Gibbs quotes on Campbell.

[DjTj]

Originally posted by Jimbo

Anyone else think that this is a telling response? It could be that maybe we really were looking at Matt Jones or hoping Pollack or James would fall to #25.

I think it means we made the trade with a number of different players in mind. Matt Jones, David Pollack, Erasmus James, Marcus Spears, Jason Campbell, Heath Miller, Roddy White ... we probably had a pretty good list of players that we were confident about before we pulled the trigger on the trade.

I'll bet that Campbell was pretty high on that list though, because we certainly did not make the trade until after Gibbs met with Campbell.

[authentic]

Originally posted by Jay Master Jay

No matter what Gibbs saids I think were going to trade Ramsey we gave up a lot to draft Campbell. Why draft a qb in the 1st rd if we dont think we need him. He cant talk about value if that's the case other teams would have drafted Rogers. Can we trade Ramsey to Detriot for a WR??

so in other words, you want Mike Williams for Ramsey??... sorry not going to happen

[BigBCherney]

Originally posted by skin_finatic

Yep, your obviously another bogus fan.

It's "you're", buddy.

To trade a future #1 and #4, and #3 this year simply to get Campbell is insane. This team won 6 games last year. This team has many needs and depth issues to be sending away draft picks all the time.

[authentic]

they must have some diamonds in rounds 4 though 7, because if not then this draft is going to go down as one of the worst ever

[jimster]

good depth and future starters is a draft strategy that many seem to have forgotten about. - I trust that this is a well thought out decision.

[BigBCherney]

Originally posted by AngusinFlorida

Hell, I'm a fricken accountant, so I'm not about to question why Gibbs did what he did.

You mean, Joe Gibbs? The same guy who said Desmond Howard was the best WR he ever scouted? Some people make Gibbs out to be some kind of God that can do no wrong. Great coach, but giving up so much for someone who isn't a need, and would have probably not have even been taken in the 1st round to begin with, isn't a smart move.

[DjTj]

Originally posted by BigBCherney

It's "you're", buddy.

To trade a future #1 and #4, and #3 this year simply to get Campbell is insane. This team won 6 games last year. This team has many needs and depth issues to be sending away draft picks all the time.

How are picks in next year's draft going to help fill our needs right now? Who in the 3rd round could have addressed a need? We'll have depth issues at QB in a year when we can finally dump Brunell, and we were able to address that today with Campbell.

You might not agree with it, but it's not "insane."

[CaliforniaSkin]

I was thinking about the Campbell pick and one thing occurred to me. If nothing else it indicates the Gibbs is planning on staying the for the full five years. If he thinks Campbell is going to be the QB of the future you have to figure that he won't play well untill at least his 3rd year in the league. (I'm assuming that he's likelyl the number 3 guy this year, number 2 next year and starts when Ramsey leaves after his contract expires in two years.)

That said, while I'm not real happy with this pick, in retrospect I'm not too unhappy either. I'd love for Ramsey to be the QB of the future but imho, he has not shown that he can be a playoff caliber QB yet. Honestly, his career numbers aren't all that great. Yes, I know there are extenuating reasons for that. I still hope he can be the one to take us to the promised land. Campbell has one thing going for him that Ramsey does not. He's a winner. He went 13-0 last year.

[Art]

Originally posted by BigBCherney

It's "you're", buddy.

To trade a future #1 and #4, and #3 this year simply to get Campbell is insane. This team won 6 games last year. This team has many needs and depth issues to be sending away draft picks all the time.

We've got great depth now at receiver. And now in the secondary. And on the offensive line. And defensive line. And, well, actually, we have good depth at QB. And, really, pretty much everywhere. We don't have a lot of needs either. The needs we did have were time together to grow and develop. And, we largely got just that this offseason.

[jimster]

the same people that bash Snyder for making "splashy" moves are some of the same people that are upset we didn't get any flashy players today.

[BigBCherney]

Originally posted by Art

We've got great depth now at receiver. And now in the secondary. And on the offensive line. And defensive line. And, well, actually, we have good depth at QB. And, really, pretty much everywhere. We don't have a lot of needs either. The needs we did have were time together to grow and develop. And, we largely got just that this offseason.

What's it like in La La Land?

[Art]

Originally posted by BigBCherney

You mean, Joe Gibbs? The same guy who said Desmond Howard was the best WR he ever scouted? Some people make Gibbs out to be some kind of God that can do no wrong. Great coach, but giving up so much for someone who isn't a need, and would have probably not have even been taken in the 1st round to begin with, isn't a smart move.

Strictly speaking, QB is probably the biggest need this team has. Right now our starting QB has never had a QB rating of even 76. Santana Moss has played at a higher level at receiver than Ramsey has at QB. From a strict performance standpoint, QB is the single biggest weakness we had going into this draft.

Now, we can believe as I do that Ramsey can lift his game. But, quite obviously, he hasn't for three years. If after this, his fourth year, he has another 75 QB rating, you can bet we'd be entering next year's draft looking for a QB. And, if having that QB now spurs Ramsey to a great performance, that's ok too.

[Art]

Originally posted by BigBCherney

What's it like in La La Land?

I do not know. If having some mild contact with reality is fantastical in your simple-minded world, I'd recommend you try to improve how you live. I can't make you understand the game or our roster. All I can do is assure you I'm a whole lot more in touch with things than you, and, it pays to be less idiotic around me.

[SkinsFTW]

Originally posted by BigBCherney

To trade a future #1 and #4, and #3 this year simply to get Campbell is insane. This team won 6 games last year. This team has many needs and depth issues to be sending away draft picks all the time.

Thats why everything the Skins have been doing lately makes no sense to me. We were 6-10 last season. We were very close to being 10-6 or better though so maybe Gibbs thinks we are good enough already and only need to build depth. We will have Jansen back, Daniels and Bowen should be healthy, and hopefully Arrington is too. We added a very good Center and a couple fast WR's so the team still could be good.

Its just to me I see that we gave up Coles which in essence cost us Pierce and Smoot and then the guy we traded Coles for doesn't show up so we could need a WR as well. And we already know we probably need a DE and maybe a MLB. So picking a QB by trading away a 1st 3rd and 4th looks bad. I'm not going to say that they don't know what they are doing but it looks to me like we will be filling the holes next year through free agency and we probably won't have a ton of cash to do it with. If this season is another one of those 6-10 or 8-8s then we gave away a top 15 pick for a guy who is going to be on the bench for a few years. Picking a QB at 25 is in no way going to make our W-L better next year or positively effect the position of Denvers free #1 draft pick. They have to really be loving that trade now.

[JRAB]

It was a bad draft... and next year's will be bad because of this year's too.

Spin it how you want. This draft does next to nothing to help this year. And it's ability to help down the road is questionable at best.

We could have:

1. Kept Coles and had the cap space to...

2. Kept Pierce and to have...

3. Kept Smoot.

4. With no need at CB, we could have drafted Shawne Merriman or Demarcus Ware at 9. They would've helped make an already great defense, superb.

5. Draft Roddy White at 25 or Heath Miller at 25.

You can't tell me the team wouldn't be WAY better off. If Ramsey flops... Campbell won't help for a few years, and by that time we could just address QB at that point.

[Tommy-the-Greek]

Originally posted by Tarhog

Obviously Hasselback is gone.

I don't think so. Tim is a cheap, young and solid #3 QB. Gibbs seems to like him and he is a nice fit for that role.

Brunnel on the other hand is overpaid, over the hill and the over/under on his retirement is 1.5 years. I think Danny is going to make him an offer he can't refuse.

Does anyone know the legality of unofficially forcing him to retire and take a well paid job in the front office/organization?

If Brunnel retires this summer or next summer what are the cap implications?

Brunnel has to have come to grips with the fact that he is not a starter anymore. He also must want to keep the dollars in his contract. What if Snyder forces him to retire by giving Brunnel almost everything he wants. He would stay involved with the NFL and would have financial security for himself and his family for years to come.

I think everyone has this all wrong. This isn't about Ramsey it is however all about Brunnel.

[DjTj]

Originally posted by JRAB

It was a bad draft... and next year's will be bad because of this year's too.

Spin it how you want. This draft does next to nothing to help this year. And it's ability to help down the road is questionable at best.

We could have:

1. Kept Coles and had the cap space to...

2. Kept Pierce and to have...

3. Kept Smoot.

4. With no need at CB, we could have drafted Shawne Merriman or Demarcus Ware at 9. They would've helped make an already great defense, superb.

5. Draft Roddy White at 25 or Heath Miller at 25.

You can't tell me the team wouldn't be WAY better off. If Ramsey flops... Campbell won't help for a few years, and by that time we could just address QB at that point.

Brunell and Coles hurt our situation, no doubt...

But given what we were left with, I think we came out okay. Carlos Rogers will see a lot of playing time this year and our defense will remain solid. We have Santana to mitigate the loss of Coles and we picked up some insurance at QB.

In a perfect world, Brunell would be in a retirement home and Coles would still be a Redskin (with a healthy toe), but we don't live in a perfect world ... we deal with what we're given, and I think we did alright.

[tr1]

On if this is what he wanted to happen when he made the trade for the 25th selection:

“When we decided to go and make that trade there was a number of players that we thought we would be looking at. To me when you are looking at the draft picks I like to put a face on it. Someone that we have analyzed and looked at on film and you say ‘ok that is what we are comparing.’ Same thing when you go and trade something. To me it is knowing the person and not putting the value on it. When I get a list which we came up with, a list that we thought with the possibilities in this draft knowing where it was loaded, this is what would be there. I mentioned there were two corners on that board that we liked so there was a group there. Receivers and corners are sitting there that we liked.

When we got down there we had done our homework and had worked Jason out but we didn’t think he would be there. You go down through there and when you get there you make the best choice based off of what you think the value would be and the future of the organization. “

Can someone translate this for me? I think it is a 'yes, we planned on taking Campbell.' but I'm not sure.

[jimster]

Originally posted by tr1

Can someone translate this for me? I think it is a 'yes, we planned on taking Campbell.' but I'm not sure.

basically saying "we wanted him, but not sure if he would be there."

[Tarhog]

Originally posted by Tommy-the-Greek

I don't think so. Tim is a cheap, young and solid #3 QB. Gibbs seems to like him and he is a nice fit for that role.

Brunnel on the other hand is overpaid, over the hill and the over/under on his retirement is 1.5 years. I think Danny is going to make him an offer he can't refuse.

Does anyone know the legality of unofficially forcing him to retire and take a well paid job in the front office/organization?

If Brunnel retires this summer or next summer what are the cap implications?

Brunnel has to have come to grips with the fact that he is not a starter anymore. He also must want to keep the dollars in his contract. What if Snyder forces him to retire by giving Brunnel almost everything he wants. He would stay involved with the NFL and would have financial security for himself and his family for years to come.

I think everyone has this all wrong. This isn't about Ramsey it is however all about Brunnel.

All due respect Tommy, its not about what you or I think, its about what Gibbs thinks. I believe Gibbs said today that he'd be 'sitting down with Tim' to discuss his future.

I have to think Hasselback is gone. Gibbs has said over and over Brunell's 'story' isn't done yet. Whether we like that or not.

[Gilgamesh]

Originally posted by JRAB

It was a bad draft... and next year's will be bad because of this year's too.

Spin it how you want. This draft does next to nothing to help this year. And it's ability to help down the road is questionable at best.

We could have:

1. Kept Coles and had the cap space to...

2. Kept Pierce and to have...

3. Kept Smoot.

4. With no need at CB, we could have drafted Shawne Merriman or Demarcus Ware at 9. They would've helped make an already great defense, superb.

5. Draft Roddy White at 25 or Heath Miller at 25.

You can't tell me the team wouldn't be WAY better off. If Ramsey flops... Campbell won't help for a few years, and by that time we could just address QB at that point.

1. Coles was a cancer that had to be surgically removed. No one wanted him here, including many of the other players. Without surgery, his foot made him worth far less than he was being paid.

2. Pierce wanted more money than he was worth. He had one good season in Gregg Williams scheme and wanted more money than Marcus Washington, our best linebacker. We have to pay attention to the cap at some point.

3. Smoot was not evaluated as a priority by our defensive coaching staff and thus allowed to let go. Williams took free agents and off the street talent and turned our existing defense into on of the best in the league. He knows how to evaluated talent, and Rogers was the highest rated player on his board. I'll trust his judgement.

4. See #3.

5. We have no need at all for a pass catching tight end with Chris Cooley on the roster, one of the few bright spots we had on offense last year. Heath Miller actually would have been a total waste. Had Mark Clayton been available at #25, you might have had a better argukment for a WR here, but I'd much rather have a QB Gibbs sees as the potential to be perfect for his system on the roster than Roddy White.

As for next year's draft, we'll have an opportunity to reacquire a #1 if/when we trade LaVar to a team desperate for LB help. We don't need him or his attitude on this team with Williams here.

[Danny Montana]

I'm amazed that our FO was "surprised" to find Campbell still on the board when we picked. Honestly, who else was going to take this kid before us? GB maybe, but that was before the Rodgers free-fall.

[FS36]

I'm completely happy with the Rogers pick. I was hoping we'd either take Troy Williamson or Carlos Rogers with our #9. After we took Rogers, I was pretty sure we were going to draft the best available receiver with our 25. But we got a QB. I can't say that I'm upset about having Cambell. The guy has an arm like Ramsey, but a more fluid release. And he can put the touch on the ball to place it over the receiver's opposite shoulder, one thing Ramsey lacks.

If we have a situation here like San Diego last season, that's great. It would mean Ramsey finally steps up to the potential everyone thought he had. If not, I'd like to see Cambell progress quickly. He's mobile, can run a 4.6 40 and can throw on the run.

I would have been happy with drafting a receiver, but our core is just fine. Sure we don't have anyone that teams feel they need to double with a safety every down, but we have depth, experience, as well as potential.

One thing I really wanted us to get this offseason was a true pass-rushing DE. I would be nice to be able to generate pressure soley from the line when we drop back everyone into coverage.

[Tommy-the-Greek]

Originally posted by Tarhog

All due respect Tommy, its not about what you or I think, its about what Gibbs thinks. I believe Gibbs said today that he'd be 'sitting down with Tim' to discuss his future.

I have to think Hasselback is gone. Gibbs has said over and over Brunell's 'story' isn't done yet. Whether we like that or not.

Of course you may be right but, I just don't think so. I don't think we can afford to pay Brunnel that kind of money to sit the bench. And we can't afford to pay starting QB money for 3 QB's. Someone is the odd man out. The logical choice would be the highest paid guy who isn't going to start and offers nothing to the team's future.

We shall see what happens. If Brunnel retires this summer you heard it from me first. If they get rid of Tim I am going to pray that Ramsey stays healthy. I would rather have Tim be the 2nd Qb till Jason is ready then have Brunnel come in. Even with a healthy line in front of him this year Brunnel is a hollow shell of what he was. Brunnel starting has to be a Skin fans worst nightmare.

I still want to know what the cap implications would be if Brunnel retired? Could we offer him a position in the organization to pay him off the balance of what he would feel we owe him?

[JRAB]

Originally posted by Danny Montana

I'm amazed that our FO was "surprised" to find Campbell still on the board when we picked. Honestly, who else was going to take this kid before us? GB maybe, but that was before the Rodgers free-fall.

Please. They weren't surprised. He just wasn't being honest.

I always thought Gibbs was one of the most honest people on Earth... but I feel like what he said was full of half-truths and flat out un-truths.

I'm convinced we made the trade with Campbell in mind. Did we have some backup players we could've taken? Yes. But we made the trade to get Campbell, IMO.