(August, 2010 - Re: McNabb) Hey, Mike, how about a two-quarterback scheme?

[Oldfan]

Hey, Mike, how about a two-quarterback scheme? ...Don't laugh. Hear me out on this.

Let's start with the obvious. Donovan has a serious flaw in his game. He can't keep his mechanics together which makes his short game inconsistent. So, I figure, like Andy Reid, you're going to adapt to the man's strengths and create a big play offense. Last season, the Eagles were number one in 40+ plays and number two in 20+ plays. But you probably knew that.

Andy's big problem was in the Red Zone. His team was number 20 in Red Zone efficiency in 2009 and number 25 in 2008. I figured it out. The two-year average was a suckish 48%. Now, think about this, Mike. That's an average. Against playoff caliber defenses that number would be much lower!

Pea-brain Eagles fans say that Donovan chokes. They say he can't finish drives that win the big games. Choking isn't the problem. He can't finish drives in the big games because he has trouble finishing drives in all games. Things just get worse for him against high-grade defenses.

The way I figure it , Donovan's short game inconsistency jumps up to bite him hardest in the compressed area of the Red Zone.

Greg Blache's great love, the passive, "bend but don't break" defensive strategy, is ineffective against most teams, but it was exactly the right strategy when playing against a Donovan McNabb led attack -- give him the short stuff, prevent big play touchdowns, and bet that his team will have to settle for three when he can't put up seven in the Red Zone.

So, let's look at your options for solving this Red Zone problem.

Donovan McNabb knows his short game problem is with his mechanics. He has been trying to correct it for 11 seasons. It's not likely you are going to help him solve it before he drives his Bentley off into the Ashburn sunset.

Your running game isn't the solution. Let's be candid, Mike. Even at its Broncos best, your ZBS wasn't all that grand in the Red Zone where size and power rule.

Can you come up with new pass routes in the Red Zone to deceive defenses? If you can, great. But, I'm guessing that's not a realistic solution in the NFL.

So, here's my suggestion.

When your offense gets to the Red Zone, you pull Donovan out of the game along with your big play runt receivers. You send in your Red Zone QB specialist. He's the guy who has the best short game among your QBs. He's the guy who runs the Red Zone offense constantly in practices.

As for drawbacks, there are some who would worry about what might happen to poor Donovan's confidence if you pull him out in Red Zone opportunities. Others would whine that the two-QB thing would undermine McNabb's leadership. I don't know about you, Mike, but you can talk to me about football strategy, or the Xs and Os, and I'll listen intently all day long. But, I turn a deaf ear when people start with their Football psychobabble.

I'll be straight with you, man. You wouldn't have been my pick to coach the Redskins. I'm not impressed with your resume. Just one playoff win in the last ten Denver seasons doesn't inspire confidence. But, now that you're here, I figure I'll do what I can to help you succeed. Besides, I think we Football geniuses should stick together. Don't you?

So, give my suggestion some thought. Okay?

Here's a summary of the evidence:

-- Eagles were top ranked big play offense 2008-9 but #20 and #23 in Red Zone

-- the often heard charge that DM can't finish drives in big games

-- the often heard charge that he chokes in big games

-- significantly lower RZ completion percentage (50.7%) than Jason Campbell (56.0%) over four years

-- his RZ completion pct in 2007 was better than only four QBs on a list of 30 (advanced stats)

-- his 59% overall completion rate is low for starting QBs

-- the evidence that, 2006 - 2009, his running game has been better than the 2009 NFL average, so Donovan can't be excluded from being a factor in the low RZ rankings of his team in 2008 and 2009

But, the most telling piece of evidence is

-- the logical deduction that his well-known inconsistency on short-range passes almost certainly carries over to the crowded short-range of the Red Zone, and would be more of a problem against high-grade defenses of playoff teams

EDIT: Here are some of the supporting comments in this thread:

KDawg: Actually, its really not as bad an idea as a lot of you are making it out to be. If you have a clearcut guy who is better in the red zone then why not try this?

zoony: Why not? Teams use multiple players for all other skill positions, why not QB?

BrotherZ: I think your idea is incredibly intriguing. I love the way it sounds on paper. I imagine a team mature enough, selfless enough, ego-less enough to really do what they all say they are doing; namely really caring about winning first. In such an environment the team could put in a more accurate and quick release, short passer who practices red zone all week (God, I really do think that is a neat idea. Imagine how much more practice he would get. - You'd create like a new position - "the red zone QB". I think its fascinating.

The Italian Stallion: While he was off regarding RZ comp%, and while I don't necessarily agree, I do think OF's idea has merit. First off, McNabb most certainly DOES struggle with short throws, and a few clips of HB screen passes (usually to a stationary target who hasn't even crossed the LoS) does nothing to discredit that.

Arsenic: This topic is pretty damn interesting... After reading its entirety, I'm left super impressed with most of your debating skills. I have learned much

MassSkinsFan: That said, I'm actually intrigued by your suggestion (though admittedly I've not read the entire thread - yet). If that scenario would work and benefit the team, why not? It would then be a matter of Shanahan managing his personnel so that there are no hard feelings etc.

thesubmittedone: Great thread, OF, thought I'd just throw that in there.

MartinC: Personally I'm happy to accept the premise that McNabb may be less effective inside the 20 than outside and that if you have a QB who is significantly better than him on your roster in that situation it makes sense to at least consider a substitution in that area.[Martin doubts we have a QB who is significantly better]

[kevinklein]

Yeah, I'm not impressed with the resume of 2 SB winning coaches either.

You need to think less, Oldfan, and enjoy the game for what it is.

[SonOfWashington]

And that man would be... Patrick Ramsey?

[DieselPwr44]

. Besides, I think we Football geniuses should stick together.

I'm suprised that a professional franchise hasn't snapped you up and put you on staff.

Zoony said it best:

Has Oldfan ever been right in his analysis in his ES tenure?

[Morneblade]

And that man would be... Patrick Ramsey?

Beaten to the punch!

I really dont want Grossman out there. I'd prefer McNabb with a running game.

And Im more worried about the run D right now than anything.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

And that man would be... Patrick Ramsey?

LMAO SOW. That was my first thought when I saw the thread title. Great minds and all that. .

Just a thought Of my good man; I wonder if Coach Mike talks in as, uhmmm, "glowing terms" when he references your coaching resume. .

Hail.

[Oldfan]

I really dont want Grossman out there.

Grossman, Beck...both look like they have better short games than McNabb.

[Mania]

You've got to be kidding me, that's all I have to say.

[jnhay]

Grossman, Beck...both look like they have better short games than McNabb.

Grossman is much more apt to turn the ball over in the redzone from what I've seen from him. Beck has no experience to indicate that he'd be better than a proven veteran in the red zone.

[bulldog]

Yes, by all means let's have Mike Shanahan change his system to imitate one from a coach whose team has never been able to win at the top levels of the NFL.

I am really sick and tired of media and fans looking at Andy Reid and putting the guy on Mount Rushmore.

In the same time that Reid has been coach of the Eagles (11 years), Joe Gibbs won 3 Super Bowls, Chuck Noll won 4 Super Bowls, Bill Walsh won 3 Super Bowls, and Bill Bellichick won 3 Super Bowls.

Meanwhile, Reid has won what exactly?

[Oldfan]

You need to think less, Oldfan, and enjoy the game for what it is.

I enjoy thinking about the game. For others, well... ignorance is bliss.

[Adam291]

If you switch QBs based on the particular play you're running, it would show your hand too easily. "Oh, McNabb is in, let's put a bunch in coverage deep." "Oh, Rex/Beck is in the game, let's cover the short routes."

[gutlead74]

Please NEVER POST AGAIN!!!!

[jnhay]

I enjoy thinking about the game. For others, well... ignorance is bliss.

At least you provide support for your opinions.

I think you'd also have to think of how bad things could get if the iffy strategy doesn't work. You'd have Mcnabb losing respect because he'd be seen as the guy who can't get it done in the redzone. You'd have the coach being questioned by fans, the media, and the players. Mcnabb isn't the kind of qb that wants to be pulled out of the game.

[onedrop]

WE DIDNT DRAFT A QUARTERBACK. get over it.

[TE#80]

If we had a clutch goal line specialist quarterback that could close the game like Papelbon, then he would, dare I say... be starting.

[DieselPwr44]

Your running game isn't the solution. Let's be candid, Mike. Even at its Broncos best, your ZBS wasn't all that grand in the Red Zone where size and power rule

21

15

13

Terrell Davis' TD totals at the height of Shanny's ZB system.

Were all those td runs from outside the redzone?

We get it. You think you're smarter than 75% of the head coaches in the NFL.

Maybe one day, you can show us your empty trophy case.

BTW, didn't Spurrier try the two QB system here?

[jnhay]

Mcnabb's redzone numbers are as good or much better than Grossman's every year. Beck doesn't even have numbers.

[Oldfan]

Yes, by all means let's have Mike Shanahan change his system to imitate one from a coach whose team has never been able to win at the top levels of the NFL.

What do you mean? Are you saying that you don't think Mike will adapt to Donovan's game and build a big play offense?

What kind of offense do you think he ran in Denver when he had Elway and Cutler? Do you think he was playing a conventional WCO ball control offense? Could you describe his philosophy when he had strong-armed QBs to work with?

[icbmayday]

Absolutely not we don't even have a 2nd qb worth of bring in....regardless of this not being a good idea.

[skinnyles]

So...yes I'm bored today as well. My thouhgts are that Red Zone scoring is more dependant on the steddy flow of the offense with a drive culminatiung in a TD. Not so much changing schemes or personnel once the Zone is reached but by treating it like it is just a natural end to the drive with all cylinders firing smoothly. Just watch the Colts. I feel the key to scoring in the Red Zone depends on a non-interrupted flow of the playcalling. NO PENALTIES!!!

Oldfan, you gotta have tough skin to voice an opinion HERE!!!

[dockeryfan]

I enjoy thinking about the game. For others, well... ignorance is bliss.

Well, being that the final roster will probably only have 2 QBs, I put the odds on this happening at hell freezing over. Oldfan, you have to look at the coach and what he's done in the past. This idea ain't gonna happen just because it's wrong, but also because Shannahan would never do it.

[Oldfan]

If you switch QBs based on the particular play you're running, it would show your hand too easily. "Oh, McNabb is in, let's put a bunch in coverage deep." "Oh, Rex/Beck is in the game, let's cover the short routes."

Defense don'[t have to worry about deep coverage in the Red Zone.

[mi6]

I my humble opinion, I think the 2 QB system is a bad idea. Period.

And, on a side note, I am not too impressed with Beck. I don't think he has a strong arm like Bartel.

[bulldog]

Relax, folks. The Redskins scored in the first preseason game from in close. In Game 2 McNabb threw a perfect strike to Davis for what should have been an easy TD and he dropped it. In Game 3 Grossman playing against the first team Jets defense did a good job of moving the team down the field and if Moss catches 2 balls in different sets that were right on the money Washington would have been in position to add another 7-10 points before the half.

In regards to McNabb, NO I don't believe Shanahan should copy what Reid did with the Eagles when Donovan was the quarterback. Personally, I think Reid's more pass happy and risky system is what prevented the Eagles from winning more games in the postseason. The use Michael Vick the last year in a semi-wildcat looked dreadful in a number of games I watched.