3rd down dumpoffs and Morale

[Riggins Seventy Chip]

When MB throws short on 3rd down over and over, it must affect the morale of the whole team. It shows that we have no confidence, and that we are just hoping to get lucky and break a tackle. It shows that we have no confidence in our ability to throw down the field. It shows that we have no confidence in the arm strength of the QB. Why wouldn't we go out with a fight, throwing the ball down the field and running at our opponent? I don't know if this is MB's or Al Saunders fault, but it's probably a bit of both. Anyways, it sucks, it's not Joe Gibbs football, and it gives us NO CHANCE to win. If we are going to lose, at least let us lose playing Joe Gibbs football.

[Raub]

You can't throw a 3 yd pass on 3rd and 8. It's simple math. Brunell must go.

[bulldog]

the truth is that the Redskins were trying to defend Manning with the same Cover 2 deep that the Skins have faced in recent weeks and Manning finished with 342 yards and 4 touchdowns...................

meanwhile the Redskins are NEVER able to exploit the middle of the field to get the ball to our tight end and slot receivers and never roll up any yardage against this scheme.

that's why it is all a crock.

this offense could be productive down the field if there was a triggerman with more pop and if Bugel could ever straighten out the pass blocking deficiencies of his unit.

[RedskinInExile]

You can't throw a 3 yd pass on 3rd and 8. It's simple math. Brunell must go.

Is it Brunell just checking out of all his downfield looks, or is it the play calling? Because if its the former, then Brunell is having a crisis of confidence, either in himself or his receivers and needs to go. But if its the latter, then what the hell did we bring Saunders in for? Bang's drunk cartoon monkey could call better plays than that.

[Darth Gibbs]

this is the stupidest strategy i've ever seen...they tried to play field position game with a team that scores from everywhere

[Stormy]

His willingness to perpetually concede possession of the ball on 3rd and medium/long is absolutely devastating on numerous levels. It negates our ability to make big plays and sustain drives, while simultaneously informing opposing defenses that they can continue to 'pin their ears back', stack the box, and keep everything underneath with impugnity, as there is no threat of being burned with the deep threat (or over the middle of the field). Likewise, it hurts the morale of the offense in a variety of ways (from the overall loss of aggressiveness, to the increasing lack of focus of the playmaker WRs - who know they are executing their routes in vain). By the same token, it saps the life out of our defense, which all too often has to spend too much time on the field, and has too short of a breather between their last series, and Brunell's concessionist 3-and-outs.

A case in point about Brunell's affinity to check down to the safety valve pass on 3rd and longs, was in evidence in a 4th quarter drive today. On his 4th consecutive series of throwing a 3 yard dump in a 3rd and 8+ situation, Troy Aikman commented that Brunnel MUST have opted for that knowing it was "4 down territory"... however, the cameras panned to show Brunell trotting off the field, before the coaches instructed him to get back in the huddle and go on 4th down. That is the defintion of a defeatist QB who simply doesn't have the ability or desire to take the chances necessary to lead a team to victories.

[MRMADD]

It's not just Brunell. The playcalling is weak, overly conservative, and inconsistent. The pass blocking is woefully pathetic. Chris Samuels and Jon Jansen are running on pure reputation now -- they look like revolving doors out there. Did you catch the play where Samuels was diving at the feet of a blitzing DB? Yeah, that's gonna work. The run blocking is a little better, but rarely pushed anybody around.

I understand the frustration by Moss, ARE, and Lloyd. They're open. Cooley should be even more frustrated -- he's proven how effective a weapon he can be, but he's not being used. And you simply don't have an excuse for only running the ball 22 times. Twelve carries for Portis? He was banged up, but only running him 12 times is a crime.

So blame Brunell if you want, but recognize that sticking Campbell in there isn't going to solve anything. It will get Campbell ready to play next year, and that's a good thing, but it isn't going to make this offense any better.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

It's not just Brunell. The playcalling is weak, overly conservative, and inconsistent. The pass blocking is woefully pathetic. Chris Samuels and Jon Jansen are running on pure reputation now -- they look like revolving doors out there. Did you catch the play where Samuels was diving at the feet of a blitzing DB? Yeah, that's gonna work. The run blocking is a little better, but rarely pushed anybody around.

I understand the frustration by Moss, ARE, and Lloyd. They're open. Cooley should be even more frustrated -- he's proven how effective a weapon he can be, but he's not being used. And you simply don't have an excuse for only running the ball 22 times. Twelve carries for Portis? He was banged up, but only running him 12 times is a crime.

So blame Brunell if you want, but recognize that sticking Campbell in there isn't going to solve anything. It will get Campbell ready to play next year, and that's a good thing, but it isn't going to make this offense any better.

You make some good points...however, there is no way the plays being called only have short routes...there are guys running down the field.

As for the blocking, it wasn't great today, but Brunell had opportunities to move within the pocket and make plays. There were only a couple times that he had no chance.

I think if there are several problems (as you imply and I agree with) you might as well make all your mistakes at one time. That's why I think it's time for Campbell. Let's let all our playmakers learn and grow within this offense at one time.

[Warhead36]

I don't think it's the playcalling. Sorry the Chiefs Offense was WAY too good the last few years for me to sit and think, "Geez why is Saunders being so conservative?"

And if he is, it's simply because he knows Brunell is a physical liability. But I think he's calling plays to call for deeper throws, Brunell just knows he can't make those throws anymore so he takes the safe play.

As far as the OL is concerned, yeah they were pretty bad today. But early on when the game was still close Samuels was doing well against Freeney. Once the Colts O exploded and they knew we had to pass, they pinned their ears back.

The thing about our OL is, we HAVE to run the ball for them to be effective. They're not like the Colts OL who can drop back and pass protect 35-40 times and be effective. Look at the Jags game. We ran it over and over again so when it came time to throw the ball, Brunell had years to throw. Same philosophy in last year's 5 game win streak.

But you can't commit to that type of power run game strategy if the Defense can't get you any stops. There is a root of the problem.....that and ultimately #8.

[Raub]

You can have all the ammo in the world....but if you don't have a gun that's capable or willing to shoot it...well....it's freakin worthless.

I'm done with Brunell. The guy needs to grab a clipboard and headset.

[LoudMouth12thMan]

You guys are football blind. I'd love to blame Brunell on this situation, but he had pressure in his face the entire game. He was forced to throw to his checkdown nearly every third down. If he holds on a second longer on most of those plays his ass is on the turf. Send your "Thank You" letters to Chris Samuels and the invisible O-line.

HTTR

[Raub]

So you're saying that Mark Brunell was forced to throw 3 yard passes on 3rd and long? Did you watch the game? The guy's ineffective at best. Stop making excuses for Jurassic Mark.

[skinpride1]

When MB throws short on 3rd down over and over, it must affect the morale of the whole team. It shows that we have no confidence, and that we are just hoping to get lucky and break a tackle. It shows that we have no confidence in our ability to throw down the field. It shows that we have no confidence in the arm strength of the QB. Why wouldn't we go out with a fight, throwing the ball down the field and running at our opponent? I don't know if this is MB's or Al Saunders fault, but it's probably a bit of both. Anyways, it sucks, it's not Joe Gibbs football, and it gives us NO CHANCE to win. If we are going to lose, at least let us lose playing Joe Gibbs football.

This dumb play calling is the reason we are 2-5 and we always seem to do it in the third quarter when we need to be taking the game over.I don't know if it's Mark or Al but if I was Gibbs someone would be on the hot seat for this!!!

[roanoker]

It's probably both. The way the O is playing it seems like it is both to me. MB and Als playcalling. :2cents:

[Capt Rich Fla]

the truth is that the Redskins were trying to defend Manning with the same Cover 2 deep that the Skins have faced in recent weeks and Manning finished with 342 yards and 4 touchdowns...................

meanwhile the Redskins are NEVER able to exploit the middle of the field to get the ball to our tight end and slot receivers and never roll up any yardage against this scheme.

that's why it is all a crock.

this offense could be productive down the field if there was a triggerman with more pop and if Bugel could ever straighten out the pass blocking deficiencies of his unit.

As stated in another thread. Brunell drops back so far that it gives the DE a virtual straight shot at him. This is why samuels looked so awful taday. When you slide block a de 10 yards back, there aint supposed to be a qb back there. It's called stepping up in the pocket. MB ssssuuuuuuuuccckkksss.

[diablo77]

:anon:

IT'S ALL ON BOONELL/ THE PLAYS DO HAVE DUMPOFFS BUT BOONELL IS SIMPLY JUST GOING TO THAT PATICULAR DUMBPOFF WITH OUT LOOKING 15 YARDS TO 20 YARDS DEEP/ OFF WITH HIS HEAD AND GET THE JC IN NOW/ THE WORST IS HAPPENING NOW WITH BOONEEL/ NOT SAYING THAT JC WILL TAKE US TO THE SB THIS YEAR/ BUT AT LEAST LET HIM MAKE THOSE MISTAKES TO LEARN/ LAST YEAR PATRICK STARTED AND BOONELL FELT IT/ PATRICK GOT BENCHED AND BOONELL PLAYED LIKE A VETEREN/

HAIL TO THE REDSKINS

CS

[Stormy]

As stated in another thread. Brunell drops back so far that it gives the DE a virtual straight shot at him. This is why samuels looked so awful taday. When you slide block a de 10 yards back, there aint supposed to be a qb back there. It's called stepping up in the pocket. MB ssssuuuuuuuuccckkksss.

Brunell suffers from both extremes of the spectrum in the pocket: Either he is getting rid of the ball too quickly, and off-balance, in his shoddy 3 step drops, or he's bungling his footwork on the deep drops in manners that lead him directly into the path of rush DEs pushing upfield. He literally sacked himself on two occasions tonight, by either rolling right into a defender, or by backpeddling into the rush pattern. His footwork is horrid, he's so gunshy that he throws off his back foot, and he refuses to step up into the pocket.

These mechanical problems, when added to the struggles of our OL, and opposing defense's knowledge that they can blitz without fear of him beating them deep... combine to shutdown our running game and negate the effectiveness of our underneath and screen patterns.

[HowBoutDemSkinsBaby]

My thing is we started off the game with Brunell completing decent 3 step drop passes and they worked. As the game went on, Brunell was taking 5 and 6 step drops and as mentioned that gave the speed rushers a chance to put pressure on Brunell as they were getting deep into the backfield. Yes Chris and Jansen played awful but speed rusher come off the edges so if your QB can take shorter drops and step up, that can help your protection a little. I dont blame Brunell for the O-lines bad play but I don feel Brunell thinks dumpoff as his first progression without even considering anything else way too much.