VCDefectors Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Center is hard to gauge, which is why I won't say Gurode is "one of the best" like you did. I did concede he is in the top half, and I do think overall is a quality center, despite his occasional snap snafus. I'd say Kreutz is the best right now. Gurode is easily one of the top 5 centers in the league. There is nobody out there that comes close to having his size-to-quickness ratio. He is also one of the very few centers who rarely needs help from guards in isolating a nose tackle or keeping them from getting penetration. Most NFL centers are either too small or not quick enough to handle DTs on their own without help. That being said, Gurode did have a tendency to get distracted by DL movement early in his career. But 95% of that has been eliminated out of his game. The other thing I hear from many Redskins fans (and the reason many of them erroneously think that Gurode is overrated) is his problems with handling shotgun snaps. Gurode does have a heredity problem with sweaty hands. He has to constantly dry his hands when on the field. When he doesn't, he will have a couple of bad snaps in a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Im not sure if you are saying that Gurode didnt miss or did miss games in the first part.....As for the impact of injurie the skins faced vs the Cowboys, well I never once in this whole thread talked about the skins oline, but you did say they didnt have any injuries, and I pointed out they did. Again, please dont pretend I said something I never even hinted towards. As for the hatred, I do not "hate" the skins, I do consider them a rival and dislike the organization. In fact, a couple of my favorite players to watch and follow through their career play on the skins. My implication of the impact of the Skins OL injuries was pretty obvious. You simply responded by saying I was wrong because the Cowboys had minor injuries. Clearly the level of injuries to the OL of the Skins and the Boys aren't even in the same ballpark. However, you came off in your reply to me as if to say I was wrong and that the Cowboys OL injuries were impactful, when they really weren't. I'll ask you to do the same in not pretending I said something I never hinted towards. A proper response would have been "Well the Cowboys did have some minor injuries to their OL, but yeah, nowhere near as impacting as the Skins, obviously." Or something like that. Instead you came off as very arrogant in trying to say I was simply wrong when it was the impact I was talking about. You've been following this thread though, so I'm not buying this load that you didn't know what I meant. Just in the future actually try to address what someone is saying, instead of nitpicking with your only goal in mind apparently being to prove us Skins fans wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: gawd, I love poke fan speak When anyone states facts about the pokes that is negative.... it's just their hatred..... never because it's true yet when Poke fans openly make inaccurate and misleading statements about the Skins... usually on their own, lashing out in revenge..... they are supposedly unbiased in their opinion :jerk: :laugh: I hate the skins and don't hide it. The difference is I don't let this get in the way of making sense. :2cents: THA for the record you stuck your foot in your mouth and was :owned: by Elk. Not really. At best I was a little vague but owned? Naahhh.. :no: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bware_Dware Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 My implication of the impact of the Skins OL injuries was pretty obvious. You simply responded by saying I was wrong because the Cowboys had minor injuries. Clearly the level of injuries to the OL of the Skins and the Boys aren't even in the same ballpark. However, you came off in your reply to me as if to say I was wrong and that the Cowboys OL injuries were impactful, when they really weren't.I'll ask you to do the same in not pretending I said something I never hinted towards. A proper response would have been "Well the Cowboys did have some minor injuries to their OL, but yeah, nowhere near as impacting as the Skins, obviously." Or something like that. Instead you came off as very arrogant in trying to say I was simply wrong when it was the impact I was talking about. You've been following this thread though, so I'm not buying this load that you didn't know what I meant. Just in the future actually try to address what someone is saying, instead of nitpicking with your only goal in mind apparently being to prove us Skins fans wrong. Again, I do not mind debating things with people, but yet again in your first paragraph on this response you claim I said the Cowboys injuries were impactful on the team, please re-read what I post, I never once said they were impactful, I just pointed out that there were injuries when you said there were not any. My only goal is to have a meaningful convo with people without misleading information being leaked into the thread. Please inform me how I came off as arrogant, maybe your a little hyped up from all the hassle THA has been giving you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Gurode is easily one of the top 5 centers in the league. There is nobody out there that comes close to having his size-to-quickness ratio. He is also one of the very few centers who rarely needs help from guards in isolating a nose tackle or keeping them from getting penetration. Most NFL centers are either too small or not quick enough to handle DTs on their own without help. That being said, Gurode did have a tendency to get distracted by DL movement early in his career. But 95% of that has been eliminated out of his game. The other thing I hear from many Redskins fans (and the reason many of them erroneously think that Gurode is overrated) is his problems with handling shotgun snaps. Gurode does have a heredity problem with sweaty hands. He has to constantly dry his hands when on the field. When he doesn't, he will have a couple of bad snaps in a game. '07 he played like a top center, '06 not as much. One season doesn't magivally change things. It's not like I'm saying Gurode is total crap. He is good. But I would say Kreutz of the Bears, Koppen of the Pats, Mawae of the Titans, Birk of the Vikes, and Saturday of the Colts are better. Of course this all just perception. To put aside any notion of homerism or bias on my part, I will concede Gurode is better than Rabach (though not by leaps and bounds). I didn't know about the sweat problem, that sucks to have deal with I bet. Maybe they should give him a drying towel like the QBs have on them in rain games. Maybe they already do. Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Again, I do not mind debating things with people, but yet again in your first paragraph on this response you claim I said the Cowboys injuries were impactful on the team, please re-read what I post, I never once said they were impactful, I just pointed out that there were injuries when you said there were not any.My only goal is to have a meaningful convo with people without misleading information being leaked into the thread. Please inform me how I came off as arrogant, maybe your a little hyped up from all the hassle THA has been giving you. Just the way it came across to me. Obviously we both came across the wrong way to each other. So let's just end it and move on. I'm not hyped up or anything, just from your response it seemed all you were saying was I was wrong, and I concluded you meant my argument about our OL injuries being impactful, and the Boys and Crayton not having to see that kind of disparity in '07, was false. Obviously we were both wrong about what the other meant, so it's now a non-point in my mind, and hopefully it will be the same for you now. Really we're just arguing semantics at this point, and none of this is very constructive. I'll drop it if you will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VCDefectors Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 '07 he played like a top center, '06 not as much. One season doesn't magivally change things. It's not like I'm saying Gurode is total crap. He is good. But I would say Kreutz of the Bears, Koppen of the Pats, Mawae of the Titans, Birk of the Vikes, and Saturday of the Colts are better. Of course this all just perception. To put aside any notion of homerism or bias on my part, I will concede Gurode is better than Rabach (though not by leaps and bounds).I didn't know about the sweat problem, that sucks to have deal with I bet. Maybe they should give him a drying towel like the QBs have on them in rain games. Maybe they already do. Who knows. I'd put Gurode ahead of Kreutz and possibly Mawae. But, believe it or not, I really do like Rabach as a center and would also put him in the top-6-7 category. One of the best playcallers in the league, IMO. I didn't pay special attention to him last season, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Gurode is total crap he's 4th best center in the NFC East Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 I'd put Gurode ahead of Kreutz and possibly Mawae. But, believe it or not, I really do like Rabach as a center and would also put him in the top-6-7 category. One of the best playcallers in the league, IMO. I didn't pay special attention to him last season, though. Well we obviously differ on the exact rankings. I should have clarified that I do think Gurode is top 10, and same with Rabach. Honestly I'd have Gurode at 6-8, and Rabch at 8-10. You are dead on about his playcalling. He is great at picking up the blitz (it's just too bad Tod Wade wasn't, I still can't believe there were Skins fans who anted Wade in over Jansen after '06). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bware_Dware Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Just the way it came across to me. Obviously we both came across the wrong way to each other. So let's just end it and move on. I'm not hyped up or anything, just from your response it seemed all you were saying was I was wrong, and I concluded you meant my argument about our OL injuries being impactful, and the Boys and Crayton not having to see that kind of disparity in '07, was false. Obviously we were both wrong about what the other meant, so it's now a non-point in my mind, and hopefully it will be the same for you now. Really we're just arguing semantics at this point, and none of this is very constructive. I'll drop it if you will. Never! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 he's 4th best center in the NFC East Ahhhh, what's better than a Sunday afternoon on ES huh? Can someone answer me that? Tr1 stirs the pot, and at some point Bubba will let everyone know that whatever Cowboy unit/player that's being discussed is 4th best in the division. :laugh: You guys are consistent. I'll give you that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Ahhhh, what's better than a Sunday afternoon on ES huh? Can someone answer me that? Tr1 stirs the pot, and at some point Bubba will let everyone know that whatever Cowboy unit/player that's being discussed is 4th best in the division. :laugh: You guys are consistent. I'll give you that much. To be fair, Bubba will tell you Witten is at least the 2nd best TE in the division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bware_Dware Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 To be fair, Bubba will tell you Witten is at least the 2nd best TE in the division. True, and tr1 will tell you he was the 5th best.... 1 Cooley 2 Shockey 3 Smith 4 Fasano 5 Witten :laugh: jk, maybe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 True, and tr1 will tell you he was the 5th best....1 Cooley 2 Shockey 3 Smith 4 Fasano 5 Witten :laugh: jk, maybe And he'll get 5 of you to argue with him hours on end about it. :laugh: That's why he's Mr. ATN. I would say it's time for a new election, but what's the point? He's earned it again this year. And once again Bubba is VP. BTW, and this is VERY off topic, but anyone notice the disapperance of all the Iggles fans since the playoffs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeHateMe Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Dallas had a fine season and had a chance to beat the eventual Super Bowl champs and came thisclose to pulling it off. But as successful as they were, they were a victim of that incredible and very special Giant defense, and more specifically, Giant pass rush. Then the very successful Packers and HOF QB Brett Favre became a victim. And finally, the record-setting, all-world, undefeated Patriots fell victim to it as well. No shame in a great season derailed by the Super Bowl Champs who defied all odds. Every time they were up against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 To be fair, Bubba will tell you Witten is at least the 2nd best TE in the division. He was a Vol.... doesn't count! I'm surprised Kevin Burnett doesn't get more love around here? What gives Bubba? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted June 30, 2008 Author Share Posted June 30, 2008 True, and tr1 will tell you he was the 5th best....1 Cooley 2 Shockey 3 Smith 4 Fasano 5 Witten :laugh: jk, maybe Sparano and Parcells will make him a star... Let's revisit at the end of the season, shall we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted June 30, 2008 Author Share Posted June 30, 2008 Dallas had a fine season and had a chance to beat the eventual Super Bowl champs and came thisclose to pulling it off.But as successful as they were, they were a victim of that incredible and very special Giant defense, and more specifically, Giant pass rush. Then the very successful Packers and HOF QB Brett Favre became a victim. And finally, the record-setting, all-world, undefeated Patriots fell victim to it as well. No shame in a great season derailed by the Super Bowl Champs who defied all odds. Every time they were up against it. Hey, if this makes you feel good about things, keep believing it...but, don't expect us to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Hey, if this makes you feel good about things, keep believing it...but, don't expect us to. What exactly are you taking issue with in HHM's post? The Giants caught lightening in a bottle and got red hot at the right time. N.E. was 18-0 and had set several records as a team and an offense. Our season didn't end well but hell no shame in losing to the eventual champs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Sparano and Parcells will make him a star...Let's revisit at the end of the season, shall we? Absolutely! :thumbsup: .. and you know I won't forget. Remember you said "STAR." We wouldn't want you back peddling and changing your stance tr1. You wouldn't do that would you buddy? :cool: :no: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bware_Dware Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Sparano and Parcells will make him a star...Let's revisit at the end of the season, shall we? For his sake, I hope your right, seems like a quality kid. But I just dont see him being more than an average TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted June 30, 2008 Author Share Posted June 30, 2008 What exactly are you taking issue with in HHM's post? The Giants caught lightening in a bottle and got red hot at the right time. N.E. was 18-0 and had set several records as a team and an offense. Our season didn't end well but hell no shame in losing to the eventual champs. The Giants actually match up well with you. Don't let those to regular season losses think otherwise. They have your number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 The Giants actually match up well with you. Don't let those to regular season losses think otherwise.They have your number. Ehhhh, everything changes from year to year. One could argue that it's hard to beat a team 3 straight? We put up 69 pts. on them in the regular season beating them by double digits at their place. I don't think they had our # but they beat us when it counted most. They actually lost a lot of key pieces including their HOF defensive anchor and leader. I look for them to drop off a bit. Their playoff run last year was highly improbable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tr1 Posted June 30, 2008 Author Share Posted June 30, 2008 Ehhhh, everything changes from year to year. One could argue that it's hard to beat a team 3 straight? We put up 69 pts. on them in the regular season beating them by double digits at their place. I don't think they had our # but they beat us when it counted most. They actually lost a lot of key pieces including their HOF defensive anchor and leader. I look for them to drop off a bit. Their playoff run last year was highly improbable. And, the pukes had an unbelievable luck streak last year. Fumbles cannot continue to come back to Romo sits to pee. Won't happen. The pukes are going down this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom [Giants fan] Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 Hey, if this makes you feel good about things, keep believing it...but, don't expect us to. It made me feel good about things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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