novascotiadiesel Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 It was for one overwhelming reason. Joe Gibbs right or wrong, is not going to going to change this turd. I mean this vetran. No matter what we want or feel Joe is the man and he is sticking with him. I realised that the sooner i accept this the sooner i would stop feeling so bad aobut it, up untill i accepted it and moved on it was litterally killing me. Now it is a bit ok. at present i am trying to find some positive points about brunell. one point i came up with was this: at least when ramsey gets in he knows gibbs won't pull him after three games. can anyone think of any other? would be nice for us to get some positivity going. :logo: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Potato Sack Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Joe Gibbs right or wrong, is not going to going to change this turd. So you've become a supporter, yet you called him a turd. OKIE DOKIE! :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCBnG21 Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Brunell is bound to go down at some point? : ) I dunno, I just see him making mistakes...what's the difference? ...at least Pat can pass the ball. Nah, perhaps it's just a matter of time and Brunell will turn it on. Gibbs was like this before, and he won before, so perhaps he'll get the last laugh... At least he doesn't have a carousel going on... Errr, sorry, just trying to be positive.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 979guy Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 why i became a brunell supporter today I thought you were going to tell us it's because you're a Green Bay fan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
novascotiadiesel Posted October 18, 2004 Author Share Posted October 18, 2004 hahah i enjoyed that green bay quote, trying to see if the creative minds on here can find some reasons to support gibbs's decision it is obviously easy to come up with reasonsl to bench brunell lets figure out what gibbs sees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntotoro Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by samtc Brunell is bound to go down at some point? : ) A player going down is something to smile about... ? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red zone Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 I thought we were trying to generate some positive spin with this thread? Honestly, it wasn't long ago we had Spurrier, Wuerffel and Mathews..... We've come along way since then and though we have a ways to go I'll take my chances with Gibbs and Brunnel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzSkinsFan63 Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 I still think Ramsey can beat a QB rating of 46.6... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 OK. Let me dig deep and come up with a few positives: Brunell senses the pass rush better than Ramsey does, and Brunell will more likely throw the ball away whereas Ramsey will take the sack. Gibbs likes to roll his QB out, and Brunell throws on the run better than Ramsey does. A lot better. Also, Brunell is taking a LOT of heat right now from us fans and the media. If Ramsey came in and played as badly as Brunell, and believe it or not there's a good chance that would be the case, then I don't know how well he'd take the deluge of criticism and the boos and the critical questions day after day. Brunell, for all his faults, faces the media after every game and calmly answers questions. He's prepared to take the pressure, which in this city can be pretty heavy. Gibbs likes to sit his young QBs on the bench for a season or two before throwing them into that fire. He's done it many times before, and it's worked many times before. He likes his young guys to learn on the bench, rather than on the field, so when they DO come into the game, they look like they've been there all along. Ramsey, right now, does NOT look like he's comfortable with this offense, so Gibbs wants him to sit, and learn. Just like Schroeder and Rypien did, two former future pro-bowlers who took us to the NFC Championship and beyond. How's that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sableholic Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 why I have suddenly changed my mind on the support for him... because if ramsey comes in and plays as bad as this then what hope is there? I kinda like to think that ramsey could do better and hope is always a nice thing. Also i mean if they both do bad then what? and don't say 0.0 hasselback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 just to play devil's advocate here w/ Henry ...all of those positives you've said about Brunell above aren't putting any points on the board. I honstly can't imagine Patrick doing any worse than Brunell at this point. My expectations for the man have hit rock bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by Henry OK. Let me dig deep and come up with a few positives: Brunell senses the pass rush better than Ramsey does, and Brunell will more likely throw the ball away whereas Ramsey will take the sack. Gibbs likes to roll his QB out, and Brunell throws on the run better than Ramsey does. A lot better. Also, Brunell is taking a LOT of heat right now from us fans and the media. If Ramsey came in and played as badly as Brunell, and believe it or not there's a good chance that would be the case, then I don't know how well he'd take the deluge of criticism and the boos and the critical questions day after day. Brunell, for all his faults, faces the media after every game and calmly answers questions. He's prepared to take the pressure, which in this city can be pretty heavy. Gibbs likes to sit his young QBs on the bench for a season or two before throwing them into that fire. He's done it many times before, and it's worked many times before. He likes his young guys to learn on the bench, rather than on the field, so when they DO come into the game, they look like they've been there all along. Ramsey, right now, does NOT look like he's comfortable with this offense, so Gibbs wants him to sit, and learn. Just like Schroeder and Rypien did, two former future pro-bowlers who took us to the NFC Championship and beyond. How's that? I am also a believer that the same people screaming now would be the same fans they got in Miami... Put him in, take him out, put him in, take him out... blah blah blah... Ramsey throws 3 ints and the screamfest begins... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins4eva Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 So, you've taken my word "positivity" and made it your own. I can work with that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BleedinBurgundyandGold Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 I have no problem with a quarterback that isn't good, or has a tough time reading defenses. THe one and ONLY reason I want Brunell benched is that he is an absolute quitter. I have never seen a quarterback look to throw the ball away so fast. I cant find any statistics on this, but its apparent. Look at Big Ben in Pittsburg. He's not the smartest (yet) or fastest QB in the league but now in back to back weeks he has flushed the pocket, audibled MID PLAY to burress and thrown a touchdown pass. That is something we will NEVER see with Brunell under center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by Thiebear I am also a believer that the same people screaming now would be the same fans they got in Miami... Put him in, take him out, put him in, take him out... blah blah blah... Ramsey throws 3 ints and the screamfest begins... I can deal with 3 ints if we're moving the ball and being aggressive. And hey, chances are they're not going to get run back for a TD, sadly, we can't say the same for Brunell's fumbles/INTs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by TankRizzo just to play devil's advocate here w/ Henry ...all of those positives you've said about Brunell above aren't putting any points on the board. Well then. Just to play devil's advocate to your devil's advocate ... I honstly can't imagine Patrick doing any worse than Brunell at this point. Why not? Patrick looked worse than Brunell in the preseason. And Patrick looked worse than Brunell against the Giants. Some posters on this board have said that they'd rather lose 21-24 than win 13-10. I'm not on of them. I know we're starving for offense right now, but rotating QBs didn't help us two year ago. It didn't help us last year, and there's no guarantee it will make any difference now. Some people seem to think Ramsey will suddenly make this offense go. Given Ramsey's performace in Gibbs' offense to date there's no reason to think that, and as stated before in this thread, the only thing worse than having one QB struggling is having two QBs struggling. Then you have a sucky offense AND a QB controversy. So yes, it CAN get worse if we start Ramsey. Others seem to think we may as well throw Ramsey in there anyway, so he can learn and stuff. Well, he can learn on the bench as well. Beleive it or not, plenty of good QBs developed their skills while riding the pine. Favre, M. Hasslebeck, Culpepper, Pennington ... not every QB has to brave the rapids like Manning. Gibbs brings his QBs along this way. That's what he does. And he's damn good at it. But now, six games into his first season we all think he should scrap that method? The man's simply doing what we knew he would do when we hiried him, what's proven to work time and again under his system. If we wanted to switch QBs after every other game we could have simply kept Spurrier. I know this is a day and age of instant gratification it tough to trust this way of thinking, but at times patience can be a wonderful thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by Henry Why not? Patrick looked worse than Brunell in the preseason. And Patrick looked worse than Brunell against the Giants. They both looked equally awful in preseason IHO. Some posters on this board have said that they'd rather lose 21-24 than win 13-10. I'm not on of them. I know we're starving for offense right now, but rotating QBs didn't help us two year ago. It didn't help us last year, and there's no guarantee it will make any difference now. Wow, could things be any more flip flopped than last year's philosophy? :laugh: I never made that connection. But sadly, we're not winning our games 13-10, Brunell just won out on the odds this past game. At this current rate we're only doing as well as Brunell lets the other team be because he's scoring as much for them as he is for us, and we're chugging along at the nice pace of 6-10. If we were 6-0, you'd have yourself a nice little arguement there, but that's not the case. We're not winning these low scoring games, we're losing them...losing them at Brunell's expense! Some people seem to think Ramsey will suddenly make this offense go. Given Ramsey's performace in Gibbs' offense to date there's no reason to think that, and as stated before in this thread, the only thing worse than having one QB struggling is having two QBs struggling. Then you have a sucky offense AND a QB controversy. So yes, it CAN get worse if we start Ramsey. If you'll give Ramsey the benefit of the doubt for a moment, he was put in in less than ideal circumstances in that game. As I said earlier, they both looked awful in the preseason. I fully believe that if he's given the next two weeks as the starter that he'll manage more than 100 yards a TD and then another TD for the other team's defense. I can't say the same for Brunell, that's about all I expect out of him, he's simply not moving the ball. Others seem to think we may as well throw Ramsey in there anyway, so he can learn and stuff. Well, he can learn on the bench as well. Beleive it or not, plenty of good QBs developed their skills while riding the pine. Favre, M. Hasslebeck, Culpepper, Pennington ... not every QB has to brave the rapids like Manning. Gibbs brings his QBs along this way. That's what he does. And he's damn good at it. But now, six games into his first season we all think he should scrap that method? The man's simply doing what we knew he would do when we hiried him, what's proven to work time and again under his system. If we wanted to switch QBs after every other game we could have simply kept Spurrier. I know this is a day and age of instant gratification it tough to trust this way of thinking, but at times patience can be a wonderful thing. It's not that I want to throw him to the wolves...at this point though, I simply think he gives us the best chance of winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSteve Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 About Ramsey sitting...that approach works best BEFORE the QB has played an NFL snap. Not when he's been in and out for two seasons. I mean he's 25 years old, 3rd year.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrfriedm Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by samtc Brunell is bound to go down at some point? : ) I dunno, I just see him making mistakes...what's the difference? ...at least Pat can pass the ball. Its never good to hope/wish for an injury to a player, but when you do so towards a Redskins.....YOU SHOULD BE BANNED!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Money Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 If you're looking for somehting positive why Brunell is still playing, how about this??? Pat is getting to see what Gibbs wants without making all the mistakes himself. He IS GOING TO LEARN how to throw the ball away once in a while and not force everything. Hell even Mcnabb learned that recently. Like you said Pat is learning that Gibbs is loyal and that he IS trustworthy. He let him compete for the job and Pat failed miserably. Hopefully, he (Pat) is doing more on the sidelines and in practice than stewing about not playing. As long as he is learning from Brunell it is not as bad as it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saqs Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 I disagree that Brunell and Ramsey looked "equally awful" during the pre-season. There was no question at all that Brunell was going to be the starter after Ramseys performance in the Rams game. He looked awful. Just as bad as Brunell has looked that last 2 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevenaa Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 The one thing no one has really debated is Brunells decision making. He doesn't make mental mistakes. It's the physical lacking that is killing us. But, that is what Coach likes. Someone who isn't mentally mistake prone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by stevenaa The one thing no one has really debated is Brunells decision making. He doesn't make mental mistakes. It's the physical lacking that is killing us. But, that is what Coach likes. Someone who isn't mentally mistake prone. (This is not directly for you, stevenaa, but...) Oh... my... GOD! WHERE is the "physical lacking"?!?!? All I hear is "weak arm" this and "can't run" that. Mark Brunell is OVERthrowing his long balls. Go back and look at EVERY long pass play we have tried. Our WRs can't get to the ball because they are 1 0f 2 WR targets Gibbs will give Mark and the long guy is double covered. Mark has to overthrow the WR a bit on those occasions to keep the ball safe and he does it with....HELLO! ARM STRENGTH. Anyone who thinks Patrick is a better scrambler than Mark (even with his bad ham) is freakin' stoned. I don't even have to TRY arguing this point. I am all ABOUT Patrick Ramsey, but Mark Brunell is our best bet right now. Next season there is no question in my mind, we should start Ramsey, but neither of these QBs is taking us far until we gel as a team. Ramsey will get a few starts this year, probably after week 10 and probably due to Mark getting hurt. Until then, let Joe go. He's gotta be comfortable to coach and a seasoned vet like Mark is what keeps Joe comfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 When are you guys seeing him overthrow the receivers :confused: Every "deep" ball I've seen has barely made it there and floated in, and then by the time it gets there because he had to heave a rainbow to get there, the safety and corner have moved over to it. maybe I'm watching the game w/ Blinders on or something, but his arm looks dead to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkey66 Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Originally posted by Henry He's prepared to take the pressure, which in this city can be pretty heavy. Understatement of the century. Bush has it easier than Brunell these days... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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