The Thread for Cold-Hearted, Demanding Redskins Fans

[Oldfan]

The game has passed him by? I dont know about that one. I know the modern NFL is different and he probably does have some things that he needs to pick up, but he looked like he still had it in 2005.

Getting rid of Gibbs would set us back even more. Thats the only constant thing weve had for years: change. Let gibbs fufill his contract and give the man a shot to turn it around. We all thought he did last season right? If we change coaches again it will be a disaster, we need to build on something.

I wasn't impressed with the offense in 2005. After two seasons, Joe was unable to put together a consistently professional passing game. During the stretch run we had no choice but to depend on the run and, luckily, we had a little success against the likes of the 2005 Rams, Cards and the Giants whose three starting LBs were on IR.

So, you want another turnaround? If we go 9-7 next year will you be convinced it's an upward trend as you were about 2005?

After three years, do you see a roster filled with promising young players who are going to get better (Chargers)? Do you see a coaching staff that finds a way to win games even though the roster and teams stats aren't impressive (Jets)? If we combine those two, you have a dynasty. I'm looking for a turnaround in philosophy. Screw mediocrity.

[hail2skins]

Oldfan, the truth is that its all about sentiment at this point. Let Joe stay for the next two years because of what he's accomplished in the past, and nothing more.

I sincerely hope that Campbell pans out and that Gibbs has a happy ending here, with a deep playoff run, if not a Super Bowl win. But unlike many in these parts, I won't be shedding many tears when the Redskins are finally able to look towards the future instead of the past, and when we hire a coach that we plan to be here for at least 10 years, and not a short-term fix.

[PCS]

Joe Gibbs has turned out to be an incredibly AVERAGE football coach.

He has no one to blame but himself. His wife tried to warn him, he should have listened.

That's not exactly what Mrs. Gibbs was talking about if the stories that Joe told us were true, and we have no reason to believe otherwise.

:applause:

Gibbs is no better than Parcells was in Dallas.

Time for him to go, the game has definitely passed him by.

Actually, Dan Synder can easily rid himself of Gibbs by hiring a future HOF HC, Bill Cowher. The MSM would applaud him for it, as would the intelligent Redskin fans.

Right now. No.

Correction. The game may have passed him by. However, since most here don't know enough about football to acutally be able to substantiate that comment aside from the same generic opinions that have become common place with fans these days.

Correction 2. Those fans who agree that the game has Joe Gibbs by and would like to see someone like Bill Cowher come in would applaud. That does not make them intelligent or at least more intelligent than those whose opinions differ from theirs. So knock that nonsense off. That's gotten real old around here.

As for me, hey. I'm tough on the man myself. However, it's not just because he's in charge. I believe that Joe has not been involved enough in the way things are done. Sure, the buck stops with him when it comes to all the players cut and brought in by the team. But I believe that he has relied on his assistant coaches a bit too much and not enough on the scouting department. Speaking of which, I believe, he needs to take a good look at that process as well and see what needs to be changed. Along with what may be obvious for some that is. As for his assitant coaches, I don't believe Joe held them completely accountable for the team's problems on the field. Until now,((Lindsey's firing is a good example I think). I believe there will much more involvement by Coach in that area as well. And I think, the same can be said for Coach Williams and Saunders and their assistants. Lindsey's firing also helps streamline a few things as well. Speaking of Al, I believe Joe tried to fix something that wasn't broken, but that's water under the bridge now and the best thing for the team right now is to maintain that direction, though again, with more involvment by him there. Yep, that makes him a busy guy, but if he's the coach I believe he is, then he as until near the beginning of the season to get things going straight and then not have micromanage as much.

All that said, I do believe that for the most part, staying the course with the present team with a few additions is best right now. What this team needs desperately more than anything else, ( except maybe a couple of d-linemen), is continuity. I believe that's why he hasn't gone out and fired alot of folks, (yet?), and explains the one promotion from within.

[Guest Rafterman]

That's not exactly what Mrs. Gibbs was talking about if the stories that Joe told us were true, and we have no reason to believe otherwise.

Right now. No.

Correction. The game may have passed him by. However, since most here don't know enough about football to acutally be able to substantiate that comment aside from the same generic opinions that have become common place with fans these days.

Correction 2. Those fans who agree that the game has Joe Gibbs by and would like to see someone like Bill Cowher come in would applaud. That does not make them intelligent or at least more intelligent than those whose opinions differ from theirs. So knock that nonsense off. That's gotten real old around here.

As for me, hey. I'm tough on the man myself. However, it's not just because he's in charge. I believe that Joe has not been involved enough in the way things are done. Sure, the buck stops with him when it comes to all the players cut and brought in by the team. But I believe that he has relied on his assistant coaches a bit too much and not enough on the scouting department. Speaking of which, I believe, he needs to take a good look at that process as well and see what needs to be changed. Along with what may be obvious for some that is. As for his assitant coaches, I don't believe Joe held them completely accountable for the team's problems on the field. Until now,((Lindsey's firing is a good example I think). I believe there will much more involvement by Coach in that area as well. And I think, the same can be said for Coach Williams and Saunders and their assistants. Lindsey's firing also helps streamline a few things as well. Speaking of Al, I believe Joe tried to fix something that wasn't broken, but that's water under the bridge now and the best thing for the team right now is to maintain that direction, though again, with more involvment by him there. Yep, that makes him a busy guy, but if he's the coach I believe he is, then he as until near the beginning of the season to get things going straight and then not have micromanage as much.

All that said, I do believe that for the most part, staying the course with the present team with a few additions is best right now. What this team needs desperately more than anything else, ( except maybe a couple of d-linemen), is continuity. I believe that's why he hasn't gone out and fired alot of folks, (yet?), and explains the one promotion from within.

Sorry, it's far from nonsense. It's simply a matter of record. Gibbs return places him below .500, and moving in the wrong direction. His personnel moves are beyond questionable, some are incompetant. Football is afterall the most measurable team sport, with the possible exception of baseball.

I've read many a moronic post on this board, so it's quite easy to question the football intelligence of some of these posters. I avoid flaming them and calling them out as I play by the rules. However, I'm entitled to my opinion that some here are naive Kool-Aid drinkers of questionable football intellect. Granted, some are casual RAH-RAH fans with no conception of the business side.

Gibbs is living on his reputation. PERIOD

If he were a first time head coach he he would be sitting on a very hot seat.

There is something to staying the course if it's going to lead somewhere. However, I have serious doubts that Gibbs' is going to be able to get where he wants to go and where this team needs to be. He hasn't shown much this time around.

BTW, I believe his wife was trying to talk him out of returning because she felt he would tarnish his legacy. It looks like she was right.

[fansince62]

I'd give Saunders his head and let him run his offense. I have doubts about Gregg Williams on personnel selections, but his performances in 2004 and 2005 earned him a chance to redeem himself with more talent. I'd give Joe Gibbs a gold watch.

old...and you know 99 out of 100 times I've got your six....but - bad as things have gotten (and that has been a team/FO effort!) - JG has just earned too much goodwill in my book. yes, I am as frustrated as you with the incompetent plan we have seen in play for low these 15 years.....what can I say? how many teams have a coach who has won them 3 SBs and reached a 4th? Heck...Cower is lionized and he only won one! Let JG serve out his contract. perhaps...with this 4th year...he can do what Parcells did..lay the fonudation for a pretty good club. let's assume we draft a quality player at number 6, sign one or two decent FAs and broach above average football this next season. Assuming we don't keep to the past and trade away the future once again...the following season/coach should be well positioned to take this team to the next level with a smart and ample draft. it's doable....but the philosophy has to change before the actors. simply rotating the coach is no guarantee that the franchise will change its flawed approach to roster management.

[PCS]

I said the whole intelligence thing was nonsense, not the comparison of Bill and Joe's records right now. You'll see that I agreed with that. However, back to the "moronic" posts on this board. I've seen some on both sides of this issue. And then some. Doesn't make them less intelligent. Ignorant maybe, but not less intelligent. As with several coaches in the league who have been in the same circumstances, there is a little leeway given to Coach Gibbs based on his past. Whether that's many years ago or recent, he like others earned that right. That's a reality and there's nothing wrong with that. Doesn't mean they can do it again, but the fact that they have gives them at least the opportunity to right the ship.

[fansince62]

That's not exactly what Mrs. Gibbs was talking about if the stories that Joe told us were true, and we have no reason to believe otherwise.

Right now. No.

Correction. The game may have passed him by. However, since most here don't know enough about football to acutally be able to substantiate that comment aside from the same generic opinions that have become common place with fans these days.

Correction 2. Those fans who agree that the game has Joe Gibbs by and would like to see someone like Bill Cowher come in would applaud. That does not make them intelligent or at least more intelligent than those whose opinions differ from theirs. So knock that nonsense off. That's gotten real old around here.

As for me, hey. I'm tough on the man myself. However, it's not just because he's in charge. I believe that Joe has not been involved enough in the way things are done. Sure, the buck stops with him when it comes to all the players cut and brought in by the team. But I believe that he has relied on his assistant coaches a bit too much and not enough on the scouting department. Speaking of which, I believe, he needs to take a good look at that process as well and see what needs to be changed. Along with what may be obvious for some that is. As for his assitant coaches, I don't believe Joe held them completely accountable for the team's problems on the field. Until now,((Lindsey's firing is a good example I think). I believe there will much more involvement by Coach in that area as well. And I think, the same can be said for Coach Williams and Saunders and their assistants. Lindsey's firing also helps streamline a few things as well. Speaking of Al, I believe Joe tried to fix something that wasn't broken, but that's water under the bridge now and the best thing for the team right now is to maintain that direction, though again, with more involvment by him there. Yep, that makes him a busy guy, but if he's the coach I believe he is, then he as until near the beginning of the season to get things going straight and then not have micromanage as much.

All that said, I do believe that for the most part, staying the course with the present team with a few additions is best right now. What this team needs desperately more than anything else, ( except maybe a couple of d-linemen), is continuity. I believe that's why he hasn't gone out and fired alot of folks, (yet?), and explains the one promotion from within.

PC...why the constant, arrogant talking down to the ES membership? an analogue: my guess is that you know next to nothing about what is happening in Iraq....but the results make you feel reasonably comfortable in asserting "things are not going well." sometimes...as the cliche goes......the results speak for themselves..

[PCS]

PC...why the constant, arrogant talking down to the ES membership? an analogue: my guess is that you know next to nothing about what is happening in Iraq....but the results make you feel reasonably comfortable in asserting "things are not going well." sometimes...as the cliche goes......the results speak for themselves..

Fan.. knock it off. I talked down to no one. I am simply stating fact. None of us are knowledgable enough about the situation to make anything but some informed, (in some cases very well informed), opinions about what exactly is going on. To accept an opinion on either side of the situation as fact is a fallacy imho. Again, I am not saying don't give an opinion. Just don't ask me to accept it as fact. I would not ask anyone to do so with me. Just give it with one foot planted squarely in the reality that there are some things we just don't know. That's what I said and always have. You've been around long enough to know this. If that strikes a chord, too bad. Truth hurts. And results speak for themselves, but sometimes they don't speak enough. You more than know this as well.

[fansince62]

Fan..no due respect, knock it off. I talked down to no one. I am simply stating fact. None of us are knowledgable enough about the situation to make anything but some informed, (in some cases very well informed), opinions about what exactly is going on. To accept an opinion on either side of the situation as fact is a fallacy imho. Again, I am not saying don't give an opinion. Just don't ask me to accept it as fact. I would not ask anyone to do so with me. Just give it with one foot planted squarely in the reality that there are some things we just don't know. That's what I said and always have. You've been around long enough to know this. If that strikes a chord, too bad. Truth hurts. And results speak for themselves, but sometimes they don't speak enough. You more than know this as well.

ignorant? morons?...uh huh. doesn't sound like a dispassionate examination of the facts to me.

the problem with your argument...which we have been dealing with since at least preseason...is that it is void of implications. this is the same response many of us received when we noted that the preseason strategy of not more fully testing/implementing the new offense was a bad decision....which turned out to be accurate.

yea...none of us can know intimately what is going on inside the redskin tent. so what? where does that lead one? one takes the observable phenomena and draws reasonable conclusions. you don't like the conclusions and that is what lies at the heart of your angst. if you really want to run with this line of thought, then you have to establish how much information is good enough - all the while, one notes ironically, complaining about any Skins who go outside the fold and speak publicly about the inner workings. It's an impossible argument to win: you don't know enough to assert something as fact...and....no one should tell you what is going on because that goes against the flow of "keeping it all in-house." so let's not draw any conclusions at all! you need to be more circumspect on what is fertile ground for opinion and what isn't. "You don't know the inner workings" is too broad a coverall....because...the facts are that we do know SOME of what has been going on. we can glean it from contract signings, player statements, reporter analysis, expert commentator analysis...and the performance on the field.

[zoony]

How incredibly boring.

...

[fansince62]

How incredibly boring.

...

can't please everyone!

[Guest Rafterman]

PC...why the constant, arrogant talking down to the ES membership? an analogue: my guess is that you know next to nothing about what is happening in Iraq....but the results make you feel reasonably comfortable in asserting "things are not going well." sometimes...as the cliche goes......the results speak for themselves..

I'm not bored at all, thank you.

[riggoraider]

Olddu....oh my bad... I mean oldfan. I am loving this thread!!!

I think that we will be alright with Gibbs at coach and if not do you have any other candidate that you think that would make us SB champ's in the next year or so?...not saying that Gibbs will just wondering who you'd rather be here.

[Oldfan]

hail2skins --- Oldfan, the truth is that its all about sentiment at this point. Let Joe stay for the next two years because of what he's accomplished in the past, and nothing more.

fansince62 --- JG has just earned too much goodwill in my book. yes, I am as frustrated as you with the incompetent plan we have seen in play for low these 15 years.....what can I say? how many teams have a coach who has won them 3 SBs and reached a 4th?

I understand your feelings and I appreciate the fact that neither of you is trying to pretend that your opinion is based on anything more than loyalty. I'll explain my view a little further.

There are 32 teams in the NFL and the owner of every one wants a dynasty. So the natural odds against one team succeeding are 31 - 1. In other words, it's hard enough to succeed without allowing sentiment to put you at a further disadvantage. The Patriots' organization has beaten the odds because they are tough and smart.

When Bill Belichek let his favorite player go last offseason, I'm sure that both he and Willie McGinest understood that it wasn't a breach of loyalty. There comes a point when the team's interest is best served by cutting ties. Had Belichek kept McGinest another year, it would have been an act of charity not loyalty. I feel the same way about keeping Joe Gibbs for another two years.

On the field this time around, I'd put Joe on a par with Marty who couldn't beat Belichek head-to-head despite having superior personnel and home field advantage. The best team will be watching the super bowl on television this year solely because of the coaching matchup. I feel sympathy for the San Diego players and their fans.

Off the field, the reason the Gibbs roster building strategy will fail over time can be proven with relatively simple math. Put simply, we should be pursuing a bargain hunting strategy and we're doing the opposite.

I think Joe's a great guy and I'm grateful to him for his past efforts, but my loyalty is to the team.

[Oldfan]

I think that we will be alright with Gibbs at coach and if not do you have any other candidate that you think that would make us SB champ's in the next year or so?...not saying that Gibbs will just wondering who you'd rather be here.

If we started now with the right plan, we could become a Top Four team in four years with a realistic shot at winning a Super Bowl. The Mangini-Tannenbaum combination has the best chance of making the Jets the next dynasty, I think. They are taking the Patriots plan and trying to improve on it.

Conservative football coaches are dinosaurs. The new breed of coach has the kind of math aptitude that would make him a top notch Poker player, someone who can calculate risks on the fly. Eric Mangini fits the mold.

The jury is still out on Mike Tannenbaum as a talent evaluator, but he has the right makeup for a great GM in today's game. He makes deals, but he drives a hard bargain. Nothing is wasted.

I don't know the assistants and front office people around the league at all, but Mangini and Tannenbaum are the kind of people I'd be looking for.

[No_Pressure]

Arguments like this make me want to become the only fan in the world of the Dayton Triangles.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/dayindex.htm

:laugh:

We should rename the skins to the Washington Dodecahedrons or something.

[Om]

If sentiment doesn't enter into your opinion about Joe Gibbs, then you must have reasons supporting your faith in him that I haven't yet heard from you.

Hmm, I guess I was right. You really HAVEN'T been paying attention to what I've said in any of our various earlier debates.

Plus, in all humility, I think you'd have had to try pretty hard NOT to run headfirst into the pillars of my "faith" in Gibbs over the past 3 years. If you're really interested, feel free to peruse any number of the links you'll find in the Archives linked a couple of inches south of these words. That won't take you to the myriad other threads I've participated in going over (and over) why I think supporting Gibbs is more than "sentiment," but at least it's a start.

I don't really think you're interested in objectivity or a balanced view though. I think you're far more interested in reminding everyone who might have missed it that you're a pissed SOB, and inviting others to join your drum beating in them thar hills.

As you said yourself, you had "fun" writing this one. You knew exactly what you were after, and you largely got it. It's a good time to be pissed on the message boards. You're sure to find a receptive audience. Enjoy it.

[PCS]

Zoony got it right.

ignorant? morons?...uh huh. doesn't sound like a dispassionate examination of the facts to me.

the problem with your argument...which we have been dealing with since at least preseason...is that it is void of implications. this is the same response many of us received when we noted that the preseason strategy of not more fully testing/implementing the new offense was a bad decision....which turned out to be accurate.

yea...none of us can know intimately what is going on inside the redskin tent. so what? where does that lead one? one takes the observable phenomena and draws reasonable conclusions. you don't like the conclusions and that is what lies at the heart of your angst. if you really want to run with this line of thought, then you have to establish how much information is good enough - all the while, one notes ironically, complaining about any Skins who go outside the fold and speak publicly about the inner workings. It's an impossible argument to win: you don't know enough to assert something as fact...and....no one should tell you what is going on because that goes against the flow of "keeping it all in-house." so let's not draw any conclusions at all! you need to be more circumspect on what is fertile ground for opinion and what isn't. "You don't know the inner workings" is too broad a coverall....because...the facts are that we do know SOME of what has been going on. we can glean it from contract signings, player statements, reporter analysis, expert commentator analysis...and the performance on the field.

Oh please. I didn't refer to people as ignorant, just some posts I have seen, ( I've been guilty of that once or twice in my day as well), and didn't call anyone a moron. I was using the posters words, not mine. Though I can see the confusion that could happen there so I edited in quotes. Implications? As if there are any, realistically, with what we discuss here? Oh, in the speculative nature of our opininions, there are possible implications to just about all of them. No, I think the heart of the matter here is that there is this problem. "It's an impossible argument to win." I have noticed recently, that it appears for some that it is more important to win an argument, than it is to actually be correct. As for the rest, again, you missed the point and I am beyond explaining it to you.Suffice to say I never said don't draw conclusions. That is all.

Did not mean to hijack thread. Carry on.

[Taylor 36]

:applause:

Gibbs is no better than Parcells was in Dallas.

Time for him to go, the game has definitely passed him by.

Actually, Dan Synder can easily rid himself of Gibbs by hiring a future HOF HC, Bill Cowher. The MSM would applaud him for it, as would the intelligent Redskin fans.

Oh, the flaws in thinking :doh:

First, Gibbs has one more playoff win in one less year than Parcells, yet he is no better???

Second, 2004 was a wash year. Gibbs and company needed to see exactly what they had and what they needed. Plus, we had a bad bite from the injury bug (Jansen ring a bell, or how about a certain whiny toe?).

The 2005 season was Gibbs first true opportunity to add some of his guys to the roster and cut the pieces of cancer out of the locker room (once again Coles comes to mind very quickly). The offense struggled down the stretch after doing very well, but this wasn't really Joe's fault. We had injury problems again, which left us with one wide receiver, and an injured QB. Many will say that Gibbs should have put Ramsey in, however, I find it interesting that when Ramsey left and got his "chance" in NY, he still ended up as #3. (Maybe the guy who won three SB's with three different QB's does know what he is saying when he says he feels that MB gave us the best chance to win).

Now, the miserable 2006 season was without doubt the hardest hitting injury bug season this team has seen in many years. We installed a new, high powered offense that we were told took a full year to really learn. When we had close to 100% of our players on the field, we showed glimpses of what this team can do. But, and I'm actually happy for this, the 2006 season showed our coaches that they need better depth.

I honestly do not think we are as far from being a great team as many on this board make us out to be. If we strength our D line and secondary and add some depth, I think we will be great. And, the credit all goes to that so-called washed up coach of ours. The coach you said was no better than another coach who over four season sustain fewer injuries and set backs, yet still had to back into the playoffs twice, and not get a victory either time.

[SkinsFTW]

Injuries are too much of an excuse that the fans like to use. We have no quality depth. When any 1 of Springs, Washington, Griffen, any single star player goes down the entire defense goes down the tubes. Meanwhile the Patriots defense doesn't miss a beat with 1/2 of their starters out, even after letting a lot of their big stars go to other teams over the past several years. Either we have really bad coaching or very bad backups, or both.

[Oldfan]

I don't really think you're interested in objectivity or a balanced view though. I think you're far more interested in reminding everyone who might have missed it that you're a pissed SOB, and inviting others to join your drum beating in them thar hills.

Om,

some fans, like me, are more demanding than others. I want us building a dynasty. Others seem to be tickled pink if we have a winning season and sniff the playoffs. In the past, most fans loved George Allen. I couldn't wait for him to run out his string and leave town.

In life, I prefer to cooperate rather than compete, but when involved in a competition, I play hard ball. Spare me the sentimentality.

Many, probably most, posters in this forum seem unwilling or unable to face reality about their football team. They want to read pieces like yours in which you take a few positive developments and spin them into rays of hope. I envy your eloquence, but you write fluff.

I see a world that has made significant moral progress over the centuries. The trend gives me cause for unbridled optimism about the future of humanity...but I need to see real evidence of a trend to be an optimist. When I look at the decision making of Gibbs ll, I see a modified George Allen approach which will produce a club that will bounce between a 10 and 20 ranking annually while giving up any real chance of becoming a Top Four team.

[Om]

OF, you're straight up grandstanding.

You keep talking about monolithic groups of other fans, ascribing actions and motivations to them, then using that transparent fabrication to prop up your condescending speechifying. You want to "build a dynasty?" Man, what a concept. Thanks for edifying the unwashed.

From out on the extreme fringes where you seem to reside, I suppose the kind of stuff I write looks like "fluff." Anything that doesn't say "the Redskins suck" probably does in your eyes. I get that, and I suspect most reading along do as well, so I'm not worried about it. You go ahead and keep soapboxing that the end is nigh and you have The Answers. There are plenty willing to listen, and plenty more than willing to share with us their Answers as well.

Me, I'll go on looking at things from a perspective that allows me to see more than one side of an issue, admit that there are factors involved I don't have access to, and synthesize those into an openly admitted fans view with a little humility and more suited to those interested in listening as much as simply spouting off.

[JoeGibbsThickandthin]

Om,

some fans, like me, are more demanding than others. I want us building a dynasty. Others seem to be tickled pink if we have a winning season and sniff the playoffs. In the past, most fans loved George Allen. I couldn't wait for him to run out his string and leave town.

In life, I prefer to cooperate rather than compete, but when involved in a competition, I play hard ball. Spare me the sentimentality.

Many, probably most, posters in this forum seem unwilling or unable to face reality about their football team. They want to read pieces like yours in which you take a few positive developments and spin them into rays of hope. I envy your eloquence, but you write fluff.

I see a world that has made significant moral progress over the centuries. The trend gives me cause for unbridled optimism about the future of humanity...but I need to see real evidence of a trend to be an optimist. When I look at the decision making of Gibbs ll, I see a modified George Allen approach which will produce a club that will bounce between a 10 and 20 ranking annually while giving up any real chance of becoming a Top Four team.

And the decesions in Spurier 1 and Norv Turner 2000. Whats the common guy among these guys?

OLDFAN. The guy is not very old.

[Oldfan]

Om -- Me, I'll go on looking at things from a perspective that allows me to see more than one side of an issue,

You are wonderfully tolerant, indeed.

...admit that there are factors involved I don't have access to...

Yes, it is hard for me to admit that I don't know it all. I can certainly learn a lot from you.

...and synthesize those into an openly admitted fans view with a little humility

Yes, your humility is evident in this post.

[Om]

1) You are wonderfully tolerant, indeed.

2) Yes, it is hard for me to admit that I don't know it all. I can certainly learn a lot from you.

3) Yes, your humility is evident in this post.

Oh, great job.

1) Yes, I am pretty damn tolerant. I even put up with serial grumps like you and MADD.

2) No argument on the first part. As to the second, I suspect you're right there too, except I wonder if that's possible given the first part. I may know at least ONE thing you don't. I mean, I've certainly learned plenty from you. You gotta figure the opposite would be true too, right? Law of averages or some bull****?

3) My tone in this thread has matched yours from the start. Stop lecturing and acting superior to the whole damn board, and you'll find that the way people respond will change as well.