Attended 'Chalk Talk' with Coach Gruden last night

[Wildbunny]

As usual, everybody looked into the defensive side of the ball...

But we still have only one C on the roster and nobody asked for that?

 

That's a bit sad.

 

Great stuff anyway, though I did find the stuff about "calls being late on the defensive side of the ball" concerning. That doesn't speak well of Joe Barry's tenure around here and could explains lots of things in our D. Tough to say then if our players are worth it or not.

[Warhead36]

2 hours ago, Wildbunny said:

As usual, everybody looked into the defensive side of the ball...

But we still have only one C on the roster and nobody asked for that?

 

That's a bit sad.

 

Great stuff anyway, though I did find the stuff about "calls being late on the defensive side of the ball" concerning. That doesn't speak well of Joe Barry's tenure around here and could explains lots of things in our D. Tough to say then if our players are worth it or not.

Bad communication was definitely a factor last year. How many times did you see guys pointing and yelling at each other about where to line up right before the snap last year? Guys were so confused all the time, it was embarassing. The talent sucked but Barry didn't make things easier on them.

[TSO]

5 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

You mean like 2 years ago when we needed a right side to our Oline and has a new GM that wanted a cant miss pick or like last year when we knew our top 2 WRs would leave after the season?

 

Us drafting pure BPA is as much of a myth as using football player, to describe a football player is dumb.

 

Disagree heavily. Any pick can be claimed to be "need" when looking into the future. Tell me what position we could draft in the upcoming draft at what's considered a solidified position right now and I can argue how that's "need based" if I wanted. It's very easy to do so and it doesn't provide evidence for what you're claiming. 

 

Here, I'll give a couple of examples about what I mean.

 

TE isn't immediate need this year, but if we pick one I can say "Reed is always injured and Vernon is old, that's a need pick". Even a Tackle can be justified as need based, since Morgan Moses's contract is almost up and, oh, Trent Williams is another bong hit from a year long suspension. Again, this is easy to do. It wouldn't verify my claims that those were obviously "need picks" and not more BPA (and I know we both acknowledge there's no such thing as 100% BPA, position is weighted at least somewhat in their grades).   

 

As for your points about Sherff and Docston... Sherff was the best Olineman prospect in the 2015 draft, it's not hard to believe he was the BPA at all. Docston was at a position we were considered stacked at, and he may even be why we weren't more aggressive with DJax and Garcon this offseason. Drafting WR last year was not an immediate need. In fact, that's why so many criticized the pick. That we didn't need a WR and were desperate for a Dlinemen, or even just a defensive pick. Scot even said after last year's draft that he wanted to address Dline but it just didn't fall that way. I don't think he's blatantly lying there and, instead, was actively picking WR because of the upcoming contract situations with Djax/Garcon. 

 

 

5 hours ago, Califan007 said:

 

So it's automatic that you must reach in the draft if you don't fill holes in free agency?

 

I certainly hope it isn't. That's kind of my concern, actually. I don't want it to be. And I actually like when I hear Gruden say we'll draft BPA or Allen recently say we'll go by the final grade when asked about it. I like that more than hearing Gruden or Manusky imply that we'll likely address defense in the draft.  

 

But that's the concern because, if they aren't planning to reach/force a position, it could potentially mean we come out of the draft without an impact Dlineman or even an impact defensive player at any position. And then it's increasingly likely we're stuck with personnel that simply can't get it done on that side of the ball, just like last season. 

 

A bit of a side note... one thing I'll commend Allen for is the way we seem to save some cap space to be able to jump on a surprise cut during any given offseason. He actually mentioned it in his recent interview, that teams cut players right now and that they'll be ready for it. That's a positive, so who knows. Maybe there's some guy they think will come available.   

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, thesubmittedone said:

 

As for your points about Sherff and Docston... Sherff was the best Olineman prospect in the 2015 draft, it's not hard to believe he was the BPA at all.

 

 

Sheehan heard from someone close to Scot that had A. Cooper ranked higher than Scherff but he was taken before our pick.  After Scherff he had Gurley apparently ranked next.  Scot himself told me that he had a DT in his sights in round 2 but was taken before his pick.  He ultimately didn't draft a D lineman as we know until the 5th.  It's fairly commonly said and Scot hinted before the draft that his top pick was Ryan Kelly in the previous draft (Cooley doubled down on this point actually the other day) but Kelly was gone and heck he didn't even take a center at all in that draft ultimately.  I think its pretty clear for better or worse Scot walked his talk for being a BPA guy.

[bowhunter]

6 hours ago, Califan007 said:

 

If there is one possible good result from Scot's firing, it will be the retiring of the phrase "He's a Football Player" to describe football players by ES members.

Take it easy Cali. Scot was "super-smart" and "played his guts out."

[Califan007 The Constipated]

2 hours ago, thesubmittedone said:

I certainly hope it isn't. That's kind of my concern, actually. I don't want it to be. And I actually like when I hear Gruden say we'll draft BPA or Allen recently say we'll go by the final grade when asked about it. I like that more than hearing Gruden or Manusky imply that we'll likely address defense in the draft.  

 

But that's the concern because, if they aren't planning to reach/force a position, it could potentially mean we come out of the draft without an impact Dlineman or even an impact defensive player at any position. And then it's increasingly likely we're stuck with personnel that simply can't get it done on that side of the ball, just like last season. 

 

A bit of a side note... one thing I'll commend Allen for is the way we seem to save some cap space to be able to jump on a surprise cut during any given offseason. He actually mentioned it in his recent interview, that teams cut players right now and that they'll be ready for it. That's a positive, so who knows. Maybe there's some guy they think will come available.   

 

You know what I realized while reading your post?...I probably should have asked what people mean by "building through the draft". I mean, i agree with everything you said...I may have agreed with everything the other guy said, too, if I had asked him that question lol...