You're the coach of the Redskins, which QB would you draft?

[GoSkins561]

If we are picking QBs as rookies, Id take Favre all day every day. Never misses a start, has the tools to play in ANY offense, natural leader, and his career speaks for itself. Before he was "Bad Int Brett," he won 3 straight MVPs and took a largely average Packers offense to two straight super-bowls, winning one. 1994-1997 is possibly the best 4 season stretch any QB has ever put together when Brett was AVERAGING 36+ touchdowns per season.

Favres a beast, you might have just missed the cut with this one. It's quite possible though Peyton comes close to his streak, without the interceptions and more than likely a second ring.

[Jethrodsp]

Favres a beast, you might have just missed the cut with this one. It's quite possible though Peyton comes close to his streak, without the interceptions and more than likely a second ring.

Peyton's thrown a bad interception or two in a crucial moment in his career too. Ask Tracy Porter...

[Skin'Em84]

you can look at tangibles and numbers and statistics all you want. they're meaningless without victories. peyton manning is a good regular season quarterback. in the playoffs he is not. when it matters most, he has not proven to be the best ever. tom brady certainly has. joe montana did as well. i'm not using it as the only reason brady would be my choice. he's accurate, smart, has a huge arm, good leader, etc. his statistics may not be as good as mannings but they're still up there. everyone slobs on peyton cause he puts up numbers. so did dan marino. if he was on this poll there's no way i'd pick him.

Bradshaw won 4 Super Bowls. Remember, Montana and Brady both have MUCH better defenses than Manning does. You can argue between the three, but really, it's not as far off as you think.

when comparing such great players, it's difficult to find a 'better' player. i look at rings and how each qb has performed when the team needed him most. peyton didn't perform in the playoffs and has really yet to show regular season form in december. tom brady is a different story.

Can't argue with the bolded section. 100% right.

and i'm not even going to address the matt cassel thing. it seems ridiculous to compare the team he played with in NE to the KC team he's with now.

NE and KC are completely different, but Cassel did take Brady's team to an 11-5 record in his first season, and does not look as good in a different system. That's what I was trying to get at. Time will tell if Cassel is great, but I'm taking it at face value for the moment.

You can't really do the same for Montana and Young, as time has shown that Young was a great QB. If the same happens with Cassel, my previous argument gets thrown out the window.

I'm ending my posting on this here, as I don't think it has much to do with the OP. Then again, I don't quite understand what the OP was getting at.

[Frostx08]

you can look at tangibles and numbers and statistics all you want. they're meaningless without victories. peyton manning is a good regular season quarterback. in the playoffs he is not. when it matters most, he has not proven to be the best ever. tom brady certainly has. joe montana did as well. i'm not using it as the only reason brady would be my choice. he's accurate, smart, has a huge arm, good leader, etc. his statistics may not be as good as mannings but they're still up there. everyone slobs on peyton cause he puts up numbers. so did dan marino. if he was on this poll there's no way i'd pick him.

when comparing such great players, it's difficult to find a 'better' player. i look at rings and how each qb has performed when the team needed him most. peyton didn't perform in the playoffs and has really yet to show regular season form in december. tom brady is a different story.

and i'm not even going to address the matt cassel thing. it seems ridiculous to compare the team he played with in NE to the KC team he's with now.

Joe Montana and Tom Brady had better teams overall than Manning ever did. Joe Montana especially...what gets lost with him getting all the credit is how talented his ENTIRE team was...not just him...THE ENTIRE TEAM. If Manning had that dominant Patriots team that killed teams defensively and even on special teams...Manning would have 5 rings. Brady is a great QB but people give him way too much credit for those Super Bowls. Manning is WAY better than him and he has all the tools. The only thing he misses is mobility...but he's great at making all the throws along with the intangibles he brings. The only person you can argue is possibly better may be Dan Marino...and maybe Steve Young. And no...I'm not just focused strictly on stats

Manning did not benefit from all the things Brady had overall as a team. Brady won all 3 of his Super Bowls by 3 points...a turnover opportunistic defense and a clutch kicker plays a huge part in that. To look at rings as a main factor is ridiculous especially if you analyze the games in and of themselves. You say I can look at stats all I want(which I'm not), but all you're doing is looking at rings and deciding who's the better QB

And you don't have to address the Matt Cassell thing. The team he's with in KC may not be good...but until he shows improvement he's obviously not good as yet either, and you can make that judgment without looking at stats

[Frostx08]

I would never take Favre. Sorry but although I think he's great at times....that many interceptions and fumbles in his career says it all

[blindlywewander]

Joe Montana and Tom Brady had better teams overall than Manning ever did. Joe Montana especially...what gets lost with him getting all the credit is how talented his ENTIRE team was...not just him...THE ENTIRE TEAM. If Manning had that dominant Patriots team that killed teams defensively and even on special teams...Manning would have 5 rings. Brady is a great QB but people give him way too much credit for those Super Bowls. Manning is WAY better than him and he has all the tools. The only thing he misses is mobility...but he's great at making all the throws along with the intangibles he brings. The only person you can argue is possibly better may be Dan Marino...and maybe Steve Young. And no...I'm not just focused strictly on stats

Manning did not benefit from all the things Brady had overall as a team. Brady won all 3 of his Super Bowls by 3 points...a turnover opportunistic defense and a clutch kicker plays a huge part in that. To look at rings as a main factor is ridiculous especially if you analyze the games in and of themselves. You say I can look at stats all I want(which I'm not), but all you're doing is looking at rings and deciding who's the better QB

And you don't have to address the Matt Cassell thing. The team he's with in KC may not be good...but until he shows improvement he's obviously not good as yet either, and you can make that judgment without looking at stats

i'm not basing my entire judgement on rings. tom brady and peyton manning are two elite quarterbacks. they're both physically gifted and have all the tools you look for in a great qb. having said that, tom brady performs in the playoffs. peyton manning does not. it's that simple. you can blame defenses or special teams or whatever you want, but it comes down to wins and losses. tom brady took his team down the field and won those superbowls. peyton manning has been erratic and ineffective in the playoffs for the most part.

come on with the matt cassell thing - are you serious? he looked decent for one year and hasn't looked good since. wow. i haven't heard that in the nfl before..

he's on the kansas city chiefs. they haven't had talent for several years. now they've got a good gm and are winning football games this year. cassell has 9 tds to 3 pics and a passer rating of 91.5. higher than he had in NE. obviously it's too early to tell, but to argue that because one quarterback had a decent season on the patriots that tom brady's accomplishments aren't as meaningful - that's ridiculous.

but really, i guess it's all on your outlook. to me, winning is what differentiates quarterbacks. making the throws when it matters the most defines greatness. watching peyton manning in the playoffs - it's hard to find that. he's obviously a good qb and i'm not arguing that. he'll be first ballot hall of fame, blah blah blah. but if i'm drafting a quarterback knowing what i know now, i'm picking tom brady. i've seen peyton play in december and january. i've seen brady do it. the two men have had similar opportunities. one made more of them. tom brady is a winner. i'd take him over anyone on that poll in a heartbeat.

[S.T.real,lights,out]

Really Brady in 4th place?? You guys are crazy!!! How many SB has he won and name me guys he's won it with! Not even close!!

[gaskinsfan]

Peyton Manning and then try to resist entirely relying on his ability and build a solid defense and run game as well. When these are in place the Colts won the super bowl. When they are not, Peyton still takes them far but they fall short. Same thing happened to Dan Marino in his day. He was so good they failed to build a solid run game to give the offense enough balance.

[darrelgreenie]

Peyton Manning and then try to resist entirely relying on his ability and build a solid defense and run game as well. When these are in place the Colts won the super bowl. When they are not, Peyton still takes them far but they fall short. Same thing happened to Dan Marino in his day. He was so good they failed to build a solid run game to give the offense enough balance.

I don't know enough about the Dolphins but the Colts are designed this way.

Their offense is always gonna be better then their defense because that's how the team was built.

The onus will alway be on their offense to help the defense.

They were designed to play with a lead.

Its tough to invest heavily enough to build dominant unit on one side of the ball and still have an above average unit on the other.

It appears that where you spend the most resources you'll get the most results.

[nemocystem]

Really? Properly coached from the beginning and carefully handled, Mike Vick could have been an all-time game-changing QB.

It didn't happen, and I hate the guy's personality/actions off the field.

But it could have happened, with the right surroundings and maturation process.

In a perfect world, of course.

But still, the scenario being voted on is along the same lines, so its a very fair response.

i concur.

but i went with Peyton. imho.....he is the single greatest talent at that particular position since........i dunno that there's been anybody on his level since QB's were calling their own plays.

i mean, i still say Montana or Tarkenton are the best ever for my 2c......but i'm waiting patiently for Peyton's career to end before i place him exactly. to me though, he does so much more with such inferior talent that really only Marino compares. but i think i'd still take Manning because he's an OC on top of being a QB with broken parts & a forever shoddy O-line.

i mean....once Indy got Peyton, it's like they stopped worrying about who they placed around him & just made sure he gets paid.

let me put it another way. imagine if you swapped Warner for Peyton in the Greatest Show on Turf....kept the same offense, but let Peyton do his sign-language thingy & that offense would have been retarded good.

& by that i mean: so good that the rest of the league would look like they were in slow motion & had recently committed their entire squads to be labotomized in favor of uber-fast robots with the intellect of Stephen Hawking....just so they could stay within a hope & a prayer. (totally nonsensical mouth-poop)

[airs0ft3r]

Manning is the best ever, without a doubt.

[mi6]

My draft picks ...

Tom Brady

And, then with other draft picks get

Joe Montana and Troy Aikman

Yeah! Now that would stir some QB controversies in DC!

[Ryman of the North]

people forget that Montana made people look good, the niners were terri8ble before he got there and frankly his first couple seasons they didnt have anyone around him other than Rice.

montana was better than manning.

[Hitman21ST]

Peyton hands down. If we had him as a rook and he could learn our system, we would be all but unstoppable.

[Frostx08]

i'm not basing my entire judgement on rings. tom brady and peyton manning are two elite quarterbacks. they're both physically gifted and have all the tools you look for in a great qb. having said that, tom brady performs in the playoffs. peyton manning does not. it's that simple. you can blame defenses or special teams or whatever you want, but it comes down to wins and losses. tom brady took his team down the field and won those superbowls. peyton manning has been erratic and ineffective in the playoffs for the most part.

come on with the matt cassell thing - are you serious? he looked decent for one year and hasn't looked good since. wow. i haven't heard that in the nfl before..

he's on the kansas city chiefs. they haven't had talent for several years. now they've got a good gm and are winning football games this year. cassell has 9 tds to 3 pics and a passer rating of 91.5. higher than he had in NE. obviously it's too early to tell, but to argue that because one quarterback had a decent season on the patriots that tom brady's accomplishments aren't as meaningful - that's ridiculous.

but really, i guess it's all on your outlook. to me, winning is what differentiates quarterbacks. making the throws when it matters the most defines greatness. watching peyton manning in the playoffs - it's hard to find that. he's obviously a good qb and i'm not arguing that. he'll be first ballot hall of fame, blah blah blah. but if i'm drafting a quarterback knowing what i know now, i'm picking tom brady. i've seen peyton play in december and january. i've seen brady do it. the two men have had similar opportunities. one made more of them. tom brady is a winner. i'd take him over anyone on that poll in a heartbeat.

Okay...a few things to clear up..

I do agree that a Quarterback is supposed to be a winner. They're supposed to put you in a position to win games...no argument there

But again, I think you're looking at Tom Brady skin deep. The Patriots as a team dominated on defense and special teams...crushing their opponents and creating turnover...after turnover...after turnover. In all 3 Super Bowls it was decided by 3 points. In the 2nd one especially he didn't just lead his team down the field...the kicker for the Panthers kicked it out of bounds and gave them the ball on the 40 yard line

I think Brady is a great QB but he isn't on Manning's level at all. The Patriots have not made it deep into the playoffs and dominated in a full TEAM fashion in a way they did before(due in great part to the team breaking up). Brady and Manning were in two different situations as a TEAM and Brady imo had the better team. Again that's not to take away from Brady...but it's really hard to argue that any QB is on Manning's level at all considering how he plays and what he's done

I think we have a misunderstanding on the Cassel thing...I don't think Cassel is a good QB lol...and he has much to prove. But Manning's impact on his team is a bit larger than Brady's impact on is

i concur.

but i went with Peyton. imho.....he is the single greatest talent at that particular position since........i dunno that there's been anybody on his level since QB's were calling their own plays.

i mean, i still say Montana or Tarkenton are the best ever for my 2c......but i'm waiting patiently for Peyton's career to end before i place him exactly. to me though, he does so much more with such inferior talent that really only Marino compares. but i think i'd still take Manning because he's an OC on top of being a QB with broken parts & a forever shoddy O-line.

i mean....once Indy got Peyton, it's like they stopped worrying about who they placed around him & just made sure he gets paid.

let me put it another way. imagine if you swapped Warner for Peyton in the Greatest Show on Turf....kept the same offense, but let Peyton do his sign-language thingy & that offense would have been retarded good.

& by that i mean: so good that the rest of the league would look like they were in slow motion & had recently committed their entire squads to be labotomized in favor of uber-fast robots with the intellect of Stephen Hawking....just so they could stay within a hope & a prayer. (totally nonsensical mouth-poop)

I don't think Peyton Manning would have been as good with the Rams. Great but not as great as he is now. The Colts play to Manning's strengths perfectly...like an art really. The Colts fit his strengths

And I think your O-line statement is inaccurate. Manning has the best O-line in the league and has for years....Brady's O-line is right behind him

And Manning has weapons. The Colts draft players that are perfect for Manning and they've been doing a good job with their selection for years. Having Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison for years doesn't hurt either...that's when he was really tearing it up

[darrelgreenie]

but if i'm drafting a quarterback knowing what i know now, i'm picking tom brady. i've seen peyton play in december and january. i've seen brady do it. the two men have had similar opportunities. one made more of them. tom brady is a winner. i'd take him over anyone on that poll in a heartbeat.

I think you approached the question from the same viewpoint as most people that reponded to this thread.

And going by the underlined statement Brady is a very good choice as is Manning.

But, i thought the presentation of the question lends itself to something other then the question of who are the top 2 QBs are right now.(Which is a fairly obvious question)

I view the question as a look at which QB has the best tools as passer around which to build.

B/c its hard to quanitfy and replicate the exact circumstances that make players successful.

Would Peyton be Peyton without Tom Moore-Mora-Dungy?

Would Brady without Bellichick-Weis?

Look at Steve Young pre-Bill Walsh and Mike Shanahan.

How do we know that Manning/Brady would have their projected success as Redskins?

I think you would have to take the most talented player b/c they give an offense the best chance for success.

I viewed this thread as a discussion about which QBs were the most talented compared to each other and what we see from the different QBs.

[Ryman of the North]

Okay...a few things to clear up..

I do agree that a Quarterback is supposed to be a winner. They're supposed to put you in a position to win games...no argument there

But again, I think you're looking at Tom Brady skin deep. The Patriots as a team dominated on defense and special teams...crushing their opponents and creating turnover...after turnover...after turnover. In all 3 Super Bowls it was decided by 3 points. In the 2nd one especially he didn't just lead his team down the field...the kicker for the Panthers kicked it out of bounds and gave them the ball on the 40 yard line

I think Brady is a great QB but he isn't on Manning's level at all. The Patriots have not made it deep into the playoffs and dominated in a full TEAM fashion in a way they did before(due in great part to the team breaking up). Brady and Manning were in two different situations as a TEAM and Brady imo had the better team. Again that's not to take away from Brady...but it's really hard to argue that any QB is on Manning's level at all considering how he plays and what he's done

I think we have a misunderstanding on the Cassel thing...I don't think Cassel is a good QB lol...and he has much to prove. But Manning's impact on his team is a bit larger than Brady's impact on is

I don't think Peyton Manning would have been as good with the Rams. Great but not as great as he is now. The Colts play to Manning's strengths perfectly...like an art really. The Colts fit his strengths

And I think your O-line statement is inaccurate. Manning has the best O-line in the league and has for years....Brady's O-line is right behind him

And Manning has weapons. The Colts draft players that are perfect for Manning and they've been doing a good job with their selection for years. Having Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison for years doesn't hurt either...that's when he was really tearing it up

actually, Manning has never had a great Oline.

[blindlywewander]

Okay...a few things to clear up..

I do agree that a Quarterback is supposed to be a winner. They're supposed to put you in a position to win games...no argument there

But again, I think you're looking at Tom Brady skin deep. The Patriots as a team dominated on defense and special teams...crushing their opponents and creating turnover...after turnover...after turnover. In all 3 Super Bowls it was decided by 3 points. In the 2nd one especially he didn't just lead his team down the field...the kicker for the Panthers kicked it out of bounds and gave them the ball on the 40 yard line

I think Brady is a great QB but he isn't on Manning's level at all. The Patriots have not made it deep into the playoffs and dominated in a full TEAM fashion in a way they did before(due in great part to the team breaking up). Brady and Manning were in two different situations as a TEAM and Brady imo had the better team. Again that's not to take away from Brady...but it's really hard to argue that any QB is on Manning's level at all considering how he plays and what he's done

I think we have a misunderstanding on the Cassel thing...I don't think Cassel is a good QB lol...and he has much to prove. But Manning's impact on his team is a bit larger than Brady's impact on is

ha, tom brady still had to make throws. he lead his team down the field. he threw the ball. he had to make the play and he did. why not dissect peyton manning's superbowl performances, or his failed playoff performances. try blame the defense on peyton's touchdown to interception ratio or drastically different pass yards, completion percentage and passer rating. just because peyton manning's team wasn't 'known' for defense doesn't mean they didn't get turnovers. doesn't mean they gave up tons of points. the patriots got to the superbowl as a team. the colts got to the superbowl as a team. peyton manning has earned his reputation for being a choke artist come playoff time. it's not even debatable. he didn't play particularly well in his superbowl victory and poorly in the colts' superbowl loss. he didn't make the throws that needed to be made when they had a chance to come back. tracy porter was the hero, not peyton manning.

tom brady wins playoff games and superbowls. he puts up stats and everyone can drool over his pro bowls, etc. just like peyton manning. but the thing that differentiates these two elite quarterbacks - one wins in january. peyton's great. if he was a skin i'm sure he'd be great here. but if he and tom brady were sitting at a table waiting to get drafted, i'm picking tom brady. there's no question for me. you can try to say the patriots have a better defense, but that's a bogus argument. every superbowl team gets there as a team. peyton manning won a superbowl thanks to dominque rhodes (over 100 yards and a touch against the bears defense, which was good at the time) and joe addai (10 catches in the superbowl i think). peyton threw one touchdown on a blown assignment by the bears to a wide open reggie wayne.

we can do this forever. you won't convince me, i probably won't convince you. the way i see it, at the end of the day, tom brady has rings. plural. and there's a reason for it. if peyton manning wins a superbowl next year, maybe another one after that - sure i'll consider changing my opinion of him. but as of now, he's shown me nothing when it matters the most. stats and numbers are great. setting records in pass first offense, sure. commendable. but look at dan marino. such a great qb. all those statistics. all those yards and touchdowns in the regular season. wow. impressive right? but not a single ring to show for it. not one superbowl title. if i was a dolphin's fan, i think i'd have a bit of a bitter/sweet view of dan marino. i'd feel the same if i was a colts fan. all those stats. all the hype. all those records and blah blah blah. and one superbowl ring? only two appearances after all those 12+ win seasons? wow.

tom brady would be my guy. blame the team. blame the defense. blame the coaches. i don't care. tom brady wins in january. peyton manning doesn't. end of story.

[blindlywewander]

actually, Manning has never had a great Oline.

i disagree. the colts oline is built to pass protect. they don't produce great running yardage, obviously, but that's because it's a pass first offense. peyton manning was sacked 10, 14, 21, 14, 17 and 13 times in the last 6 years. compare that to ben roethlisberger who was sacked 50, 46, 47, and 46 times in the last 4 years. ben's got two rings behind that line. i think he'd probably be willing to upgrade to peyton's in a heartbeat.

[XxSpearheadxX]

Peyton is the best I've ever seen, and there are some great QBs on that list, but Peyton wins hands down.

[XxSpearheadxX]

Also LOL at Cutler being included, I needed a laugh tonight, thanks

[Ryman of the North]

i disagree. the colts oline is built to pass protect. they don't produce great running yardage, obviously, but that's because it's a pass first offense. peyton manning was sacked 10, 14, 21, 14, 17 and 13 times in the last 6 years. compare that to ben roethlisberger who was sacked 50, 46, 47, and 46 times in the last 4 years. ben's got two rings behind that line. i think he'd probably be willing to upgrade to peyton's in a heartbeat.

The lack of sacks speaks to Manning having a quick release and his willingness to throw the ball away.

name one superlative lineman he has had. Tarik Glenn was decent but not elite and he has never had a true LT aside from Glenn. his center Saturday is solid but not special.

the Steelers havent had very good pass pro Olines but they have always had a running game, something Maning had for a while with James but all in all the Colts Oline has never been a strength.

[Rpredskins]

you know mcnabb back in the day was a threat unlike any other QB. Probably a stretch to say that overall he was better than Manning or Brady, but that dude could RUN before he hurt his knee a few years ago. I think drafting McNabb would at least create the most interesting offense

[blindlywewander]

The lack of sacks speaks to Manning having a quick release and his willingness to throw the ball away.

name one superlative lineman he has had. Tarik Glenn was decent but not elite and he has never had a true LT aside from Glenn. his center Saturday is solid but not special.

the Steelers havent had very good pass pro Olines but they have always had a running game, something Maning had for a while with James but all in all the Colts Oline has never been a strength.

haha - alright ryman. i forgot you're a football genius. i'll just refrain from arguing against you. allowing under twenty sacks a season couldn't mean they're a good offensive line. it couldn't be that tom moore chose his linemen to fit that system and adapt to peyton's quick throwing and offensive style. you're right.

[Mania]

Tell me how an unproven QB such as Sam Bradford gets more votes than Tom Brady and everyone else except for P. Manning and A. Rodgers?