Needs vs. Wants

[goldenster95]

This whole "we NEED this player" thing has gotten a little bit old. We don't NEED as many folks as we really think we do. Assuming that we end up re-signing Jansen (a big *if*) and Gardener (which is probable), these are our NEED positions:

1. LG: we can fill this position through the draft or pick up someone like Mawae from the Jets and move Moore to guard. A line of Samuels, Moore, Mawae, RG (e.g., Stai or Tre), and Jansen would be superb.

2. WR: we need someone to complement Rod Gardner or take over the #1 spot. I say we go for Peerless Price and make him the one big acquisition of the offseason. Then our top two WRs will be Rod and Peerless/or high draft pick and Thompson at #3.

3. FS: perhaps the most glaring of all holes on this team. David Terrell, you stink, buddy. This is another position we can fill through the draft or maybe get Andre Lott to take over.

4. K: if not the biggest hole, perhaps the second biggest. 'Nuff said on this one.

5. P: see above discussion on kicker position.

6. PR: sorry, but I don't like having the idea of Champ at PR, especially since he's blown his share of returns this year.

Some faux NEED positions:

1. RG: if we get a good LG, there's enough on our roster to insert someone to become above-average. With that and a solid LG, we'll have a line that'll be one of the better ones in the league.

2. RB: yes, Davis will leave and the sky will fall. Well, chicken littles of the world, I doubt that'll happen. Why? With an improved line, an upgraded WR corps, and a more experienced Ramsey, Betts and Watson -- though no Pro-Bowlers by any stretch of the imagination -- will give us enough of a rushing attack to be good.

3. RDE: with Bruce Smith out, hopefully by this year, let's give LaDairis Jackson a chance. Again, nothing Pro-Bowl like, but very solid. With Daryl Gardener at one DT spot and a first round DT, the center of the line will be good enough to open some opportunities for the ends.

[Mad Mike]

We've all seen posts that go overboard to one side or another of this issue. I think you got it just right.

:thumbsup:

[Art]

Our biggest need is not to panic and overreact. We need to do less than to do more right now.

I agree with you on most of what you are saying though. The single biggest "need" is for a strong, young, starting level player on the interior line. One would suffice because we have competent bodies coming back. I think receiver really is a want though.

We can move the ball. Our receivers aren't a weakness. We should want an improved level of depth and accomplishment here, but we don't strictly speaking need it to be successful. Same really with safety. Hell, we've had a great pass defense WITH Terrell, so, it is possible to have success with him there, though this year may not show that as much.

Kicker and punter are clear and desperate needs, and I hope one of the guys we have at least can fill one of those needs. One of your faux needs worries me though. This team needs defensive line depth and quickness and speed and youth desperately. Though I think the single biggest hole we must fill is left guard, it is clear to me the single weakest area we have right now is defensive line.

I am speaking, of course, thinking at least Smith or Wilkinson are not part of the plans. If both aren't then this just may be our biggest need area. I think you kind of think this is a need area too because you have this as our top pick in the draft and even when you go with the best player available model you don't really use your first rounder on a player you don't really need.

[Eparadox]

I agree about Running back, just look at the Denver Broncos. For the last few years, they've kept their line at the top of their priorities, and look what kind of running success they've had with no-name backs. A good running back can make his O-line look better, but a good O-line can make the running back look great.

[Storm]

We need to learn that we may not fill all these positions in one year.

We have to plan to fill our weakest spots with young players over a couple of years, that way creating consistancy and avoiding major roster changes annually.

Example. If we sign Jansen, we dont need to pick up two guard in one year, we can pick up one in the draft this year and maybe one next year or draft a second one late and groom him for next year.

Recievers, we can get one burner this year and draft one and groom him for the next year. Or sign Peerless Price and draft a burner in the third or fourth rounds and groom him.

D line, we dont need to draft a starting DE and DT this year, we can take one this year and one next. (B Smith is servicable for another year).

[The Sisko]

As much as we need OG's I think Art is correct in saying that our D line is our area of most pressing need. With Gardner they were fair to middlin' (and that's being kind). IF he's resigned, and we don't add another DT to replace BDW, we'd be one tweak of Gardner's back injury away from having a truly awful, stink 'em up DL. Trade down, FA or whatever, but we really MUST have someone very good to replace BDW next season. It would make our D line a lot better, but it would also provide some insurance against Gardner's back screwing next season for us.

My ideal scenario would have us trading down to say #10 or #11 picking the best DT available then using the extra pick on an the best OG available. With our third pick (2nd round) I'd take Taylor Jacobs if he's available, if not I'd go with the best C or DE left on the board. I'd use our 3rd rounder on a FS. A draft that went something like this would make me

With all that said, I have to admit if Andre Johnson were to be there when we pick I would be veeeery tempted to take him. He's got "real deal" written all over him. :drool:

[Thinking Skins]

I think that the only position that is a definite NEED is LG or RG. I think that we just need maturity everywhere else. The same way that we started off pretty crappy in Marty's system, we started off pretty crappy in Steve's system. If we had another year to let everything gel, we'll be fine. What we will finally have at teh beginning of next year that we have not had in the last 10 years is a good QB. We have dependable recievers and speedy recievers who we can throw the ball to. We have backs who can move the ball in the backfield. We have a defense which, give or take a play or two, can control a game. These are the components that lead to success.

We dont need to go into the draft like we NEED to draft this position or that position because we will end up getting a guy like the LT we got a few years back who never played an NFL snap or Shuler who was a bum. I for one would be extrememly pissed if we spent our first rounder on a WR. Yeah, it would be nice to have Randy Moss on our team, but we can make it with Gardner and Thompson.

Our only glaring weaknesses are at Guard and Safety. Our SS is pretty good and I'd like to see what he can do after he actually goes through a training camp as the starter and stuff. We dont see too many teams drafting FS or Guard in the first round so I think we can take the best player avaliable or even trade down, which is definately an option with Mendes at the helm because he is so reluctant to pay top dollar.

I just pray that we dont come out of next year's draft with 6 new LB's and no Guards!

[Burgold]

I still think our biggest "want" is a better pass rush. The lack of pass rush for two years has moved Lavar to end, weakened how good our cb's look, exposed our safeties and probably aided in the overuse of the zone. I suggest a DE in round 1 if there is a potent one out there, someone who could be great. We give up way to many third downs.

Our biggest need? A Superbowl victory. That would cure a lot of our ills. Course it would mean a pretty lousy draft pick, but I could live with that.

[Gmac61]

DL has got to be our priority in draft, followed closely by OL. On the DL, we probably need to go for a big DT first before DE because even if BDW comes back (which is unlikely), we still have no depth behind the current starters. At DE, we have Jackson who seems capable but needs time to show what he can do. If Smith is gone too, then we'll need to look around for another DE also.

On the OL, we can pick up one FA guard and re-sign Jansen, we're in decent shape. Still need some solid youth at OG, but we could most likely get one in 2 or 3 round.

I know I'm in the minority, but I believe we have the talent onboard to field a decent line if we'd just settle on 5 starters and let them play TOGETHER!!

[Guest Trevor]

I'm with goldenster95 on this one. Give me Peerless Price and a vet guard or center and I'll be happy. That way we can address safety and the d-line in the draft.

[Henry]

Other than a guard we seriously NEED at least one decent safety, especially if we continue to rely on zone coverages only to stick the safeties in man on corner blitzes all the time. We've been getting killed by poor safety play all year long.

[SkinsThug]

You forgot what we're going t get:

2 QBS, 4 WRs, and a ML:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[goldenster95]

Good posts, fellas.

Now, let's put the needs vs. wants thing aside and query what will actually happen.

A scary thought indeed.

[Art]

Last year we entered free agency needing an upgrade or replacement at MLB, DT, DE, S, LB, OG, OG, C, WR, QB.

The only positions we failed to get an upgrade or competent replacement for was safety, one offensive guard and wide receiver. Judging from the attention the front office paid to signing guys to fill need areas this offseason I would say it bodes well for what may be recognized and identified for this offseason.

We did a very good job of attempting to fill need areas. I think we'll do another swing at filling others we couldn't fill this offseason. And, we'll still have a couple of more to take care of when the offseason is done.

[yank]

Eparadox wrote:

"... agree about Running back, just look at the Denver Broncos. For the last few years, they've kept their line at the top of their priorities, and look what kind of running success they've had with no-name backs."

Clinton Portis was an outstanding player at Miami, a high 2nd rounder and has been a fantastic running back at Denver this year. He'd be perfect for our system and will be Pro Bowl material for many years. He's hardly a no-name.

Terrell Davis was pretty good only a couple years back.

I do agree that the OL is high priority though and can make a decent back look super. Ask Ernest Byner...

[MRMADD]

I think our only true "needs" are at LG, S, DT (to replace Big Daddy), QB (to replace Matthews), K, and P.

WR is a "want". It would certainly help Spurrier's offense to have a credible deep threat opposite Gardner -- but if that means you have to forego one of the "needs", you're making a big mistake. Two good WRs doesn't make an offense go. Just ask the Vikings. Any new WR will touch the ball five times a game. Betts will touch it 20+ times. The OL will block every play. Hell, the punter might touch it more often. I'd love to see Charlie Rogers suit up in burgundy and gold, but

RB is a "want". RG is a "want". Depth on the OL is a "want". DE is a "want". TE is a "want".

Unfortunately, we have so many needs and wants that we can't possibly fill them all this offseason with above-average players. So where are you willing to skimp? To me, we've been skimping on the OL for way too long. Let's fix it now.

I'm also tired of watching us hire matadors to play safety. Let's fix that, too.

Look, we're not on a one-year rebuilding path. We shouldn't even TRY to fix everything now.

[Charlie Murphaaay]

Originally posted by yank

Clinton Portis was an outstanding player at Miami, a high 2nd rounder and has been a fantastic running back at Denver this year. He'd be perfect for our system and will be Pro Bowl material for many years. He's hardly a no-name.

Terrell Davis was pretty good only a couple years back.

Denver's offensive line has remained solid. THe main thing is that they know how to draft running backs. They usually draft runners who are quick decision makers, quick footed and downhill runners who also have good hands, explosion into the hole.

We need better scouts and a GM.

[Thinking Skins]

Art, you're kidding right? Our offseason movement looked pretty crappy until some redskins fan (who must have a seat reserved on Jesus's right hand) sent a prayer up for us to get a DT and we got Gardener. If we wouldn't have gotten him, I'm certain that our defense would not be able to do what its doing right now. Given we did sign some guys on offense to take the spots of the guys who had already left, but we got 2nd rate talent. I mean, I'm very confident in Mendes's ability to negotiate a cap friendly deal, but somebody needs to tell him that talent does mean a little something in the NFL.

I agree with you though about the OL being our biggest need. I'm all in favor of trading down out of the top ten and getting a lot of above average guys. I would be highly upset if we traded up or stayed where we are to get a QB or a WR. Thats something a hish school kid would do in Madden 2003, not an NFL GM or whatever our triligy is called.

[Ignatius J.]

blakman,

you don't get it both ways. Either the crappy fans are resposible for our lack of an offensive line, or the brilliant front office made an excellent move. Was there luck involved? Yes. But there was luck involved with our o-line too. Rod Jones would have been interesting to see at Guard. But that didn't happen.

-DB

[MRMADD]

DB, we did see Jones at guard. He was an unmitigated disaster. Did you forget how poorly he performed at guard before he was injured? It's impossible to defend the FO's job last offseason -- they totally ignored the OL until it was too late, and then panicked and signed every has-been and never-was they could find to fill out the roster. They hoped if they brought in 20 guys, two would stick. They didn't.

Let's hope they learned their lesson.

[Thinking Skins]

Ttrue dat!!

[Ignatius J.]

Mr. Madd,

NFL sunday ticket did not cover preseason (which was when rod was injured right?) so I don't remember that, but I'll take your word for it.

So why do people think he'll be an acceptable jansen replacement?

-DB