Should Stan "Tookie" Williams be granted clemency?

[Spaceman Spiff]

Let him fry.

[NavyDave]

I still don't see how the world is better with one less person preaching peace. As for your Singapore Justice, i believe the saying goes "One can not at once both prepare for peace and war" (i know i got that saying wrong, but its along those lines)

So if Saddam after gassin all of his citizens, had people fed to lions, raped and plundered Kuwait, was imprisoned then wrote a book asking dictators to be kind he shouldn't answer for his crimes?

The world is better because one less murderer is gone

War can bring about peace.

[redman]

I don't believe anyone's posted the details of his crimes, but here they are, courtesy of Wikipedia:

The Murders

Williams at age 29Williams was charged and convicted for murdering Albert Owens, Tsai-Shai Yang, Yen-I Yang, and Yee Chen Lin in 1979 during two separate robberies.

[edit]

Albert Owens

According to court transcripts, late on the evening of Tuesday, February 27, 1979, Stanley Williams introduced his friend Alfred Coward, a.k.a. “Blackie,” to a man named "Darryl". A short time later, Darryl, driving a brown station wagon, drove Williams to the residence of James Garrett. Coward followed in his 1969 Cadillac. Stanley Williams often stayed at the Garrett residence and kept some of his belongings there, including a 12 gauge shotgun. Upon arriving at the Garrett residence, Williams went inside. About ten minutes later, Williams returned carrying a twelve-gauge shotgun.

The four men then discussed where they could go in Pomona to make some money. Williams left the other men for a brief period of time. When he returned, he had a .22 caliber handgun, which he also put in the station wagon. Williams then told Coward, Darryl and Sims they should go to Pomona. In response, Coward and Sims entered the Cadillac, Williams and Darryl entered the station wagon, and both cars traveled on the freeway toward Pomona.

Shortly thereafter, the two vehicles exited the freeway near Whittier Boulevard. They drove to a Stop-N-Go market and, at Williams’ direction, Darryl and Sims entered the store presumably to rob it. At the time, Darryl was armed with the .22 caliber handgun Williams had previously placed in the station wagon. The clerk at the Stop-N-Go market, Johnny Garcia, testified that he had just finished mopping the floor when he noticed the station wagon and four black men at the door to the market. Sims states that he and Darryl walked in the market. Sims proceeded to walk to the back of the market as Darryl approached the clerk and asked for a cigarette. Sims states he then "walked back from the back ‘cause there was somebody in there and just walked out the door and got back the car with, uh, Blackie. And then we left."

Williams reportedly became upset that Darryl and Sims did not commit the robbery. Williams told the men that they would find another place to rob. Williams said that at the next location all of them would go inside and he would show them how to commit a robbery.

Coward and Sims then followed Williams and Darryl to the 7-11 market located at 10437 Whittier Boulevard, in Pico Rivera, California. The store clerk, twenty-six year old Albert Lewis Owens, was sweeping the store parking lot. When Darryl and Sims entered the 7-11, Owens put the broom and dust pan he was using on the hood of his car and followed them into the store. Williams and Coward followed Owens into the store. As Darryl and Sims walked to the counter area to take money from the register, Williams walked behind Owens, pulling the sawed-off shotgun from under his jacket and told Owens to “shut up and keep walking.” While pointing the shotgun at Owens’ back, Williams directed him to a back storage room. Not long after, Williams blew out a security camera and then executed Owens, shooting him twice in the back at point blank range as he lay prone on the storage room floor. [3]

The pathologist who conducted the autopsy on Owens testified that the end of the barrel was “very close” to Owens’ body when he was shot. One of the two wounds was described as “a near contact wound.”

After Williams murdered Owens, he, Darryl, Coward and Sims fled in the two cars and returned home to Los Angeles. The robbery netted Williams and his associates approximately $120.00. Once back in Los Angeles, Sims asked Williams why he shot Owens. Williams said that he “didn’t want to leave any witnesses.” Williams also said he killed Owens “because he was white and he was killing all white people.” Coward claims that Williams bragged about killing Owens. Williams said, “You should have heard the way he sounded when I shot him.” Williams then made gurgling or growling noises and laughed about Owens’ death.

[edit]

The Yang Family

The Yang family, who were immigrants from Taiwan, included husband and wife Yen-Yi Yang wife, Tsai-Shai Yang, were well above their sixties. One of their children, Ye-Chen Lin had recently joined them from Taiwan. The family worked together operating and maintaining a motel called the Brookhaven in South Central Los Angeles.

At approximately 5:00 a.m. on March 11, 1979, court transcripts show that Stanley Williams entered the Brookhaven Motel at 10411 South Vermont Avenue. After entering the public lobby area, Williams broke down the door that led to the private office. Once inside the private office, Williams, using his shotgun, killed seventy-six year old Yen-I Yang; Williams also killed Yang’s wife, sixty-three year old Tsai-Shai Yang; lastly, Williams killed Yang’s daughter, forty-three year old Yee-Chen Lin. Williams then removed the currency from the cash register and fled the location.

Robert Yang, son of Yen-Yi and Tsai-Shai, was asleep with his wife in their bedroom at the Brookhaven Motel when he was awakened by the sound of somebody breaking down the door to the motel’s office. This sound was immediately followed by the sound of his mother or sister screaming, followed by gun shots. When Robert entered the motel office he found his mother, his sister, and his father had all been shot. Robert observed that the cash register was open and money was missing. It was later determined that the robbery of the Brookhaven Motel and the murder of the three members of the Yang family netted Stanley Williams approximately one hundred dollars.

According to the forensic pathologist, Yen-I Yang suffered two shotgun wounds. One shotgun wound was to his left arm and abdomen. This wound shredded Yen-I’s left arm, fractured his ribs, and shattered his spleen, right kidney, bowel and large vessels. The other shotgun wound was to the lower left chest. This wound also fractured ribs and shattered the spleen, right kidney, bowel and large vessels. Moreover, a plastic shotgun shot container and associated wadding were recovered from the base of Yen-I’s liver. The pathologist further explained that both of the Yen-I Yang’s wounds were inflicted when the end of the muzzle was only feet from Yen-I’s body.

Yee-Chen Lin was shot once in the upper left face area at a distance of a few feet. She was transported from the scene by paramedics to Centinela Hospital where she died at 7:36 a.m.

Tsai-Shai was shot twice at close range. The pathologist explained that one shotgun wound was to the coccyx or tail bone. Based on the physical characteristics of the wound and the fact that wadding, along with the plastic shot container, were recovered just beneath the skin of this wound, the muzzle of the gun must have been just inches from her body when she was shot and killed. The other shotgun wound was to the anterior abdomen with the charge entering at the naval. At trial, the pathologist testified that the muzzle of the gun was a few feet from Tsai-Shai’s body when the shot that caused this wound was fired.

Williams was convicted of the murders of all four individuals and sentenced to death. In addition associates in San Quentin recall him claiming to have murdered police. He is also believed to have ordered killings inside the prison.[4]

Don't it just make you all warm and fuzzy inside that this guy's said some nice things against gang violence?

[CHUBAKAH]

It's pretty well known here in CA, that he is still tied to things on the outside, and not all of it is good.

As a citizen of CA, I'm tired of my tax dollars paying for this trash.

Take him out yesterday.

[rincewind]

So if Saddam after gassin all of his citizens, had people fed to lions, raped and plundered Kuwait, was imprisoned then wrote a book asking dictators to be kind he shouldn't answer for his crimes?

The world is better because one less murderer is gone

War can bring about peace.

hold on their cowboy, i NEVER said he shouldn't answer for his crimes. I said i don't believe in killing people - including convicted murderers.

[ntotoro]

The man is responsible for the continued corruption of young American minds that could have had a purpose in life other than being dead or in jail by 16.

Not to mention what it has done to their families.

Fry him, behead him and stick his head on a lamppost, just like in Conan.

[rincewind]

okay, going back i realize i've gotten too into the 'why you shouldn't kill Tookie' instead the 'i don't believe in killing.' I shouldn't be arguing for this guy because of the few good things he has done (especially since the bad things he has done far out weigh them). My stance is however, that i do not believe there is any justifing killiing a person when it is not in direct self defense (and even then i find it questionable).

[nelms]

The fact that this dude started the Crips and lived a gangsta lifestyle shouldn't factor into anything. The fact that this dude has now spoken out against the gangsta lifestyle shouldn't factor into anything.

The only relevant fact is this: he was convicted and sentenced to death for the murders of 4 people. The death sentence needs to be carried out.

[jpillian]

Come on you gotta feel a LITTLE bad for the guy.

I mean he NEVER had a chance!!

Check out this note he passed to a fellow prisoner in '79 while trying to plan for a jail break.

"Check Yes or No" -- it's the middle school version of the Great Escape!!

:laugh:

This was Exhibit 76 from his trial -- as found in the "LOS ANGELES COUNTY

DISTRICT ATTORNEY’S RESPONSE TO STANLEY WILLIAMS’ PETITION FOR EXECUTIVE CLEMENCY" which twa posted on page 3.

Pretty pitiful stuff.

:doh: I think he MIGHT of done a bit much PCP.

[Mooka]

It's pretty well known here in CA, that he is still tied to things on the outside, and not all of it is good.

As a citizen of CA, I'm tired of my tax dollars paying for this trash.

Take him out yesterday.

I know a cpl of guys that do volunteer work at San Quentin. They say that most people who work there know Tookie still has a large part with the Crips and all they say are, "once a con, always a con." General consensus is that he isn't reformed at all.

The fact that this dude started the Crips and lived a gangsta lifestyle shouldn't factor into anything. The fact that this dude has now spoken out against the gangsta lifestyle shouldn't factor into anything.

The only relevant fact is this: he was convicted and sentenced to death for the murders of 4 people. The death sentence needs to be carried out.

Totally, agree. His only chance of receiving clemency was a higher court hearing his appeal of his murder trial.

heres an exerp from a judge on the Ninth US Circuit of Appeals:

"We are aware of Williams' Nobel Peace Prize nomination for his laudable efforts opposing gang violence from his prison cell, notobly for his line of children's books "Tookie Speaks Out Against Gang Violence," and his creation of the "Internet Project for Street Peace." Although Williams' good works and accomplishments since incarceration may make him a worthy candidate for the exercise of gubernatorial discretion, they are not matters that we in the federal judiciary are at liberty to take into consideration." Judge Procter Hug, 2002.

No more appeals for Tookie, he's used em all up. Whether he should be granted clemency is only based on his work for peace while in jail, which is up to Ahnold on the 8th to decide.

[Leonard Washington]

i heard there maybe riots and all that jazz. i think its kind of silly. i'm glad if he is remorseful and has given something back to society; that's what's prison supposed to do. sitting in a cell gives you time to think, realize you F'd up and be willing to change your ways. unfortunately he f'd up big time and he got the death penalty; that's the breaks. if he is really a changed man he should realize that he has to pay the price for the man he was and believe that God sees him for the man he is now. yea it's hard to come to grips with dying, especially when you are essentially a healthy person. perhaps he can say prison saved him (and potentially others!) b/c he never would be the man he was today if he wasn't locked up.

about the racial aspects...yea i believe racism exists. but if tookie was cletus, a member of the KKK, who killed black people and said he changed and wrote some books, i wouldn't believe **** he said. i would hope he realizes his wrongs and finds peace before he dies.

[ironmic]

hell yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!