MWAI Posted June 27, 2013 Share Posted June 27, 2013 sure Rambo as the Free safety and Thomas as the Strong safety is what will occur NEXT year....but for THIS year Reed Doughty is safe if for no other reason he is going to be Special Teams captain. And so with 4 safeties....Doughty MUST be assigned Strong safety because he simply cannot play the free safety position. So even though Haslett and many of us look at Thomas as a strong safety, I would much rather have Phillip Thomas back up Rambo for this season because Doughty scares me to death. Of course Merriweather could re-injure himself and suddenly Doughty could be a starter or be Thomas's backup. We'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted June 27, 2013 Share Posted June 27, 2013 Mahons- Was gonna respond but NLC pretty much said what I was gonna say and have been saying. But, let me ask you this: between Thomas and Rambo who do you think is the better FS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted June 27, 2013 Share Posted June 27, 2013 Depends on the FS' responsibility on the play. The only safety responsibilities I give Rambo the advantage in are cover-1 and a slight advantage in cover-3. Furthermore, if it's a run play and we're in cover-3, I'd feel better with Thomas at FS, but obviously we don't know when the opponent will be running. My fear with Rambo is what will happen when an RB inevitably gets past our LBs. I can just envision one of this high tackles, or one of his arm tackles, and the RB busting the big one. From the arguments you're making is it safe to assume you believe Rambo will be our starting FS next season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted June 27, 2013 Share Posted June 27, 2013 Did you watch the same Phillip Thomas I did? Why do you trust PT to be the last line of defense more than you trust Rambo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 In Cover 3 and Cover 1 (single high in our scheme) the FS will be in the same part of the field... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 Are you suggesting the FS responsibilities on these two plays are the same? Are are you just informing us that they're both single high safety looks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 For the most part yes. The details are fine enough to where you can't say a player is better in one and marginally better in the other. I'll re-address your over-thinking and anxiety on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 This isn't really directed at anyone in particular, but I wonder how the player who leads the NCAA in interceptions in any given year fares in the NFL historically? Obviously we can't say anything based on the last two years, but what about before that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 Depends on the FS' responsibility on the play. The only safety responsibilities I give Rambo the advantage in are cover-1 and a slight advantage in cover-3. Furthermore, if it's a run play and we're in cover-3, I'd feel better with Thomas at FS, but obviously we don't know when the opponent will be running. My fear with Rambo is what will happen when an RB inevitably gets past our LBs. I can just envision one of this high tackles, or one of his arm tackles, and the RB busting the big one. I'm not trying to over complicate the question, I'm not talking on a play by play basis. (even though we play more Cover 1/Cover 3) Just asking who you think is the better FS between Thomas and Rambo? I agree that tackling is an area that needs improve for Rambo but its been just as much an issue for Thomas. I think they're equal in that category. From the arguments you're making is it safe to assume you believe Rambo will be our starting FS next season? I think the door is w i d e open for Rambo or Thomas to start at FS this year. For one we don't have a FS on this roster right now. And bar for performance is set very low: Maddie Williams. I actually wouldn't be surprised if a rookie starts very early this season, (by week 4). The reason why I say before week 4 instead of week 1 is because NFL coaches seems very hesitant to start rookies at FS and Rambo doesn't come in with a reputation for discipline. I would be very surprised if Rambo doesn't make the team. I don't view him as a typical 6th round pick because of how thin we are at FS and because of the extraordinary depth in this SAF draft class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 This isn't really directed at anyone in particular, but I wonder how the player who leads the NCAA in interceptions in any given year fares in the NFL historically? Obviously we can't say anything based on the last two years, but what about before that? 2012 - Phillip Thomas (Fresno St) - Redskins - 4th rd 2013 - ??? 2011 - David Amerson (NC State) - Redskins - 2nd rd 2013 - ??? 2010 - Jayron Hosely (Va Tech) - Giants - 3rd rd 2012 - 1 pick - LIKED HIM OUT OF SCHOOL/TOO EARLY TO TELL 2009 - Raheem Moore (UCLA) - Broncos - 2nd rd 2011 - 2 picks - WIN 2008 - Eric Berry (Tennessee) - Chiefs - 1st rd 2010 - 5 picks - WIN 2007 - William Moore (Mizzou) - Falcons - 2nd rd 2009 - 11 picks - WIN 2006 - Dwight Lowery (San Jose St.) - Jets/Jags - 4th rd 2008 - 10 picks - WIN 2005 - Aaron Gipson (Oregon) - never heard of him - LOSS??? 2004 - Charles Gordon (Kansas) - Vikings - undrafted - broke leg - LOSS So since 2007 it looks like they've panned out well... as in you at the very least get a servicable if not dangerous player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 Is Raheem "Gave Up A TD In The Playoffs" Moore really a win? I was under the impression that Broncos fans weren't wild on him even before that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted June 29, 2013 Share Posted June 29, 2013 Win was qualified as a servicable to dangerous player. So yes, he's a win as of right now in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted July 2, 2013 Share Posted July 2, 2013 I'm not trying to over complicate the question, I'm not talking on a play by play basis. (even though we play more Cover 1/Cover 3) Just asking who you think is the better FS between Thomas and Rambo? I would be projecting Thomas at singe high, so it's not a very easy comparison, which is why I broke it down the way I did. Thomas' ball skills and instinctual play lead me to believe he could make some plays out there, but he doesn't possess sideline to sideline speed. However I don't know why I'd be comparing those two, as I stated in my prediction, I believe BM would be playing FS when someone other than Rambo was on the field. If you're asking me who I think the better FS between Rambo and BM are right now, I'd go with BM. I disagree that the Redskins run single high majority of the time. I don't recall that last year and after re-watching the DAL/WSH Thanksgiving game, that's certainly not what I saw. With that being said, we were blowing them out so you're going to be showing more 2 deep looks. However even in the first half when it's still a game, 2 deep is more prevalent, and that's with me counting the 2 deep pre-snap looks that are really cover-1 (you see Gomes get in man, and Madieu drop). Furthermore, when re-watching the game, I noticed Madieu line up at both right and left safety, in the box blitzing with Gomes playing single high, and in the box playing man with Gomes in single high, which is evidence of us interchanging safeties. Game is on youtube if you just search Redskins v Cowboys, if you got some time check it out and let me know what you think. I agree that tackling is an area that needs improve for Rambo but its been just as much an issue for Thomas. I think they're equal in that category. They both leave something to be desired no doubt, but I'd give a slight edge to Thomas. When I watch Thomas I see a guy who's consistently dealing with blockers, and he's not great at shedding them to get to the ball and make a solid tackle. When I watch Rambo, I see a guy in open space tackling high, with his arms, and never really making that solid contact. Either way, it's something I'd like to see both of them improve upon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 Versus Dallas on Thanksgiving, we lined up in a single high look 32 times, and anything else 47 times. And the huge bulk of that 47 times came with the Cowboys running no huddle late in the fourth. Versus Dallas in the NFCE Championship game, we lined up in a single-high safety look or rotated to single-high safety 49 times, and lined up in anything else 13 times. I didn't see much Madieu blitzing, but my eyes were crossing trying to figure out WTF Gomes was doing on most plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 Re-watching the final Dallas drive in no huddle I'm counting nine two deep looks and seven single high looks. With that said I don't have all 22, but there were multiple obvious cover 3 looks, there's a cover -1 with deep off man near the end that could be misconstrued as cover-2 but is not. There's also multiple other plays in which Gomes comes down and is man, there's another play that may be an inverted cover-2, Gomes/Madieu drop down in the box both, but Hall and WIlson dtrop deep. I also noticed on one of the plays Hall was playing single high himself. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YmiraAHVKkU Futhermore, was cover-0 included in your numbers for the second game under other coverages or single high? EDIT: Re-watching there's not as much cover-0 as I had presumed, and single high was about the only look they're showing from what I've watched. But I did notice Pugh come in on at least one if not two plays and spell the single high look with Madieu playing man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 I only recall seeing Cover 0 2-3 times between both games. The times I saw it we bailed out of it to a 2 deep look, so into the "anything else" category it went. I also tried to take into account any times we showed the quarterback 2 deep initially and rotated into Cover 1/Cover 3 look, which might be easier to see on the All 22. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 I was really surprised about cover-0 being so absent, thought we had run a lot more of it. I attempted to take into account when we show two deep but changed the look, usually I was able to locate Gomes either coming up in man or zone which indicated to me a switch. On an extremely positive note, the blitz packages between Thanksgiving and Week 17 were night and day in my opinion. The complexity of the blitzes in the last game is what impresses me the most. You finally start to see some zone blitz scheme we're supposedly replicating. On one play in the first qtr, jenkins/bowen drop, and OLBs rush, Romo sits to pee has no clue what to do, throws it to a blanketed Bryant, and Hall nearly taps it to himself for the interception(incredible play by Hall, on one of his best days of the season). Really hope to see the Redskins buidling on that this upcoming season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 In the middle of the season it seems like Haz got so basic trying to cover up the holes we had it's not surprising we played more Cover 2 than usual, trying not to get beat deep. By Week 17, I think we sort of gave up on Gomes, and Reed and Pugh were able to rotate in and play better, which allowed Madieu to stay the single high safety. And even though he is still godawful, he did play better towards the end of the season. Once Haz did that he just blitzed the crap out of the Cowboys on almost every play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 I would be projecting Thomas at singe high, so it's not a very easy comparison, which is why I broke it down the way I did. Thomas' ball skills and instinctual play lead me to believe he could make some plays out there, but he doesn't possess sideline to sideline speed. However I don't know why I'd be comparing those two, as I stated in my prediction, I believe BM would be playing FS when someone other than Rambo was on the field. I know, but considering that Thomas is making a transition and Rambo is playing virtually the same defense in the same role he did at Georgia. I'm just asking who do you rate as the better FS in this scheme? If you're asking me who I think the better FS between Rambo and BM are right now, I'd go with BM. I would agree with only at the outset of the season. Starting a rookie FS is a tall order. But, BM has already proven his failings at FS. I disagree that the Redskins run single high majority of the time. I was speaking specifically about Base defense. When we're in base what other defense do you think we run any where close to Cover 1/3? We're very much like the Steelers/Packers/Seahawks in that respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 —Bacarri Rambo as the starting free safety on opening day may be in the process of evolving from an experiment into a plan. If he can learn to handle the responsibilities of strong safety to the satisfaction of the coaches—the two safeties do have to be interchangeable—it seems likely that he will be in the starting lineup on Sept. 9. ^^Rich Tandler Also: Redskins rookies David Amerson, Bacarri Rambo open camp as starters in secondary http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/football-insider/wp/2013/07/25/redskins-rookies-david-amerson-bacarri-rambo-open-camp-as-starters-in-secondary/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 DG, Have to wait to see lineup until everyone is healthy, last year Morris was a FB during pieces of training camp. Also, does this mean you now agree that SAF's need to be interchangeable? Re: Rambo Does appear the path to starting is growing even brighter, the path is never something I have disagreed with, it's his talent. Specifically his ability to come up in the box and stop a rush, since safeties are interchangeable in this scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 No they aren't... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emor09 Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 Just to give some credit to our front office... How awesome is it that we can be so excited over a late round pick? The prior administration (won't even say the name) wasn't even reliable enough to find a contributor in the second round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RG3Hunna Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 Just to give some credit to our front office... How awesome is it that we can be so excited over a late round pick? The prior administration (won't even say the name) wasn't even reliable enough to find a contributor in the second round. It's hilarious because a lot of "Fans" wanted to run this regime out of town after they benched McNabb for Grossman and entered the season with Beck/Grossman as starters. It's great to see those irrational thoughts have subsided almost across the entire fanbase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted July 31, 2013 Share Posted July 31, 2013 Just to give some credit to our front office... How awesome is it that we can be so excited over a late round pick? The prior administration (won't even say the name) wasn't even reliable enough to find a contributor in the second round. I'd be happy if our prior administration even had a draft pick past the 1st round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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