G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 All I know is during the Gibbs 2 era.. Gibbs system, 1 play off win... Al Saunders...0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 All I know is during the Gibbs 2 era.. Gibbs system, 1 play off win... Al Saunders...0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 You're attacking the wrong coach. Blame Gibbs because he is the one not letting Saunders do his job. What's obvious to me is that Gibbs likes to run the ball first, whereas Saunders like to throw the ball. Back in the air coryell days, Gibbs too liked passing the ball more than running it. But when he became a head coach, his philosophy changed. He started relying on running the ball more and more. IMHO, Saunders is closer to Coryell in terms of offensive philosophy than Gibbs will ever be. Gibbs is the reason why our offense sucks. Since Gibbs became our head coach, our offense has just stunk. His offensive philosophy is outdated, period. Football has passed him by. He isn't that good anymore. I'm gonna say this. If Gibbs retires, and Gregg Williams becomes our coach and Saunders is our offensive coordinator, we'll win multiple superbowls. Call me Hitler, but I wish I could ban you.. The idiocy has reached a new level.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 You're attacking the wrong coach. Blame Gibbs because he is the one not letting Saunders do his job. What's obvious to me is that Gibbs likes to run the ball first, whereas Saunders like to throw the ball. Back in the air coryell days, Gibbs too liked passing the ball more than running it. But when he became a head coach, his philosophy changed. He started relying on running the ball more and more. IMHO, Saunders is closer to Coryell in terms of offensive philosophy than Gibbs will ever be. Gibbs is the reason why our offense sucks. Since Gibbs became our head coach, our offense has just stunk. His offensive philosophy is outdated, period. Football has passed him by. He isn't that good anymore. I'm gonna say this. If Gibbs retires, and Gregg Williams becomes our coach and Saunders is our offensive coordinator, we'll win multiple superbowls. Call me Hitler, but I wish I could ban you.. The idiocy has reached a new level.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viper30 Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 saunders' qbs threw for 4000 yds because there defense stunk every year he was there. they were in plenty of 34-31 shootouts... saunders has been nothing but problems since he got here...i can only think of a handful of games since the start of 2006 where the offensive game plan was very good or better (2 games w/brunell & 2 games w/campbell where we scored 28+ pts).. detroit in 2007... in 2005 we had a game of 52, 3 games of 35, and a game of 31 and in those games there were more passing tds than rushing tds, and of those passing tds many were over 30-40 yds... i really don't think its all gibbs.... :eaglesuck :gaintsuck i would like to compare these numbers at the end of the season...it will be interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viper30 Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 saunders' qbs threw for 4000 yds because there defense stunk every year he was there. they were in plenty of 34-31 shootouts... saunders has been nothing but problems since he got here...i can only think of a handful of games since the start of 2006 where the offensive game plan was very good or better (2 games w/brunell & 2 games w/campbell where we scored 28+ pts).. detroit in 2007... in 2005 we had a game of 52, 3 games of 35, and a game of 31 and in those games there were more passing tds than rushing tds, and of those passing tds many were over 30-40 yds... i really don't think its all gibbs.... :eaglesuck :gaintsuck i would like to compare these numbers at the end of the season...it will be interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 All I know is during the Gibbs 2 era.. Gibbs system, 1 play off win... Al Saunders...0 One win with THE best defense in a long time (for holding opponents) a defensive TD return, a dropped catch that would have defeated us and an HISTORICALLY bad performance on offense from the position handpicked by Gibbs. Thank Gregg Williams and S Dot Taylor for that win, as Gibbs clearly didn't want to win it on offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 All I know is during the Gibbs 2 era.. Gibbs system, 1 play off win... Al Saunders...0 One win with THE best defense in a long time (for holding opponents) a defensive TD return, a dropped catch that would have defeated us and an HISTORICALLY bad performance on offense from the position handpicked by Gibbs. Thank Gregg Williams and S Dot Taylor for that win, as Gibbs clearly didn't want to win it on offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 I admit that I missed the memo that said Gibbs was over ridding the plays that Saunders was calling. I've been basing my Saunders bashing on the premise that Gibbs didn't touch the play calling anymore but if that's inaccurate then I want to retract my previous statements here. The playing recently has been HORRIBLE and I was blaming Saunders for it but if Gibbs is the reason for this then I want him gone. I'm tired of this broken expirence of Gibbs 2. Since he returned nothings gone right and we've wasted years of playing time for our players we can't get back. I want a new coach if Gibbs is too stupid to get out of the way then I hope Snyder removes him. Problem no one knows for sure.. Everyone "thinks" they know what's going on. Everyone blames Gibbs for being too conservative, and I have too, but I'm just like everyone else, I don't know for sure. I do know, that this isn't the same old Gibbs system everyone thinks it is.. Gibbs contrary to popular belief, aired it out quit often during his first tenure. I couldn't recall which years but I know for a fact there were some years he passed more then he ran. I seem to remember a year where he had 3 WR's with 80 or more catches. You don't even see that in todays game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 I admit that I missed the memo that said Gibbs was over ridding the plays that Saunders was calling. I've been basing my Saunders bashing on the premise that Gibbs didn't touch the play calling anymore but if that's inaccurate then I want to retract my previous statements here. The playing recently has been HORRIBLE and I was blaming Saunders for it but if Gibbs is the reason for this then I want him gone. I'm tired of this broken expirence of Gibbs 2. Since he returned nothings gone right and we've wasted years of playing time for our players we can't get back. I want a new coach if Gibbs is too stupid to get out of the way then I hope Snyder removes him. Problem no one knows for sure.. Everyone "thinks" they know what's going on. Everyone blames Gibbs for being too conservative, and I have too, but I'm just like everyone else, I don't know for sure. I do know, that this isn't the same old Gibbs system everyone thinks it is.. Gibbs contrary to popular belief, aired it out quit often during his first tenure. I couldn't recall which years but I know for a fact there were some years he passed more then he ran. I seem to remember a year where he had 3 WR's with 80 or more catches. You don't even see that in todays game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 One win with THE best defense in a long time (for holding opponents) a defensive TD return, a dropped catch that would have defeated us and an HISTORICALLY bad performance on offense from the position handpicked by Gibbs.Thank Gregg Williams and S Dot Taylor for that win, as Gibbs clearly didn't want to win it on offense. You forget it was CP and the OFFENSE, that got us to that game for the offense to suck.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 One win with THE best defense in a long time (for holding opponents) a defensive TD return, a dropped catch that would have defeated us and an HISTORICALLY bad performance on offense from the position handpicked by Gibbs.Thank Gregg Williams and S Dot Taylor for that win, as Gibbs clearly didn't want to win it on offense. You forget it was CP and the OFFENSE, that got us to that game for the offense to suck.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Call me Hitler, but I wish I could ban you.. The idiocy has reached a new level.. Though his criticism was harsh, he wasn't calling Gibbs a whore or saying he 'sucks' or even that he's a coward. It's not idiocy to suggest a HoF coach known for OFFENSE has ridden an often great defense to one playoff win (relying solely on the D) handpicked a medicore(at best) QB who was more often AWFUL than he was mediocre-to-good, made multiple errors in time management and instant replay challenges, It is, however, idiotic to suggest that our one playoff win with "Gibbs system"(which was changed from 2004 to some degree,) while not even finishing a second season with Saunders as OC, reflects anything other than a simple minded need to hold ANYONE BUT Gibbs responsible for what's happened to the team since he's been here. Oh and Portis was out most of the year in 2006 and Brunell was far worse and lost in the new offense. Yeah, but let's hold that against Saunders. Apparently, you think the offense finished 2005 (PLAYOFFS and last game vs. Eagles) well. That said, I think if Gibbs could have gotten his hands on a better QB to start, he would be less conservative and fearful in his attitude and approach. But I think even with Tom Brady, he'd call it differently than what we might want to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Call me Hitler, but I wish I could ban you.. The idiocy has reached a new level.. Though his criticism was harsh, he wasn't calling Gibbs a whore or saying he 'sucks' or even that he's a coward. It's not idiocy to suggest a HoF coach known for OFFENSE has ridden an often great defense to one playoff win (relying solely on the D) handpicked a medicore(at best) QB who was more often AWFUL than he was mediocre-to-good, made multiple errors in time management and instant replay challenges, It is, however, idiotic to suggest that our one playoff win with "Gibbs system"(which was changed from 2004 to some degree,) while not even finishing a second season with Saunders as OC, reflects anything other than a simple minded need to hold ANYONE BUT Gibbs responsible for what's happened to the team since he's been here. Oh and Portis was out most of the year in 2006 and Brunell was far worse and lost in the new offense. Yeah, but let's hold that against Saunders. Apparently, you think the offense finished 2005 (PLAYOFFS and last game vs. Eagles) well. That said, I think if Gibbs could have gotten his hands on a better QB to start, he would be less conservative and fearful in his attitude and approach. But I think even with Tom Brady, he'd call it differently than what we might want to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 its becoming pointless to argue with the people who still think Gibbs II and Gibbs I are the same person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 its becoming pointless to argue with the people who still think Gibbs II and Gibbs I are the same person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 You forget it was CP and the OFFENSE, that got us to that game for the offense to suck.. CP mainly and the DEFENSE. Seriously, did you even watch those games? It was the defense that gave us all the short fields vs. Dallas and made the plays that kept us in games to win them. It was the DEFENSE That sealed the game against a BAD Eagles team with Mike McMahon at QB. But the holes in the running game when our O-line has been healthy have been much larger since Saunders got here. If you actually paid ANY attention to what has happened since Gibbs came back, we barely implemented anything that helped Clinton have success until 2005. And even then, Clinton had gained weight. By the end, since the rest of our offense was inconsistent at best, we rode Clinton into the ground so that he was of little help in the playoffs. Kind of Pyrrhic victory to get a playoff spot if what caused you to get there is eliminated as positive factor, thus revealing the pre-existing detriments (like the offense and who was left in at QB, even though he was injured.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 You forget it was CP and the OFFENSE, that got us to that game for the offense to suck.. CP mainly and the DEFENSE. Seriously, did you even watch those games? It was the defense that gave us all the short fields vs. Dallas and made the plays that kept us in games to win them. It was the DEFENSE That sealed the game against a BAD Eagles team with Mike McMahon at QB. But the holes in the running game when our O-line has been healthy have been much larger since Saunders got here. If you actually paid ANY attention to what has happened since Gibbs came back, we barely implemented anything that helped Clinton have success until 2005. And even then, Clinton had gained weight. By the end, since the rest of our offense was inconsistent at best, we rode Clinton into the ground so that he was of little help in the playoffs. Kind of Pyrrhic victory to get a playoff spot if what caused you to get there is eliminated as positive factor, thus revealing the pre-existing detriments (like the offense and who was left in at QB, even though he was injured.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Problem no one knows for sure.. Everyone "thinks" they know what's going on. Everyone blames Gibbs for being too conservative, and I have too, but I'm just like everyone else, I don't know for sure. I do know, that this isn't the same old Gibbs system everyone thinks it is.. Gibbs contrary to popular belief, aired it out quit often during his first tenure. I couldn't recall which years but I know for a fact there were some years he passed more then he ran. I seem to remember a year where he had 3 WR's with 80 or more catches. You don't even see that in todays game. You're making our point for us. Gibbs I IS different than Gibbs II. It was different in 2004, it was different (though at least better) in 2005. Gibbs DID use to air it out. He IS playing it differently and he brought in Saunders to help. But he HIMSELF has said he's reigned things in with Saunders in certain games---games we lost. But then he did that in 2005 too. In those games we blew before going on a winning streak. I just want to point out that if we didn't blow so many games, we could have maybe finished the season more normally and MAYBE healthier, possibly with homefield advantage against Tampa or someone. But instead we were somewhat burned out and Brunell was allowed to stay in rather than going with someone who wasn't hurt and we just watched him stink it up for three games (incl. Eagles end of season.) If Mark were given a couple more weeks to get healthy, maybe he could have been ready for the SB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Problem no one knows for sure.. Everyone "thinks" they know what's going on. Everyone blames Gibbs for being too conservative, and I have too, but I'm just like everyone else, I don't know for sure. I do know, that this isn't the same old Gibbs system everyone thinks it is.. Gibbs contrary to popular belief, aired it out quit often during his first tenure. I couldn't recall which years but I know for a fact there were some years he passed more then he ran. I seem to remember a year where he had 3 WR's with 80 or more catches. You don't even see that in todays game. You're making our point for us. Gibbs I IS different than Gibbs II. It was different in 2004, it was different (though at least better) in 2005. Gibbs DID use to air it out. He IS playing it differently and he brought in Saunders to help. But he HIMSELF has said he's reigned things in with Saunders in certain games---games we lost. But then he did that in 2005 too. In those games we blew before going on a winning streak. I just want to point out that if we didn't blow so many games, we could have maybe finished the season more normally and MAYBE healthier, possibly with homefield advantage against Tampa or someone. But instead we were somewhat burned out and Brunell was allowed to stay in rather than going with someone who wasn't hurt and we just watched him stink it up for three games (incl. Eagles end of season.) If Mark were given a couple more weeks to get healthy, maybe he could have been ready for the SB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viper30 Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 at the end of 2005, our offense was ranked 11th, our QB had 23 tds to 10 int, and our defense was ranked 8th i believe...not to bad in a coaches 2nd season back in the saddle (don't forget your QB was playing on one knee and your second wr was taylor jacobs)....let's see if saunders can produce those #s by season's end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viper30 Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 at the end of 2005, our offense was ranked 11th, our QB had 23 tds to 10 int, and our defense was ranked 8th i believe...not to bad in a coaches 2nd season back in the saddle (don't forget your QB was playing on one knee and your second wr was taylor jacobs)....let's see if saunders can produce those #s by season's end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowfire Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Argue untill you are blue in the face on who is to blame but let me tell you when you have less than 100 yds passing in a game there is more of a problem than just coaching. As said before the coaches do not play the game they just call the plays it is up to the players to execute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowfire Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Argue untill you are blue in the face on who is to blame but let me tell you when you have less than 100 yds passing in a game there is more of a problem than just coaching. As said before the coaches do not play the game they just call the plays it is up to the players to execute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viper30 Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 let's see : saunders now has 2 rbs, 3 legitimate wrs + a premiere TE, he has a No. 1 defense scoring points for him and shortening the field. let's see what his 700 page playbook can do now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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