don't, you pay Mike Vick for going to prison and Pacman for sitting out. These guys are talented but nobody knows to what extent guys are talented coming out of college. College talent doesn't necessarily equal NFL talent. Character concerns cannot be the sole basis for selecting a guy but it has to be considered. If two players are near equals, then you character has to be the deciding factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCchillin89 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Character can derail talent or skill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Character and talent should be gauged hand in hand. Too many posters on here want to judge a player by what others have said, rather than by that player's actual actions. Every time a player's character is questioned, many will automatically assume the worst, and interpret bits of info to accomodate their view of said player. Often times, the people bashing the player's character never stop to consider the player's surroundings, nor do they even mention them. Often times the players labeled with these problems are stuck on mediocre-at-best teams, with coaches who can't control the lockerroom (see Marvin Lewis, most any coach of the Raiders/Al Davis/, Petrino). And I agree with the OP. Implying that a player might have character issues simply because they rap is racist. Maybe not outright, and maybe not even intended, but it is. Character counts for a lot, but people need to consider reserving their judgment on player's they don't know, until the player's actions actually are detremental to a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[[ghost]] Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 A player ought to have enough character to take his job seriously, and work hard all year long. Work hard on game day, work hard in practice, work out hard during the off season. But otherwise, I don't care if he regularly has Gay Orgies with some of the ugliest guys in the world during the week, so long as he comes to work at practice and on game day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moorecards Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Also depends on age I think. Look at Taylor, he had some character issues at the beginning of his career, but I think the character of the team/locker room helped him learn and he did learn from past issues and changed his life around completely. I think it is a case by case issue. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodiesel#44 Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Talent has to be #1i'd put character #2 I would actually have to say the opposite. Character above Talent. I want to be proud of the team we have.I say neither. The main criteria has to be talent. Character should be looked at only as a deal breaker. And it depends on the definition of character. The guy must: Seem to get along and play well with others. An ego is OK, but not to the point of disrupting team chemistry Respect and recognize a coaches authority Honor his contract/commitment to the team Appear to be capable of staying out of jail Be reliable Not embarass the team Not have substance abuse or gambling problems All the other "character" traits are meaningless and should not be used as criteria. I don't care if: The guy goes to a different church, or no church at all Screws around on his wife Gets a speeding ticket now and then Doesn't like puppies, kittens or children Doesn't vote Parties past his bedtime now and then Caters naked boat parties Gets drunk on occasion and tells a Supreme Court Judge to loosen up Picks his nose in public You don't win a SB on character, you win it on talent and teamsmanship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chump Bailey Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I'm all for second chances and for being forgiving - obviously we're human and have our flaws. The only person that I would not make an exception for is Pacman. I truly believe this cat is clueless and not remorseful in the slightest. I would consider letting him back in only after several years of suspension and he kept his nose clean the whole time were the decision mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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