So do you start RGIII in week 13?

[GoCommiesGo]

I don't think anyone wants to see him fail, his success would be the success of the team. The price paid and his performance are not syncing up at the moment and that sucks. 

 

To label someone a hater because you can look at it and say "Wow he doesn't look good" is asinine. No one here wants to see the Redskins fail any longer, and I think the majority of people would like to see Griffin be a franchise player. At this moment he looks like a bottom tier quarterback who is learning to play his position in his third year. 

 

No matter how you cut this as a third year pro it is not reassuring. 

[General NSJ]

What's the point in keeping him out there?  He's a detriment to the other guys on the field.  You can't honestly evaluate the rest of the team if the point man is scared to death to throw the damn ball?  Let's be real honest here, he looks like he has NO clue what he's doing out there.  Label me a hater, I don't care. I trust what my eyes tell me and I don't see a guy who's confident, nor does he have any kind of handle on the offense. 

 

[HAILSKINSNYC]

I don't have the time to break that down but I would be interested to see what the percent of first down handoffs are for Washington is compared to say Green Bay or New England. 

 

If I get some free time today I'll see if I can look into this. 

 

We ran on first down 16 times....threw it 6 times......RG3 was 5 for 6 on first down.    I'm not including the last two drives where it was obvious he was going to pass.

I think Gruden is willing to be flexible, but you can't make a living having your QB throw the ball behind the LOS or checking down. At some point, regardless of whatever scheme is being run, Griffin is going to have to be able to drop back and throw the ball down the field to a quality QB. 

 

There is no sabotage going on here...Griffin just isn't nearly as far along as the other two QBs as a dropback passer. 

 

Griffin is low on confidence....the coach has done NOTHING to help him.....NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!    except make it worse.

Looking at the ESPN stats page. Where did you get that infor? The ESPN page has it different, unless I can't read.

 

2014

3rd and 6+

0 TD-- 1 INT-- 109 yard-- 50% comp.-- 6.81 YPA -- 46.1 QB. 

 

2013

3 TD-- 2 INT-- 651 Yards-- 60.2% Comp-- 7.4 YPA -- 88.8 QB

 

2012

4 TD-- 0 INT-- 428 Yards-- 57.1% Comp-- 6.11 YPA-- 94.2 QB

 

he's regressed because of coaching....no doubt about it

[3200fps]

 

 

Is it Gruden?  Is it his dad? It sure as heck is not the norm for RG3.

 

The reason I have fears of Bob being our QB for the future is because I think the QB we see now is closer to his "norm".  If anyone refuses to admit he has regressed then that is denial.  Does the OL need to be better?  No doubt about that at all.  What we are witnessing is the product of someone who thinks "I've already arrived".  He was a humble person in 2012, someone who acted like he was embracing his opportunity for a shot in the NFL.  Snyder sure as hell didn't help matters with the "special access" his family was getting, which is reflective in Bob's overall behavior. 

[KingGibbs]

If Grudes doesn't believe in III how do you think his teammates feel?

[HAILSKINSNYC]

If Grudes doesn't believe in III how do you think his teammates feel?

 

It's an excuse for the others on offense to not work as hard.....it's all RG3's fault

[Skins Wingman]

Griffin in 2012 accounted for 40 first downs (28%) in 2014 6 (9.5%) all by rushing. 

 

The early down issues and the decision by Griffin/Coaching to not run is really hurting the offensive production as far as moving the chains.

this is the biggest difference between 2012 and now. in 2012, he was running all over defenses. he was keeping drives alive. it seemed like every time we were 3rd and long, he would run for the 1st and wear the defense down mentally and physically. this allowed morris to have more touches, and more chances to break a big run.

at the end of the day, we drafted a running quarterback who either doesnt want to run or is being forced not to. at the end of the day, his legs will always be his biggest asset and if we dont use them it was a mistake to draft him. its time to go back to the designed runs, heavy read option, and instill it into his brain that he will always be a running qb. otherwise, start kirk or colt. he will never be aaron rodgers like he think he can be.

[KingGibbs]

It's an excuse for the others on offense to not work as hard.....it's all RG3's fault

Alfred Morris disagrees with you.

[SkinsWizCubsDukes]

All this drama is not worth it.  Colt McCoy should have been starting since he was entered into the Titans game.  All coaches know to ride the hot hand and Gruden got overruled by Snyder and is now making a mockery out of this franchise.  He's making a point to show Snyder he was right and I for one am glad that someone has the balls to stand up to this owner even if it is passive aggressive.

 

We would be talking about playoff with Colt McCoy as our starter no doubt about it.  He played well in preseason, (yes, against backups…) and the team looked good with him under center.

 

I feel bad for Griffin, he blew his knee out and somehow forgot how to play quarterback…but he made millions of dollars and Subway Bob has a good life ahead of him regardless of if he gets benched.  In this league you either perform or you don't.  And he is not performing very well at all.  The commentators in the game (Rich Gannon), were breaking him down and now they have even had segments on ESPN breaking down game film and showing you his mistakes.  It's that bad and now we have to wonder what might have been had we kept Colt McCoy in.  Let's not forget that McCoy was highly coveted out of college and then was drafted by the lowly Browns…he has looked great since playing for the B&G...

 

Long story short…bench RG3…it's Jason Campbell part 2 with more drama.

[darrelgreenie]

Looking at the ESPN stats page. Where did you get that infor?

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/06/02/qbs-in-focus-by-down-and-distance/

We ran on first down 16 times....threw it 6 times......RG3 was 5 for 6 on first down.    I'm not including the last two drives where it was obvious he was going to pass.

Damn. I noticed Jay had this tendency but didn't know it was this slanted. SMH.

[HAILSKINSNYC]

Alfred Morris disagrees with you.

 

Maybe...but the o-line and Receivers agree with me

[UK Skins]

It's an excuse for the others on offense to not work as hard.....it's all RG3's fault

I honestly think you are just trying to wind people up now. You're posting crap to get a rise out of people, because no one is dumb enough to actually believe what you are posting.

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

It's an excuse for the others on offense to not work as hard.....it's all RG3's fault

So according to this guy

-The coach is sabotaging him because he never wanted him to succeed

-The media is sabotaging him because they want the team to fail.

- His teammates are sabotaging so they won't have to work hard and can blame someone else

I'm not making this up. He's actually said all of this.

[Alexa]

3rd and 10+

Robert Griffin 2013

1 TD--1 INT--269 yards--57% comp--7.7 YPA--79 QB rating

But were they converting 3rd downs.

 

We ran on first down 16 times....threw it 6 times......RG3 was 5 for 6 on first down.    I'm not including the last two drives where it was obvious he was going to pass.

 

Griffin is low on confidence....the coach has done NOTHING to help him.....NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!    except make it worse.

 

he's regressed because of coaching....no doubt about it

How's it coaching? They're designing plays that are getting wr's open. What else are they suppose to do? Go out and actually throw the ball for him?

[KingGibbs]

Maybe...but the o-line and Receivers agree with me

Do you realize how idiotic you sound?

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

But were they converting 3rd downs.

 

How's it coaching? They're designing plays that are getting wr's open. What else are they suppose to do? Go out and actually throw the ball for him?

Only run screens, bootlegs with one read on half the field, and called shots downfield. You know... 'cause Robert is so good.

[skins island connection]

I present the FACTS and all the haters run away......RG3 was sabotaged by Gruden.....plain and simple.    Gruden wants him to be successful playing the way he wants...if he can't, screw him.

 

 sabotaged?  Really?  Really;  Really!

 I suppose Mike Shanahan sabotaged him as well, and if the next HC ends up being Joel Osteen or  the Pilsbury Dough Boy they will be grabbing their knives as well, huh/

 

 Gruden is trying to teach the kid how to be a pocket QB and Griffin isn't showing he can. I'm not saying Gruden is the best choice in teaching a QB but he has experience in it. The RO was a gimmick that was most likely going to be phased out as Griffin learned to be a pocket QB, but he's not grasping the concept so he is struggling. A work-in-progress if you will.

[skins island connection]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/06/02/qbs-in-focus-by-down-and-distance/

Damn. I noticed Jay had this tendency but didn't know it was this slanted. SMH.

 

ok greenie, I asked you earlier, but maybe you didn't see it, so I want to get your opinion on this scenario.

 

the organization has to make a decision on griffin's future in may, I believe, right?

So, my thinking is to sit griffin the remainder of the season. Bring in a QB specialist-type coach to work ONLY with him on his fundamentals, what he is doing wrong, because the problems he's having are deeply seeded bad habits, and they take time to retrain his mind into what to do in certain situations.

Because I don't believe he will be able to learn it being behind center, being under almost constant pressure, he will revert back to his old way of dealing with pressure. Let Cousins or Colt finish the season, after the season is over, heavily address the o-line problem.

 

now, in this time, griffin can hopefully be re-taught, his bad habits and things he's not seeing/doing can hopefully be gone and he can have a fresh 2015 training camp, provided he has picked up on his mistakes and corrected them. now, if by chance he doesn't grasp it, the QB coach will have seen this before may and can inform the FO of his results, and whether or not to sign him.

 

Its basically saying give him private tutoring without playing in any games, and let the teacher turn in the test results before may, that way they can say they did everything they could to help him, or he gets it, learns how to play in the pocket, improves his skills, and he could possibly be the starter in 2015.

 

I'm saying this, not to be on anyone's side, but to give him the benefit of a doubt and to look in the best interest of the team as well. If he works out, great; if he doesn't, then they have their decision to make.

[darrelgreenie]

Well since you asked that scenario sounds crazy to me since I don't believe the things you believe.

Also, it sounds like a you're tacitly admitting that the coaching staff is failing to develop Griffin and needs to outsource help.

 

How's this strike you.

 

Jay keeps his mouth shut and doesn't make every press conference and interview all about the QB.

Jay and McVay put together game plans that the offense can execute with fewer mistakes e.g. (Moses matched up 1-on-1 all game) and fewer penalties. And put together a passing game plan more in tune with Griffin's strengths like the Viking's game plan.

[Fat Stupid Loser]

sabotaged?  Really?  Really;  Really!

 I suppose Mike Shanahan sabotaged him as well, and if the next HC ends up being Joel Osteen or  the Pilsbury Dough Boy they will be grabbing their knives as well, huh/

 

 Gruden is trying to teach the kid how to be a pocket QB and Griffin isn't showing he can. I'm not saying Gruden is the best choice in teaching a QB but he has experience in it. The RO was a gimmick that was most likely going to be phased out as Griffin learned to be a pocket QB, but he's not grasping the concept so he is struggling. A work-in-progress if you will.

That was the story last year. Shanahan was a cancer, sabotaging our ROTY QB. Now its the new guy. Shanahan wasn't the problem, neither is Gruden.

[skins island connection]

Well since you asked that scenario sounds crazy to me since I don't believe the things you believe.

I don't see it as crazy, I see it as getting Griffin some private one-on-one tutoring which he does need; tutoring he cannot learn while under constant pressure behind center.

Also, it sounds like a you're tacitly admitting that the coaching staff is failing to develop Griffin and needs to outsource help.

Gruden and McVay may not be getting through to him, or maybe they have other problems to deal with and cannot dedicate all of their time on 1 person. This is why I'm saying to get him some personalized help, because he has fundamental flaws which are holding him back; they can be corrected, but not while playing in-game. He needs  re-training, to break him of his bad habits, to help him read the whole field, to develop pocket awareness [ admittlngly when there is one ] to develop his read progressions.

How's this strike you.

 

Jay keeps his mouth shut and doesn't make every press conference and interview all about the QB.

when ALL parties stop lynching each other it will be better for the team.

Jay and McVay put together game plans that the offense can execute with fewer mistakes e.g. (Moses matched up 1-on-1 all game) and fewer penalties.

I agree there should have been more protection / adjustments made to counter pressure.

And put together a passing game plan more in tune with Griffin's strengths like the Viking's game plan.

Griffin's only strength is running the RO, and it does absolutely nothing to address the habits he has on-field and will not address his issues.

 

you're still being hung up on finger-pointing, all I'm trying to do is come up with something that will benefit everyone. The help Griffin needs cannot be gotten while under constant pressure; he will always revert to his habits of dealing with it in his way, which is why he's in the predicament he's in now.

[skins island connection]

That was the story last year. Shanahan was a cancer, sabotaging our ROTY QB. Now its the new guy. Shanahan wasn't the problem, neither is Gruden.

 

 Griffin had an ego, and its not totally a bad thing. the crap that went on with Mike was bad for everyone involved.

 now similar things are surfacing with Gruden, and I think that Griffin is in the humbling stage; this is the critical point in his career. He has 2 ways he can go. One way he can work hard through private tutoring and break himself of his habits and learn to be more of a pocket passer; if he does, he would be absolutely the most dangerous weapon on field, but he has to train himself and trust himself and his teammates first.

or, he can further regress, and end up mentally wrecked, and might not see a starting position ever.

 

It sucks because he does have talent and a good arm, but the way he played in college doesn't translate into winning at the pro level. It happens all the time, in every aspect of life, even in school; a kid struggles in school, a teacher gives him/her some one-on-one help, and in most cases the kid comes out being much improved. that's the angle I am taking on this.

[GoldSkinner]

Like I said, leave this bum out there to play the remaining games. I want him to be so humiliated, so crushed, so utterly broken that he'll force himself to rebuild both mentally and physically. I want sponsors to think twice before putting him in a commercial and inflating his ego. Render him so speechless that he'll have nothing to do with social media because he'll have nothing to say; blasted so hard by the media that he'll finally develop a thick skin, and shed the wet-paper bag he calls an exterior. I want him to be resurrected as a football player, pure and simple. Not a walking microcosm of what the Redskins have become in these past 15 years, an entertainment device dressed as a football entity.

[darrelgreenie]

This is why I'm saying to get him some personalized help, because he has fundamental flaws which are holding him back; they can be corrected, but not while playing in-game. He needs re-training, to break him of his bad habits, to help him read the whole field, to develop pocket awareness [ admittlngly when there is one ] to develop his read progressions.

when ALL parties stop lynching each other it will be better for the team.

Griffin's only strength is running the RO, and it does absolutely nothing to address the habits he has on-field and will not address his issues.

you're still being hung up on finger-pointing, all I'm trying to do is come up with something that will benefit everyone. The help Griffin needs cannot be gotten while under constant pressure; he will always revert to his habits of dealing with it in his way, which is why he's in the predicament he's in now.

Huh? Finger pointing? Dude YOU asked ME and I responded.

I don't believe the things YOU believe. I don't believe Griffin need tutoring nor do I believe he's a fundamentally flawed QB in need of fixing. So of course your idea seems crazy to me. Your idea tries to fix things that aren't broken.

And lets be clear about the whole ALL parties bit. Gruden is the one doing all the talking. Lets not be false and make it seem as if Griffin and Jay are go tit for tat. Griffin screwed up once but it wasn't intentional, he didn't intend to call out his teammates. Gruden's comments were with intent and have been numerous.

Griffin's only strength is RO? ...Sure..Great!

[GoCommiesGo]

And lets be clear about the whole ALL parties bit. Gruden is the one doing all the talking. Lets not be false and make it seem as if Griffin and Jay are go tit for tat. Griffin screwed up once but it wasn't intentional, he didn't intend to call out his teammates. Gruden's comments were with intent and have been numerous.

Griffin's only strength is RO? ...Sure..Great!

 

I want to say I like Griffin I thought, coming our of college, he was going to be a sure fire franchise stud. The pass he made to beat Oklahoma was one of the best throws I've ever seen. With that being said. 

 

The press conference to end all press conferences struck me as a last ditch effort to get a persons attention. Gruden doesn't strike me as a dummy, he took a calculated risk in his remarks. Whether or not it was the right thing to do is up in the air, I don't manage people like that but I understand why he could take that route. 

 

Griffin has deflected criticism to others multiple times, and I think it got to the point that Gruden felt he needed to take the step in the media to for lack of a better term put him back in his place. Again, it can be discussed on whether or not it was the right thing to do. 

 

 

To get back to the point of the thread, you start him until you see either growth or abject failure. I think Gruden has his mind very much made up and it would take an above average performance of the remaining games to change it.