Taxes Taxes Taxes!!

[Stigmata]

This is Think of it this way: less than 3-1/2 dollars out of every $100 paid in income taxes in the United States is paid by someone in the bottom 50% of wage earners. Are the top half millionaires? Noooo, more like "thousandaires." The top 50% were those individuals or couples filing jointly who earned $29,019 and up in 2003. (The top 1% earned $295,495-plus.) Americans who want to are continuing to improve their lives, and those who don't want to, aren't. Here are the wage earners in each category and the percentages they pay:

The top 1% pay over a third, 34.27% of all income taxes. (Up from 2003: 33.71%) The top 5% pay 54.36% of all income taxes (Up from 2002: 53.80%). The top 10% pay 65.84% (Up from 2002: 65.73%). The top 25% pay 83.88% (Down from 2002: 83.90%). The top 50% pay 96.54% (Up from 2002: 96.50%). The bottom 50%? They pay a paltry 3.46% of all income taxes (Down from 2002: 3.50%). The top 1% is paying nearly ten times the federal income taxes than the bottom 50%! And who earns what? The top 1% earns 16.77% of all income (2002: 16.12%). The top 5% earns 31.18% of all the income (2002: 30.55%). The top 10% earns 42.36% of all the income (2002: 41.77%); the top 25% earns 64.86% of all the income (2002: 64.37%) , and the top 50% earns 86.01% (2002: 85.77%) of all the income.

Yep the rich are not paying there fair share, the democrats will say..

ya know since the poor dont really pay much in taxes when it relates to the total % of all taxes paid demographically, the Democrats say (very miss leading) that tax cuts only help the rich, well yeah since the poor or the lower 50% pay a small % of total taxes.. duh!

Divide and conquer yeah baby make people resent the ones who really pay most of the taxes in the first place, not to mention the business owners who pay huge amounts of the total taxes.

[Stigmata]

wtf happened to my post

[Stigmata]

hmm this isnt what i intended how do i get rid of this thread and re-do it?

[Stigmata]

well the point is or what i was trying to point out, the top 50% of all wage EARNERS pay 96.54% of all income taxes, the rest of the 50% pay 3.5%. so when the democrats say that tax cuts only benefit the rich a scale that starts at wage earners of 29k and up all i can say is duh!

Very miss leading and intended to make the people who really dont pay squat in taxes to begin with, angry..

[Major Harris]

well, at least it only took ya 4 posts to let us know how you feel. :laugh:

[Stigmata]

well, at least it only took ya 4 posts to let us know how you feel. :laugh:

lol i had alot more info, when i made the thread it went poof? very strange..

[rdsknbill]

Well, I do know that I had to pay 26k IN this year. Even after paying in quarterly.

The reason? My business showed a profit. Go figure :mad:

Still blows me away that everyone is saying that "America is built on small business" when those small business get the crap taxed out of them for being successful. Are they not supposed to succeed? and when they do, why does the government bend them over and punish them for that success. Meanwhile the big corporations are hiding under tax shelters.

Just ticks me off.

[Larry]

well the point is or what i was trying to point out, the top 50% of all wage EARNERS pay 96.54% of all income taxes, the rest of the 50% pay 3.5%. so when the democrats say that tax cuts only benefit the rich a scale that starts at wage earners of 29k and up all i can say is duh!

Very miss leading and intended to make the people who really dont pay squat in taxes to begin with, angry..

1) It's been discussed about 4,000 times 'round here, already.

2) Your emphasis of the word EARNERS is rather dramatic, although of debatable accuracy. A very large chunk of the top 50% income RECEIVERS get a good chunk of their income as UNEARNED income. (Unearned in the IRS sense. I'm not trying to place a value or moral judgement here. In fact, it's a term I don't like much, but I can't think of a better one.)

3) Speaking of "Very miss leading and intended to make the people" think a certain way: How come, when you're trumpeting that the top 5% of taxpayers pay 55% of all income taxes, you neglect to mention that they also received 40% of all income?

Could it perhaps be that, when you point at someone and say "He pays 10 times the taxes that the average american pays", people won't feel quits as sorry for him if you also say "He receives 8 times the salary that the average american receives"?

4) And I'll point out once again: Why is it, whenever some "conservative" wants to try to make america feel sorry for the way the big, mean, government is picking on millionaires, that the first thing they do is to take the only tax in our entire nation where "the rich" don't pay a lower percentage of their income than "the poor", and complain that the one tax that "tilts the other way" is unfair because it picks on one "class" more than others?

Look at state sales tax, for example, and "the poor" pay a vastly higher tax rate (as a percentage of their income) than "the rich". But the only tax where "the rich" pay a higher percentage, is unfair because they're being picked on.

[Larry]

Still blows me away that everyone is saying that "America is built on small business" when those small business get the crap taxed out of them for being successful. Are they not supposed to succeed? and when they do, why does the government bend them over and punish them for that success. Meanwhile the big corporations are hiding under tax shelters.

Agreed.

I understand, for example, that Microsoft has not paid any corporate income taxes for something like 20 years.

(I wish I could remember which writer it was where I'd read along the lines of "The big power struggle in America isn't the one that people are used to watching, between rich and poor, or between labor and business. It's between big business and small business.")

[DeanCollins]

lol i had alot more info, when i made the thread it went poof? very strange..

go back an edit it, change the color of the text to white. somtimes the text doesn't change automatically from black to white for the black backround.

[Fred Jones]

Agreed.

I understand, for example, that Microsoft has not paid any corporate income taxes for something like 20 years.

(I wish I could remember which writer it was where I'd read along the lines of "The big power struggle in America isn't the one that people are used to watching, between rich and poor, or between labor and business. It's between big business and small business.")

I agree, and the current administration is just feeding the fire and giving more discounts to big business with their big lobby.

[portisizzle]

1)

Look at state sales tax, for example, and "the poor" pay a vastly higher tax rate (as a percentage of their income) than "the rich". But the only tax where "the rich" pay a higher percentage, is unfair because they're being picked on.

Cry me a river.

Sound like jealousy to me. So instead of rewarding positive performance in America we reward sloth and punish performance.

BTW, how many people here are mad because there are rich people in the world? Penis envy or something?

Wake up and get a real cause...... or move to mother Russia....

oh....Communism didn't work......oh

[gchwood]

The Rich do not pay for alot of their "unearned" money because it is tied up in investments, in many investments you don't have to pay unless you take the money out.

Furthermore, many "lower" income earners are not educated enough on how to protect there money. Instead they blindly pay the taxes without ever creating ways to minimize their exposure

[Mass_SkinsFan]

This whole debate is worthless and pointless while the current system is in place. There's no need for hundreds and thousands of pages of tax code.

A flat tax on all businesses and individuals, set at something like 5%, with NO exemptions at all, would be the easiest and fairest thing possible. Which is why it will never happen.

[Cskin]

Still blows me away that everyone is saying that "America is built on small business" when those small business get the crap taxed out of them for being successful. Are they not supposed to succeed? and when they do, why does the government bend them over and punish them for that success. Meanwhile the big corporations are hiding under tax shelters.

Someone else stole my thunder... they must be punished. :laugh: I was going to say.... you got hammered in taxes.... just like me because I own a business.. while Microsoft and other monoliths paid nothing. What on earth is wrong with this picture? Is this supposed to motivate me to become a mongomonopoly behemoth company... so I can escape paying taxes? :doh:

We've debated the tax thing forever. I think we all agree the current tax system and IRS dept. are not the solution. Unfortunately, no one can create a solution that everyone can agree on.

I just go back to the forefathers... when they created this country.... and wonder what they would think about nearly half the income earners in this country paying for the other half... whether they would think that was fair. Through time there have always been the haves and the have nots.... the key is to create an enivorment that makes it easier, not via entitlements or handouts, for the have nots to become the haves.

I think if we created a consumption tax or fair tax... maybe not the current proposed system but something that protects those on or below the poverty line but where most everyone would pay the same.... than there would be no choice but for the lower end income earners to be lifted up by the boosted economy created by a simplier tax system.

Finally, we've got to get the govt. out of our pockets and remove the mechanism for which they continue to dig. It's obvious they have no means of policing themselves. It's obvious they do not care about waste, boondoggles, and pet projects. It's obvious special interest groups have poisoned the tax system. It's OBVIOUS we need the means to collect revenue TAKEN OUT of the hands of our corrupt politician's hands.

[TimmySmith]

1)Look at state sales tax, for example, and "the poor" pay a vastly higher tax rate (as a percentage of their income) than "the rich". But the only tax where "the rich" pay a higher percentage, is unfair because they're being picked on.

Huh? State SALES tax is based on purchases. Completely controlled by the individual consumer. Not to mention the fact that rich people generally buy more stuff, and more expensive stuff.

[rdsknbill]

Someone else stole my thunder... they must be punished. :laugh: I was going to say.... you got hammered in taxes.... just like me because I own a business.. while Microsoft and other monoliths paid nothing. What on earth is wrong with this picture? Is this supposed to motivate me to become a mongomonopoly behemoth company... so I can escape paying taxes? :doh:

We've debated the tax thing forever. I think we all agree the current tax system and IRS dept. are not the solution. Unfortunately, no one can create a solution that everyone can agree on.

I just go back to the forefathers... when they created this country.... and wonder what they would think about nearly half the income earners in this country paying for the other half... whether they would think that was fair. Through time there have always been the haves and the have nots.... the key is to create an enivorment that makes it easier, not via entitlements or handouts, for the have nots to become the haves.

I think if we created a consumption tax or fair tax... maybe not the current proposed system but something that protects those on or below the poverty line but where most everyone would pay the same.... than there would be no choice but for the lower end income earners to be lifted up by the boosted economy created by a simplier tax system.

Finally, we've got to get the govt. out of our pockets and remove the mechanism for which they continue to dig. It's obvious they have no means of policing themselves. It's obvious they do not care about waste, boondoggles, and pet projects. It's obvious special interest groups have poisoned the tax system. It's OBVIOUS we need the means to collect revenue TAKEN OUT of the hands of our corrupt politician's hands.

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

Cskin for president!!!!! :laugh:

Seriously though. That was a very poiniant post that I'm sure that every small business owner in this country can relate to.

Looking back, I think that the taxes that Uncle Sam was raping me for every year had alot of impact on my decision to sell my business.

[Larry]

Huh? State SALES tax is based on purchases. Completely controlled by the individual consumer. Not to mention the fact that rich people generally buy more stuff, and more expensive stuff.

But it's a SALES tax on only CERTAIN products.

The tax may be 6% on groceries, 20% on gasoline, and 1/2% on cars or real estate. (And 0% on anything bought out-of-state.)

And "poor" people spend a much higher percentage of their income on food and gasoline.

[Stigmata]

Sorry if this has been discussed 4000 times. Im a small business owner also and get hammered every year for taxes. So its just fresh in my mind.

As far as Microsoft not paying taxes? i wonder how many people they employ? and out of the people they employ how much taxes do they accumulatively pay per year, ontop of the goods they buy and manufacturing and the sale of there products that create taxes. as a whole ie corporation ill bet they pay massive amounts of taxes.

they are a huge entity with tentacle's all over the place.

If you made 30k a year and paid 30% in income taxes, so $9000 and looked at a guy making 300,000 he pays 90,000. it would take the guy making 30k 10 years to pay the tax the 300k guy did in one year. now stretch that over a 10 year period..

But were just talking about the CEOs right?

[LD0506]

The biggest complaint I have is not how much is collected in taxes but how it's spent. Trillions of dollars have gone down the rathole over the years and we as a country have little to show for it. Both sides of the aisle have their "special interests", both are complicit it draining the national treasury. It's one thing to say"I pay too much in taxes", it's quite a different thing to say "I get too little for the taxes I pay". There are a lot of commonsense actions that could be taken to move us towards a healthier situation as far as the national economy but there's always somebody getting their ox gored, and they always make sure they get the best politicians money can buy to see that it doesn't happen. Making the feds accountable to the populace is right up there with building a perpetual motion machine.