OM FIELD: Redskins OL - Tale of the Tape

[TheLongshot]

I am not sure I agree with this. I mean it looks good on a "body for a body" basis maybe but when you start looking at details it I don't think it holds water. Samuels should be good for a few more years...as long as he is healthy but we all saw what happened last year when he went down for the end of the season with an injury that would have ended his year regardless of which game it happened in. The same is likely true for Thomas. Most people here thing at least Jansen is done now and more than a few put Rabach in that same catagory. Rinehard was a LT in college and drafted to play LG for us so thinking he can make the move to RG when he obviously was not ready to go at LG yet (why else sign Dock again?) is somewhat wishful thinking to me. Fabini is really too old now. Heyer is looking more and more like a decent short term backup but not a starter.

To be honest, most teams would be in trouble if they lost their starting LT, because it isn't likely that the replacement will be nearly as talented. I actually think Heyer did a solid job there last year. Personally, tho, I think if we do draft OT, whoever it is is likely to replace Samuels.

Look at Philly as an example. They have had great starters for a decade now, most of whom were in their prime. They kept drafting linemen though, some in the early rounds. This last year when they lost a starter they had a guy on the bench who came in and preformed just as well as the starter. When that backup guy got hurt, they brought in yet another backup without missing a beat. Three guys deep at one position and little or not drop in performance.

Actually, I was hearing a lot about a drop in performance from Andrews to Jean-Gilles. Then again, I don't really follow the Eagles that closely.

I'd like to see an upgrade over Rabach sometime in the near future. This is a great Center class, it seems like we could draft his replacement now and eventually work him in. Rabach is pedestrian, and his strength is supposed to be that he is a savvy player. But more than anything, I remember him committing some atrocious penalties last year so I don't know how much I believe that. Add to that, his size and athletic ability are somewhat of a liability. We can do way better than him at the position.

Well, it is hard to measure how much his adjustments he makes at the line affect how the line plays. I do agree with you that they may start looking to draft his replacement, but I expect it will be a developmental guy.

Also, we can't be entirely sure how Dockery is going to fare in the new offense we are running, and Rinehart is a pretty unknown quantity. It's a bit of a leap of faith to assume we are going to be fine at gaurd and not worry about drafting the position for the while.

I'm not worried about Dock, who's a known quantity with his teammates. I also doubt the offense has changed all that much for him, particularly since the running game is pretty much unchanged.

When I'm talking about Guard, I'm not just talking about Rinehart, but also Montgomery, who looks like a solid reserve for both guard and center. We also have another developmental prospect in Devin Clark. As I said above, while I can't see us picking up another developmental guard, I could see a center who also plays some guard.

I think it would go a long way towards addressing the future health of the position if we drafted Andre Smith or Michael Oher in the first round and then grabbed a solid center prospect in the 3rd or 5th to develop. Oher and Smith come with the bonus that you know they can move over to LT once Samuels retires, filling a short-term and crucial long-term position of need.

I'm actually a bigger fan of dropping back and picking up someone like Eben Britton, who probably could play LT with some seasoning.

People who want defense would go crazy, but the needs there aren't pressing and we can always shore that up next year. I say take advantage of the strengths of the draft class.

Well, OLB is still a strong need and there are some decent candidates up top. We don't need a guy who can play LT now, just one who can be moved there later.

[Going Commando]

I'm actually a bigger fan of dropping back and picking up someone like Eben Britton, who probably could play LT with some seasoning.

If Andre Smith is there you have to pick him rather than trying to trade back for Britton. Britton's draft range is extremely murky. How far can you afford to trade back before you risk missing him altogether? 20? And I think there is a pretty steep drop off in OT talent after him, I'm not a huge fan of Beatty. Last year's class demonstrated the dangers for needy teams of having a run on a position. I don't want us to miss the boat on an OT again.

Besides if Andre Smith is there, why settle for hamburger when you could have steak?

Andre Smith surely wouldn't. Actually he'd probably have both. Sorry I couldn't resist.

[american soldier]

Tennessee Titans Offensive Line (#1 in least sacks allowed)

Name Pos Hgt. Wgt. Age

Kevin Mawae C 6-4 289 38

Michael Roos T 6-7 315 26

David Stewart T 6-7 312 26

Eugene Amano G 6-3 310 27

Jake Scott G 6-5 295 28

Average 6-5 304.2 29

Redskins Offensive Line (Allowed too many sacks and got pushed around)

Name Pos Hgt Wgt Age

Rabach C 6-4 296 32

Heyer T 6-6 325 25

Samuels T 6-5 317 32

Thomas G 6-5 317 33

Dockery G 6-6 330 29

Average 6-5 317 30.2

I'm not sure if this comes down to size as much as it come down to heart, smarts, technique and maybe a QB that reads defenses quickly. The Titans offensive line made all the top defenses look pretty average last year with practically the same size and aged lineman as ours.

[boofMcboof]

Can this get stickied . . .

. . . to the forehead of Snyderrato.

[american soldier]

All due respect, Om, because I love your pieces and the research and time you put into them, but evaluating an offensive line on height, weight and age alone won't tell you anything. I realize you elluded to that in your post, but the fact remains there is no way to accurately assess an offensive line (or any position for that matter) based on these factors.

How do they get off the football?

What gaps are they weak in in pass and run schemes?

How do they handle the blitz?

If I had game film I'd love to sit down and break it all down for everyone here, but I don't. So it's understandable that this is all that we have to go by as fans without access to all the games. But it doesn't really mean all that much.

The age thing is the biggest factor of the three you looked at, in my opinion. We need to get younger on the line in a hurry. That's a huge problem.

Call me a Skins fanatic, but I have most all the games from 2006 up to now. Occasionally, I'll watch a game or two. I haven' t really taken the time to analyze the line play for a thread such as this, but it would still be a bit misleading in that I would not know the blocking assignments. Thus I wouldn't know which lineman screwed up or if the QB called the wrong blocking scheme or simply took too long in the pocket. I'm still going to watch some games to see how often our linemen simply got manhandled. That is the issue we all are alluding to.

[KDawg]

Call me a Skins fanatic, but I have most all the games from 2006 up to now. Occasionally, I'll watch a game or two. I haven' t really taken the time to analyze the line play for a thread such as this, but it would still be a bit misleading in that I would not know the blocking assignments. Thus I wouldn't know which lineman screwed up or if the QB called the wrong blocking scheme or simply took too long in the pocket. I'm still going to watch some games to see how often our linemen simply got manhandled. That is the issue we all are alluding to.

Lack of size doesn't mean you get manhandled. And it's not necessary to know what play is called to analyze the OL. It makes it much more difficult, but if you read the flow of a play you can see where things didn't happen when they needed to.

[skinny21]

I recall talk of the schemes being radically simplified last year (as our losses mounted), and I'm curious how much was directed at the linemen. I'm hopeful that this 2nd year in the system, in addition to any personnel changes, helps improve our line. Its tough to stay real optimistic with all the question marks this team (and line) has though.

I really just want a 1st or 2nd round talent at RT. Actually, I'd love it if we traded down and wound up with solid picks at RT, G and LB. I'd also like to see Geisinger take over for Rabach, but that ain't gonna happen.

[TheLongshot]

Besides if Andre Smith is there, why settle for hamburger when you could have steak?

It looked like there was a lot of gristle on that steak...

Honestly, he scares me a bit with the lack of work ethic leading up to the draft. Also, I still think we need to nail down the Sam LB position, since right now we don't really have anyone who I'd feel comfortable going into the season with.

[PROSCOUT]

WOW. I knew all of this last year and OM you are just getting around to seeing the weights of our offensive linemen? All I can say is wow.

I remember when the Skins had the heaviest offensive line in football. Since then, or since Snyder took over, that stat has not been important to him, instead its been all about wide receivers and cornerbacks and safeties. After all, their is nothing sexy about a huge overweight grown man with a belly lapping over his pants.

If Danny, as well as people like yourself, had been on this 12 years ago, it might not be the problem it is today. Nevertheless, we are what we are and it is what it is. And Dockery does make a difference, a HUGE difference, at least when we will run the ball to the left side of the line.

Now, if only we had brought in the center from Baltimore that outweighed Rabach by 20 pounds, we would be better off but that ALSO was not sexy I guess.

[Peregrine]

Anytime you talk about the Skins offense last year, there was a big difference between the first 6 games of the season and the last 10. It makes perfect sense that it was either the offensive line getting worn down due to age and size(I think it has more to do with age), or Zorn getting figured out, or a combination of the two. At least to me, it makes more sense than just saying "Campbell just stopped playing well and started playing poorly". Remember, we ran the ball better in those earlier games as well.

[TSO]

WOW. I knew all of this last year and OM you are just getting around to seeing the weights of our offensive linemen? All I can say is wow.

I remember when the Skins had the heaviest offensive line in football. Since then, or since Snyder took over, that stat has not been important to him, instead its been all about wide receivers and cornerbacks and safeties. After all, their is nothing sexy about a huge overweight grown man with a belly lapping over his pants.

If Danny, as well as people like yourself, had been on this 12 years ago, it might not be the problem it is today. Nevertheless, we are what we are and it is what it is. And Dockery does make a difference, a HUGE difference, at least when we will run the ball to the left side of the line.

Now, if only we had brought in the center from Baltimore that outweighed Rabach by 20 pounds, we would be better off but that ALSO was not sexy I guess.

Talk about patting yourself on the back.

Om is talking about both age and size, as you so conveniently omitted. He also mentioned the fact that the size of our Oline may not be so important if they're playing at a high level and that age has a lot to do with that.

I also don't get the "If Danny, as well as people like yourself, had been on this 12 years ago, it might not be the problem it is today" comment. Are you implying that Om works with the FO? Furthermore, Danny wasn't here 12 years ago.

[Going Commando]

I'm not sure if this comes down to size as much as it come down to heart, smarts, technique and maybe a QB that reads defenses quickly. The Titans offensive line made all the top defenses look pretty average last year with practically the same size and aged lineman as ours.

You forgot talent. Roos, Mawae, and Stewart are three of the best at their position in the league. And Jake Scott who they got from Indy is a terrific pass blocking guard.

[Om]

WOW. I knew all of this last year and OM you are just getting around to seeing the weights of our offensive linemen? All I can say is wow.

I remember when the Skins had the heaviest offensive line in football. Since then, or since Snyder took over, that stat has not been important to him, instead its been all about wide receivers and cornerbacks and safeties. After all, their is nothing sexy about a huge overweight grown man with a belly lapping over his pants.

If Danny, as well as people like yourself, had been on this 12 years ago, it might not be the problem it is today. Nevertheless, we are what we are and it is what it is. And Dockery does make a difference, a HUGE difference, at least when we will run the ball to the left side of the line.

Now, if only we had brought in the center from Baltimore that outweighed Rabach by 20 pounds, we would be better off but that ALSO was not sexy I guess.

Thanks for the tip. Send me the URL to your blog--I'll get with Vinny & The Dan and be sure we all check it before posting or drafting next time.

[Om]

I also don't get the "If Danny, as well as people like yourself, had been on this 12 years ago, it might not be the problem it is today" comment. Are you implying that Om works with the FO? Furthermore, Danny wasn't here 12 years ago.

If I did, I can promise you one thing: the offensive and defensive lines would be young, big and deep---we'd never go a single draft w/o bringing in at least a couple of big bodies, with at least one of those a first-day prospect. We'd also be as proactive as any team in the history of the NFL in securing a bona fide professional quarterback.

Give me a QB and two solid lines of scrimmage and I'll be in the mix every year.