Redskins Lunch About to Discuss Briggs: 12:45

[Dana87]

I dont need you to give me excuses as to why he started to tank it at the end of the year. Gibbs saw his problems as well. Maybe not catching JCs first pass did something to him but i hope he comes back out with intensity next year.

Your wrong he never tanked it. Gibbs was upset because he let his emotions get the better of him. His attitude needed to be ajusted and Gibbs did that. But I'm telling you you can just about pick any game and I will show you how this guy was getting open and looking back at the QB's back because the ball was going somewhere else. As far as missing JC's first pass that is another bad rap he has been given. Ronde Barber striped Lloyds arm just as the ball arrived. Great play by a Pro Bowl CB not just a dropped pass by Lloyd. In that same game Lloyd was open twice on the sideline and the ball was over thrown. Lloyd went up and got both passes but had his legs taken out and lost the ball when he hit the ground. I tivo and watch games two to three times the week after so I remember the play instead of having to rely on someone in the media who barely watched the game tell me that Lloyd is a bust.

[TLusby]

....I will show you how this guy was getting open and looking back at the QB's back because the ball was going somewhere else. ..................I remember the play instead of having to rely on someone in the media who barely watched the game tell me that Lloyd is a bust.

I totally agree! Lloyd is open most of the time in almost every game that I watched. I also TIVO the games and rewatch them. It's especially nice to have during the offseason. I watched the Dallas at Washington game last night and Lloyd had about 40 yards and was consistantly open. He also had a 38 yard catch called back for holding on Fauria. Fauria was horrible in that game and was owned by Ware on two consecutive plays. Lloyd will be solid once the QB position is solid! Hell, Moss is solid and only had 55 catches for 790 yards (14.4 ypc). Lloyd had only 23 catches for 365 yards (15.9 ypc). Lloyd needs more opportunities and clearly has a great average at nearly 16 yards per catch.

[skinsn24]

Your wrong he never tanked it. Gibbs was upset because he let his emotions get the better of him. His attitude needed to be ajusted and Gibbs did that. But I'm telling you you can just about pick any game and I will show you how this guy was getting open and looking back at the QB's back because the ball was going somewhere else. As far as missing JC's first pass that is another bad rap he has been given. Ronde Barber striped Lloyds arm just as the ball arrived. Great play by a Pro Bowl CB not just a dropped pass by Lloyd. In that same game Lloyd was open twice on the sideline and the ball was over thrown. Lloyd went up and got both passes but had his legs taken out and lost the ball when he hit the ground. I tivo and watch games two to three times the week after so I remember the play instead of having to rely on someone in the media who barely watched the game tell me that Lloyd is a bust.

Dana, Breathe easy.

Now you can say whatever you want, you can make all the excuses in the world for Lloyd, but he was not getting the job done. I do agree there were some times when he was open and didnt get the ball.

However, there are many times where he appears open but is in zone coverage, and Lloyd as a problem sitting in a hole in a zone, he has had this problem for a long time. Also none of us know if the routes he runs are correct and what read he is on the play. Sure he can streak down the sidelines but if he is the 4th read, he is not going to get the ball.. I dont know what his routes are sussposed to be or what read he is on any particular play, but know who does?.....Joe Gibbs.

If Lloyd was constantly open, Gibbs would know this and would not have benched him. I dont really trust Joe with offseason moves, but when it comes to coaching, i am with him 100%. If he thinks a guy isnt getting it done, then he simply isnt getting it done.

[Dana87]

If Lloyd was constantly open, Gibbs would know this and would not have benched him. I dont really trust Joe with offseason moves, but when it comes to coaching, i am with him 100%. If he thinks a guy isnt getting it done, then he simply isnt getting it done.

To set the record straight he got benched for throwing his helmet in the Atlanta game. Your right we don't know if he was running the right routes but if that had been a problem we would have heard about it. I don't know where you're getting your info from but I have not seen him have any problems sitting down in a zone. Have you seen him have this problem? Because I haven't. I also understand that he might be the third or forth read, I am not assessing blame simple trying to help you understand that the rap Lloyd has gotten is unfair and unwarranted. I also know alot of people on this board that will be eating crow this year when he has solid #2 WR numbers (that is if they are man enough to admit they were wrong about him).

[ceviker]

To set the record straight he got benched for throwing his helmet in the Atlanta game. Your right we don't know if he was running the right routes but if that had been a problem we would have heard about it. I don't know where you're getting your info from but I have not seen him have any problems sitting down in a zone. Have you seen him have this problem? Because I haven't. I also understand that he might be the third or forth read, I am not assessing blame simple trying to help you understand that the rap Lloyd has gotten is unfair and unwarranted. I also know alot of people on this board that will be eating crow this year when he has solid #2 WR numbers (that is if they are man enough to admit they were wrong about him).

You are so wrong. When Brunell was in there, you are right, you don't know if it was Lloyd or Brunell. But when JC was in there, JC threw some BEAUTIFUL passes to Lloyd, only to have Lloyd drop them. Watching some of the games at FedEx, I saw Lloyd running half-assed and not overall not giving his 100% throughout the game ( Jags, Falcons, Eagles game, and @Dallas game were the games I went to).

So the criticism is fair and just. If he comes out and plays outstanding next year, I will praise him, but it still doesn't mean it wasn't his fault last year.

<sigh> And to think, I was soooooooooooooo excited when we traded for him.

[Mackdaddydean]

Get CJ or bust... I really think thats the best thing for the team. We have no possession receiver. If we get one the defense will take care of its self. Trust me.

[skinsman4u]

Even if this trade does fall through, it may add to the culture of resentment inside Redskins Park. Once again, they are trying to bring in outsiders with huge contract extensions instead of taking care of their own.

Sorry for using your sig, but your comment is so true. And I would say taking care of their players, also includes coaching. Hell, all we have to do is coach and put those hours in with good film study and look for it when you see it during the game make adjustments. They, the assistants, probably don’t see it. Either they aren’t seeing the crease or we aren’t executing. Sometimes you'll also see stuff during the game that you didn't game plan for so you run a set up play to see if what you see is true, come back during another series and it will still be there. Coaching in the NFL is like being a Doctor or Lawyer or something in the high technical field you have to work hard at it.

You have to set the conditions by putting people in the right place and understanding strengths and weaknesses. I remember when Sean Taylor was inactive during the Tampa game. Oh Tampa went right to work on Bowen. Boy they were working that safety. And then out in Seattle when we had Springs on the corner. Boy they tested Springs on a deep route down the sideline he came up way short and it was just a matter of time. Seattle's assistants, receivers and Hasslebeck must have waked up that morning with Springs on their mine.

Nothing against Springs, but if you go back and kind of just look at the Tampa game in 05 regular season and then look at the Seattle divisional game you can kind of see it. Maybe I'm wrong but just an observation. They were also working that play action in the Seattle game on the very first TD, too. But you can't let coaching be the result of your failure. We also need to establish an identity in the red zone. Right now we just kind of walk up and hope that the plays gonna work. Tampa was different, but Seattle we were out coached. But a lot went on with our safety play in the Tampa game that resurfaced in Seattle.

I mean its not like we're Indianapolis or someone. But why not? Our skill positions are just as good, if not better. Is Addai better than CP or even Betts? So why can't we punch in from the 20. Other teams don't have red zone problems. I think we're missing something up stairs either through coaching or not putting in good solid planning during game prep or can't make the right adjustment during the game. We should be averaging 21 points a game.

[Geoff_K]

Snyder is not making the personel decisions, nor is Vinny. The final personel decisions are being made by Gibbs

you make this appear to be a fact, where it is more an opinion. Unless you are sitting in the room when they discuss players (are you ? if so my apologies) then it is an opinion.

[skinsn24]

To set the record straight he got benched for throwing his helmet in the Atlanta game. Your right we don't know if he was running the right routes but if that had been a problem we would have heard about it. I don't know where you're getting your info from but I have not seen him have any problems sitting down in a zone. Have you seen him have this problem? Because I haven't. I also understand that he might be the third or forth read, I am not assessing blame simple trying to help you understand that the rap Lloyd has gotten is unfair and unwarranted. I also know alot of people on this board that will be eating crow this year when he has solid #2 WR numbers (that is if they are man enough to admit they were wrong about him).

Dana, I will be the first to admit, when we got Lloyd i was sooo excited. However, he was a major letdown. It made me look like a retard, all my friends all me out on it, but it is a fact.

I hope Lloyd turns it up next year and is money. If he is great, everyone will be happy, but that doesnt mean that the current critisism is wrong or unwarrented. He had a bad year so people critiize. If a company is in the red, people will critiize.

The fact that Llody didnt really get better when JC came in is very strange. Brunell, fine, he cant throw.

As for the sitting down in a zone, one of the major concerns with most people around the league in regards to Lloyd is he doesnt sit down in a zone. He is a side line receiver, who is willing to work the sidelines or deep routes, but doesnt love the middle of the field. This could be due to not wanting to take a hit but ill give him the benefit of the doubt on that one.

It is mainly due to his not so precise route running and inability to find a soft spot in a zone to sit down in.

Simply, if he was open as often as you think he was, Dont you think Coach Joe Gibbs would find a way to get him the ball?

[jimster]

The fact that Llody didnt really get better when JC came in is very strange. Brunell, fine, he cant throw.

I think (my opinion) is that Lloyd came into the season with huge expectations, along with a lot of players, and by the time Brunell was benched he had let his own frustration get into his head. You could see the way he carried himself later in the season was not the same as in the beggining of the year. - WR's are all about confidence and attitude, and we've seen over the years how tempermental they can be.

I'm looking forward to seeing him next season with a fresh start and having had a chance to work with Campbell in the off-season, working on timing, etc.

...as far as route running, I've re-watched the San Fran game from 2005 when Lloyd was still with the 9ers, and he can definately run many types of routes. He was their go-to guy.

[skinsn24]

I think (my opinion) is that Lloyd came into the season with huge expectations, along with a lot of players, and by the time Brunell was benched he had let his own frustration get into his head. You could see the way he carried himself later in the season was not the same as in the beggining of the year. - WR's are all about confidence and attitude, and we've seen over the years how tempermental they can be.

I'm looking forward to seeing him next season with a fresh start and having had a chance to work with Campbell in the off-season, working on timing, etc.

...as far as route running, I've re-watched the San Fran game from 2005 when Lloyd was still with the 9ers, and he can definately run many types of routes. He was their go-to guy.

Jimster i agree with you, he def looked different at the end of the year.

As far as the route running, yes he was the niners go to guy, and yes he can run different routes. I obviously was not trying to say he only runs this route or that one. I am saying that is one of his weaknesses. Most Gms around the league consider him an average 2 at best. He is known to make the spectactular catch, he isnt really known for 10 yard ins, or moves to the middle of the field. Simply put, i want him to do better and prove the critics wrong, however untill he does people will critiize him because of the draft picks and money.

[RWJ]

Another thing to think about is that Lloyd was in his 1st year with our team with a new OC. He very much has the ability to be a true No. 2 WR in the NFL. This upcoming year will tell whether or not he will shine. I say he will have a decent year with 40 receptions, between 800 and 1000 yards receiving and 6 TDs.

[skinsn24]

Another thing to think about is that Lloyd was in his 1st year with our team with a new OC. He very much has the ability to be a true No. 2 WR in the NFL. This upcoming year will tell whether or not he will shine. I say he will have a decent year with 40 receptions, between 800 and 1000 yards receiving and 6 TDs.

Not a bad prediction except 40 catches for 800 yards is 20 yards a pop. I would like to see him get around 60 balls, that is what he need to do.

[Dana87]

You are so wrong. When Brunell was in there, you are right, you don't know if it was Lloyd or Brunell. But when JC was in there, JC threw some BEAUTIFUL passes to Lloyd, only to have Lloyd drop them. Watching some of the games at FedEx, I saw Lloyd running half-assed and not overall not giving his 100% throughout the game ( Jags, Falcons, Eagles game, and @Dallas game were the games I went to).

So the criticism is fair and just. If he comes out and plays outstanding next year, I will praise him, but it still doesn't mean it wasn't his fault last year.

<sigh> And to think, I was soooooooooooooo excited when we traded for him.

I don't know what games you were watching but your memory isn't serving you very well because I was there for many of these games as well. And also watched them over again when I got home. I can remember 1 ball that Lloyd dropped that was not an acrobatic catch.