bulldog Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 Portis and Brunell Let Down by Offensive Line Clinton Portis’ 9 yards on 4 carries on Sunday was no more a reflection of his worth as a back than was Eric Dickerson’s negative yardage totals against the Redskins in the 1983 postseason 51-7 drubbing. In both cases the respective offensive lines were overwhelmed. Forget committing 8 players to stopping the run. The Giants were able to stop the run at times with as a few as 6 defenders close to the line of scrimmage. They simply won all the individual match-ups. Unfortunately for the Redskins the offensive line has a recent history of being outclassed by their opponents in the NFC East, at least where East clubs have presented themselves as respectable. Yes, Portis ran for good yardage in the Redskins 31-7 win against the Giants at the end of last season, but the Giants were not a good team, finishing 6-10. Against the Cowboys this season the Redskins failed to establish a running game OR protect the passer (until the final 3:40 of the game). Against the Eagles last season the Redskins similarly failed to get anything going on the ground. Pass protection was also an issue once again. People on the board can complain that Portis is overpaid and that he will never become Walter Payton or Emmitt Smith, but the fact remains until he gets the kind of blocking other top backs in the league get on a consistent basis week to week against the better clubs, we are never going to know exactly what Portis’ upside looks like. If you don’t believe me look at the numbers. Portis tallied 52 yards against Dallas and 9 against the Giants for an average of two yards a carry. In both games the team gave up 5 sacks. Brunell and Portis don’t automatically suffer football amnesia when East teams come on the schedule, but it sure appears as if the offensive line does. Physical football? Sorry but looking at the Giants front four there is only one established top level performer in Strahan and a high pick in Joseph that seems to have the skills to be a pro bowl player down the road. The other two spots are manned by average players. The Redskins offensive front was further aided in that regular linebackers Carlos Emmons and Barrett Green were down with injuries. Still it was clear from the first drive that the offensive line was not going to win the trench battle. A step slower and with seemingly no energy for this critical contest, you could tell it was going to be a long day for Mr. Brunell and Co. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCscorpio Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 Yes I felt that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskns21 Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 Great post. I wonder what the source of that trouble is? Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 I didn't see Dallas consistently getting pressure with their front 4. I saw them getting pressure with well-executed blitzes coming from all angles. The blitz, as a rule, isn't on the Oline to pick up. That is left to the TE/Rbacks... typically. But the Cowboys do this to everyone. Parcells is a master of drawing up the blitz, and never becoming predictable. As for the NY game, you are correct. Our Oline got slapped. But every aspect of our game SUCKED, not just our Oline. We've all seen this Oline play well on several occasions this year... especially against Denver and Seattle... two good blitzing teams. I'm not ready to write them off yet... and I think it is a mistake to use the Giants game as fodder for any argument, other than 'complete meltdowns happen' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rvan1 Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 the giants defensive front 4 looks pretty scary to me though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiefhogskin48 Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 I think you're underestimating the Giants' defensive line. They are actually quite talented, if not all household names. Their RDE in particular will be good for years to come. I think another factor we're largely neglecting is that it's impossible to match the level of passion of a team dedicating the game to the most important figure in the history of their franchise. That being said, the main thrust of your post is dead-on. The offensive line is underacheiving--- particularly in run-blocking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flexxskins Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 For some reason I found myself trying to find fault in your assessment, but I couldn't. You are very accurate and I hope that we can find a way to correct this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 I agree. The line never had a moment in which they looked good, and Brunell as a result never looked comfortable. This was why Portis couldn't run and why we couldn't even try to throw deep versus the Giants to Moss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoby6644 Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 I'm not ready to write them off yet either, but there does seem to be something lacking with the O-line. If you remember the KC game, Jared Allen had a monster game playing against what I would say is one of the best tackle tandems in the league. It just seems like they are not phyiscal enough. They did not really do a good job of getting push off the line and finishing the blocks. Not really sure if it is a technique, talent, or fatigue issue, but I hope they can get it resolved fast. :eaglesuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins11 Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 Yes, the dirtbags are playing like scumbags, allowing the Giants to dominate us, and allowing KC to sack us like a million times. Time for Bugel to prove his worth, in my opinion. He had the immense talent of the hogs to work with last time. Any chance we could bring in Hannifan too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 I think what we're seeing more than anything is NOT a lack of talent, or cohesiveness, or execution, or coaching... but a lack of consistency. That part, the Oline (and entire team for that matter) need to pick up. ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaudry Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 It seems to me that we get lineman here and they never get any better. Jansen and Samuels have only been marginally better since starting their rookie years. Thomas has gotten worse. Dockery may be the only exception, but he only turned from "bad" to "decent." Are these overrated players or is this below-average coaching? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbill Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 How's the problem get fixed? Rabach is clearly an upgrade over Raymer, and the return of Jansen was supossed to bring a nasty feel to the O-line. Unfortunately, it hasn't come to pass. I personally feel as if we pull way to often. I'd like to see these guys fire off the ball and drive the defenders back off the line. At the end of the day, I feel as if the talent is there, but the aggressiveness is lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted November 3, 2005 Share Posted November 3, 2005 Are these overrated players or is this below-average coaching? I'm going with overrated players. For some reason they don't have a nasty streak like the Bugel coached Hogs of yesteryear. Those guys were just mean and nasty. They punched teams in the mouth consistently. Maybe it is unfair to compare, but none of those guys were 1st rounders except May, and Jacoby was a walk-on:laugh: Maybe these guys need more time together, but the old Hogs listened to Bugel and bought into his tecniques. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard Washington Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 where's the link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom [Giants fan] Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Osi U. is and will be far better than average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackice7x Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 A running back is only as good as the offensive line. If there is a terrible offensive line then there will be a bad running back. If the offensive lines goes down so does the rest of the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenster95 Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 The Giants d-line is actually pretty damn good. Strahan is old but is still a premiere pass rusher. Umenyiora is one of the most underrated d-lineman in the NFL. And William Joseph is proving that his apparent status as a bust in previous years is now falling by the wayside. Having said that, our line should've played much better. It didn't, however, because we kept passing the damn ball. WHY?! When you do that, any d-line will be able to get to your QB since they don't have to respect the run. If we ran the ball more, we would've wore the Giants defense down and then set up play-action for the big pass. Instead of running first to set up the pass, we tried to pass to set up the rest of our offense. That didn't work because the Giants, terrified of giving up the big play, had a slew of people in coverage. When we kept trying to pass, pass, pass, no one was open and, even when the line gave Brunell time, he ended up going down on a coverage sack. If we gave Portis a healthy dose of the ball to begin the game, I think the game would've turn out a lot different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrg76 Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 I'm going with overrated players. For some reason they don't have a nasty streak like the Bugel coached Hogs of yesteryear. Those guys were just mean and nasty. They punched teams in the mouth consistently. Maybe it is unfair to compare, but none of those guys were 1st rounders except May, and Jacoby was a walk-on:laugh: Maybe these guys need more time together, but the old Hogs listened to Bugel and bought into his tecniques. I agree we have the most overrated line in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREDICTOR Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Great post.I wonder what the source of that trouble is? Why? The Skins offensive linemen are finesse oriented, and they have no attitude. They don't enter a game looking to run over people or push people around. They not only can't give anyone a bloody nose...they are afraid to get one. They won't run the ball consistently until they get a couple of guys on the offensive line who have attitude. Not trouble makers off the field, but "bad attitude" on the field. Riggins even had that "bad" attitude when the hogs were blocking for him. Jacoby enjoyed falling on people and crushing them. Mark Schlereth had that mentality of doing whatever it took to get the opponent out of the way. The offneisve line took pride in giving bloody noses...and after they punched someone....Riggins would come up and knock them down. It was a team effort...and the team was the offensive line AND Riggins. This group is just different. They haven't been drafting or signing guys with attitude. There is your problem in a nutshell. No drive or fire. Although I have to say Jansen could fit right in if we found 4 other guys like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redman Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Actually Randy Thomas has the same mean attitude, and Rabach is certainly acceptable as a center, if not better than that. The left side of our line is where I wonder about our attitude. Samuels has always struck me as a finesse blocker, and Dockery with his size should be murdering people but he doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DB44 Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 :applause: There have been some good posts, and they are too numerous to list them all. In a nutshell (and will admit now I would not have the "mabas" to say this to their face): We have a finesse OL. They seem to be soft pass blockers only. I rewatched the 49er game last night, and on quite a few occasions in 2nd and short, 3rd and short, our Oline went backwards. There just isn't any push going forward. The comparisons to the Hogs, in this thread are accurate. The hogs were tough guys who pounded people. Are our Olinemen not strong enough? Do they not weigh enough? Is it time to bring Tre Johnson back? People have said Jansen is the guy who can bring that nasty streak, and I love Jansen, but I think he maybe a little tentative from his injury last year. I don't know. At this point I wouldn't mind seeing our Oline get in a few fights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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