hoskins Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Yes, it is true that Shanny was given one of the worst rosters in football. However, it is also true that he chose 3 of the worst quarterbacks we've had around here in a while. And that is saying a LOT! Do we really trust him to get it right the 4th time? It's only the most important position in sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Yes, it is true that Shanny was given one of the worst rosters in football. However, it is also true that he chose 3 of the worst quarterbacks we've had around here in a while. And that is saying a LOT! Do we really trust him to get it right the 4th time? It's only the most important position in sports. To play devil's advocate, he picked his LT with his first 2010 pick and picked up a pretty talented vet Qb. He didn't pick a guy to develop, but perhaps he envisioned Beck as that guy. Then last year he takes the trade down and goes BPA at positions of need. Maybe he decided to take his lumps and just focused on the other holes. We haven't given the Qbs the supporting cast they need, and outside of maybe McNabb, he hasn't really gone out and gotten 'his guy' yet. I sort of wish we had a younger guy to put out on the field... at least we could blame some of the offense's struggles on inexperience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSO Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 People don't realize it but the redskins job is in far condition than an expansion franchise. Getting Mcnabb set this team behind but the logic was to use him until you found a rookie which i understood, but that experiment ended about 2 years too early Not knocking you, but I'm tired of this sentiment. Getting McNabb really didn't hurt anything and was totally worth the chance. We traded a 2nd rounder and 4th the next year. We got the 4th back from trading Campbell to the Raiders. So, essentially, all we lost was a 2nd rounder on a potential franchise QB for a few years. A 2nd rounder we more than made up for by trading down in the recent draft and grabbing a boat load of picks in the process. It didn't work out with McNabb, but you take that chance every time especially when you don't have an elite QB playing the position. McNabb was coming off a Pro Bowl season and had huge numbers... unfortunately, the last few games on that season were more indicative of who he was becoming than what he had done previous to that and I don't blame Shanahan for not thinking that was more a fluke and they could work on improving his game. In my mind, this FO has been nothing short of incredible thus far. First off, Vinny left Allen and Shanahan with only 5 picks. Secondly, their first offseason was tragically handcuffed by the post-salary cap rules where there were literally no Free Agents worth anything available. Still, here's what they managed to do: 1- Got rid of so much dead weight/players over the hill and established a culture of "only hard work reaps rewards" with a mixture of youth and players in their prime. They immediately cut Cartwright, Randle El, Rabach, Betts, Dockery, Randy Thomas, Cornelius Griffin, and Smoot. How many of those players are playing in the league right now? Exactly. Yet, they were friggin starters for us! They gave Portis a push to work harder by signing Johnson and Parker to contracts that had zero long-term affects, than cut both of them when neither proved they had anything left. 2- Signed so many Redskin-type, blue collar players to fair contracts that won't hamper us in the future with Rocca, Cofield, Bowen, Wilson, Atogwe, Brown, Mcintosh, Lichtensteiger, Torain, and Lorenzo Alexander. What's even more impressive is we can essentially cut any of these guys and not get destroyed by it. 3- They have already drafted more solid players in two years as well as bring in more undrafted free agents who actually produce than we've done in ten years previous to that. Think about Kerrigan, Riley, Williams, Helu, Hurt, Gomes, Neild, Austin, Banks, Armstrong*, Paul and others we haven't seen much from yet like Aldrick Robinson, Evan Royster, Markus White (who was awesome in preseason) and Brandyn Thompson (also impressive during preseason) who have plenty of potential. 4- Have made excellent trades that have only benefited the team and lost next to nothing... some through addition by subtraction alone. We traded Campbell who no longer wanted to be here after the McNabb trade for a 4th, Haynesworth who was nothing but a selfish ahole for a 5th even after the entire league knew we wouldn't keep him on the roster, McNabb for a 4th after it was obvious he didn't want it anymore (I say "want", not "have". I think he has it, but just doesn't want to try), trade Jarmon who wasn't a fit here for Gaffney straight up (easily our most consistently productive no. 2 WR in forever) and a 6th Round Pick plus Holliday for Hightower. 5- And still, with all of this, created an enormous amount of salary cap room, enabling us to maneuver freely and sign who we want to what we want. To top it off we have a bunch of extra draft picks for the next two years and a full slate of them the year after that. Seriously, how anyone can focus on the perceived (and slight) negatives over all that I mentioned above and be disappointed in this FO is beyond ridiculous. There isn't anything "homer" about what I stated above. It's all true. Yes, you can claim keeping Haynesworth on our roster for too long was a mistake as well as picking up McNabb, but that's all in hindsight. It could've just as easily went the other way where Haynesworth became a motivated monster like he was during his last two years in Tennessee and that McNabb still had a few more years in him. But to focus on that alone and our inability to win games with a very young roster after a rash of injuries on a team that had to literally build from scratch is simply complaining for the sake of complaining like a weak-minded child. Heck, this doesn't require patience. This requires admiration. People should be admiring this team's growth right now. If they can't friggin see it, I feel bad for them. It stinks we have to have a bunch of well-intentioned posters and mods try to keep so many from jumping off the ledge when they should be admiring how well this FO has done and just how bright our future looks. Heck, one more offseason like last year's and we're going to be a really, really good team faster than you know. Two more and we'll be elite. Just watch. ---------- Post added December-6th-2011 at 11:12 PM ---------- Can we get Bang a Danny Smith avatar? lol, how about Danny in flip flops? Didn't Bang just make a thread praising Danny Smith and admitting he was wrong about him? I am disappointed in our Special Teams though... it's been rough the last few games. I've always been on Danny's side and have defended him against Bang's and GHH's tirades, but I can admit I'm starting to wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RFKFedEx Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 According to Czaban Shanny has no control over this team after these weed suspensions. You'd think the players on the team were as out of control as they were under Zorn, Spurriur, etc. if you didn't truly know how much progress has been made. So much knee jerk reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I nominate Thesubmittedone post for post of the year and that it be mandatory reading for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWinSkins83 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I suggest alot of you people go back and look at America's Games Bronco's 98 season. Mike Shanahan knows how to put an team together. On that offense it was 8 of the 11 starters that was drafted 6 rounds or later. And when people say Elway was the reason for those Superbowls don't know much about that team. TD was the focal point of that offense. And John played off of it. Also in that year when they had won the first 13 games Elway was out for 4 of those games. And I don't think it was Elway retiring was the reason Broncos fell off it was TD career ending injury was the reason why the Broncos fell off. If Mike can get a Elite prospect I expect us to be that team that is talked about being in the Superbowl every year will our QB retires or Mike retires. ---------- Post added December-7th-2011 at 09:08 AM ---------- According to Czaban Shanny has no control over this team after these weed suspensions. You'd think the players on the team were as out of control as they were under Zorn, Spurriur, etc. if you didn't truly know how much progress has been made. So much knee jerk reaction. Czaban just hates Mike. How can he have control over players he can't even talk to. I mean how in the world you put that on Mike? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leesburgvaskinsfan Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Not knocking you, but I'm tired of this sentiment. Getting McNabb really didn't hurt anything and was totally worth the chance. We traded a 2nd rounder and 4th the next year. We got the 4th back from trading Campbell to the Raiders. So, essentially, all we lost was a 2nd rounder on a potential franchise QB for a few years. A 2nd rounder we more than made up for by trading down in the recent draft and grabbing a boat load of picks in the process. It didn't work out with McNabb, but you take that chance every time especially when you don't have an elite QB playing the position. McNabb was coming off a Pro Bowl season and had huge numbers... unfortunately, the last few games on that season were more indicative of who he was becoming than what he had done previous to that and I don't blame Shanahan for not thinking that was more a fluke and they could work on improving his game. In my mind, this FO has been nothing short of incredible thus far. First off, Vinny left Allen and Shanahan with only 5 picks. Secondly, their first offseason was tragically handcuffed by the post-salary cap rules where there were literally no Free Agents worth anything available. Still, here's what they managed to do: 1- Got rid of so much dead weight/players over the hill and established a culture of "only hard work reaps rewards" with a mixture of youth and players in their prime. They immediately cut Cartwright, Randle El, Rabach, Betts, Dockery, Randy Thomas, Cornelius Griffin, and Smoot. How many of those players are playing in the league right now? Exactly. Yet, they were friggin starters for us! They gave Portis a push to work harder by signing Johnson and Parker to contracts that had zero long-term affects, than cut both of them when neither proved they had anything left. 2- Signed so many Redskin-type, blue collar players to fair contracts that won't hamper us in the future with Rocca, Cofield, Bowen, Wilson, Atogwe, Brown, Mcintosh, Lichtensteiger, Torain, and Lorenzo Alexander. What's even more impressive is we can essentially cut any of these guys and not get destroyed by it. 3- They have already drafted more solid players in two years as well as bring in more undrafted free agents who actually produce than we've done in ten years previous to that. Think about Kerrigan, Riley, Williams, Helu, Hurt, Gomes, Neild, Austin, Banks, Armstrong*, Paul and others we haven't seen much from yet like Aldrick Robinson, Evan Royster, Markus White (who was awesome in preseason) and Brandyn Thompson (also impressive during preseason) who have plenty of potential. 4- Have made excellent trades that have only benefited the team and lost next to nothing... some through addition by subtraction alone. We traded Campbell who no longer wanted to be here after the McNabb trade for a 4th, Haynesworth who was nothing but a selfish ahole for a 5th even after the entire league knew we wouldn't keep him on the roster, McNabb for a 4th after it was obvious he didn't want it anymore (I say "want", not "have". I think he has it, but just doesn't want to try), trade Jarmon who wasn't a fit here for Gaffney straight up (easily our most consistently productive no. 2 WR in forever) and a 6th Round Pick plus Holliday for Hightower. 5- And still, with all of this, created an enormous amount of salary cap room, enabling us to maneuver freely and sign who we want to what we want. To top it off we have a bunch of extra draft picks for the next two years and a full slate of them the year after that. Seriously, how anyone can focus on the perceived (and slight) negatives over all that I mentioned above and be disappointed in this FO is beyond ridiculous. There isn't anything "homer" about what I stated above. It's all true. Yes, you can claim keeping Haynesworth on our roster for too long was a mistake as well as picking up McNabb, but that's all in hindsight. It could've just as easily went the other way where Haynesworth became a motivated monster like he was during his last two years in Tennessee and that McNabb still had a few more years in him. But to focus on that alone and our inability to win games with a very young roster after a rash of injuries on a team that had to literally build from scratch is simply complaining for the sake of complaining like a weak-minded child. Heck, this doesn't require patience. This requires admiration. People should be admiring this team's growth right now. If they can't friggin see it, I feel bad for them. It stinks we have to have a bunch of well-intentioned posters and mods try to keep so many from jumping off the ledge when they should be admiring how well this FO has done and just how bright our future looks. Heck, one more offseason like last year's and we're going to be a really, really good team faster than you know. Two more and we'll be elite. Just watch. ---------- Post added December-6th-2011 at 11:12 PM ---------- lol, how about Danny in flip flops? Didn't Bang just make a thread praising Danny Smith and admitting he was wrong about him? I am disappointed in our Special Teams though... it's been rough the last few games. I've always been on Danny's side and have defended him against Bang's and GHH's tirades, but I can admit I'm starting to wonder. Great post! This sums it up nicely regarding all the clean-up that's currently taking place from all the years of bad picks and terrible years of, shaky at best, decision making. Those who still listen to the "Sports Reporters" for any kind of insight IMHO... are looking in the wrong place. They (Czabe and Andy) are chasing ratings through sensationalizing and riling up Redskins Nation. I quit listening to them years ago....unfortunately, Lavar and Chad aren't much better. This is again IMHO. We are taking our medicine now. I see us as in our pre-season now as we see who will stay and who will go. Eventually I see us getting better, not just to squeak in as a wildcard but really better. Shanahan and Allen have a plan for getting us back on track. It's going to take time. Our franchise QB is playing on Saturday and I hope it's RG III. Hail! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingdaddy Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 what are you attributing to shannahan though when you say he outcoached another team?i look at shannahan as more of a GM than a game to game stratagy guy. he has input but i think kyle, haz, and smith are responsible for their side of the ball. and as for making a difference, you can't make assumptions that we don't have excellent schemes in place but lack the players to take advantage. guys running wide open in the secondary that the qb can't find is not on the OC, just like missed tackles are not the responsibility of the DC, but both of these things can easily flip your record. i just don't get how fans can expect a coach to take a steaming pile of **** and turn it into a playoff contender just by their will. it takes time, talent, and execution. You're point about the QB is exactly my concern about the job Shanahan is doing. He's the one who brought in McNabb, and he's the one who fully endorsed Beck. By doing so, he's wasted two years of developing a QB of the future. The Kerrigan pick may turn out to be great, however, it came at the expense of getting a QB in the draft last year which is the biggest need this team has. How long are we supposed to be patient? The Skins started out this year 3-1 and there's no good reason why we're sitting at 4-8 rather than 6-6 and in the hunt. I wonder why this coaching staff keeps being given the benefit of the doubt as we continue to lose close games. That's all I'm saying. I hope everyone is right about giving Shanahan time, but we now go into year 3 of his regime and have no idea who will be the QB on this team that will have expectations of contending for the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leesburgvaskinsfan Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 You're point about the QB is exactly my concern about the job Shanahan is doing. He's the one who brought in McNabb, and he's the one who fully endorsed Beck. By doing so, he's wasted two years of developing a QB of the future. The Kerrigan pick may turn out to be great, however, it came at the expense of getting a QB in the draft last year which is the biggest need this team has. How long are we supposed to be patient? The Skins started out this year 3-1 and there's no good reason why we're sitting at 4-8 rather than 6-6 and in the hunt. I wonder why this coaching staff keeps being given the benefit of the doubt as we continue to lose close games. That's all I'm saying. I hope everyone is right about giving Shanahan time, but we now go into year 3 of his regime and have no idea who will be the QB on this team that will have expectations of contending for the playoffs. I hear what you're saying about the QB situation. I still think we keep Grossman as a bridge until our franchise QB is ready (hopefully RG III). The other pieces are falling into place. I think we need to take a hard look at Landry and his health issues. As much as I like him when he's healthy, he's starting to remind me more and more of Shawn Springs when he was here. The Defense is close to being very good now and is maybe a CB and SS away from being elite. The offense needs a solid young RT and lots of good OL depth. We're set at RB and another reliable receiver away from being possibly good there. I agree with Bang and others about our Danny Smith. For years I liked his swagger, but I think he's lost his edge. Hail! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I nominate Thesubmittedone post for post of the year and that it be mandatory reading for everyone. I second that. Great post thesubmittedone.!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeefJerky Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I second that. Great post thesubmittedone.!! Make it a third. I think that MAY be the best post I've read on this site. Excellent post thesubmittedone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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