KDawg

People post the roll out thing every week and every week I tell them that’s not 4’s strength. Never sticks.

I don’t know, man. OL needs 3, maybe 4, new linemen.

Curl has been absolutely tremendous so far today.

He’s dressed.

When I say roster I mean the entirety of it. The defense is a good unit. The offense is not a good unit because of OL and QB.

This just in: our OL is horrendous

@Skinsinparadise I want to make something clear: while I think our roster is overall middling.. it’s good enough to beat anyone on any Sunday given a “good” day. Houston, however, has an absolutely abhorrent roster. Outside of Pierce I’m not sure they have any quality.

I turned on the game to see us get a pick six. You’re all welcome.

I like McCain about 75x more at nickel than free. And I liked him 0.5 at free so… that’s an improvement for sure.

Agreed here. Heinicke really can’t be QB1. Unless this team goes on a serious playoff run now… which I doubt. And even then it’s a tough sell. Retreads are tough. Especially retread free agents. The ownership change (if it happens) certainly helps on that front but new facilities haven’t been built and nothing has shown to be changed yet, so tough to get it before the owner is REALLY in place. Carr will have choices and maybe Washington is one but it’s more likely it’s not. And I sure don’t want to trade for him (and it’s not just Carr. Right now that’s my feel for any of the rumored possible options. I wouldn’t touch Kyler Murray with a 10ft pole if they moved on from him. Carr > Murray all day). If we’re going to use draft capital I move up for a Bryce Young. I’ve been on the trade up train for a QB, though. I wanted Fields. The tough part is Howell. You kind of have to see him somehow this year. If this team is in the playoff hunt he won’t be playing. If they aren’t… maybe? No guarantee it’s not Wentz even though that’s not what I would do. I like Carr as a player but his cost will hinder our ability to sign key pieces. Payne? Sweat? (I’d trade him asap but not many seem to agree there). Curl? Fuller is a decent starter but his cap cost is a hindrance and we will need to replace him if we cut him for cap. Theres too many questions for me to say “yup! Carr!” If somehow they shake the roster out to be in good shape prior to FA, we have the cash and have our guys we need I’d probably be more in line with the idea. Carr, with an overall decent roster and good weapons could be dangerous. But I want to see that before I get on the retread bandwagon. Seeing is believing.

Because 1) Heinicke is who he is. He wins games because the other players play harder because he’s a gamer and they respect him. He’s doesn’t play the position overall great but he’s a leader. Not a sustainable model for an entire season. 2) middling rosters can play great or poor on a week to week basis. We have experienced that over and over again. You listed the same things on D as I did, you’re just crowning them all faster than I am. In fact the only thing we disagree on is edge. I have no comment on Young and nor do I count him. He hasn’t played in over a year. There are plenty of development pieces that are coming along. But they aren’t there. I’m not commenting on potential. I’m counting on the here and now. You’re projecting the roster, which is good. It does project well. You’re discounting the cost of keeping all of these pieces, though.

I think our OL is abysmal. Still. DL is okay. Sweat is a close but no cigar guy most of the time. DTs are outstanding… both starters and depth. LB is okay. Davis is developing but there’s really nothing next to him. Including Holcomb. He’s a good NFL backup. Forrest and St-Juste are developing nicely. Fuller is not bad but not great. Curl is underrated and one of our high end guys. Offensively our TE room is still fairly suspect. Though I like Rogers. RB is good now that we have someone to take mileage off of Gibson. Gibson has been much more of a playmaker because of that. WR is solid for slots 1-3. 4-6 are inconsistent but most teams deal with that so overall good. QB is a below average spot. OL is poor. We are a middling roster that has some pieces but can also very easily lose some pieces if we don’t navigate the cap properly.

I think we have a very middling roster from top to bottom. 2-3 high end guys, 3 above average starters, 3-4 developing guys, 2-3 perfect fit niche guys, 30ish middling guys ranging from okay starter to okay backup and 5 or so guys it wouldn’t hurt at all to part with. I don’t think paying Derek Carr is going to help us make that better. We need to re-sign, sign, and draft guys. Carr limits our ability to do that, sort of like Wentz. Except he’s a better QB. Payne is a must sign. But everything is situational based, right? If we trade Sweat for extra draft assets in THIS draft, then I’d be more inclined to give Carr a contract. If we trade Sweat for next year assets I’d be all about rolling with Howell and developing our line and trading up next year for a QB. If we don’t trade Sweat… ya. Not sure what avenue to go.

Only viable options to me are Howell or a rookie. Spending big on another retread typically doesn’t pan out for us. Nothing against Carr’s ability. I think he’s a quality QB and much better than our current crop. Just seems to be a bad avenue for us. But I’m not against him.

What if I told you one of our other quarterbacks has a Wentz type arm? But wait… THERE’S MORE! He’s also got Heinicke mobility and, based on his season with the worst OL in college football last year he also has some serious moxie! But he’s not starting until next year, so…

This is a mixed bag for me. I like that these young men are compensated for their name and likeness. They should be for the amount of money they bring the university… but paying them more than a professional when they are technically amateurs is a bit much. And this makes program equity even harder to achieve. The rich will have high end programs and the not so rich will be mediocre at best. which we’ve kind of had anyways, but now it’s much more definitive. College is supposed to be amateur, but it’s not. I think I’d like it better if college football was split again. There’s D1, 2 and 3. I think there should be an additional level for the power 5 programs. Some of these schools literally CANNOT compete.

That’s one of the things you get with Heinicke. Guy doesn’t break mentally. He makes bad plays, bad passes, good passes, good plays, bad reads, good reads, good scrambles, bad scrambles… but that is how he plays all the time. No moment is too big or too small for him. He’s him. And that is an advantage. I like him on our team more than Wentz so far. So if we have to keep two QBs from this roster going into next season it’s an easy pick for me. I’ve never disliked Heinicke’s mentality and attitude. And he seems like a good dude. Still hope we upgrade QB (and I kind of hope that upgrade is Sam Howell)

Not surprised Wentz is superior statistically. Even the sacks are closer than they look if you add 100+ pass attempts to Heinicke’s numbers. But… it’s that immeasurable “play for/with him” factor for Heinicke. That’s the thing that isn’t measured and can’t be that props him up. It’s wild if you think about it.

Just got an alert from ESPN that the investigation into Snyder/Commanders by Congress will end in 2023. Without making it political, because my question has zero to do with that, can someone tell me what this means for him selling? That doesn’t ease the burden to sell, right? Just takes some heat off of him and the franchise from a federal law perspective?

If the plan was to run the ball and be a run first offense ala Tennessee (i think that's an okay plan but it's not all that sustainable unless you have the best bruiser in the NFL)... Then the OL needed to be a higher priority in the offseason. But the plan wasn't that. The plan was to get Wentz, protect him and spread the ball all over the field. But then that didn't work because our OL was absolutely horrendous and Wentz mobility is basically nonexistent at this point. (Which by the way, points to the fact that the OL should have been a higher priority as well). So now, Wentz is out, Heinicke is in. We can't spread the ball all over the field with him, but we have a guy who can move a bit in the pocket and manipulate it. We don't have a bruiser offensive line, so we're not built to run right now and we're not built to pass (Heinicke isn't a great passer, Wentz can't move enough with the OL). So the OL situation really screws us regardless. We need to get that shored up.

He wouldn’t be Bs’ing him. He’d know behind the scenes. But these guys play the media like fiddles on purpose.

Human element.

I mean he can’t name Wentz the starter. The entire fanbase (all 45 of us) would wonder what the hell he’s doing. This is posturing so Wentz feels important and valued.

We can argue stats and all that stuff all day but… Heinicke crushing Busch Lites on the flight home makes him my hero.

I disagree with you. I think Allen and Payne are close to that level. Allen moreso. And that's about it at the moment. What may come down the pipe with guys like Curl, Forrest, Davis, Young, McLaurin, Dotson remains to be seen. We are a roster that would be good with a QB and an OL. But their "overall ratings" sink this roster from good/average to below par.