Karl Rove to quit at end of August

[The Evil Genius]

Either way Sarge, it's a dishonest approach.

[chomerics]

"You fight with the military you have"

A nice way for Rummy to say "The last adminstration gutted the military and left it in the condition it's in now, and so this is what we have to fight with"

Funny, but hasn't THIS administration had 6 FREAKIN YEARS to build up the military's numbers???? Nah, ignore the relevant facts, and blame the other guy. Ignore the fact that our troop numbers have not gone up significantly WHEN WE ARE FIGHTING A GOD DAMN WAR, and blame Clinton. . .

but Clinton. . .but Clinton. . .but Clinton. . .STFU, grow a set of balls, and start placing the blame where it belongs. At the heals of the people who had no freaking clue how to use a military, how to utilize people, how to recruit, and how to WIN A FREAKIN WAR!!! Nah, blame the other guy :doh: If it weren't so completely sad, and horrific, it would actually be laughable. . . but the 3000+ soldiers who have died, and the 50,000+ soldiers that have been injured are all part of the game these chicken hawks with no military experience played. . .too bad the chicken's coming home to roost now isn't it. . .

[chomerics]

Either way Sarge, it's a dishonest approach.

That is the only approach Sarge has, because if he was honest, he could never defend these guys.

[twa]

Chom, if you really want to grow the military,enlist :laugh:

Hell, I not only defend em,I'm sending my daughter to college with his kid.

[Buddy Dude]

several constitutional violations, and many crimes too late.

Not that it matters to me, it really doesn't, but I haven't really followed this story as much as I probably should have. Outside of what CNN has claimed, has there been any actual proof of either of these? If so, what in the COnstitution did he violate, and what crimes did he committ?

I'm honest about wanting to know, because I have no idea.

[Buddy Dude]

blame Clinton. . .

but Clinton. . .but Clinton. . .but Clinton. . .STFU, grow a set of balls, and start placing the blame where it belongs. At the heals of the people who had no freaking clue how to use a military, how to utilize people, how to recruit, and how to WIN A FREAKIN WAR!!!

Several things wrong with this post.....

Clinton severely depleted the military, that's a fact nobody argues. Secondly, it doesn't take balls, as you say, to place blame on someone for anything. Also, last time I checked, it was up to the MILITARY to recruit, not the government.

Lastly, when was the last war that was won under a Democrat? Thank you very much. Democrats are ******* in the face of war. Instead of settling issues, they sidestep them and hope they'll go away.

Whether you want to admit it or not, Clinton and his lack of balls is why we were faced with the problems of a weak military, the Taliban, and Al Qaeda. He had the chance to stand up and stop it before it got out of control, but he didn't. He ignored the facts and warnings for 8 years, and Bush was left to deal with it.

To Bush's credit, it isn't stupidity on his part that's gotten us in this situation. It's his arrogance, and his solid belief that the people around him know what they're doing.

Outside of Condi, nobody in the administration has a clue about much more than how to blink. As far as Cheney goes, that ****er's nuts, i don't know what to make of him, but at least he's funny.:laugh:

[chomerics]

Chom, if you really want to grow the military,enlist :laugh:

I could never take the authoritarian structure of the military, I question EVERYTHING in life, the last thing the military needs is a 36 year old man who questions authority :laugh:

[Buddy Dude]

I could never take the authoritarian structure of the military, I question EVERYTHING in life, the last thing the military needs is a 36 year old man who questions authority :laugh:

Translation: I couldn't handle it.

[Predicto]

Translation: I couldn't handle it.

Here's a hint.

The personal attacks about enlisting or not enlisting are not any more compelling when you make them than they were when they were made against you earlier.

Keep it above board.

[chomerics]

Several things wrong with this post.....

Clinton severely depleted the military, that's a fact nobody argues.

If by "depletion" you mean "cut their bloated funding at a time we were not at war" I agree with you. Why should we have funded the military at a war level during peacetime? To keep the military industrial complex going full speed ahead? We already outspend the next 20 nations combined on defense, at what cost? Why do we need to fund a military like we are at war, unless we want to start a war that is unnecessary ie. Iraq

Secondly, it doesn't take balls, as you say, to place blame on someone for anything.

Actually, yes, it does take balls to blame the party you supported, and rallied with for the past 6 years. It is called admitting a mistake, and admitting you are wrong. That takes balls to do, and some people lack the testicular substance to do so.

Also, last time I checked, it was up to the MILITARY to recruit, not the government.

Ummm. . .who can dictate how many troops we have? Can the military just go out and hire 100,000 troops without congressional approval? Can they just massively increase their recruitment numbers without congressional support? nope. Congress can dictate to the military how and where to spend their money, it is what is debated on and voted on. Congress doesn't just give the military a check for $600Billion dollars and turn their back, they get itemized lists of what the costs are, and they debate what will be funded and what won't be funded. The federal government has the right to go to the DOD and say we 400,000 more troops get them here is the money, and the DOD has the right to say to the gov't "we need more troops".

What happened was that the DOD leaders said to Rummy "we need more troops", and Rummy said, we can do it with less, revise your plan. When they came back and said the same thing, he said we can do it with less. This was a governmental choice by this administration to take over a country with the amount of troops they deemed necessary, and the military commanders who disagreed with them were given their walking papers. So they either agreed with their outlandish plan, or were told you have no job. Nice way to run a country huh. . .

Lastly, when was the last war that was won under a Democrat?

How about WWII!!! Better yet, tell me when a war was won by a republican! Gulf I wasn't a real war either. . .so hmm. . .maybe the civil war with Lincoln???

Thank you very much. Democrats are ******* in the face of war.

Unlike the republicans who have never served in war, never been shot at, and never even spent a single day in the military. . .well, sorry Dubya did have that stint in the National Guard (when he actually was there) where he played with his toys when he wasn't getting drunk, doing coke and cheer leading. But that was just to avoid the Vietnam war, and besides his daddy was big and powerful man, so his time in the guard was time served to avoid the draft.

Instead of settling issues, they sidestep them and hope they'll go away.

Like Regan did with Beiruit right? Wait. . .he cut and ran. . .that COWARD!!!!

He had the chance to stand up and stop it before it got out of control, but he didn't. He ignored the facts and warnings for 8 years, and Bush was left to deal with it.

What a load of crap, and I can tell that you have not been around here that much, because we all know it is a joke. Clinton failed at getting Bin Laden, yet he did, he failed. . .but he tried something. He tried to get the SOB. He went after him. Bush did nothing! Absolutely nothing for 9 months, until we were attacked. . .on his watch. . . after an entire month of vacation.

To Bush's credit, it isn't stupidity on his part that's gotten us in this situation. It's his arrogance, and his solid belief that the people around him know what they're doing.

Try to clean it up with your use of the word arrogance, but stupidity, moronic, ignorant, they are all the same thing, they all point to the same problem. The president, and the people around him don't know what the hell they are doing with ANYTHING! Bush is a Sadim (midas in reverse). Everything he touches turns to crap.

Outside of Condi, nobody in the administration has a clue about much more than how to blink.

And Bush surrounding himself with a bunch of half wits, morons, and ignoramuses who don't know how to think is not his fault. . .nope, no sir, it's Clinton's :doh:

[chomerics]

Translation: I couldn't handle it.

Umm, no, I could handle the military just fine. I can handle authoritarian figures, and PT, it's all just a bunch of BS anyway. The reason I did not enlist is because it is not a place for a person who questions everything in life, and likes to challenge people a lot. It is a place for a yes man, someone who obeys orders, someone who lets others think for them. That is not a place for me, and I very wisely know my lot in life.

I grew up in the military, and I know what the life entails. I also know it is not a place I belong, because I take nothing at face value, and question everything in life. That is not what you want in the military, that is not the right mentality, and simply knowing this, and knowing that is not what I want to do in life, makes me a happier person overall.

Maybe you should actually try to comprehend some of the words people tell you here, because there are a lot of wise people on this board, people who know a heck of a lot about a issues. People who are a lot smarter than either you or I, and people you can learn a lot from. . .I am not expecting it, but hey words of advice are free right, so why not take advantage of the cost benefit?

[Sarge]

Funny, but hasn't THIS administration had 6 FREAKIN YEARS to build up the military's numbers???? Nah, ignore the relevant facts, and blame the other guy. Ignore the fact that our troop numbers have not gone up significantly WHEN WE ARE FIGHTING A GOD DAMN WAR, and blame Clinton. . .

but Clinton. . .but Clinton. . .but Clinton. . .STFU, grow a set of balls, and start placing the blame where it belongs. At the heals of the people who had no freaking clue how to use a military, how to utilize people, how to recruit, and how to WIN A FREAKIN WAR!!! Nah, blame the other guy :doh: If it weren't so completely sad, and horrific, it would actually be laughable. . . but the 3000+ soldiers who have died, and the 50,000+ soldiers that have been injured are all part of the game these chicken hawks with no military experience played. . .too bad the chicken's coming home to roost now isn't it. . .

I hear the draft board is looking for you to bolster our numbers

Of course, you'd be off to Canada then, eh?

[Sarge]

If by "depletion" you mean "cut their bloated funding at a time we were not at war" I agree with you. Why should we have funded the military at a war level during peacetime? To keep the military industrial complex going full speed ahead? We already outspend the next 20 nations combined on defense, at what cost? Why do we need to fund a military like we are at war, unless we want to start a war that is unnecessary ie. Iraq

Uh, in case there is a war. Military's don't just sprout overnight, something Klinton never understood

[Buddy Dude]

Here's a hint.

The personal attacks about enlisting or not enlisting are not any more compelling when you make them than they were when they were made against you earlier.

Keep it above board.

There's a difference, I actually served

[The Evil Genius]

Let it be known - from hence forth - only those who served can comment on the military.

[Buddy Dude]

If by "depletion" you mean "cut their bloated funding at a time we were not at war"

That, along with the closure of several bases.

Ummm. . .who can dictate how many troops we have? Can the military just go out and hire 100,000 troops without congressional approval?

Yes, it's called recruiting. Can you sit there with a straight face and tell me that Congress would step in and tell them to quit signing people up if healthy, young, able bodied people wanted to join?

How about WWII!!! Better yet, tell me when a war was won by a republican! Gulf I wasn't a real war either. . .so hmm. . .maybe the civil war with Lincoln???

Wow, twice in the last 142 years? And the last time was 62 years ago? And you're actually bragging about this?

For the record, we got our ass handed to us in Vietnam and Somalia, under Democratic rule, both being more recent than WWII.

Democrats win wars almost as much as the French.

Unlike the republicans who have never served in war, never been shot at, and never even spent a single day in the military. . .well, sorry Dubya did have that stint in the National Guard (when he actually was there) where he played with his toys when he wasn't getting drunk, doing coke and cheer leading. But that was just to avoid the Vietnam war, and besides his daddy was big and powerful man, so his time in the guard was time served to avoid the draft.

Are you even aware that over 75% of the military consistently votes Republican? This disproves your point completely. Liberals are labeled as ******* for a reason, because they are.

Let me ask you this chom.....How come you'll sit there and dog Bush about military service, without also throwing in a counterpoint.....Like John Kerry receiving a purple heart for a paper cut? Or John F. Kennedy receiving a Medal Of Honor after losing his boat? Something anyone else would have received a Court Martial for if they didn't have a powerful family backing them?

What a load of crap, and I can tell that you have not been around here that much, because we all know it is a joke. Clinton failed at getting Bin Laden, yet he did, he failed. . .but he tried something. He tried to get the SOB.

Oh, I forgot, anyone that's new to the board is retarded in your eyes, because obviously I was just born and have never seen the light of day, because I'm new here.

Call me crazy, but last time I checked, the board almost unanimously agrees that you're a crackpot fool that spouts off at the mouth, and only backs your arguments with incessent whining and ****ing instead of actual facts and evidence.:doh:

Unlike you, I live in the real world. I know my information from a combination of common sense, living the facts, public records, and not believing what CNN tells me.

Bush is a Sadim (midas in reverse). Everything he touches turns to crap.[/Quote]

I think I'm gonna be sick, I almost completely agree with you on something.

[The Evil Genius]

n/m

doublepost...doh!

[chomerics]

I hear the draft board is looking for you to bolster our numbers

Of course, you'd be off to Canada then, eh?

\

Actually Sarge, I think we SHOULD have a draft. If you want to fix the mess your boys created, then you SHOULD do it the right way. . .which yes, would require a draft. Heck, if they drafted me I'd go, I have no qualms about it. . .I doubt they have a need for a 36yr old man with a penchant for challenging authority though.

[Patrick Evidente]

\

Actually Sarge, I think we SHOULD have a draft.

He would probably disagree with you on that.

[Buddy Dude]

\

Actually Sarge, I think we SHOULD have a draft. If you want to fix the mess your boys created, then you SHOULD do it the right way. . .which yes, would require a draft. Heck, if they drafted me I'd go, I have no qualms about it. . .I doubt they have a need for a 36yr old man with a penchant for challenging authority though.

You'd have no worries, you know, once you told them you were gay and all. Only Jokes:laugh:

Seriously though, you need to lighten up a lot.

For someone who claims to love their country and the military so much, you sure seem to hate everything there is about both.

Whether you agree with certain policies or not is irrelevant. Be proud of the fact you live in the greatest country in the world and quit ****ing about it.

There's plenty of places for you and Alec Baldwin to go if you think things are so horrible.

You really oughta drink more. Or move out of boston, the Democratic stench in the air is rotting your mind.

Holy ****, I can't imagine if you've been there you whole life. It would certainly explain a whole lot, as far as your views go. I can't really fault you if the only thing you've been fed your whole life is liberal BS. I just don't know if that might be the whole problem. :whoknows:

[Buddy Dude]

Maybe you should actually try to comprehend some of the words people tell you here, because there are a lot of wise people on this board, people who know a heck of a lot about a issues. People who are a lot smarter than either you or I, and people you can learn a lot from. . .I am not expecting it, but hey words of advice are free right, so why not take advantage of the cost benefit?

You know, you could learn a lot from that statement. Such as practice what you preach, heed your own advice, etc.

[Popeman38]

Let's see he rigged an election, was apart of a war that cost lives unnecessarily, possibly leaked info, anything else? He's getting out while he can, probably trying to avoid prosecution. :helmet:

Internet intelligence, you gotta love it.

[chomerics]

That, along with the closure of several bases.

And the closure of several bases did not occur under republican leadership? Are you seriously this ignorant, or do you honestly not know about the BRAC closures under Bush?

Yes, it's called recruiting. Can you sit there with a straight face and tell me that Congress would step in and tell them to quit signing people up if healthy, young, able bodied people wanted to join?

do you even know what a budget is and how it is run? Do you understand how the process works? Do you have a clue as to how a budget is passed? For someone that has been in the military, you are obviously quite uninformed on how the military actually gets paid, spends and allocates money.

Wow, twice in the last 142 years? And the last time was 62 years ago? And you're actually bragging about this?

yea, WWII is nothing to be proud of huh. . .

For the record, we got our ass handed to us in Vietnam and Somalia, under Democratic rule, both being more recent than WWII.

Funny, but from 1968-1976 who was president? Oh yea, that Nixon fella along with Ford. . .when did we leave Vietnam? Why did we leave Vietnam? And how do you get your "ass" handed to you when you have a kill ratio of over 100/1?

Democrats win wars almost as much as the French.

The sad thing is that you actually believe this garbage, and you haven't a clue to why.

Are you even aware that over 75% of the military consistently votes Republican? This disproves your point completely. Liberals are labeled as ******* for a reason, because they are.

how does having a predominantly ® voting military prove that Bush was ignorant, and ill prepared at in going to war? How does it disprove that Rummy isn't a moron? how does it disprove anything I say? Just because a block of people vote for one party means absolutely nothing in the ability of a party to conduct a war. you have Iraq as the poster child for this!!!!

Let me ask you this chom.....How come you'll sit there and dog Bush about military service, without also throwing in a counterpoint.....Like John Kerry receiving a purple heart for a paper cut? Or John F. Kennedy receiving a Medal Of Honor after losing his boat? Something anyone else would have received a Court Martial for if they didn't have a powerful family backing them?

WOW, yep, you are "one of them". . . I know of your type, you are a person who puts your ideology before your country. You have the unmitigated gall to dress down people who actually served to protect a person who was doing coke and cheerleading while he was serving.

Oh, I forgot, anyone that's new to the board is retarded in your eyes,

because obviously I was just born and have never seen the light of day, because I'm new here.

Nope, not someone new. . .but instead someone with absolutely no substance to their discussion, and nothing to offer in terms of dialog except for campaign slogans and party one liners. You, are a GREAT example of what is wrong with this country, and YOU are the type of person responsible for all of the animosity and decisiveness seen. Maybe if you would remove your head from Dubya's arse, and cleaned the crap out of your eyes, you could understand what I am telling you. . .but then again, it is not expected from the likes of people like you.

We run across your kind every once in a while in the tailgate, people who show up, sprout the latest propaganda they've read on Drudge, or recycled off of their hate e-mail lists and disappear. You do serve as a good whipping boy for those of us who actually know what we are talking about though, because your ignorant writing is a flag to everyone here.

Call me crazy, but last time I checked, the board almost unanimously agrees that you're a crackpot fool that spouts off at the mouth, and only backs your arguments with incessent whining and ****ing instead of actual facts and evidence.:doh:

Unlike you, I live in the real world. I know my information from a combination of common sense, living the facts, public records, and not believing what CNN tells me

LMAO, your "real world" consists of reading lies about what is going on in Iraq, meanwhile, those of us who actually know what is happening around us are not surprised when we see things like the '06 elections. We've been forecasting the breakup of the GOP, and the splintering of your party for the past 2 years, and now you look around saying happened to my party??? And if ANYTHING, I back up my stuff all the time with every known data point, and regression curve I can find to back it. . .again, the old ASS U ME adage bites you in the head.

We've been telling you that Iraq was not winnable with what you went in with, and it was not worth the cost. We've been telling you what the truth is, not what you want to believe. . . but that is ok, continue off living in your "real world". We need the likes of you to pop your head in here every now and then to make a glaring example of how not to behave. Now go off and read the latest Colter rant about evil liberals, listen to Rush tell you how liberals are evil and then close the night masturbating to Hannity singing the national anthem. Your reality is a fine bubble you live in . . . too bad it is as real as a Narnia.

[chomerics]

He would probably disagree with you on that.

Of course he would, because that would be how to win the war in Iraq. . .

[Dictator]

You, are a GREAT example of what is wrong with this country, and YOU are the type of person responsible for all of the animosity and decisiveness seen.

Chomerics,

Do you own a mirror?