GatorEye Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 After watching the idiocy that is Ron Zook in yesterday's bowl game, I have to believe Rex turns pro this year. Zook called a stupid halfback pass from a third string running back when Rex was driving us to a game tying touchdown. Taking the ball out of your best player's hand during crunch time isn't a way to endear him. The announcers said Rex is being told by NFL brass that he would be drafted anywhere from late first to the third round. I think that keeps him out of reach for us. If he was still hanging around in the 4th round when we draft, I might not be surprised to see SOS take a shot with him, but after what he said about Ramsey in the season wrap up press conference, he'd be contradicting himself by grabbing a QB in the early rounds. He mentioned drafting a kicker in the first round if he thought someone was worthy although it was probably said somewhat in jest. As a side note, I though it was funny when they interviewed Emmitt Smith on the sideline (who refused to answer any questions about his future in Dallas or the Tuna) that he said Rex should stay in school for his senior year to develop his skills. That's pretty funny coming from a guy who left school a year early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 we don't need Grossman. he doesn't bring anything to the table that Ramsey doesn't already have, including a year under his belt in the NFL if I were looking for a #3 quarterback to groom, I would be looking for a guy with a better arm than Grossman and more athleticism than Ramsey has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watergator Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 bulldog, you sure show your anit-gator bias. There is no one I've ever seen with a better arm than Grossman, except maybe Montana. He might not have the stength of Ramsey but Rex is almost magical when he's on. floaters, lasers, he can do it all. He's also more mobile than Ramsey. BTW, Spurrier is in Gainesville right now. Wonder if he gives Rex a call? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorEye Posted January 3, 2003 Author Share Posted January 3, 2003 Originally posted by Watergator BTW, Spurrier is in Gainesville right now. Wonder if he gives Rex a call? I read that as well - having dinner with Foley. I wonder what he said about the game. I'm not sure whether we need Grossman or not, but I won't argue with his physical skills (whether he is short or not). I do think he is more mobile than Ramsey. Grossman brings the fact he has seen and been is SOS's system for 2 years and played in it for one. Ramsey only has a few games experience. Again I think SOS has seen enough to give Ramsey the shot, but I still say there is nothing wrong with having a guy to push him. I don't have confidence in DW to stay healthy as a backup, although Grossman hasn't proven he can against the pros either so it's all moot. What's disturbing is that we are having this discussion and the season isn't even over yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 the last thing the Redskins need to do with the holes they have is spend a high pick on a guy that is going to ride the bench. with the investment already made in Ramsey, and the fact he has shown definite NFL skills, wouldn't it be wiser for this team to turn the page and move on to other spots on the team where we don't even have a legitimate starter or prospect? the mania of some fans for the continual stockpiling of talent at the qb spot would end up with the Redskins having Kurt Warner, Patrick Ramsey and Rex Grossman on the roster while we would have Delbert Cowsette and Bernard Jackson starting at DT :laugh: the Redskins won one Super Bowl with Tom Owen backing up Joe Theismann. Another one with an out of favor Jay Schroeder backing up Doug Williams and a third with Jeff Rutledge backing up Mark Rypien. I think we can find a way to win 10 games and get back to the postseason with Ramsey at quarterback, showing him some patience and spending judiciously to close the gap on the offensive line, speed at WR and depth on defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorEye Posted January 3, 2003 Author Share Posted January 3, 2003 Originally posted by bulldog the last thing the Redskins need to do with the holes they have is spend a high pick on a guy that is going to ride the bench. with the investment already made in Ramsey, and the fact he has shown definite NFL skills, wouldn't it be wiser for this team to turn the page and move on to other spots on the team where we don't even have a legitimate starter or prospect? the mania of some fans for the continual stockpiling of talent at the qb spot would end up with the Redskins having Kurt Warner, Patrick Ramsey and Rex Grossman on the roster while we would have Delbert Cowsette and Bernard Jackson starting at DT :laugh: the Redskins won one Super Bowl with Tom Owen backing up Joe Theismann. Another one with an out of favor Jay Schroeder backing up Doug Williams and a third with Jeff Rutledge backing up Mark Rypien. I think we can find a way to win 10 games and get back to the postseason with Ramsey at quarterback, showing him some patience and spending judiciously to close the gap on the offensive line, speed at WR and depth on defense I agree with 90% of what you said except that I contend DW is not a viable #2 QB because he hasn't proven he can stay healthy. With that - we still need another viable QB. I don't want to spend a high draft pick or a lot of money on a backup QB, but I think we need some insurance. With an offense driven largely by QB play, we need another backup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laurent Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Originally posted by Watergator bulldog, you sure show your anit-gator bias. There is no one I've ever seen with a better arm than Grossman, except maybe Montana. This argument doesn't lend you any credibility whatsoever. If there is one thing that sticks out about Montana then it is how he was able to achieve what he did with the weak arm of his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GURU Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 First, laurent, you sound slightly ignorant. Did you ever see Joe Montana play? He did NOT have a weak arm. No, he didn't possess a rocket, but he could make throws that not many others could. In a dead out sprint, he could twist his body and make a pinpoint toss practically anywhere downfield. Maybe he couldn't fire a deep out like Elway or Marino, but he could throw the deep out if he had to. There weren't a lot of deep outs in the West Coast Offense, though. The fact is that Joe Montana was one of the best pure passers that the game has ever seen. Period. So I know what watergator is getting at. But I can't say that Grossman's passing even remotely reminds me of Montana's. The arguement about Grossman having played two years in Spurrier's system vs. Ramsey's 6 games bothers me because it doesn't account for the transition from the college game to the NFL. If we learned anything, it's that Spurrier's system didn't work against NFL defenses the way it did against college defenses. Many of the pass patterns and audibles that worked so well against Georgia just don't work against the Philadelphia Eagles. At this point, Ramsey has a major advantage over Grossman because he has seen NFL defenses first hand, and he has a better idea of what aspects of Spurrier's offense works and what doesn't. Grossman was erratic this season, especially under pressure. While any QB will struggle with pressure, not all react the same. Take the second Eagles game. Ramsey was rattled early, but came back, threw 3 TDs against a very, very tough pass defense, and almost made a game of it by himself. I'm not sure if I saw the same resiliancy from Grossman this season. But he could show it next seaon. Even if Florida continues a rough transition from Spurrier to Zook, Grossman can really improve his draft status by improving his QB skills. Like Ramsey, Grossman has natural passing skills. Even though he played on a bad, losing team, Ramsey's leadership, toughness, and resiliancy stood out and made him a first round draft choice. Grossman could really help his stock by returning for his last year and showing some of the same qualities than endeared Ramsey to scouts. How a QB reacts to adversity is extremely key to his ultimate success at the highest level of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRMADD Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Watergator: bulldog, you sure show your anit-gator bias. There is no one I've ever seen with a better arm than Grossman, except maybe Montana. He might not have the stength of Ramsey but Rex is almost magical when he's on. floaters, lasers, he can do it all. He's also more mobile than Ramsey. Go away, brainless Gator fans. Saying Grossman's arm is almost as strong as Montana's is kinda like saying he's almost as mobile as Ramsey. Arm strength was not exactly Montana's strong suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Madd, think what watergator was saying was not that G. had super arm strength, but that he has the touch to make all of the throws (like Montana). I have no opinion. But I think its been said over and over that we ought not to throw any picks in the first 4 rounds at a QB when we have multiple other needs. Draft a project with a late pick? Maybe. I think drafting a 'superkicker' in the 2nd or 3rd round would be more reasonable. I'm WAAAAY tired of our kicking woes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRMADD Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Are their any "superkickers" in this draft? I think we can find a free agent (I know, we keep trying and failing) because rookie kickers always struggle. I'd hate to see us use a 2nd rounder on a kicker when we have so many needs -- there are some good OGs who should still be on the board by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 I'm only 1/2 serious on drafting one...but you have to admit...our kicking has killed us. We need the next Jason Elam or Vinatieri and we need him now. I'm concerned we will once again obsess about offense and defense and pay lip service to special teams once again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 we give up on kickers too soon. Marty signed Tuthill and watch in 2 or 3 years he's gonna be one of the most consistent kickers in the league. Just because he went through a cold stretch doesnt mean he's a crappy kicker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Agree, we should have kept Tuthill. Just checked and Elam is a free agent this year. He's 32 and coming off a bit of an off year, but that might be a bonus as we could probably get him relatively cheaply. He's mostly money. I'd hope we'd make a play for him and maybe draft a talented punter in a late round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watergator Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 MrMadd, I'll put my football experience and knowledge against yours any day. I've been a Skins fan for 40 years as well. Read what I said, jerk. "Strength" is not what I was saying. That is the most over-rated aspect of a QB (Ryan Leaf, Tee Martin, McGuire, etc. etc. etc). It just has to be good enough and no, I don't think Shanes or Dannys is good enough. Rex has a "great arm" and like SOS always says (and has said about Ramsey) is "he can make ALL the throws". If you've ever watched Rex at ground level, you'd be amazed at his footwork and release as well. I think the Broncos will get Rex before the Skins do. The Skins need lineman and other players first. If Rex is there in the 3rd round, he'll be a Skin. Spurrier has to have 2 QBs he can believe in and Rex would be a great backup if Ramsey gets hurt, God forbid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Come on now Water, I defend your post and then you make me regret it...play nice now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ummagumma Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Originally posted by GatorEye As a side note, I though it was funny when they interviewed Emmitt Smith on the sideline (who refused to answer any questions about his future in Dallas or the Tuna) that he said Rex should stay in school for his senior year to develop his skills. That's pretty funny coming from a guy who left school a year early. Why is it funny? Emmitt came out and it obviously was the right move. Maybe he feels it's not the right move for Grossman. Please don't tell me you think Grossman will have a NFL career that favorabely compares to Emmitt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 When, oh when, Lord, will Gator fans stop placing familiarity with Spurrier's system over proven NFL-caliber skills? Wuerffel, Matthews, Anthony, Green, Doering, Jackson . . . :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Murphaaay Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Originally posted by bulldog if I were looking for a #3 quarterback to groom, I would be looking for a guy with a better arm than Grossman and more athleticism than Ramsey has. Grossman is way more mobile and athletic than Ramsey is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 As much as I am not a Gaytor fan or a Grossman fan, that guy needs to get the hell out of there before they kill him. He gets no love in Gainsville and the offense looks to be further off track for next season. What the hell is that coach thinking making a reciever, who threw for no yards that game, throw the ball on the last play when his QB had passex for over 300 on the day already? Dumb Move on Rex,:thumbsup: just don't come here:nono: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 If we draft a QB, it should be an ultra mobile a la Aaron Brooks project, probably in the 6th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yank Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 If we get some butt ugly mean stud Hogs up front it wont matter how mobile Ramsey is and it wont matter who the backup QB is. Paraphrasing voting in Chicago as it pertains to drafting for the OL this year - "draft early and draft often". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted January 4, 2003 Share Posted January 4, 2003 The only gators I want to hear about are the ones being used for boots, luggage and steak. There isnt one gator worth signing or pursuing including that fragile jerk RB out of Jacksonville. You draft Linemen first and the rest takes care of itself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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