Thankyou, santana and carlos rogers

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

McIntosh botched the coverage, but we all saw Rogers botch the tackle... Tackling is supposed to be his strong point. I don't see how you can argue that he "made an effort"... Jumping on the guys back and letting him drag you for 10 yards is making an effort. Nudging him with a shoulder and hoping he falls down is not making an effort.

You have acknowledged in other threads the obvious, that all the talk about Carlos would go away if the guy would make big plays... This game was a classic example of this. I haven't blamed Carlos completely for the loss and I won't blame Moss either. However, the game was very close and there are a handful of plays that could've changed the outcome of the game. Carlos had two opportunities, and he failed on both.

This wouldn't be an issue if the guy made big plays to help us win games in the past...

hes a good tackler. tackling guys that have 50 pounds on him is tough to do, especially in open space from the angle he was at. i doubt gregg williams chewed him out for that one too bad. it wasnt even his guy in the first place.

other than that, what other big plays could he have helped on.? they barely threw to their WR all day long. he was throwing to TEs and dumpoffs all day. our CBs held the packers WRs to 9 catches for 76 yards. every other yard favre got was from a TE/RB/FB.

what else do you want from rogers?? and when i said he needs to make more big plays, sure he needs to make them but sean taylor made them all for us yesterday. rogers and springs completely shutdown their WRs all day long. thats enough for me. maybe it wasnt enough for you.

[-mando-]

so to summarize this thread...a cornerback is no longer supposed to shut down his reciever, they are supposed to make up for other peoples mistakes...sweet

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

so to summarize this thread...a cornerback is no longer supposed to shut down his reciever, they are supposed to make up for other peoples mistakes...sweet

having the number 1 pass defense in the NFC with no pass rush just isnt good enough i guess. its to the point now where its beyond hillarious when people bash rogers for missing one tackle, yet we get 800 threads crying about cutting moss slack after he had maybe the worst game ive ever seen out of a single player. i dont think carlos has ever had a game like moss had yesterday.

[SkinzFoLife]

On the play that Rogers missed the tackle, that wasn't his responsiblity, albeit he missed the tackle, its was Rocky's man, and Rocky bit on the play action and left the guy wide open down the middle. I didn't think Rogers has that bad of a game. Our Defense actually played really well, check out the numbers.

Our offense let downt he defense yet again and those costly turnovers.

[SeanTaylor'sFist]

What about Laron Landry? He didn't put out much of an effort to tackle Lee once he saw Carlos go in for the tackle.

Where is that 4.35 speed he had in April?

To hang this on Carlos is wrong.

[pjfootballer]

This hate for Rogers has got to stop. He's actually playing well. He took a bad angle on a big TE. I've been satisfied with his play so far.

[Aghar]

I am strting to get pissed off with the lack of knowledge people have around here. If you know anything about football you would say that the missed tackle by Carlos was just a "missed tackle" and if anything was a GREAT PLAY to come from half way across the field to even have a shot at the TE! He recognized that Rocky had blown the coverage and once he saw Farve starting to throw it he made a jump for the TE. This was not a bad play. In fact it shows how good Carlos can be in covering the field. You people are starting to run out of easy scapegoats to blame losses on. This was a game that should have been won. Moss was partially to blame, but he wasn't the only one dropping balls or fumbling out there! Ever think that losing TWO OL during the game might actually set your offensive production back a bit? :doh: So before , as fans, you start pointing a finger in a direction of one individual player in an attempt to make them responsible for a tough loss, against a good opponent, please....PRETTY PLEASE know what the hell your talking about! :applause:

Wash it away....The Cards are coming....

[adamyesme1111]

Another STUPID thread. Rogers had a couple penalties, but he and the rest of our defence plays great. Where is Portis mentioned in this? It was his and Moss's mistake that lost us the game.

[NewCliche21]

Have you noticed that an opposing offensive player can't just make a good play against us? It's just that one of us effs up? I mean, forget that Plaxico is outstanding. Forget that Green Bay's passing offense is NUMBER ONE. Rogers just sucks and makes mistakes while the opposing team just walks right through him.

Sounds stupid, doesn't it?

[Cringer Eats You]

Wait, Rogers has very well except for that penalty and missed tackle, but I never saw his man get wide open. This should read, "Thank you wide receivers for not being able to catch the important one". At least Santana manned up and stated multiple times that the game was on him. The loss was certainly on him this time around. I was as mad at him as anyone else here probably was.

[DallasSucks19922010]

it's hard to say santana lost the game for us, but you can say that he hasn't been much of a football player for us this year. He has a terrible case of the dropsies. All of the playmakers let us down today.

its hard to say he lost the game for us??? the go-ahead score was on HIS fumble for TD and no1 except Campbell was hustling to actually make a tackle. I love santana as much as the next redskin fan but what the heck is his problem nowadays? and what the heck is with hate for rogers? our secondary has played damn good and the only person you can blame is rogers? he misses a couple tackles and so does alot of defenders but hes played the best out of springs, smoot, and himself. you guys are stupid for making him ur scapegoat. u cant blame joe gibbs/al saunder for that 4th down play within field goal range and they throw a pass that doesnt even come close to 1st down yardage.

[GOSKN5]

I dont think anyone from the Defense should be included... they D was awesome yesterday... and has been great all year... the offense just struggled... completely... they will get it together though... the plays were there.. thats the good part... we just have to execute...

[HailfrmDEN]

If Rogers is the worst player we have to care about on our defense, then were doin pretty well. Walt harris made bad plays.:point2sky

[Smoot Point Really]

having the number 1 pass defense in the NFC with no pass rush just isnt good enough i guess. its to the point now where its beyond hillarious when people bash rogers for missing one tackle, yet we get 800 threads crying about cutting moss slack after he had maybe the worst game ive ever seen out of a single player. i dont think carlos has ever had a game like moss had yesterday.

Carlos has had 37 games in which people have made excuses for him. Just because the defense as a whole plays well, doesn't mean you can't criticize a player who failed to capitalize on opportunities to lessen the points our defense did give up.

Rogers missed one tackle (which all he had to do was wrap up and wait for teammates) that cost 50 yards (not 42 like Peter King says, since he bumped him 10 yards down the field... not 18. It was a 60 yard play) and 7 points. He missed one opportunity at a pick that would've been an incredible catch, but did hit him in the hands. That cost us another 3 points.

Santana Moss cost us the other 7 (and possibly more with missed opportunities)... However, Santana Moss has won us games in the past. Carlos Rogers has lost us games in the past (including playoff games). All I want to see from Carlos Rogers is that he even the score by creating positive plays that mitigate the negative plays that inevitably happen at the cornerback position.

Big plays win games... Carlos hasn't provided big plays that help win games. This is my only complaint. What separates Carlos from the Pro Bowl is his inability to convert his opportunities... It also hurts the team.

I believe Carlos Rogers wouldn't think he had a great game...

[Smoot Point Really]

Bottom Line: Carlos was in position to win the game... again... He didn't.

While you all think that it was a small and insignificant play... One play can ruin an entire game or day (or week if you are a fan).

Carlos needs to convert his opportunities.

I really can't understand why in order to defend a player people stoop to:

1) Placing blame on other players... BTW, once the coverage was blown, it was Carlos responsibility to tackle that guy. Those who say we should blame Rocky for blowing the coverage aren't acknowledging that blown coverages happen, and that it's everyone's responsibility to tackle once the coverage is blown. Landry should've had Lee too... However, it was Carlos who actually bumped Lee with his shoulder instead of wrapping him up.

2) Say that other fans "lack knowledge" (like Aghar above)... First, Carlos didn't come from halfway across the field. Second, I've never heard anyone call such a miserably blown tackle a "GREAT PLAY" (your caps, not mine). Do you owe Carlos some money?

3) Say that people who criticize are "hating" (pjfootballer)... How is it hating to point out very clear blown opportunities and hope that the player starts converting those opportunities into positive plays?

BTW, I liked HailfrmDen's response... We don't have a lot to correct on defense, but it would be nice (and it isn't much to ask) if this was fixed. If Walt Harris can get 8 INTs in one season, then I don't think it's much for Carlos Rogers to make a few big plays in critical situations.

[nebster21]

ADHD is kicking in hard now i see. Carlos needs to learn to wrap up on his tackles instead of going for the blow up move that ST does. He could have saved that 60 yard gain. But all in all he had a good game.

[CG]

ADHD is kicking in hard now i see. Carlos needs to learn to wrap up on his tackles instead of going for the blow up move that ST does. He could have saved that 60 yard gain. But all in all he had a good game.

Yeah, I'm totally on board with this comment. Rogers just ran into Lee on that long 65 yarder, but his mistakes beyond that weren't too bad. I don't think you should ever put blame squarely on one player for a loss - the game was still close and we had some opportunities to tie it up and put points back on the board. Moss' fumble and ball off the face were miserable to watch but the game wasn't "over" by any means at that point.

[pjfootballer]

3) Say that people who criticize are "hating" (pjfootballer)... How is it hating to point out very clear blown opportunities and hope that the player starts converting those opportunities into positive plays?

BTW, I liked HailfrmDen's response... We don't have a lot to correct on defense, but it would be nice (and it isn't much to ask) if this was fixed. If Walt Harris can get 8 INTs in one season, then I don't think it's much for Carlos Rogers to make a few big plays in critical situations.

Because no matter whether we win the game or lose the game, Rogers name gets mentioned with negativity. Is he where he should be in his 3rd year? No. But the man has not been playing bad this year. I think he's been solid.

He missed the tackle against the Giants Burress because the whole defense was tired. He missed the tackle on the Packers Lee because Lee was running straight ahead and Carlos came at him from an angle. Oh and never mind that he outwieghs him by 100 pound. Carlos didn't shoulder bump him, he tried to grab him. I think you should rewatch that play. So he didn't make the tackle. Big whoop. Everyone misses them.

If the defense was giving up 30 points a game and Carlos was missing tackles left and right and getting burned for multiple TD's, then everyone would have a point. Otherwise everyone needs to get off his ass and STFU! You want to blame someone? Blame the damn offense who can't muster more than 2 scores a game. Blame the allstar receiver with ZERO catches, tipped passes for INT's and a fumble. Blame the allstar RB who seems to have become a fumbling machine.

All you cats out there blaming Rogers have no proof and no leg to stand on. It's just out and out right hatred and it's getting rediculous. Last year, yeah. Rogers sucked. Not so much this year. You all need to get your facts straight. Man this is getting so out of hand with the Rogers hatred. Every friggin week the same S***, different game with you guys.

By the way, he doesn't get paid to "WIN GAMES" like you said. He gets paid to cover WR's and get INT's. The team is paid to win games. It is not his responsibility. Where the eff is Smoot or Springs? Why didn't they WIN the game. You guys give me a headache sometimes. :doh:

[InsaneBoost]

Oh well, I think it's time to drop it, we played the ****, yet everyone acts like Green Bay was hot stuff too, both teams player horribly, we just happened to let our fumbles get recovered by the wrong team.

[Maximus71]

Because no matter whether we win the game or lose the game, Rogers name gets mentioned with negativity. Is he where he should be in his 3rd year? No. But the man has not been playing bad this year. I think he's been solid.

He missed the tackle against the Giants Burress because the whole defense was tired. He missed the tackle on the Packers Lee because Lee was running straight ahead and Carlos came at him from an angle. Oh and never mind that he outwieghs him by 100 pound. Carlos didn't shoulder bump him, he tried to grab him. I think you should rewatch that play. So he didn't make the tackle. Big whoop. Everyone misses them.

If the defense was giving up 30 points a game and Carlos was missing tackles left and right and getting burned for multiple TD's, then everyone would have a point. Otherwise everyone needs to get off his ass and STFU! You want to blame someone? Blame the damn offense who can't muster more than 2 scores a game. Blame the allstar receiver with ZERO catches, tipped passes for INT's and a fumble. Blame the allstar RB who seems to have become a fumbling machine.

All you cats out there blaming Rogers have no proof and no leg to stand on. It's just out and out right hatred and it's getting rediculous. Last year, yeah. Rogers sucked. Not so much this year. You all need to get your facts straight. Man this is getting so out of hand with the Rogers hatred. Every friggin week the same S***, different game with you guys.

By the way, he doesn't get paid to "WIN GAMES" like you said. He gets paid to cover WR's and get INT's. The team is paid to win games. It is not his responsibility. Where the eff is Smoot or Springs? Why didn't they WIN the game. You guys give me a headache sometimes. :doh:

Tell us how you really feel and by all means dont hold back :laugh:

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Bottom Line: Carlos was in position to win the game... again... He didn't.

While you all think that it was a small and insignificant play... One play can ruin an entire game or day (or week if you are a fan).

Carlos needs to convert his opportunities.

I really can't understand why in order to defend a player people stoop to:

1) Placing blame on other players... BTW, once the coverage was blown, it was Carlos responsibility to tackle that guy. Those who say we should blame Rocky for blowing the coverage aren't acknowledging that blown coverages happen, and that it's everyone's responsibility to tackle once the coverage is blown. Landry should've had Lee too... However, it was Carlos who actually bumped Lee with his shoulder instead of wrapping him up.

2) Say that other fans "lack knowledge" (like Aghar above)... First, Carlos didn't come from halfway across the field. Second, I've never heard anyone call such a miserably blown tackle a "GREAT PLAY" (your caps, not mine). Do you owe Carlos some money?

3) Say that people who criticize are "hating" (pjfootballer)... How is it hating to point out very clear blown opportunities and hope that the player starts converting those opportunities into positive plays?

BTW, I liked HailfrmDen's response... We don't have a lot to correct on defense, but it would be nice (and it isn't much to ask) if this was fixed. If Walt Harris can get 8 INTs in one season, then I don't think it's much for Carlos Rogers to make a few big plays in critical situations.

im in agreement that rogers could use some more big plays, but stop with the walt harris nonsense. i already showed you the garbage QBs he picked off, playing for one of the worst pass defenses in the league. harris sucked huge balls here, he was torched constantly, and everybody was calling for his head. one career high season doesnt make him good.

but yes, carlos missed a tackle on a blown assignment from a linebacker. that was one bad play he made.

you know you could do that with pretty much most players on our team though, its just funny you love turning it on rogers. most players on our team just do the little things to help win, whcih rogers does. he doesnt make the huge game changing plays like a taylor/portis/moss. hes not on that level in my opinion. hes just a good solid trustworthy corner. dont expect him to make deangelo hall moves. i think youre just expecting more out of him because he was the 9th overall pick. you gotta get over that.

[ST+LL=Area51]

Last I checked it wasn't Carlos who blew the coverage. He gave a solid 50 pounds to a TE that was running full speed. Ease up.

[Smoot Point Really]

Because no matter whether we win the game or lose the game, Rogers name gets mentioned with negativity. Is he where he should be in his 3rd year? No. But the man has not been playing bad this year. I think he's been solid.

Let's start at the top... I don't remember anyone saying Carlos had a bad game against Philly or Detroit. Heck, some over-rated his game against the Dolphins where he gave up two plays over 20 yards. I also don't hear anyone saying he has played poorly this year.

What is incredible to me is this unnatural infatuation some have with Carlos Rogers that any amount of criticism amounts to "hating". You said it yourself... He hasn't lived up to expectations (paraphrasing your statement above)... I don't take this as "hating" either. I agree with you...

He missed the tackle against the Giants Burress because the whole defense was tired. He missed the tackle on the Packers Lee because Lee was running straight ahead and Carlos came at him from an angle. Oh and never mind that he outwieghs him by 100 pound. Carlos didn't shoulder bump him, he tried to grab him. I think you should rewatch that play. So he didn't make the tackle. Big whoop. Everyone misses them.

I'm sure Carlos Rogers isn't using these excuses... Carlos should've stopped both plays... A veteran Darrell Green who has nothing to prove would've broken his own arm trying to make a tackle on a bigger player (and did).

If the defense was giving up 30 points a game and Carlos was missing tackles left and right and getting burned for multiple TD's, then everyone would have a point.

The defense gave up 10 points, and Carlos could've made plays to prevent those 10 points. Why not point that out? Carlos Rogers hasn't done anything in nearly 2 and a half seasons to have earned the infallibility that these sycophants bestow.

Otherwise everyone needs to get off his ass and STFU!

Thanks for the unfortunate mental picture. Freud would have a field day. Was your mother named Carlos?

You want to blame someone? Blame the damn offense who can't muster more than 2 scores a game. Blame the allstar receiver with ZERO catches, tipped passes for INT's and a fumble. Blame the allstar RB who seems to have become a fumbling machine.

Let's see... The offense stunk. However, the offense wasn't on the field when Carlos shouldered Lee... Dropped an interception that hit him in the hands (I don't hold this against Carlos, but I wish he would make plays like this)... Or missed the tackle on Burress...

Why defend Carlos by pointing out other aspects of the team that suck?

All you cats out there blaming Rogers have no proof and no leg to stand on. It's just out and out right hatred and it's getting rediculous. Last year, yeah. Rogers sucked. Not so much this year. You all need to get your facts straight. Man this is getting so out of hand with the Rogers hatred. Every friggin week the same S***, different game with you guys.

Carlos has improved... However, he's been in a position to make plays that would help us win games and he has failed... Pointing that out isn't "hating". You agree with me that he hasn't lived up to expectations... I really don't see any difference in the things we are saying other than your "passion".

By the way, he doesn't get paid to "WIN GAMES" like you said. He gets paid to cover WR's and get INT's. The team is paid to win games. It is not his responsibility. Where the eff is Smoot or Springs? Why didn't they WIN the game. You guys give me a headache sometimes. :doh:

I believe every football player is paid to "win games"... You work within a team to win a game. Each player is put in a situation to win or lose a game. You know who is most consistent at helping win games? Probably Ethan Albright... Because he does his job. Other cornerbacks in this league tackle, cover, and create turnovers... Carlos is good at covering. This year, he has blown two tackles that have contributed to losses. He hasn't created enough turnovers in 4 years either. Other cornerbacks do... He does this, we forgive the bad plays. He doesn't do this, the bad plays are magnified.

[Aghar]

Bottom Line: Carlos was in position to win the game... again... He didn't.

While you all think that it was a small and insignificant play... One play can ruin an entire game or day (or week if you are a fan).

Carlos needs to convert his opportunities.

I really can't understand why in order to defend a player people stoop to:

1) Placing blame on other players... BTW, once the coverage was blown, it was Carlos responsibility to tackle that guy. Those who say we should blame Rocky for blowing the coverage aren't acknowledging that blown coverages happen, and that it's everyone's responsibility to tackle once the coverage is blown. Landry should've had Lee too... However, it was Carlos who actually bumped Lee with his shoulder instead of wrapping him up.

2) Say that other fans "lack knowledge" (like Aghar above)... First, Carlos didn't come from halfway across the field. Second, I've never heard anyone call such a miserably blown tackle a "GREAT PLAY" (your caps, not mine). Do you owe Carlos some money?

3) Say that people who criticize are "hating" (pjfootballer)... How is it hating to point out very clear blown opportunities and hope that the player starts converting those opportunities into positive plays?

BTW, I liked HailfrmDen's response... We don't have a lot to correct on defense, but it would be nice (and it isn't much to ask) if this was fixed. If Walt Harris can get 8 INTs in one season, then I don't think it's much for Carlos Rogers to make a few big plays in critical situations.

Excuse me? I will respond to your point quoting me directly only by saying I think you should read my full post. If you did and took that away from it, I cannot say more.

I'd like to ask you a question however. Your premise for blaming Carlos is what exactly? He was in position to win the game and he didn't? Was he the only one in a position to win the game? C'mon, every player on that field at one point or another could be considered "in position to win the game" and didn't. It's foolish actually to even get into that type of conversation. The truth is if you look hard enough you can find fault in any player's game every week. You just choose to look at Carlos and no further. It's a shame really since he is only a player who happens to be a KEY part of a top 3 defense this year.

P.S. For the record I have been critical of Carlos when it was justified. This is just not one of those times. Not by a long shot. :2cents:

[Smoot Point Really]

Excuse me? I will respond to your point quoting me directly only by saying I think you should read my full post. If you did and took that away from it, I cannot say more.

You are quoted as saying the following in post #182 of this thread:

I am strting to get pissed off with the lack of knowledge people have around here. If you know anything about football you would say that the missed tackle by Carlos was just a "missed tackle" and if anything was a GREAT PLAY to come from half way across the field to even have a shot at the TE!

You assumed people "lack knowledge"... You not only dismissed the play as simply a "missed tackle", but you went as far as to call it a "GREAT PLAY" (which is absurd). You also incorrectly state that Carlos had to run halfway across the field, when he didn't even have to cross a hash mark.

Because of these reasons, I stated the following:

2) Say that other fans "lack knowledge" (like Aghar above)... First, Carlos didn't come from halfway across the field. Second, I've never heard anyone call such a miserably blown tackle a "GREAT PLAY" (your caps, not mine). Do you owe Carlos some money?

I apologize if I misinterpreted your post or took the first few lines out of context.

I'd like to ask you a question however. Your premise for blaming Carlos is what exactly?

I'm not blaming Carlos for losing the game solely. Others have blamed Moss, but I won't even blame Moss entirely. I still think we would've won the game if our offensive line didn't get pummeled in the 2nd half with injuries. I also didn't like some of the play calling, and you have to give credit to Green Bay.

He was in position to win the game and he didn't? Was he the only one in a position to win the game?

He has been in a position to win multiple games for this team over the 2 years and 5 game career and he has failed repeatedly. This has never been simply about one game with Carlos Rogers. Cornerbacks who cannot convert their opportunities for interceptions better not miss tackles or blow coverages.

C'mon, every player on that field at one point or another could be considered "in position to win the game" and didn't. It's foolish actually to even get into that type of conversation. The truth is if you look hard enough you can find fault in any player's game every week. You just choose to look at Carlos and no further. It's a shame really since he is only a player who happens to be a KEY part of a top 3 defense this year.

We'd be top 1 and undefeated if Carlos Rogers could've made two tackles and/or converted an interception opportunity. The entire responsibility cannot be placed on one player, but perhaps these missed opportunities help point out exactly why this player is KEY... At this point, Carlos Rogers hasn't made enough plays to be exonerated for his blown tackles or missed interceptions. I'm waiting for this guy to break out, but his stone hands and other mistakes have cost us multiple games (including a playoff game). His missed opportunities have figured significantly in two losses last year and our two losses this year.

P.S. For the record I have been critical of Carlos when it was justified. This is just not one of those times. Not by a long shot. :2cents:

It's justified that we should be critical... It's not justified that we should say things like "Carlos Sucks" or "We need to give up on Carlos"... He hasn't earned the right to be above criticism. I want to see him figure more in our wins and less in our losses. He is a good player, but he is playing average (as opposed to poor last year). There are too many decent cornerbacks in this league who do convert their opportunities and make up for the inevitable bad play. We should expect more from him, our 9th overall pick.