wrecker Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Last I checked, it was Spurrier's decision to resign, Gibbs' decision to bring in Saunders, Gibbs' decision to retire. Certainly you can hang Zorn and all of that situation onto Vinny and Snyder, but the vast majority of problems were caused by the coaching staffs.Unfortunately, you seem to be reflecting the problem with this team: all we've ever done in the past decade is change coaching staffs and not build anything. Why can't we develop late round picks? Because the coaching staffs who drafted them are gone and the new staff doesn't have these guys in their plan. While I wasn't a fan of hiring Shanahan, he should get his 5 years to turn this thing around. Getting rid of him would be falling into the same pattern we have for the past decade, which isn't a successful one. Well you could make the case for why Spurrier was hired in the first place. Believe me, I want coaching continuity more than anyone. But if we are not close to competing after 3 seasons then I don't think it will serve any purpose to continue for 2 more. Snyder would have obviously missed the boat again. To keep an ineffective coaching staff in place for 5 years just to say we did it won't help the future of the Redskins. We need to find the RIGHT person for the job. It appears we never will until Snyder hires a REAL GM. Edit: Don't get me wrong, if Shanahan pulls it together next year and gets us to a 9-7 record or better and we can average 20+ points a game then I will feel we are on our way. Year 4 better be playoffs though or we are back to what I said before. Year 5 we should be competing for a SB run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbill1952 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Bottom feelers? A little Freudian slip by the OP or by Smoot? Regardless, Smoot hits the nail on the head, just like he did with his Fat Boy speech 3 years ago. Too bad the suits never listened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Smoot is correct about everything except "the only difference between Jason Campbell and Tom Brady" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSUSkins24 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Every poster that wants to get rid of Orakpo should read this. Seriously. I would hate to see Orakpo in any other uniform. Let's not forget about Ryan Clark either. A certain safety that was emerging as a great player until we let him go to the Steelers... where he is still making plays :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkskin Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 One thing...Why does everyone forget that Champ Bailey had pretty much said he wasn't going to be coming back and threatened to sit out of training camp if he got franchised tagged. It was actually a supremely smart move by the otherwise completely dimwitted Vinny Cerrato to move Champ and get draft picks and Clinton Portis in return. Champ didn't want to be here, he wasn't going to resign here, and he acted kind of like a douche, so he got traded." Except we traded Champ and a 2nd rounder for Portis. Didn't get any draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffro Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 FYI - Fred Smoot was a Redskins in 2009. I know, I wasn't being literal although I probably should have. Was just trying to say what happened x years ago isn't how it is today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLongshot Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Well you could make the case for why Spurrier was hired in the first place. Not many were questioning the hiring of Spurrier at the time he was hired. At the time, it was considered a great hire. It is only in hindsight that people question it. Believe me, I want coaching continuity more than anyone. But if we are not close to competing after 3 seasons then I don't think it will serve any purpose to continue for 2 more. Snyder would have obviously missed the boat again.To keep an ineffective coaching staff in place for 5 years just to say we did it won't help the future of the Redskins. We need to find the RIGHT person for the job. It appears we never will until Snyder hires a REAL GM. Allen isn't a real GM? Allen is about as real as a GM gets. The reason why we aren't succeeding now has little to do with ineffective coaching. That should have been obvious once Shanahan was brought in and finished with the same record as Zorn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Well you could make the case for why Spurrier was hired in the first place.Believe me, I want coaching continuity more than anyone. But if we are not close to competing after 3 seasons then I don't think it will serve any purpose to continue for 2 more. Snyder would have obviously missed the boat again. To keep an ineffective coaching staff in place for 5 years just to say we did it won't help the future of the Redskins. We need to find the RIGHT person for the job. It appears we never will until Snyder hires a REAL GM. Edit: Don't get me wrong, if Shanahan pulls it together next year and gets us to a 9-7 record or better and we can average 20+ points a game then I will feel we are on our way. Year 4 better be playoffs though or we are back to what I said before. Year 5 we should be competing for a SB run. Vinny wasn't a real GM. Bruce Allen is one of the more respected GMs in the league. I was listening to Brian Billick earlier, giving his take on the Skins and his sentiments were that Snyder did the right thing by bringing in Bruce and Shanny. He also felt that they did a solid job in rebuilding the roster so far. The fans just need to be patient.... mmmm I wonder how many times that's been said.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrecker Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Not many were questioning the hiring of Spurrier at the time he was hired. At the time, it was considered a great hire. It is only in hindsight that people question it.Allen isn't a real GM? Allen is about as real as a GM gets. The reason why we aren't succeeding now has little to do with ineffective coaching. That should have been obvious once Shanahan was brought in and finished with the same record as Zorn. A REAL GM that knows football would not have hired Spurrier. I really like Bruce Allen. Bruce Allen is a great guy, a shrewd financial guy, great with the salary cap...etc... He proved in Tampa he is not a good talent evaluator. He would be a great financial advisor in the front office but is not the GM you want to build a roster. Unfortunately Shanahan's track record of building a roster is also not very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 I know, I wasn't being literal although I probably should have. Was just trying to say what happened x years ago isn't how it is today. I'll believe that when time proves it to be true. No offense but "fool me once..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss_Hogg Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Bottom Feeding “I’m not saying the players we do have are bad or they’re not playing good; what I’m saying is we’re three or four great players away from being on the standard that [the other NFC East teams] have set. Right now...and since I’ve been playing, we’ve been the bottom feeders feelers of the NFC East, and the culture has to change. It’s not just the preparation; it’s a lot coming with turning a team around, and I don’t think they’re doing it right now.” Skins NFC East Rankings during Smootie's career: 2001: 2nd 2002: 3rd 2003: 3rd 2004: 3rd 2005: 2nd 2006: 4th 2007: 3rd 2008: 4th 2009: 4th Average finish: 3.1 Mediocre? Yes, bottom feeders? No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 A REAL GM that knows football would not have hired Spurrier.I really like Bruce Allen. Bruce Allen is a great guy, a shrewd financial guy, great with the salary cap...etc... He proved in Tampa he is not a good talent evaluator. He would be a great financial advisor in the front office but is not the GM you want to build a roster. Unfortunately Shanahan's track record of building a roster is also not very good. Shanny's draft picks, the last 3 years in denver resulted in: -Jay Cutler -Tony Schefler -Brandon Marshall -Elvis Dumervil -Jarvis Moss -Ryan Clady -Eddie Royal -Kory Lichtensteiger -Ryan Torrain -Payton Hillis *Doesn't sound to me like he doesn't know how to build a roster..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrecker Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Shanny's draft picks, the last 3 years in denver resulted in:-Jay Cutler -Tony Schefler -Brandon Marshall -Elvis Dumervil -Jarvis Moss -Ryan Clady -Eddie Royal -Kory Lichtensteiger -Ryan Torrain -Payton Hillis *Doesn't sound to me like he doesn't know how to build a roster..... Where is defense on that list other than Dumervil? Moss was a bust. Is that why his offense was great but his defense was terrible? Looks like he was good at building half a roster. I guess if you put all your marbles into the offense it could appear you are a great offensive coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrabR Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Carlos Rogers said basically the same thing this yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brandymac27 Posted November 17, 2011 Author Share Posted November 17, 2011 Bottom feelers? A little Freudian slip by the OP or by Smoot?Regardless, Smoot hits the nail on the head, just like he did with his Fat Boy speech 3 years ago. Too bad the suits never listened. I just copy and pasted the article and didn't make any changes to the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brotherz Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Where is defense on that list other than Dumervil? Moss was a bust. Is that why his offense was great but his defense was terrible?Looks like he was good at building half a roster. I guess if you put all your marbles into the offense it could appear you are a great offensive coach. Well at this point its the half of the roster we need to build! I'd be thrilled if our problem was that we just kept drafting great offensive players but he needed help picking defensive ones. Our offense right now is absolutely putrid. If he can fix that, I honestly believe we will be very competitive in the future because based on what he has done HERE I am not convinced he lacks defensive playmaker identification skills. He didn't draft champ bailey but he certainly recognized the better side of the portis/draft pick vs. champ bailey trade he made with us. Since being here he has drafted Jarvis Jenkins (who by all accounts was going to have a decent year), Ryan Kerrigan (you simply have to be impressed with this pick), Perry Riley (jury's out, but I'm leaning towards him being a future starter right now). I know this is a common refrain but we all seem to be over-thinking this. We need to draft the Best available QB next year, find a real number one receiver and draft five interior offensive lineman. That alone will make us infinitely better in the next two years. Its not rocket science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrecker Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Year 1 before the season: Defense was decent (top 10 on paper). Offense was bad to mediocre. Shanahan changes the defense to a 3-4 and brings in McNabb and a bunch of old guys. Drafts Trent Williams. Year 1 season result: Defense is terrible. Offense is still bad to mediocre. Year 2 before season: Drafts defense 1st and 2nd rounds and signs FA's to fix defense. All but 1 played in a 4-3 and needed to be converted. Year 2 result so far: Defense is marginally better than before year 1. Offense is terrible. I don't see any improvement from before year 1. I do see some regression though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortiz Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Frederick is right on ... I love the "we" usage also. good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailGreen28 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Coaching “This is how I feel about the Redskins, this is what we do: we get the best leftovers in the NFL." Ouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinzfever2010 Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 You know its sad when Champ Bailey is better than every CB we have on the roster and we got rid of him. Jason Campbell is better than an QB we have on the roster and we got rid of him. You can start arguing the same thing about Carlos Rogers at this point. We get rid of players we need. I sit back and watch people start talking about cut LaRon Landry and trade Brian Orakpo (lol yeah ok... its just a matter of time before we're watching them kick ass on someone else's team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsniper1 Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 I will take our current MLB to Antonio Peirce any day of the week and twice on Sundays! Champ refused to stay a Redskin, and our coaches have basically left us, Spurrier left, was not fired, Gibbs left, was not fired, Zorny, well he was fired! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor4Life Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Uhhh first of all NEVER use the words "supremely smart" and Vinny Cerrato in the same sentence.Second, we didn't get draft picks...we TRADED a high draft pick - along with one of the best DBs in the league, for Portis, making it a supremely STUPID trade. Running backs grow on trees and have short careers - if there's ANY position you don't overpay for in the NFL, it's running backs. Yet we trade a hard to find shutdown DB AND a draft pick for one. Nice. I was waiting to see this post before I threw out my own correction. Portis fought hard and was great during those two playoff runs in '05 and '07, but NO WAY do you trade a shutdown corner and high draft pick(s) for a running back. There was nothing about that trade that was smart. Nothing. It was a typical "Vinny got hosed again" type of trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailGreen28 Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 He GAVE Denver a second round pickChamp was leaving anyways. We essentially got Portis for a 2nd. Which has been more valuable to his team since? CP or (Bailey+Bell)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 I was waiting to see this post before I threw out my own correction. Portis fought hard and was great during those two playoff runs in '05 and '07, but NO WAY do you trade a shutdown corner and high draft pick(s) for a running back. There was nothing about that trade that was smart. Nothing. It was a typical "Vinny got hosed again" type of trade. Except you forget that Champ was a free agent and was going to leave, so at least we got something for him as opposed to nothing, which is not stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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