Memphis State #1 vs. Tennessee #2 (now Duke convo.) (poll included)

[Skins247]

The only guy on SI.com worth reading is Stew Mandel. The rest are hacks. I'll take Pat Forde over all of them.

But yeah, Duke is not the program it once was, and i'd take at least a dozen coaches over Coach K.

Edit: Why is he even IN this thread?

You would take a dozen coaches over Coach K? Ok, I'll bite. Could you please list those 12? Reason being, I need a good laugh.:laugh:

[jbooma]

So here's the dealio.... This Saturday is of course the battle between the only unbeaten college team left and our cross-state rivals the Vols. Having said that, tickets are ranging anywhere from $4000 to $10,000 plus :doh: (I know, right?) This is only the 2nd time in the Tigers long history that the team was ranked #1 and the 1st time for more than 12 hours :doh: :doh:

So here's my question.... Having said all of the above, and you had the cash to blow and Memphis State is your home team would you and how much you spend?

And who do you like?

:munchout:

I would spend $0

The game means NOTHING

[jbooma]

But yeah, Duke is not the program it once was, and i'd take at least a dozen coaches over Coach K.

Edit: Why is he even IN this thread?

I am not a Duke fan at all but Coach K is stll averaging 25 wins a year there in the ACC year after year, that is very impressive.

What 12 coaches would you list as better then Coach K???

[Touchdown Redskins]

Just because K hasn't won a title in recent years doesn't mean he still can't coach. That is ridiculous. Bobby Knight won 902 games. And even he only won 3 titles. I say "only" because Wooden has many more. But its hard to win titles, man. That's my point. Even Dean Smith, as great as he was, only won a few. I don't think K hasn't won more lately because of lack of talent, either. I don't buy that. Like I said, its not easy to win titles. And I really don't see the big deal over them losing to Wake Forest and Miami. Big deal. Wake has been on a roll lately. And Miami has proven that if you don't show up to play against them, or take them lightly, then you can be had. Even if you're Duke. But I do think maybe K messed up by talking about the way Roy handled Lawson's injury. I think that may have took some focuse away from him coaching his team.

And dude, Williams is a great coach. He also won at KU. And he quickly won a title at UNC. The guy can flat out coach. And he can recruit kids. And sure, it helps to be at UNC as far as recruiting. That school, for the most part, recruits on his own. But you still have to have a coach that can make it all come together. And that's where you aren't giving Roy enough credit.

But to say Pearl is a better coach, even currently, is just stupid. Seriously, man. What the **** have the Vols ever done with Pearl?

Winning titles are hard, but not when you have the #1 recruiting class every single year. Also, if you read that SI.com article I posted earlier, I think Coach K knows that he doesn't have very good talent. He hasn't scheduled many non-conference road games, and he rarely schedules non-conference games of any sort against heavyweights. His teams have routinely come up short since 2001, and that's because the talent he's recruiting is not the one-and-done type (Durant, Beasley, Oden, etc.).

As for Wake Forrest and Miami, I know that sometimes teams can get on a hot streak, and Duke always has a bullseye on their back, but really, you can't lose to unranked teams this late in the season. They've been doing that every single year, and it's becoming pretty routine. They also always seem to have trouble with teams full of athletes (for example, a Memphis or even a VCU last year).

Like I said before, Coach K is great, and he's obviously one of the best, but when you have such high expectations and don't crack the Sweet 16 (especially when you have 7 McDonald's All-Americans on your squad), something's wrong.

[Touchdown Redskins]

I am not a Duke fan at all but Coach K is stll averaging 25 wins a year there in the ACC year after year, that is very impressive.

What 12 coaches would you list as better then Coach K???

25 wins in the ACC is not what it used to be. The ACC will be lucky to get four teams in the tourney this year. I'm not saying that what he's done hasn't been remarkable, but when you have great recruiting, you better be getting 20+ victories a year. In any case, Duke isn't measured by regular season success (what college is?). It's measured by how it does in the tourney, which has been poor of late.

[Skins247]

Winning titles are hard, but not when you have the #1 recruiting class every single year. Also, if you read that SI.com article I posted earlier, I think Coach K knows that he doesn't have very good talent. He hasn't scheduled many non-conference road games, and he rarely schedules non-conference games of any sort against heavyweights. His teams have routinely come up short since 2001, and that's because the talent he's recruiting is not the one-and-done type (Durant, Beasley, Oden, etc.).

As for Wake Forrest and Miami, I know that sometimes teams can get on a hot streak, and Duke always has a bullseye on their back, but really, you can't lose to unranked teams this late in the season. They've been doing that every single year, and it's becoming pretty routine. They also always seem to have trouble with teams full of athletes (for example, a Memphis or even a VCU last year).

Like I said before, Coach K is great, and he's obviously one of the best, but when you have such high expectations and don't crack the Sweet 16 (especially when you have 7 McDonald's All-Americans on your squad), something's wrong.

Dude, simply having #1 recruiting classes doesn't automatically mean you should win a title every year. And Duke doesn't have good talent? And Coach K knows this?:laugh: Sure, man. They have awful talent, you're right. Poor K. As for what kind of talent he's recruiting? So what! It has been proven you can win, whether you recruit one-and-done types or lifers. That's meaningless.

As for the WF and Miami losses. Again, I wouldn't read anything into it. You do realize that both those teams are fighting for their NCAA lives, right? And we'ren't both on the road? Last I checked, winning on the road in the ACC wasn't a breeze. Hell, just ask Clemson about going to Chapel Hill.

[PleaseBlitz]

You would take a dozen coaches over Coach K? Ok, I'll bite. Could you please list those 12? Reason being, I need a good laugh.:laugh:

I would, but im sure a Duke nuthugger like you would rather have Coach K than anyone. The man does less with more talent than anyone in the NCAA. He couldnt get out of the first round last year.

FACT: He's been past the Sweet 16 ONCE in the last 7 years. :yawnee:

[Skins247]

25 wins in the ACC is not what it used to be. The ACC will be lucky to get four teams in the tourney this year. I'm not saying that what he's done hasn't been remarkable, but when you have great recruiting, you better be getting 20+ victories a year. In any case, Duke isn't measured by regular season success (what college is?). It's measured by how it does in the tourney, which has been poor of late.

ROFL@ "winning 25 wins in the ACC isn't what it used to be". Dude, 25 wins in ANY conference is getting it done, especially in a conference like the ACC. And getting to the tourney is first and foremost for Duke. And they accomplish that goal every year. Again, its TOUGH to win a title! You don't automatically win with the best talent on "paper". If that were the case don't you think the Yanks would have a title or three in the last 5 years? Afterall, they had a payroll over 200 MILLION dollars! While most teams didn't even have a payroll of even a million. You're a typical Duke-hater. And FWIW, im not even a Duke fan, man. My opinion is completely an un-biased one.

[jbooma]

I would, but im sure a Duke nuthugger like you would rather have Coach K than anyone. The man does less with more talent than anyone in the NCAA. He couldnt get out of the first round last year.

FACT: He's been past the Sweet 16 ONCE in the last 7 years. :yawnee:

How many coaches have made it to the sweet 16 as much as K in that same time frame???

Sorry but the guy is still one of the best coaches in the league.

I hate Duke but respect Coack K a lot.

[jbooma]

25 wins in the ACC is not what it used to be. The ACC will be lucky to get four teams in the tourney this year. I'm not saying that what he's done hasn't been remarkable, but when you have great recruiting, you better be getting 20+ victories a year. In any case, Duke isn't measured by regular season success (what college is?). It's measured by how it does in the tourney, which has been poor of late.

Sorry but getting 25 wins in any conference year after year is awesome.

Who cares about where recruiting classes are ranked, that is the most overated thing in all of sports. Look at football how are those teams with all the #1 ranked classes doing??

What other team in the NCAA has made it to the sweet 16 what 6 or 7 straight seasons? That is no small feat.

I will remind you I hate Duke, but respect Coach K tremendously.

[PleaseBlitz]

How many coaches have made it to the sweet 16 as much as K in that same time frame???

Sorry but the guy is still one of the best coaches in the league.

I hate Duke but respect Coack K a lot.

Last 3 tourney: Cumulative wins.

Cumulative wins in the NCAA tournament, 2005-2007:

UNC - 8

Florida -8

UCLA -6

Illinois - 6

Louisville - 5

WVU - 5

Kentucky - 5

Villanova -5

Michigan State - 5

George Mason - 4

Arizona - 4

LSU - 4

Texas - 4

Memphis - 4

Duke - 4

Wisconsin - 4

Boston College - 4

Duke has the same number of wins as GEORGE MASON! :rotflmao:

And you contend that K does a LOT with the talent he has?

Edit: Someone with half a brain could figure out a whole bunch of the dozen+ coaches i'd rather have than K.

[jbooma]

Duke has the same number of wins as GEORGE MASON! :rotflmao:

And you contend that K does a LOT with the talent he has?

Edit: Someone with half a brain could figure out a whole bunch of the dozen+ coaches i'd rather have than K.

You said 6 out of the last 7, so lets see that

So you are saying because coaches have performed better the last 3 years makes them better then a coach that has done for so long and actually has a ring. Very interesting philosphy you have

I think we need to do a national review on what the hell they teach you guys at WVU :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[Touchdown Redskins]

Sorry but getting 25 wins in any conference year after year is awesome.

Who cares about where recruiting classes are ranked, that is the most overated thing in all of sports. Look at football how are those teams with all the #1 ranked classes doing??

What other team in the NCAA has made it to the sweet 16 what 6 or 7 straight seasons? That is no small feat.

I will remind you I hate Duke, but respect Coach K tremendously.

Like I said, he's a great coach, and he definitely gets it done year after year. The problem is, he gets it done in the regular season. As for recruiting classes, it's much, much easier to recruit college basketball players than college football players. And for Duke, the Sweet 16 is a failure. Their goal is to win the title every year, and if they set such high standards, they should be ready to be judged by that same standard.

Also, 25 wins against a very weak non-conference schedule in a down year for the ACC isn't very hard. Hell, Maryland averages better than a 20-win season in the ACC, but it doesn't mean much come tourney time.

[Gator Bait]

Last 3 tourney: Cumulative wins.

Cumulative wins in the NCAA tournament, 2005-2007:

UNC - 8

Florida -8

UCLA -6

Illinois - 6

Louisville - 5

WVU - 5

Kentucky - 5

Villanova -5

Michigan State - 5

George Mason - 4

Arizona - 4

LSU - 4

Texas - 4

Memphis - 4

Duke - 4

Wisconsin - 4

Boston College - 4

Duke has the same number of wins as GEORGE MASON! :rotflmao:

And you contend that K does a LOT with the talent he has?

Edit: Someone with half a brain could figure out a whole bunch of the dozen+ coaches i'd rather have than K.

of course you wouldn't dream to think of how who has won the most final 4s in the last 20 years. Or who was chosen to coach the USA national team

someone with a half a brain could figure out that one

[PleaseBlitz]

You said 6 out of the last 7, so lets see that

Go ahead and put it together. You dont need me to hold your hand and walk you through it.

So you are saying because coaches have performed better the last 3 years makes them better then a coach that has done for so long and actually has a ring. Very interesting philosphy you have

I know you read what i wrote because you quoted it. I said "But yeah, Duke is not the program it once was, and i'd take at least a dozen coaches over Coach K."

Duke USED to be really really good. They arent anymore. Lots of better programs.

I think we need to do a national review on what the hell they teach you guys at WVU :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

You went to a commuter school so :stfu:

[jbooma]

Their goal is to win the title every year, and if they set such high standards, they should be ready to be judged by that same standard.

I don't think any team has those type of standards in todays NCAA's. Over the past 10 years the quality of all the teams have taken a huge step then what it was like before. Mason proved that any team hot at the end can make a run if they get the right teams to play in the tourny.

[PleaseBlitz]

of course you wouldn't dream to think of how who has won the most final 4s in the last 20 years. Or who was chosen to coach the USA national team

someone with a half a brain could figure out that one

Again, you need to enhance your reading skills like Booma.

But yeah, Duke is not the program it once was, and i'd take at least a dozen coaches over Coach K.

10-20 years ago, great program. Since 2001, not nearly worthy of the attention they get.

When bashing Coach K, its always a good idea to just plagerize Mjah, so i will.

Hate Coack K huh. Yeah you should hate him. Hate him for getting the most out of all his players.

This is a myth that you've swallowed hook, line, and sinker. It's a well-know fact that K does not get the most out of his players. He stacks his team chock full of All-Americans year after year, builds what on paper looks like the best team hands-down, yet fails to make it to the Final Four even half the time. Given the raw material he starts with, that's called underperformance.

Getting bounced before the Elite Eight is downright humiliation for the teams K puts together -- and yet, it happens with alarming frequency.

Hate him for running a great program.

You are confusing a winning program with a great program.

How many "great programs" recruit and start rapists? Is that "great?"

Shelden Williams should know by now that No Means No, because opposing fans frequently hold up giant signs to that effect, hoping he'll learn.

Of course, they're assuming that he can read.

How many "great programs" are led by coaches who try to browbeat their school's undergraduate newspaper reporters into submission by sticking them in a locker room full of imposing basketball players and cursing at them for half and hour?

Is that "great?"

Coaching players to take unprecedented numbers of hilarious flops, in a desperate attempt to win a game even at the sacrifice of the team's credibility?

Is that "great?"

The word you meant to use is shameful.

Hate him for yelling at refs like every other head coach in the country trying to do everything they can to help their team win.

Now it's abundantly clear that you have no perspective at all.

Can you identify the speaker of the following quote?

"You cannot allow people to go around pointing at officials and yelling at them without technicals being called. That is just not allowed. So let's get some things straight around here and quit the double standard that exists in this league, all right?"

Who was that?

Here's a hint: his name rhymes with "Roach K." And he was talking about Dean Smith, whose legacy as a good coach and a good human being K will never catch.

Yet today, K does exactly the same thing he whined about to the press back when it was inconvenient to him.

How many other coaches would cry to the press like spoiled little babies about this, just to turn around and do the very same thing?

Mommy, the bad man is saying cuss words. Oh, my virgin ears!

Oh, and by the way, $*%& you ref. That call was horse$#!+.

Why isn't Coach K tossed out of every game he coaches -- at his own insistence?

Now, what's that were you saying about your favorite hypocrite head coach?

[jbooma]

Duke USED to be really really good. They arent anymore. Lots of better programs.

:

Which you still have not named so go ahead we are waiting

please do not say WVU :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[PleaseBlitz]

Which you still have not named so go ahead we are waiting

please do not say WVU :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

I just listed a whole bunch. ****, can you not read?

[PleaseBlitz]

BTW, does it shock anyone that Jbooma is a Duke fan? :rotflmao:

[jbooma]

I just listed a whole bunch. ****, can you not read?

I thought you were kidding about this list, I guess not:

UNC - 8

Florida -8

UCLA -6

Illinois - 6

Louisville - 5

WVU - 5

Kentucky - 5

Villanova -5

Michigan State - 5

George Mason - 4

Arizona - 4

LSU - 4

Texas - 4

Memphis - 4

Duke - 4

Wisconsin - 4

Boston College - 4

[jbooma]

BTW, does it shock anyone that Jbooma is a Duke fan? :rotflmao:

I guess you can't read since I posted a couple of times in this thread that I hate DUKE :doh: :doh:

[PleaseBlitz]

I guess you can't read since I posted a couple of times in this thread that I hate DUKE :doh: :doh:

Yeah, just like you hate Michigan. :laugh:

Waiting for you to address ANY of the arguments put forth in this thread. :yawnee:

You can start with:

And you contend that K does a LOT with the talent he has?

Or anything in the post i quoted from Mjah.

[jbooma]

Yeah, just like you hate Michigan. :laugh:

Waiting for you to address ANY of the arguments put forth in this thread. :yawnee:

You can start with:

Oh I do hate michigan and duke and the yankees they are the teams i hate the most.

Lets say I thought I just told you with the "talent" he has he still averages 25 wins a year and at least makes it to the sweet 16. I don't see many other coaches that can say the same over a long period of time, can you, didn't think so.

The other point people put way to much stock in this term "#1" ranked classes etc... for any sport. Who cares if you get a ton of McDonalds all-americans or best players etc... you have no clue what that will translate to at the next level.

If you look at the other coaches in the ACC no one else can say they are as consistent as K, not Gary, not Roy, not anyone. Year after year Duke is always fighting for the conference title. Can you name another team in any of the other large conferences that can say that, no.

[SlobberknockerSkinsFan]

Geez, I'm gone for a few hours and my thread had reverted bake to Duke?

Neways, thanks to those who will vote, and have voted. Maybe i'll check back in another 3 hours, and hear more hate about my Wolverines...

Oh, hey there Booma.....