tr1 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Way to pick the least significant stat in an attempt to make a point. So you feel that a four year tally of a DE's tackles and sacks are no indication of the type of player he is??I know there's more to it than just numbers but you've got on your Skins' blinders if you can't see the similarities. This is such a dishonest thread. As bubba pointed out, you can compare any two players in the league and twist it to look any way you want. Consider Randy Moss in Oakland and TO with the pukes. Moss' TD production with Oakland was bad last year...should you expect the same with TO? Sorry, I don't like invald correlations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Way to pick the least significant stat in an attempt to make a point. So you feel that a four year tally of a DE's tackles and sacks are no indication of the type of player he is??I know there's more to it than just numbers but you've got on your Skins' blinders if you can't see the similarities. Nice way to totally avoid the debunking of your theory... there aren't any real similarities at all, again you can find two dozen DE's with similar numbers at the age in their career... some went on to greatness others out of the league...trying to assume what one player can do based on what another player didn't because of some similar numbers... is funny at best. again, you have no real comparisons... you ignore physical conditioning, you ignore type of defense played in, you ignore coaching, styles of play, quality of team around each.... type of attitude each posses, hell they are not even the same team. I mean one could could make a half assed comparison if Carter was playing for the same team and in the same defense with the same coaches... but even then it would be a stretch. your theory has too many holes to consider taking seriously Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jivelikenice Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 You can always find flops in free agency which makes this thread a waste of time....Give me info about style of play, work ethic, injury history, coaching, etc... and then make a comparion....stats aren't the whole story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truant Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Wiley's big problem was hit attitude and work-ethic. Find a correlation there and we'll talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgray88 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 San Diego didn't start playing the 3-4 until Wade Phillips got there in 2004. Wiley had already been cut. He was never a 3-4 LB for them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDave95 Posted August 25, 2006 Author Share Posted August 25, 2006 I'll back off the 3-4 comparison because I honestly don't remember. I'm sure that a 3-4 switch was blamed for Wiley's poor numbers but I don't remember any of the specifics. All of the talk was... "Now that Wiley's back at home in the 4-3, he's going to put up 12 sacks like he used to." That sounds similar to some of the Carter expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConcordNCSkinsFan Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Wiley's big problem was hit attitude and work-ethic. Find a correlation there and we'll talk. Have to agree with this. The big problem I saw with Wiley was he got a big head when he had his best season and got caught up in the "DAT DUDE" nonsense trying to be a part time DJ/Rapper or something. I hope if B Lloyd has a big year he doesn't get caught up in his rap persona too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Joe Hog Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 This thread makes no sense. He hasn't even played a game as a Redskin yet. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isifhan Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 "Now that Wiley's back at home in the 4-3, he's going to put up 12 sacks like he used to." That sounds similar to some of the Carter expectations. I think the Carter expectations are "now that he's back home as a DE in the 4-3 he should provide a much better pash rush than we are used to having and could potentially put up double digit sacks". I don't think anyone here is looking at him as the next Reggie White, but as long as he makes more than 47 tackels and has more than 1.5 sacks he'll be more productive from a statistical standpoint than Wynn last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDave95 Posted August 25, 2006 Author Share Posted August 25, 2006 This thread makes no sense. He hasn't even played a game as a Redskin yet. :doh: It's more about the unrealistically lofty expectations Cowboy fans had for Wiley. At their FA signings, there were plenty of similarities. Will Skins fans be equally disappointed with Carter's performance?? It sounds like they won't. Great coaching, excellent work ethic, and man, that 6% body fat. I don't think you guys have anything to be worried about... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldskool Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 It's more about the unrealistically lofty expectations Cowboy fans had for Wiley. At their FA signings, there were plenty of similarities. Will Skins fans be equally disappointed with Carter's performance??It sounds like they won't. Great coaching, excellent work ethic, and man, that 6% body fat. I don't think you guys have anything to be worried about... Again this guy hasnt even played a down in a Skins uniform, how are you or anyone else going to judge him? Our DE production for the last X number of years has been piss poor when it comes to applying pressure to the QB. If the guy can get back to his post injury status, along with the much better coaching staff and D line that we have here compared to SF, then it won't be a disapointment at all. Even if he doesn't, he still should be an upgrade from what we have right now. Now if you see differently in your crystal ball, please let me know. While you're scrying, let me know how the TO-Parcells issue ends up. I'll wait for your response so I can call Vegas :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mayor Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Another 'Boys fan that just has to come here and shoot off their mouth. It doesn't matter if his logic is flawed. They just have to talk trash. Comparing Wiley to Carter at this point is just unfounded speculation....to stir the pot. Don't go away mad, just go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 It's more about the unrealistically lofty expectations Cowboy fans had for Wiley. At their FA signings, there were plenty of similarities. Will Skins fans be equally disappointed with Carter's performance??It sounds like they won't. Great coaching, excellent work ethic, and man, that 6% body fat. I don't think you guys have anything to be worried about... no this thread was about trying to stir up skin fans with some shoty conclusions based on two guys age, weight, position, and no real comparisons past that. Smoke and mirrors may confuse poke fans, but you need to bring more to the table around here. Carter may or may not be a disappointment... but there is nothing tangible in your comparisons to Wiley to suggest it intelligently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Someone just brought up Marcellus Wiley as an example of a Cowboys' free agent signing bust. It got me wondering...Andre Carter - 6'4", 265 lb defensive end Marcellus Wiley - 6'4" 275 lb defensive end Sack totals for the 4 seasons prior to FA signing: Andre Carter: Marcellus Wiley: 5................ 3 2................ 6 7................13 13 ..............11 Tackle totals for the 4 seasons prior to FA signing: Andre Carter: Marcellus Wiley: 44............... 51 10............... 36 34............... 48 54............... 65 Forced fumbles for the 4 seasons prior to FA signing: Andre Carter: Marcellus Wiley: 0................ 2 1................ 1 1................ 5 3................ 3 Andre Carter is currently 27 years old. Marcellus Wiley was 28 when Dallas signed him. Andre Carter excelled in the 4-3 and his diminished stats were partially attributed to his team's switch to the 3-4. Marcellus Wiley excelled in the 4-3 and his diminished stats were partially attributed to his team's switch to the 3-4. Hmmmmm, makes you wonder... just because the Cowchips got burned with a POS, overhyped DE; doesn't mean that it is the case with us. How about you worry about your pansy-boy T.O. and stink, fat titts Tuna. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XxSpearheadxX Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Yeah what Bubba said. Andre is going to do well. His lack in production had as much to do with his spinal problems as the latter switch to LBer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Someone just brought up Marcellus Wiley as an example of a Cowboys' free agent signing bust. It got me wondering... ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmd24 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 I'll back off the 3-4 comparison because I honestly don't remember. I'm sure that a 3-4 switch was blamed for Wiley's poor numbers but I don't remember any of the specifics. All of the talk was... "Now that Wiley's back at home in the 4-3, he's going to put up 12 sacks like he used to." That sounds similar to some of the Carter expectations. It was that Wiley was switched to the strong side in the Chargers 4-3, so his run defense responsibilities were greater, and he claimed that was often chipped or double-teamed by the TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REEGSKINS Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 you need to worry about your own free agent pickups. the 10 million $ rental. sean taylor is gonna SMASH him. just like he did when TO was with the eagles. oh yeah and dont forget glen's alligator arms in that 35-7 drubbing. go troll on your own board , stop sweating us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Big Dave's comparison logic can be used on any subject like motor vehicles Corvette vs Ranger Both are American made Both are two door both are about the same length and weight both are 1988 both have headlights & taillights both have four wheels both have transmissions and engines both have windshields and back windows heck both are red so you can say using bigdave95 logic, that you can figure out the kind of performance you get from a Corvette, just by simply testing out a Ford Ranger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XxSpearheadxX Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 heck both are red :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 THA is like Lavar. He has to make things up and or exaggerate in order to argue counterpoints. It's that Arrington me against the world attitude. Jumbo and DD, one of closest friends happens to be a devoted 49'er fan and even before AC became a skin, he was never impressed with him relative to where he was drafted and what was expected of him. Even in his 12.5 sack year, many of them were "garbage sacks" according to him. Once again, going by his words as he watches every 49'er game and I don't. Sometimes new additions workout and sometimes they don't. I'm not slamming AC by any means. My comment was based on the opinions of many es posters who have high expectations for him. I definitely think this was an area of need for you guys and a reasonable attempt satisfy it. GW seems to get the most out of his players and he does add athleticism to the position. We'll see how he translates to the overall success of the defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 closest friends happens to be a devoted 49'er fan the mythical other team fan friend, who is an expert on judging players abilities I would like to meet this guy, because he sure is used a lot in these debates when someone doesn't have an real evidence to back up their claims... maybe he can settle these arguments once and for all :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terpfan Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 This thread is ridiculous. I think bubba's last post pretty much says what I was going to. How about we let him play a year before we call him a bust? BTW, the only sack numbers that matter for Carter are 7, 13, and 7, his totals the three years he was actually playing DE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEHEREAFTER Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 the mythical other team fan friend, who is an expert on judging players abilitiesI would like to meet this guy, because he sure is used a lot in these debates when someone doesn't have an real evidence to back up their claims... maybe he can settle these arguments once and for all :laugh: That's just it. I'm a fan. You're a fan and he's a fan. Most of the so called "experts" and "insiders" know just as much as we do. Bubba, it's just my :2cents:. I don't claim to know everything like you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4man5282 Posted August 25, 2006 Share Posted August 25, 2006 Big Dave's comparison logic can be used on any subjectlike motor vehicles Corvette vs Ranger Both are American made Both are two door both are about the same length and weight both are 1988 both have headlights & taillights both have four wheels both have transmissions and engines both have windshields and back windows heck both are red so you can say using bigdave95 logic, that you can figure out the kind of performance you get from a Corvette, just by simply testing out a Ford Ranger i can't tell the difference bubba :whoknows: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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