City Paper: Sorry, but I applaud Dan Snyder

[Stophovr6]

another 4 year plan!.... :doh:

Well what exactly do you want? a 1 year plan? Like the one whereby GW takes over the team and automatically wins? Do you really think that's how it was going to go down. Because it would've probably taken him 4 years if he can even get it done.

OR would you rather a 1 year plan a la Snyder? The one where we go through FA to get a bunch of players half of which don't fit our system but have desirable names.

You don't build a dynasty in one day. How long did it take Cooke to get it right with Gibbs?

I'm just as frustrated with anyone with this franchise but if giving it time is what it takes, I'm in for the longhaul. But keep slapping your head, it's clearly the only form of rebuttle you have.

[jimster]

Well what exactly do you want? a 1 year plan? Like the one whereby GW takes over the team and automatically wins? Do you really think that's how it was going to go down. Because it would've probably taken him 4 years if he can even get it done.

OR would you rather a 1 year plan a la Snyder? The one where we go through FA to get a bunch of players half of which don't fit our system but have desirable names.

You don't build a dynasty in one day. How long did it take Cooke to get it right with Gibbs?

I'm just as frustrated with anyone with this franchise but if giving it time is what it takes, I'm in for the longhaul. But keep slapping your head, it's clearly the only form of rebuttle you have.

2/3 of the NFL have changed head coaches in the last three off-seasons. - I would think that indicates that finding a good head coach is harder than people think.

[fansince62]

Well what exactly do you want? a 1 year plan? Like the one whereby GW takes over the team and automatically wins? Do you really think that's how it was going to go down. Because it would've probably taken him 4 years if he can even get it done.

OR would you rather a 1 year plan a la Snyder? The one where we go through FA to get a bunch of players half of which don't fit our system but have desirable names.

You don't build a dynasty in one day. How long did it take Cooke to get it right with Gibbs?

I'm just as frustrated with anyone with this franchise but if giving it time is what it takes, I'm in for the longhaul. But keep slapping your head, it's clearly the only form of rebuttle you have.

yawn.

go for it big guy! some folks tolerate sustained mediocrity. some folks expect excellence. I guess we know what side of the fence you sit on. :applause:

[herrmag]

Hmmm...some interesting points. Especially the part about the assistants hire. I am hoping he is right and Dan and all of us for that matter, reap the rewards of stretching out the process.

Agreed. Here's to hoping that Snyder did take all of the issues mentioned in this article into account, and are the reasons why we are still without head coach. If so, good for him. Please pardon me, however, if I'm a bit pessimistic on the odds that he actually did.

[fansince62]

2/3 of the NFL have changed head coaches in the last three off-seasons. - I would think that indicates that finding a good head coach is harder than people think.

no..it means that finding a good combination of players, FOs and coaches is harder than people think. and it means we have a good idea which 3rd we fall into!

[Hooper]

A laughable and ridiculous article.

I guess Danny and Vinny have it right and the rest of the league has it wrong. Oh, except Al Davis.

And don't bring up Jerry Jones -- at least his coordinator first hire was a guy in demand.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

or to assign praise/resignation....you made my point..

Actually, I made my own point...which was the opposite of yours. I said that Snyder and Vinny are probably far more deliberate, logical and responsible with their actions than fans want to admit. Whether or not those actions bear anything positive, I didn't say. You, on the other hand, seem convinced that they are NOT being deliberate, logical or responsible, and it's soley from your own personal speculation...you don't even need to see results.

Again, I made my own point...yours was never validated.

every statement he made at the outset about continuity...being happy with the staff...etc...has been turned on its head.

Can you quote the exact things Snyder said, and in context? I say that because, one, I didn't see the press conference, and two, there have been a few posters here who HAVE attempted to put quotes of "continuity" and such into perspective...and when doing so, it came across much differently than you (and others like you) have been portraying it.

So if you could show exactly what Snyder said, and the context in which he said it, that would help. Because, no offense, but I have ZERO confidence in how fans translate comments said in press conferences and in interviews when it's translated thru their personal viewpoints, and often agendas.

If you don't want to, that's fine, too...but at least you'll know why I'm not taking your translation as carved-in-stone truth.

Snyder screwde the pooch by speaking before thinking. I have no problem wiht someone coming out and saying "I think we need to set a differnet course for these reasons....". Instead, he fed everyone a bunch of BS because, apparently, it was the soothing to say at the moment.

At this point...I don't even care any longer about the "process" or its outcome. DS is simply not a person one invests faith or trust in. You are free, of course, to size up the measure of a man and make your own decisions on what true leaders are and what character consists of.

I base it on results, not on what the apparent "frenzy" of the moment during a process may look like. It will not hang on what he said at a press conference...it will hang on how the team performs, what their record is, whether or not we're winning within our division...things like that.

[Stophovr6]

yawn.

go for it big guy! some folks tolerate sustained mediocrity. some folks expect excellence. I guess we know what side of the fence you sit on. :applause:

The fence isn't dividing what any of us want for this franchise, only the way things are handled.

It's nice to see fellow fans trying to paint others as ones thatdon't want their team to be good. What exactly does that accomplish?

Are you gonna answer my question about Cooke? How long did it take him? Looks like you became a fan the year after he bought the franchise. How did the first two decades work out?

[smitty71]

The author makes some logical statements. However, I am more disenchanted with the promotion of Cerrato than anything else and that was not addressed in the blog. Snyder thinks he knows something the other 31 NFL owners don't - what that is, I have no idea - and year after year refuses to hire a ""proven" GM to run the organization. Until he decides to do that, or sell the team to someone who will, I am afraid the Skins will never get to another Superbowl.

[skinny21]

First off, very interesting to see someone from the CP praising Snyder for anything, because the CP always, without fail, characterizes Snyder as the most dispicable human being on earth. So this piece is noteworthy for that reason alone, if nothing else.

I part ways with the writer on the G. Williams point. I have no inside information to back this up, but my strong hunch is that GW was never under strong consideration for the job, and that he was only interviewed to placate Gibbs and to try to demonstrate to the fans that GW was given a fair shake. I just don't believe there's anything GW could have said or done in the three or four interviews he had that would have completely undone everything he did for us over the last four years.

The more I think about it, the more I believe GW never had a shot.

[Stophovr6]

The author makes some logical statements. However, I am more disenchanted with the promotion of Cerrato than anything else and that was not addressed in the blog. Snyder thinks he knows something the other 31 NFL owners don't - what that is, I have no idea - and year after year refuses to hire a ""proven" GM to run the organization. Until he decides to do that, or sell the team to someone who will, I am afraid the Skins will never get to another Superbowl.

This is a good point and maybe one of the better reasons to have beef with Snyder right now. The drawn out coaching search...not so much.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

yawn.

go for it big guy! some folks tolerate sustained mediocrity.

Which hiring Williams as the new HC very well may have lead to...

[fansince62]

What were the contradictions in your mind?

already addressed

What were the costs, and what was the cowardice?

costs to other people and their reputations; costs to DS himself and his reputation; costs to the players in terms of uncertainty and sense of vision; potential costs in terms of coaches/players who will not come here because of the perception of FUBAR written over much of this; costs in terms of unity of the fanbase (as TheDane painted in a separte thread); costs in terms of integrity of the "process"

Am I right in assuming you feel the press would NEVER have speculated or been innacurate under "normal" circumstances? lol...

no....I am saying what should be obvious...that the strategy of total silence only exacerbates the matter. yes...he doesn't have to say anything. but a smart person would anticipate things and control the situation....a confident person could step forward and bring others along with him...and never spill the beans......confident leaders who know what they are doing can do that....look at Parcells for an object lesson.

The one we just "jettisoned" was brought upon mostly because the head coach jettisoned himself...we didn't do that.

And the coaching staff we just "jettisoned" had four years to prove itself...and ended up with a losing record and four straight years of entering December with abysmal records of 3-6, 5-6, 3-7, and 5-7. As much as I worship Gibbs, these last four years have been medicre at best. There's no denying that anymore.

maybe...then again...maybe not. dpends on the departure point. what preceded this cast was an abysmal cluster you-know-what beynd belief. and what has been the one common ingredient all along?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

This is a good point and maybe one of the better reasons to have beef with Snyder right now. The drawn out coaching search...not so much.

I agree. I'm willing to give Vinny this chance in his new position as executive whatever lol...but in 2-3 years, all success and all failure will (should) be at his feet. If we're having winning seasons with good players, then I'll hope at least a few of the men on this site will actually BE men and own up to the fact that Vinny can be a pretty good personnel guy. If we're having losing seasons with no improvement from one year to the next, then I hope Snyder has the balls to say "Ok, time to move on" and let Vinny spend his offseasons elsewhere.

[fansince62]

Which hiring Williams as the new HC very well may have lead to...

whihc...as folks like you prefer to say...we have no way of knowing....

[fansince62]

I agree. I'm willing to give Vinny this chance in his new position as executive whatever lol...but in 2-3 years, all success and all failure will (should) be at his feet. If we're having winning seasons with good players, then I'll hope at least a few of the men on this site will actually BE men and own up to the fact that Vinny can be a pretty good personnel guy. If we're having losing seasons with no improvement from one year to the next, then I hope Snyder has the balls to say "Ok, time to move on" and let Vinny spend his offseasons elsewhere.

agree...with one exception...that Snyder is man enough to own up that both HE and Vinny need to move on should they lose!

[PCRoughrider]

Anybody who "applauds" Dan Snyder is not a Redskins fan.

[skinny21]

First off, very interesting to see someone from the CP praising Snyder for anything, because the CP always, without fail, characterizes Snyder as the most dispicable human being on earth. So this piece is noteworthy for that reason alone, if nothing else.

I part ways with the writer on the G. Williams point. I have no inside information to back this up, but my strong hunch is that GW was never under strong consideration for the job, and that he was only interviewed to placate Gibbs and to try to demonstrate to the fans that GW was given a fair shake. I just don't believe there's anything GW could have said or done in the three or four interviews he had that would have completely undone everything he did for us over the last four years.

The more I think about it, the more I believe GW never had a shot.

I can understand your hunch... but I have a bit of trouble believing Snyder would sit through 4 interviews with the man just to placate the fans or Gibbs. Wouldn't 1 or 2 ten hour sessions be more than sufficient?

My belief is that Snyder wanted continuity on the defense but wanted a philosophy change on the offense that would play to Campbell's strength (based on DS's comments regarding Zorn and Campbell in the presser). I'm guessing that what Williams offerred on this front was not matching up to what Snyder/Vinny wanted.

I'm betting that Snyder hired Zorn particularly because he liked what Zorn had in mind with regards to Jason. Snyder was possibly also concerned that bringing in a head coach before Zorn (or any OC) might hurt Campbell's development. I'm guessing that Snyder really likes Campbell's potential and feels (rightly so) that he has a bunch invested in this kid.

For the record, I wanted Williams and I too find it hard to be patient, but I've gotta believe that Snyder has learned at least some tough lessons from his past.

[Stophovr6]

whihc...as folks like you prefer to say...we have no way of knowing....

Are you more upset the GW is not the coach, or that the new coaching search is such a perceived debacle?

[herb mul-key]

I don't like the article...being different for differents sake...really I see no basis for saying Snyder is being "thorough". He got caught with his pants down and is in full reactive mode...he would have hired Fossil last week w/out the fan backlash...

The coordinaters hiring smacks of putting puppets in place so Snyda and Vinny can dictate how the team should look and play...

Mooch is his only saving grace right now...he I could live with cause of his likeability...freaking Fossil was the enemy for so long and I felt sorry for the Gints he was there coach...I remember after a while felt I can't stand to hear JF talk when he was a Gints drama queen coach explaining all those heartbreaking losses.

No the article does not help Snyda's case in my view.

[skinny21]

what an "arsehole" - to paraphrase his language...he misses the key point ...... being thorough (which is up for debate since we don't know what is happening and how much of this is driven by circumstances - right... folks who claim this all the time?; interview 10,000 folks for all I care...that doen't make it thorough...it makes it lengthy) is not the same as having a plan.....and even more directly...a good plan.

what a windbag!

Sure lengthy does not equal thorough, but considering DS has interviewed a small list of people multiple times - doesn't that lend itself more to thoroughness? (ie. lengthy = interviewing 10,000 people, thorough = interview 10 people 1,000 times each).

[fansince62]

The fence isn't dividing what any of us want for this franchise, only the way things are handled.

It's nice to see fellow fans trying to paint others as ones thatdon't want their team to be good. What exactly does that accomplish?

Are you gonna answer my question about Cooke? How long did it take him? Looks like you became a fan the year after he bought the franchise. How did the first two decades work out?

cmon now...don't fall back on "let's place nicey" when you tossed your own barbs!

Are you claiming that the conditions Cooke and Snyder operate under are/were the same?

I think that time is irrelevant. I have labored to get across the idea that beyond process and wins/losses (i.e., these are secondary).....the core issue for me is DS as a man...his character as evidenced by the near 10 years we have had to observe him in action. I have spent most of my adult life in organizations accountable for much larger groups of people than the Washington Redskins. I have been around powerful people and been a leader myself. You get a "feel" for the essence of a leader, of a man......of character...over time. And I'm just not seeing it here.

Joe Gibbs "has it"....DS does not.

You are free to agree or disagree.

[fansince62]

Sure lengthy does not equal thorough, but considering DS has interviewed a small list of people multiple times - doesn't that lend itself more to thoroughness? (ie. lengthy = interviewing 10,000 people, thorough = interview 10 people 1,000 times each).

one would like to think so...but we have no way of knowing. for all we know the multiple interviews could be over sticking points that are irrational or secondary.

I have no doubts whatsoever that we will end up with someone eventually...and that Zorn is a good man to have around and that Blache learned from Williams.

There are signals...such as Carroll and others pushing their chairs back from the table that suggest not everything is "smooth as she goes skipper"

[Peytskins47]

Personally, there is nothing in that article I can argue with. I pretty much agree with it on almost every point.

I do think he glosses over the assistant hires a bit, but I think he pretty much gets it.

Jason

I agree. But I think he is pretty well on with the assistant hires. Why would you hire a HC and then let his 'buddies' come in. By hiring the assistants now the logic could be, 'hey we have gotten who we think are the best people, you make it work'. Plus, nothing wrong with taking your time to make the right hire on the HC.

[cjbrown]

I've noticed that I post more when something is very good or very bad; If it stirs me emotionally.

I think controversy gets ratings. So I understand the medias viewpoint. And I understand that fans want to win and they know they have with GW, so they fear change. Also, the process was closed so speculation fueled speculation.

However, How often does an owner get to speak for hours and days with "real" football people, the best in the business, from teams all around the league, the new winners to lead team. He should lock up the most important parts (OC & DC AND STAFF) and learn as much as he can. He should make sure they can work together and communicate and have a long term vision of what is good for the team. He should look as far as he can without hurting the team. I think he's done that.

GW appearred to have communication issues, with coaches and players. He got unlimited D money and high first round draft picks, he should have done well. He big time misevaluated talent with Ryan Clark and the Corner (forget his name). Pierce signed for a little more money - what happened. The secondary coaches did not talk or practice together at times? He would not start rookies. But, this year he softened. He did a good job, but he second half adjustments at times appeared nonexistent.

So GW was the primary reason we won, but he got the most resources. I definitely think we could do better. But, I appreciate what he did.

I think the article points out that the easy thing to do would be to continue with the way things were, but it might might be the best for the team or the fans.

Peace