thumbs up, thumbs down.. who looked good.. who didnt (merged)

[SkinsWizCubsDukes]

Ade Jimoh sucks, please let Byron Westbrook take his spot.

Jansen is a disgrace to all "Pro Bowl" lineman. He was overmatched and outplayed on every down.

Collins is better than Brunell...for certain...I have been saying this since last preseason.

HB blades looked amazing, a great steal in the draft.

I was very impressed with the defense, most notably the front 7 led by LF, and also I was impressed with the receivers on offense.

The o-line needs work (or Samuels to come back), and Campbell looked a little rusty IMO, but once he continues to get more comfortable and gets some better blocking he will be fine. RBs didn't show me anything special but that is probably due to the o-line.

It all starts up front and the d-line did great and o-line didn't. Point blank, but I am very excited about the re-vamped defense.

[redskins55]

Thumbs Down

"Consistancy". We need to develop an early rythem and keep it going throughout the game.

Thumbs up

"Playmakers"

Even though we didnt get into the endzone, we clearly have playmakers on offense and defense. We definately have a differnet team this year.

[Om]

Monte55Coleman,

Thumbs up for a solid OP and starting a good thread.

Thumbs down for your user name.

For shame.

[bubba9497]

Thumps up the Redskin Cheerleaders

[SkinsTerps26]

Thumps up the Redskin Cheerleaders

were they even at the game???

[SkinSince87]

since no one is mentioning Springs I will, on every other tackle I saw a 2 and was thinking Taylor coming up but then he stood and I saw a 4 with the 2.

[cphil006]

Affter years of not drafting quality O-lineman in the second, third, and forth rounds, it is really catching up with us. We need depth at o-line. Second stringers who are young and can actually play.

[Gregpeck99]

Thumbs up for Eric Edwards (#84) ... Eric who?

[BigRay]

I give JC thumbs up considering he didn't have the best protection in the world and he kind of took a beating out there he stood in there and threw the ball he made some good throws.

[ouvan59]

so did 10 other qbs in the reg season and 14 if you count

preseason..geez..beating David Carr..Eli..Bledsoe..Leftwich..

and Brees...who was the only decent qb they beat that had a good season

It was Romo sits to pee that the Skins beat not Bledsoe. And at this point Brad Johnson = Mark Brunell = Done. Brad looked just as bad as Brunell did this week. Matt Moore looked tons better than Brad.

[SHYSTER411]

I did not get to see the game on Saturday and was wondering if Marcus Washington lined up at defensive end at all like they said they are going to be using him this year? If so did he look like he is going to be effective. I didn't really want to start an entirely new thread for this one question.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

who looked good:

our dline in run defense - if they play like this all year ill be eating my words with mustard and ketchup. this is EXACTLY what they should have been doing last year. STUFFING the LOS. we held the titans to 2.5 yards pery carry on the ground, which is beastly. granted the titans dont have a good running offense anymore, but the way our dline clogged holes and allowed our LBs to make plays is what we should be excited about.

landry and fletcher - two of the standouts, fletcher was everywhere and landry made some very nice plays for a rookie, that blitz he had was pure evidence that his speed is still top notch and williams will most likely send him a good deal. but fletcher looks that good when our dline is performing the way it did. if we can sustain that type of play from our front four all year, fletcher is going to have a pro bowl caliber year. he needs to hold on to interceptions as well haha.

santana moss - two very nice catches, that deep one was reminiscent of 05 and hopefully we see more of that. he completely pwned that corner he was up with and his speed is obviously still in tact. randle el looked pretty good too, its a shame he couldnt hold on to that on over the middle (although he took a mighty hit).

who didnt look good:

our dline pass rush - again, NO PRESSURE at all. we didnt log a sack and collins had way too much time to set and throw. our DTs got through every now and then, but our edge pressure struggled. carter did nothing, and neither did daniels. that guy chris wilson looks like he has a good burst from the DE spot, but id like to see if hes capable of doing that against the starting O. either way, our pass rush struggled again and too many times collins just stood there. i dont remember him being flushed out of the pocket at all.

our oline - i know its early and theyre missing samuels, but good lord if they look like that again this is the line im going to complain about all season. heyer looked pretty terrible and vandenbosch was SLAYING him all game. yes i know hes a probowler and heyer is an undrafted rookie, but man was that ugly. jansen got pwned a lot and needs to bone up. maybe he needs to take bmitch up on that fight offer cause he sure could use the work.

our run game: betts and cartwright proved why theyre backups, notice how bad ladell betts looked when our line struggles. and our line was not playing well. this unit needs to shore itself up in the next month.

mark brunell - wow. sacked 3 times, duck passes, throwing into double coverage. the guy is just done. i know collins lit up their 3rd string defense, but at least his arm looked much better. collins threw that one nice pass to the middle, and it had some zip on it. brunell is currently awful and his arm is currently awful.

campbell - i hesistate to put him here because he made some great plays with his arm and his feet, but hes gotta start completing more passes. 6/14 is not going to cut it. his completion percentage last year was his achilles heel and we saw it again on saturday. the one thing i loved was that he got decked twice and all he did was shake it off and keep on fighting, which is something you cant teach. the guy obviously has poise and i really wonder just what it would take to rattle this guy because currently none of us have seen him rattled.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

I did not get to see the game on Saturday and was wondering if Marcus Washington lined up at defensive end at all like they said they are going to be using him this year? If so did he look like he is going to be effective. I didn't really want to start an entirely new thread for this one question.

he did once that i saw and he got picked up. cant remember if collins completed the pass or not. washington definitely has good burst though.

[Smoot Point Really]

who didnt look good:

mark brunell - wow. sacked 3 times, duck passes, throwing into double coverage. the guy is just done. i know collins lit up their 3rd string defense, but at least his arm looked much better. collins threw that one nice pass to the middle, and it had some zip on it. brunell is currently awful and his arm is currently awful.

campbell - i hesistate to put him here because he made some great plays with his arm and his feet, but hes gotta start completing more passes. 6/14 is not going to cut it. his completion percentage last year was his achilles heel and we saw it again on saturday. the one thing i loved was that he got decked twice and all he did was shake it off and keep on fighting, which is something you cant teach. the guy obviously has poise and i really wonder just what it would take to rattle this guy because currently none of us have seen him rattled.

Brunell - you forgot to mention his propensity to burn time outs...

Campbell - I agree with you. I also think that this week their intent was to stretch the field, which usually means a lower completion percentage. Horrible line play and trying to get the ball down field were big contributors to the lack of success. From my perspective, his primary targets this game were wide receivers. Cooley was invisible in the passing game.

BTW, the pass to ARE in the flat was really great... JC hit him in stride and ARE was able to get some nice YAC up the sideline.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Brunell - you forgot to mention his propensity to burn time outs...

Campbell - I agree with you. I also think that this week their intent was to stretch the field, which usually means a lower completion percentage. Horrible line play and trying to get the ball down field were big contributors to the lack of success. From my perspective, his primary targets this game were wide receivers. Cooley was invisible in the passing game.

BTW, the pass to ARE in the flat was really great... JC hit him in stride and ARE was able to get some nice YAC up the sideline.

good point SPR about cooley, i didnt notice that until you mentioned it. but man did our oline look bad. 5 months of complaining about the dline, all to have our dline look very good and our oline to completely implode. we better turn that around quick or its gonna get ugly.

jansen needs to shut up and remember how to play tackle because he looked baaaaad.

[Die Hard]

Affter years of not drafting quality O-lineman in the second, third, and forth rounds, it is really catching up with us. We need depth at o-line. Second stringers who are young and can actually play.

I'm just wondering.... who has coach Joe Bugel "coached up" since he got here?

Jansen was a 2nd round choice drafted before Bugel came back... and his play has steadily decline since then. We got Rabach and Thomas through free agency. And Samuels was drafted #3 overall and before Bugel got here.... and made Pro Bowls before he arrived as well. Todd Wade was another free agent siging with previous success and starting experience.

In 4 years... Bugel turned Dockery into a decent linemen..... and that's it. Where are the backups and projects he was supposed to develop? We don't have any.

How is it possible?

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

I'm just wondering.... who has coach Joe Bugel "coached up" since he got here?

Jansen was a 2nd round choice drafted before Bugel came back... and his play has steadily decline since then. We got Rabach and Thomas through free agency. And Samuels was drafted #3 overall and before Bugel got here.... and made Pro Bowls before he arrived as well. Todd Wade was another free agent siging with previous success and starting experience.

In 4 years... Bugel turned Dockery into a decent linemen..... and that's it. Where are the backups and projects he was supposed to develop? We don't have any.

How is it possible?

when you have 1 draft pick every year, its hard to get depth that you can coach. and all the oline we do draft we let go.

[Die Hard]

when you have 1 draft pick every year, its hard to get depth that you can coach. and all the oline we do draft we let go.

Come on, seriously, the Redskins have had drafts for the last 4 years.... you take one example from this season and that's the gist of your argument.... the "anamoly"?

Do you really want to hang your head on the fact that since Joe Gibbs has returned the team has only had 4 draft picks? Really? Because that'll be the easiest argument to debunk.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Come on, seriously, the Redskins have had drafts for the last 4 years.... you take one example from this season and that's the gist of your argument.... the "anamoly"?

Do you really want to hang your head on the fact that since Joe Gibbs has returned the team has only had 4 draft picks? Really? Because that'll be the easiest argument to debunk.

we have drafted the least amount of players over the past 7 years than any other team in the NFL. that is a fact. if youd like to debunk it, feel free.

and obviously i was kidding about 1, weve had a few more than that, but we havent had a full draft in god knows how long.

2006 - 5 picks

2005 - 6 picks

2004 - 4 picks

2003 - 3 picks

2002 - 10 picks

2001 - 5 picks

2000 - 8 picks

41 picks over the past 7 drafts. find me a team with less draft picks in that time.

[Pedro]

we have drafted the least amount of players over the past 7 years than any other team in the NFL. that is a fact. if youd like to debunk it, feel free.

and obviously i was kidding about 1, weve had a few more than that, but we havent had a full draft in god knows how long.

2006 - 5 picks

2005 - 6 picks

2004 - 4 picks

2003 - 3 picks

2002 - 10 picks

2001 - 5 picks

2000 - 8 picks

41 picks over the past 7 drafts. find me a team with less draft picks in that time.

And yet look at what we get when we do draft. The last draft could turn out to be an awesome one. My first thought was imagine if we had a full deck but then I remember Coach saying they looked deeper because of a lack of picks.

Hopefully they look as deep next season with a full deck of picks. Whatever happens at this point our off season pick ups (via FA or the Draft) are looking good as a whole.

Kudos to the talent scouts/decision makers?

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

And yet look at what we get when we do draft. The last draft could turn out to be an awesome one. My first thought was imagine if we had a full deck but then I remember Coach saying they looked deeper because of a lack of picks.

Hopefully they look as deep next season with a full deck of picks. Whatever happens at this point our off season pick ups (via FA or the Draft) are looking good as a whole.

Kudos to the talent scouts/decision makers?

good players we have from these drafts that are on this team:

landry

campbell

rogers

taylor

cooley

samuels

mcintosh

5 1st rounders, 1 3rd rounder and 1 2nd rounder. in 7 years. we dont ever have picks in the meat rounds 2 3 and 4 where really good players are found. we give them up for guys like brandon lloyd and tj duckett. we have to stop that if we want to progress and build depth.

food for thought, new england has drafted 61 players in the same time that weve drafted 41. thats 20 extra players they have brought in and gotten production out of. and lots of their big impact guys are in rounds other than round 1.

[Die Hard]

41 picks over the past 7 drafts. find me a team with less draft picks in that time.

Uh yeah, but that's not what we were discussing was it. I hate when people pick losing arguments and then completely change the topic

The Redskins have drafted offensive linemen.... and they've signed a whole bunch who were undrafted..... and they signed a whole bunch in free agency.

Again, out of all the offensive linemen.... the only players that have contributed have been the players that were already developed before Bugel got his hands on them.

So what is Bugel doing exactly? Or Don Breaux for that matter?

[Pimpey42000]

Thumbs up

The whole defense

Thumbs down

The offensive line

The offensive line problems can be fixed, and I expect them to get fixed, especially when Samuels comes back.

That's what im saying.:applause:

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Uh yeah, but that's not what we were discussing was it. I hate when people pick losing arguments and then completely change the topic

The Redskins have drafted offensive linemen.... and they've signed a whole bunch who were undrafted..... and they signed a whole bunch in free agency.

Again, out of all the offensive linemen.... the only players that have contributed have been the players that were already developed before Bugel got his hands on them.

So what is Bugel doing exactly? Or Don Breaux for that matter?

im sorry, we'll go back to that. the only drafted lineman we have are samuels and jansen, everyone else was a free agent. most of our other lineman we drafted we allowed to leave. dockery was the only one worthwhile. molinaro and wilson were drafted in 04, both are gone. reggie coleman and jeff grau were drafted in 2002, both are gone. samuels and michael moore were drafted in 2000, i dont even know who moore was.

so in the past 7 years we have drafted 7 olineman, 1 is here. dockery was solid but hes gone.

so yes, bugel hasnt developed any olineman pretty much. all of our late round picks havent worked out at all.

[Pedro]

So what is Bugel doing exactly? Or Don Breaux for that matter?

Are you suggesting they need replacing ('cos I'm sure you're not asking a fan on a forum to answer the above question)?

If so I would be interested in a resources vs production (in regular season games only ) post re: the OL. If you can do it for every group (i.e. OL/DL/LBs etc) so we can see where we are failing and where we are doing well.

The last 5 years should be enough to see the overall trend versus the odd peak or trough. Would the OL be at the bottom of the chart?