Minus Tiki, Coughlin tries to unite locker room

[InTikiITrust]

And some say Tiki wasn't a distraction in the locker room :doh:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/2007/07/22/2007-07-22_tamer_tom_has_giant_task.html?ref=rss

Tom Coughlin, the hard-driving, rules-obsessed, arm-waving, often out of control on the sidelines Giants coach, has presided over three of the most chaotic seasons in the team's 82-year history. It placed him right on the edge of getting fired in January, but he's not expected to be granted another reprieve if the chaos isn't replaced this season by at least one playoff victory.

The moment he steps on the practice field Saturday in Albany, the Coughlin Watch starts up again. So do a ton of questions.

Will this be a wasted year for the Giants? Should new general manager Jerry Reese have been allowed to pick his own coach? Is Coughlin a lame duck and did the Giants just put a one-year delay on the inevitable by bringing him back this year, with perhaps an all-star cast of Bill Belichick, Bill Cowher, Bill Parcells and John Fox available after this season?

Or was he a victim of an extraordinary number of injuries to key players during last season's second-half meltdown that turned a 6-2 start and Super Bowl dreams into a 2-6 finish and quick exit in the wild-card round? And did criticism by Tiki Barber, his best player, who claims his coach made his retirement decision easier, undermine him in the locker room?

What is not in question is that Coughlin is in a tough spot. He lost his best player and his quarterback regressed in the second half of the season. So few moves were made in the offseason that it's almost as if he's been set up to fail.

"Personally, I like him," Barber says Friday by phone as he sits on a plane awaiting takeoff. "I would like to hang out and have a beer with him. I have no personal problem with Tom Coughlin."

Then, he adds this zinger: "I don't like the way he coaches."

Linebacker Antonio Pierce, signed by Coughlin as a free agent two years ago and a big supporter of the coach, didn't like the All-Tiki-All-The-Time theme that emerged when news of Barber's upcoming retirement broke in October during a Giants winning streak.

"I was tired of hearing about the Tiki Barber thing," Pierce says. "We are the New York Giants. Every coach stresses individuals get awards and accomplishments, but every week we shouldn't have the Tiki Barber Show."

Coughlin's NFL coaching future is at stake. He will turn 61 the week before the season opener in Dallas, and if he gets fired by the Giants, after getting fired by the Jaguars, and with all the player unrest that has marked his stay in each city, it will be difficult for him to get another head coaching job in the league. His high-tension act wears out his players. This may be his last chance, which puts an extraordinary amount of pressure on him to win this year.

He issued an edict to his players in June to just shut up and play and eliminate all the in-house sniping. No more ripping coaches in the media.

Will Barber's retirement help settle down the turmoil in the locker room? "I think so," Pierce says. "You can't replace Tiki Barber on the field, but you can change things in the locker room. It's a positive and negative. You never want to lose a player that productive, one of the best the Giants have ever had. But at the same time, you don't want to have somebody causing distractions."

"I don't really have a response," Barber says. "I am irrelevant to the New York Giants this season. I don't have a uniform on. ... Antonio doesn't know me. He's never been a friend to me. For him to assume my impact on the locker room - he's mistaken. I know this much: It's easy to point the finger at someone who is not there."

Three days after the Giants were eliminated by the Eagles in the wild-card game, co-owners John Mara and Jonathan Tisch ended weeks of speculation that Coughlin would be paid the $3 million for the final year of his contract and told to leave. Instead, they gave him a one-year extension through the 2008 season.

In effect, in meetings with Mara and Tisch immediately after the season, Coughlin bought himself a one-year audition by selling his plan for the future. Because the Giants never allow their head coach to go into the final year of his contract, Coughlin will be up for review again after this season.

"There's worse things in life than having a year tacked onto the contract each year," Mara says.

For Coughlin to create an atmosphere for success, the sniping in the locker room must stop and Coughlin must find a way to stop being a lightning rod.

Mara says he doesn't buy "for one minute" that the players don't like Coughlin. "There were a lot of opportunities last year for players to tell me or tell Jon Tisch that they didn't want him back," he says. "That just did not occur. I felt pretty confident most of the players did want him back."

Although most players wouldn't rip the coach to the owner, Mara insists he would have found out if his team didn't want to play for Coughlin. "The guy is a good football coach," Mara says. "Some people wanted Parcells gone after '86. I never got the sense there was a mutiny downstairs."

Although Mara has not mandated that Coughlin win a certain number of games to keep his job, the assumption is that losing in the wild-card round for the third year in a row won't be good enough.

"We have to feel at the end of the season we are moving in the right direction," Mara says. "Too many things can happen in a season. You can't pin yourself down to a specific number of wins and losses. I know the focus of everybody has been that he is a lame duck. No way we are looking at it like that. Our focus is he is going to be with us a number of years."

Coughlin is one of only five coaches to make the playoffs each of the last two years and he is the first Giants coach since Parcells in his final two seasons in 1989-90 to get them into the postseason two years in a row.

One thing the Giants did insist is that Coughlin be a little easier on his players and eliminate the adversarial relationship with the media. He then met with beat writers and columnists to try to devise a better working relationship.

"Would I like him to see him be a little softer with the media and with the players? Yes I would," Mara says. "The bottom line ends up being wins and losses. You can't expect somebody to make significant material changes at this stage of his career. That's not what we expect. He's done all those sessions with individual reporters. His communication with the players has been better."

Mara sees a difference. He says Coughlin has a "different persona around the office."

Even so, he declined to speak to the Daily News last week, presumably upset about the story written from the NFL meetings in March in which he described the criticism he received last season by saying, "Hitler and then me, in that order. Unfortunate, but it is."

click the link for the rest of the article....it's pretty long.

Yep, sounds like Tiki is a distraction and worried about himself.

[bubba9497]

anyone else find it ironic a guy whose handle is InTikiITrust

now keeps trying to throw Tiki under the bus :laugh:

[TODD]

Yep, the Giants should be THRILLED to finally have their only consistent offensive weapon out of the lineup.

Brandon Jacobs and his 134 career carries is much more formidable.

[D-Day]

Tiki down,

Plax, shockey, and Strahan left. Still plenty of powder in the keg. Add to that QB prone to slumps + a lame duck coach = a happy skins fan.

BTW Tiki being gone is also a plus as he kills us on the field.

[InTikiITrust]

Yep, the Giants should be THRILLED to finally have their only consistent offensive weapon out of the lineup.

Brandon Jacobs and his 134 career carries is much more formidable.

Teams will loving seeing the 6'4, 256 runningback coming out of the backfield and knowing the have to stop him at least 15 times a game. I'm sure 180 pound defensive backs are just licking their chops of having to tackle a guy 4-6 inches taller and 50 pounds heavier when he bumps it to the outside.

[D-Day]

Teams will loving seeing the 6'4, 256 runningback coming out of the backfield and knowing the have to stop him at least 15 times a game. I'm sure 180 pound defensive backs are just licking their chops of having to tackle a guy 4-6 inches taller and 50 pounds heavier when he bumps it to the outside.

You guys forget one important contributing factor to Brandon Jacobs success last year. Defenses were tired from chasing the fast elusive Tiki around. That won't happen this year as the giants have no change of pace back. Also there is a reason the big backs have bad knees after a couple season. Your height and weight doesn't matter when you have legs.

[InTikiITrust]

You guys forget one important contributing factor to Brandon Jacobs success last year. Defenses were tired from chasing the fast elusive Tiki around. That won't happen this year as the giants have no change of pace back. Also there is a reason the big backs have bad knees after a couple season. Your height and weight doesn't matter when you have legs.

So teams will love the beating of a bigger back? Yeah okay.

And the Giantd 3rd running back (Ahmad Bradshaw is who I believe it will be), will be the change of pace back. He's a shifty runner. Not great speed but he's similiar to Tiki Barber - let's his holes develop and a good cutback runner.

[D-Day]

So teams will love the beating of a bigger back? Yeah okay.

And the Giantd 3rd running back (Ahmad Bradshaw is who I believe it will be), will be the change of pace back. He's a shifty runner. Not great speed but he's similiar to Tiki Barber - let's his holes develop and a good cutback runner.

That means they can come in with the game plan for a bigger back, just ignoring the contributions that Tiki made to your offense won't make it go away. So you have Ahmad Bradshaw, good football name and all but who the **** is that. :laugh: We will see if he can find the hole before we crown him good enough to be an effective rotational runner.

Scouting report

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/rb/ahmadbradshaw.html

Strengths:

Very athletic...Was quite productive...Natural runner with top vision, instincts and patience...Has excellent hands and is a good receiver out of the backfield...Gets the most out of every carry...Decent strength...Has experience as a return man.

Weaknesses:

Size and bulk are just average...Has some character concerns...Lacks great timed speed, explosiveness and a burst...Won't run away from people...Racked up stats vs average competition...Sub par blocker...Not physical or tough...Limited upside.

Notes:

Was a walk-on at Marshall...Originally signed to play football at Virginia but never enrolled after he was arrested for underage alcohol possession and obstruction of justice...Was arrested again in 2006 for burglary and petit larceny...Not nearly the prospect his production would suggest...Profiles as more of a backup at the next level but his off-the-field troubles might very well cause him to go undrafted.

Going with the weaknesses listed here, sounds like he is the anti TIKI except for with the character issues.

[ArmchairRedskin]

Tiki accounted for over 2000 yards of offense in each of his last three seasons. I see maybe 1400 out of Jacobs/Droughns.

It's weird to see Giants fans throw this guy to the wolves now that he's gone despite the huge factor he played in their recent offensive success.

[bubba9497]

nothing like finger pointing to bring a team success

[Tulane Skins Fan]

The loss of Tiki is obviously going to hurt. However, does he not sound like a total jerk in this article? I'm not an AP lover still or anything, but how does Tiki get off saying that AP can't "assume" what Tiki's impact on the locker room was. Wasn't AP in that locker room?

[InTikiITrust]

That means they can come in with the game plan for a bigger back, just ignoring the contributions that Tiki made to your offense won't make it go away. So you have Ahmad Bradshaw, good football name and all but who the **** is that. :laugh: We will see if he can find the hole before we crown him good enough to be an effective rotational runner.

Scouting report

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/rb/ahmadbradshaw.html

Strengths:

Very athletic...Was quite productive...Natural runner with top vision, instincts and patience...Has excellent hands and is a good receiver out of the backfield...Gets the most out of every carry...Decent strength...Has experience as a return man.

Weaknesses:

Size and bulk are just average...Has some character concerns...Lacks great timed speed, explosiveness and a burst...Won't run away from people...Racked up stats vs average competition...Sub par blocker...Not physical or tough...Limited upside.

Notes:

Was a walk-on at Marshall...Originally signed to play football at Virginia but never enrolled after he was arrested for underage alcohol possession and obstruction of justice...Was arrested again in 2006 for burglary and petit larceny...Not nearly the prospect his production would suggest...Profiles as more of a backup at the next level but his off-the-field troubles might very well cause him to go undrafted.

Going with the weaknesses listed here, sounds like he is the anti TIKI except for with the character issues.

Tiki Barber didn't run away from people last year. Tiki Barber found success by cutting back and boucing off people. A lot of RBs faster than Barber but Barber was a smart run that waited for the hole, hit it, and could break tackles.

How many guys are great blockers coming out of college? How many RBs make an easy adjustment to picking up blitzs and blocking at the pro level? It takes time.

I also wouldn't say Tiki was extremely phsyical. He wasn't not Brandon Jacobs, Eddie George, or Jamaal Lewis.

Let's take a look at this one. I'll highlight some important parts..

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/2007/bradshaw_ahmad

Positives: Has good muscular development in the upper body, good chest thickness and tapered calves … Shows the stop-and-go agility, along with good vision, to change directions when the rush lane is clogged … Has patience waiting for blocks to develop and is a tough competitor that likes the physical aspect of the game … Works to fall forward and get extra yards, showing good body lean … Lacks blazing speed, but shows good initial quickness and balance to cut on a dime and head up field … Lets the play develop and is rare to see him out-run his blockers … Sees and feels the entire field and, while he might lack ideal size for the inside running game, he has the lower body strength and sharp cuts to gain valid yardage between the tackles … Has a quick short-area burst to reach the edge, but lacks the speed to out-run the defense … Shows a good burst through the holes to accelerate through those gaps (slasher-type runner) … Keeps defenders guessing and off-balance with his head fakes, loose hips and moves … Shows good ball security and distribution, running low to the ground … Effective receiver out of the backfield who catches the ball cleanly and outside the frame … Despite his size, he will not hesitate to face up as a blocker … While his speed tapers off going long distances, he still has that quick start to get up and through the holes … Tough to bring down on initial contact and shows the vision to find even the smallest of seams … Has the body control and adjustment skills to be an efficient weapon on screens, as he has a good feel for finding the soft spots on the field … Can also handle return duties in an emergency and also has experience on the coverage units … There are no false steps or need to gather before attacking the line, as he shows no hesitation in his running stride … The thing you notice on film is his toughness, as he knows how to lower his head, square his shoulders and drive through tacklers (tackled for losses only 20 times on 552 carries) … Has a good hand punch and wide base to anchor and face up to edge rushers, and shows alertness picking up the blitz to protect the pocket.

Negatives: Lacks explosion to win many foot races in the open … Does not have ideal bulk to absorb inside punishment, but compensates with good pad level running and lower body strength to break tackles … Has had two off-field issues that need further review and explanation … Not really a short-yardage runner, as he will get engulfed trying to push the pile … Good receiver, but lacks the second gear to elude after the catch and struggles some to get into his routes when lined wide (better when in the slot) … Was able to break tackles vs. a lower level of competition, but might not have the power to wear down a pro defense … Can make an initial tackler miss, but can't elude for long … Decent blocker vs. edge rushers, but will get instantly pushed back into the pocket when facing up to the bull rush.

Care to debate this scouting report?

[InTikiITrust]

One more.....

Former Giants' HB Tiki Barber on the belief that he was the center of locker room dissention: "It (the dissension in the locker room) came from other people, too. A lot of it (came) to me. But whatever. If they want to make me the excuse, that's fine by me."

[barens2]

anyone else find it ironic a guy whose handle is InTikiITrust

now keeps trying to throw Tiki under the bus :laugh:

I do actually. :doh:

[Hitman#21]

I do actually. :doh:

Yea he should definitley change his name, he hates tiki!:doh: :laugh: :laugh:

[InTikiITrust]

Yea he should definitley change his name, he hates tiki!:doh: :laugh: :laugh:

Tell me how to change it and I will.

[D-Day]

Tiki Barber didn't run away from people last year. Tiki Barber found success by cutting back and boucing off people. A lot of RBs faster than Barber but Barber was a smart run that waited for the hole, hit it, and could break tackles.

I guess you didn't watch the giants and skins games, he ran away from out guys plenty of times. Those traits you mention are invaluable for a RB, but yeah the Giants won't miss him. :doh:

How many guys are great blockers coming out of college? How many RBs make an easy adjustment to picking up blitzs and blocking at the pro level? It takes time.

Yes it does and since we are talking about this year then once again you are screwed THIS YEAR.

I also wouldn't say Tiki was extremely phsyical. He wasn't not Brandon Jacobs, Eddie George, or Jamaal Lewis.

I don't think I said he was, It has been a day or two but I don't think I said Tiki was physical.

Let's take a look at this one. I'll highlight some important parts..

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/2007/bradshaw_ahmad

Positives: Has good muscular development in the upper body, good chest thickness and tapered calves … Shows the stop-and-go agility, along with good vision, to change directions when the rush lane is clogged … Has patience waiting for blocks to develop and is a tough competitor that likes the physical aspect of the game … Works to fall forward and get extra yards, showing good body lean … Lacks blazing speed, but shows good initial quickness and balance to cut on a dime and head up field … Lets the play develop and is rare to see him out-run his blockers … Sees and feels the entire field and, while he might lack ideal size for the inside running game, he has the lower body strength and sharp cuts to gain valid yardage between the tackles … Has a quick short-area burst to reach the edge, but lacks the speed to out-run the defense … Shows a good burst through the holes to accelerate through those gaps (slasher-type runner) … Keeps defenders guessing and off-balance with his head fakes, loose hips and moves … Shows good ball security and distribution, running low to the ground … Effective receiver out of the backfield who catches the ball cleanly and outside the frame … Despite his size, he will not hesitate to face up as a blocker … While his speed tapers off going long distances, he still has that quick start to get up and through the holes … Tough to bring down on initial contact and shows the vision to find even the smallest of seams … Has the body control and adjustment skills to be an efficient weapon on screens, as he has a good feel for finding the soft spots on the field … Can also handle return duties in an emergency and also has experience on the coverage units … There are no false steps or need to gather before attacking the line, as he shows no hesitation in his running stride … The thing you notice on film is his toughness, as he knows how to lower his head, square his shoulders and drive through tacklers (tackled for losses only 20 times on 552 carries) … Has a good hand punch and wide base to anchor and face up to edge rushers, and shows alertness picking up the blitz to protect the pocket.

Negatives: Lacks explosion to win many foot races in the open … Does not have ideal bulk to absorb inside punishment, but compensates with good pad level running and lower body strength to break tackles … Has had two off-field issues that need further review and explanation … Not really a short-yardage runner, as he will get engulfed trying to push the pile … Good receiver, but lacks the second gear to elude after the catch and struggles some to get into his routes when lined wide (better when in the slot) … Was able to break tackles vs. a lower level of competition, but might not have the power to wear down a pro defense … Can make an initial tackler miss, but can't elude for long … Decent blocker vs. edge rushers, but will get instantly pushed back into the pocket when facing up to the bull rush.

Care to debate this scouting report?

Dude, I just put up the first scouting report I saw, great you have one that elaborates on the shorter more concise one I put up, obviously these guys saw different players or they are journalist who threw some crap togeather. Still doesn't deflect the telling part of the one I found.

Size and bulk are just average...Has some character concerns...Lacks great timed speed, explosiveness and a burst...Won't run away from people...Racked up stats vs average competition...Sub par blocker...Not physical or tough...Limited upside.

If the Giants nation is happy with dude as your frontline rotational back, then so am I, ecstatic actually. I said Tiki will be missed and you basically said he won't and offered up this rookie as a reason why, then you say certain aspects of Tiki's game will take time to learn. While I agree that goes against him being the answer this year.

You still totally dismiss Tiki's contribution to your team, don't worry you will be by week 4. Big backs don't last long in the NFL and they are not some new twist the giants have found to confuse the D. Most of the bruiser style backs have had that good scat back with them. The formula is simple, fast guy wears them out > big guy runs over them. You are now going to be missing the first half, Will it work, we shall see but damn dude you could try to take a little criticism of your team. We all have holes.

[Hitman#21]

Tell me how to change it and I will.

Theres a thread to request for a mod to change your name, just search for it and youll find it.

[CPortJGibbs89]

Tell me how to change it and I will.

Time to change it to InBrandonITrust....

[Hitman#21]

:laugh:

Time to change it to InBrandonITrust....

:laugh: :laugh:

I highly doubt he can take 15 plus carries a game without falling apart. Hes a goal line back at best. a poor mans Jerome Bettis.

[SonnyJ]

I find it amazing that anybody, with a straight face, can say that Barber's retirement is addition by subtraction for the Giants. This is the craziest idea yet. Barber was hardly some vet on his last legs, eking out yardage here and there. He was at the top of his game, routinely shredding teams. Without him, the Giants lose that last game in FedEx and you don't even have a quick playoff exit to talk about, instead a losing season after being 6-2 at the halfway point. This is the guy that made the whole offense go, yet somehow the team is going to be better for him leaving, because he was a locker room distraction?

What's wrong, Antonio? All the questions about Tiki distracted you from what you were supposed to be doing on the field?

I can't believe anyone is buying into this. He might have been a complete prick in the locker room, but his production far supercedes anything else.

[Hitman#21]

I find it amazing that anybody, with a straight face, can say that Barber's retirement is addition by subtraction for the Giants. This is the craziest idea yet. Barber was hardly some vet on his last legs, eking out yardage here and there. He was at the top of his game, routinely shredding teams. Without him, the Giants lose that last game in FedEx and you don't even have a quick playoff exit to talk about, instead a losing season after being 6-2 at the halfway point. This is the guy that made the whole offense go, yet somehow the team is going to be better for him leaving, because he was a locker room distraction?

What's wrong, Antonio? All the questions about Tiki distracted you from what you were supposed to be doing on the field?

I can't believe anyone is buying into this. He might have been a complete prick in the locker room, but his production far supercedes anything else.

His numbers speak for itself, as much as i hated him i respected him for what he can do on the playing field.

[pjfootballer]

Tiki down,

Plax, shockey, and Strahan left. Still plenty of powder in the keg. Add to that QB prone to slumps + a lame duck coach = a happy skins fan.

BTW Tiki being gone is also a plus as he kills us on the field.

With Tiki gone, you can almost give us a 2 TD advantage, because that was about how many he scored on us every game. I mean he single handedly beat us at Fed Ex in December. 234 yards and 3 scores. A...B....C ya!!

[pjfootballer]

Teams will loving seeing the 6'4, 256 runningback coming out of the backfield and knowing the have to stop him at least 15 times a game. I'm sure 180 pound defensive backs are just licking their chops of having to tackle a guy 4-6 inches taller and 50 pounds heavier when he bumps it to the outside.

I thought he was 270? Anyway, do you honestly think he'll get by the LB's and DL on every carry? He won't be facing CB's everytime he carries the ball.

[Riggo#44]

Yeah Tiki is the only problem:

According to sources on both sides, there are no current plans for the 35-year-old Michael Strahan to hold out in an effort to get an increase in his $4 million salary, despite months of rumors and reports. However, everyone acknowledges that Strahan is unhappy with his contract, not thrilled with the team's offseason activity, and is a wild card who on a whim could decide not to show up.