Tea Party vs. Black Panthers, which is "more" racist?

[Sticksboi05]

NBP? A bunch of wanna-be activists denounced by the real Black Panthers or a movement with millions of nutjobs? Both are people I don't want to associate with.

[Teller]

All this being said, it still seems silly that anyone on the right is pointing at these guys saying "SEE. THE LEFT WONT REPORT ON THEM, BUT THEY CLAIM THE TEA PARTY IS RACIST." It's silly because the NBP is NOT RELEVANT. The Tea Party is. You're comparing a rowboat to a destroyer

I agree with you, for the most part. Personally, I wouldn't have made this specific comparison, but to each his own.

I think it would be more appropriate to compare the panthers and the klan, and Tea Partiers to....I don't know, moveon.org? (Maybe someone on the left has a better comparison.)

On the other hand, to call a group who use criminal tactics to influence court cases and elections "irrelevant," I think is a little inaccurate. I understand what you're saying in terms of the scope of the two movements; and I agree with that. But as we saw nine years ago, just 19 people with bad intentions can become VERY relevant, very quickly.

[Baculus]

When was the last time the Tea Party showed any interest for issues which affect minority groups the U.S., outside of mockery or insults?

We can provide a number of instances in which Tea Partiers have either said outright racist/bigoted things or stood around with signs that were clearly bigoted, but the Tea Party supporters suddenly become deaf and blind when these are pointed out to them.

[Madison Redskin]

"Williams should know about professional racial baiting. Last year, he called called President Obama an “Indonesian Muslim turned welfare thug and a racist in chief.” And in February, he called Obama “our half white, racist president."

http://thinkprogress.org/2010/07/14/williams-naacp/

I think it's probably safe to say that a health minority of tea partiers share Williams' sentiments, even though many of them probably would not admit as much in public.

[Teller]

So, here is an example of that fine "Tea Party" attitude:

"Tea Party Leader Condemns NAACP For Making ‘More Money Off Of Race Than Any Slave Trader Ever."

"WILLIAMS: You’re dealing with people who are professional race baiters, who make a very good living off this kind of thing. They make more money off of race than any slave trader ever. It’s time groups like the NAACP went to the trash heap of history where they belong with all the other vile racist groups that emerged in our history."

"Williams should know about professional racial baiting. Last year, he called called President Obama an “Indonesian Muslim turned welfare thug and a racist in chief.” And in February, he called Obama “our half white, racist president."

http://thinkprogress.org/2010/07/14/williams-naacp/

Are you going to provide the context that the NAACP was having a vote this week to condemn the Tea Party as a racist organization? No? OK.

[Madison Redskin]

Are you going to provide the context that the NAACP was having a vote this week to condemn the Tea Party as a racist organization? No? OK.

Do you really think that context justifies Williams' previous remarks?

[alexey]

I think very few Tea Party members are racist - in fact, I think most of the ones that did racist things/held racist signs/made racial statements at rallies were just nut jobs trying to bend the Tea Party cause to serve their own racist purposes.

Things get a little less clear cut when you expand the "crazy test" beyond racism to include things like "is Obama a socialist who is out to destroy America"

[thebluefood]

Seriously, though, are there different Tea Partiers around the country than here in Eastern North Carolina? I've met plenty of 'em around here and I've never met a racist among them. Not one.

[Teller]

Do you really think that context justifies Williams' previous remarks?

I think they are both wrong.

Does it justify his comments? No. It doesn't.

[Baculus]

NBP? A bunch of wanna-be activists denounced by the real Black Panthers or a movement with millions of nutjobs? Both are people I don't want to associate with.

Most people have probably never even heard of this organization (NBP) until this entire issue.

[Teller]

Seriously, though, are there different Tea Partiers around the country than here in Eastern North Carolina? I've met plenty of 'em around here and I've never met a racist among them. Not one.

There are idiots in every large group. Hell, I'm sure there are stupid Redskin fans somewhere. Of course, I've never met one. :pfft:

[Teller]

Most people have probably never even heard of this organization (NBP) until this entire issue.

That may be true.

Just like many of us had never heard of Al Qaeda until 9/11. I'm not sure what your point is here.

[Rdskn4Lyf21]

NBP? A bunch of wanna-be activists denounced by the real Black Panthers or a movement with millions of nutjobs? Both are people I don't want to associate with.

It's simply amazing that some of you guys can't think for yourselves and just regurgitate what is being fed to you....

When was the last time the Tea Party showed any interest for issues which affect minority groups the U.S., outside of mockery or insults?

We can provide a number of instances in which Tea Partiers have either said outright racist/bigoted things or stood around with signs that were clearly bigoted, but the Tea Party supporters suddenly become deaf and blind when these are pointed out to them.

Nobody is arguing that there are absolute idiots within the Tea Party. Does that make up all of them? If you believe that, then you have something in common with the very small minority of the Tea Party.

In order to not be labeled as racist, they have to have distinct interests in issues that solely affect minorities?

[alexey]

Seriously, though, are there different Tea Partiers around the country than here in Eastern North Carolina? I've met plenty of 'em around here and I've never met a racist among them. Not one.

Have you met people who are perhaps a bit confused about the definition of "socialism"? Maybe a few people who subscribe to a little apocalyptic thinking? Some believers in Obama being a Muslim? Some people who think that our Constitution is based on Christianity, maybe?

I'm afraid that focusing on racism alone won't give you the full flavor of the Tea Party.

[THEREALTOR1]

Have you met people who are perhaps a bit confused about the definition of "socialism"?

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/socialism

Main Entry: so·cial·ism

Pronunciation: \ˈsō-shə-ˌli-zəm\

Function: noun

Date: 1837

1 : any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

2 a : a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b : a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state

3 : a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done

[Sticksboi05]

It's simply amazing that some of you guys can't think for yourselves and just regurgitate what is being fed to you....

Who are you to imply that we take what we hear from the news and put it on ES. Come down from your high horse...

Anyway, I don't think all of them are what you see on the reports about calling Obama the antichrist. Millions is too much, what I mean is both groups have nutjobs.

Now, I'm guessing a 'higher percentage' of the NBP is racist especially if the original Black Panther party won't even support them.

[Baculus]

Are you going to provide the context that the NAACP was having a vote this week to condemn the Tea Party as a racist organization? No? OK.

The context? We've been talking about this stuff for the last year, so you've ignored or missed the many examples of race-baiting and bigotry from some Tea Parties. Heck, in discussions with you, I have provided examples of race-baiting from Tea Party heroes such as Rush Limbaugh, and you have yet to say a single thing about such comments.

Why? Because perhaps you are in agreement with some of these sentiments. You probably believe that Obama IS a racist, or that he is attempting to destroy "white culture" or some such. The "Obama is a socialist" opinions are often accompanied by " . . . and he hates White people, too."

[scskin]

This thread accentuates the divide some in our country have. It's not going anywhere in my opinion. It just keeps being repackaged.

[Baculus]

That may be true.

Just like many of us had never heard of Al Qaeda until 9/11. I'm not sure what your point is here.

My point is simple -- to some on the Right, the NBP represents everything they fear from "militant blacks," and they apply this fear to not only blacks in the NAACP, but the President, black Democrats, and many black folks themselves. (At least the supposed "uppity " ones.)

I can't tell you how many times I have heard random right-wingers on web forums say, "These Black Panthers are the face of Obama's civilian army of thugs!" The Black Panthers, to them, epitomizes the "Obama the radical socialist Muslim hates White people" narrative.

[Rdskn4Lyf21]

Who are you to imply that we take what we hear from the news and put it on ES. Come down from your high horse...

Anyway, I don't think all of them are what you see on the reports about calling Obama the antichrist. Millions is too much, what I mean is both groups have nutjobs.

Now, I'm guessing a 'higher percentage' of the NBP is racist especially if the original Black Panther party won't even support them.

No high horse to come down from. I'm sorry that you got so offended that I took your statement at face value. We agree here. I just couldn't read your invisible sarcasm face next to the number you threw out there. Next time I'll assume it's there and not take anything you say seriously

[thebluefood]

Have you met people who are perhaps a bit confused about the definition of "socialism"? Maybe a few people who subscribe to a little apocalyptic thinking? Some believers in Obama being a Muslim? Some people who think that our Constitution is based on Christianity, maybe?

I'm afraid that focusing on racism alone won't give you the full flavor of the Tea Party.

I didn't say they were brilliant. I surely don't agree with most of them. Most of them are very far to the right and they hold opinions like this.

But, we're talking about racism. That's what this thread is about. Many of these people I know don't know a damn thing about politics, but they CERTAINLY aren't racist.

[Teller]

The context? We've been talking about this stuff for the last year, so you've ignored or missed the many examples of race-baiting and bigotry from some Tea Parties. Heck, in discussions with you, I have provided examples of race-baiting from Tea Party heroes such as Rush Limbaugh, and you have yet to say a single thing about such comments.

Since you missed these the first time, I'll help you out a little.

I think they are both wrong.

Go back and read it in context. I was talking about the NAACP voting to call the Tea Party a racist group AND Mr. Williams' statements.

This was my response to bluefood saying he had never encountered a racist Tea Partier:

There are idiots in every large group.

Go back and read both of these comments in context for yourself. Then join the rest of the idiots who have attempted to accuse me of racism, or ignoring racism perpetrated by whites.

I don't know why people like you feel compelled to completely fabricate my position in order to attack me. Maybe it's because you're pissed off that you can't attack facts, or what I actually say. And that being the case, I feel even more secure in my position.

Why? Because perhaps you are in agreement with some of these sentiments. You probably believe that Obama IS a racist, or that he is attempting to destroy "white culture" or some such. The "Obama is a socialist" opinions are often accompanied by " . . . and he hates White people, too."

Show me. Where have I said anything of that sort? Did I choose to support him in the last election because I figured he would attempt to destroy my life as I know it?

You've been exposed. And like I said, you're no better than the idiots who have tried before you. I've always seen you as someone who was informed, could debate issues, and could debate what a poster actually says. It's unfortunate that I've been proven wrong.

[sjinhan]

they are all have racist component to them...

so is FOX news at least admitting that part of the driving force that is carrying this Tea Party is racists?

[Baculus]

Nobody is arguing that there are absolute idiots within the Tea Party. Does that make up all of them? If you believe that, then you have something in common with the very small minority of the Tea Party.

I never said such fools and idiots make up "all of them," but many on the Right have done nothing at all to resolve these sort of problems within their own movement. And not only that, but, according to polls and such, many in the Tea Party movement DO have rather questionable beliefs, and some of it absolutely stems from White anger in this country" anger towards the belief that minorities receive too many handouts; anger and despair over a feeling of dis-empowerment; anger over the economy.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/andy-ostroy/the-tea-party-movement-is_b_538750.html

Time and time again, conservative populist movements have ALWAYS resulted in some racist attitudes: it is sad, but know American tradition. Especially when you take into account that some of the Tea Partiers are descendants of the Dixiecrats which were absorbed into teh Republican party after the civil rights movement. (A reality which appears to be overlooked.)

That doesn't mean, by all means, that all Tea Partiers are racists, but it IS a part of the movement. (And if you don't believe me, go to Stormfront and read about their excitement over the "racial awakening" in the Tea Party movement.)

I want to add this point: Most of these conservatives had nothing to say when Bush was spending like crazy, but suddenly Obama gets into office, and BAM! "Tax Enough Already!" It apparently took a black liberal to get the anger rolling, and you would have to do a lot of convincing before you can change my mind that Obama's complexion was not a factor in this sudden conservative anger.

In order to not be labeled as racist, they have to have distinct interests in issues that solely affect minorities?

Not at all, but they go out of their way to attack groups whose interest lie in these areas, or they go out of their way to attack "social justice," or anything which smacks of "welfare." I must add that I have been hearing this stuff ("crackhead welfare mothers," etc.) from conservatives for YEARS, so it's really nothing new.

[19Skins72]

Damnit HH I wrote a book, hit submit...and do not see my post :mad:

cliff notes version - We agree on almost all of your post to me, I just don't understand the comparison of the two groups because ones irrelevant and small, and the other is pretty damn relevant and large.

We really need to bring these tailgate political conversations to a bar near martinsburg, I need drinking buddies that like the skins and dont like purty lips