Thiebear Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Its only fair: Try and be specific Try and research it a little before you throw it out there. Try NOT to mention Kerry if at all possible. I have an issue with the Immigration grant. I have an issue with the prosecution / checking into the leaks on intellegent sources. It should be quick and painful. I have an issue with how quiet we are on the SUDAN. And to be fair: I have an issue with him running a campaign when he should have been in the air guard: Yes, i know it was allowed but it still is stupid... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsfan1966 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 He hasnt done anything about illegel immigration. He overplayed the WMD thing (though he didnt lie, I think everyone at the time though Iraq had WMD) He hasnt pressed the UN to deal with this oil for food thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 I'll start with the most important and work down. 1- The Prescription drugs for seniors plan. Why does someones age entitle them to something more than me? Why cant I have a gas subsidy? Certainly a gas subsidy would improve my business (by lowering an expense) and therefor help the economy. The Pres Drug plan is nothing but a sell out to the gimmegimmegimme generation. The worst part is that the only alternative was the Dems saying "Even More!" 2- Not going after Islmic fundamentalist hard enough. We should shutting down Mosques and Immams (sp?) instead of constantly walking on eggshells. We should be going hard after Iran, Terrostine, Sudan. 3- 15 billion for Aids in Africa. As long as 1 person in the US needs treatment for any disease, that money should stay here. I dont mind helping other nations, but not at the expense of our own sick. 4- Immigration. Our borders are a sieve. And he is completely unwilling to do a thing about it. That's a start. There's alot of Social Issue stuff as well, but they arent that important to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Good Thread. I agree in the whole fairness thing! Kind of goes along with the "mile in their shoes" thread from the weekend that I started. here goes: 1. Immigration policy is lacking in security concerns. 2. Some weak stances on N. Korea, Iran and the Sudan 3. Never came right out and said "I f'ed up on WMD due to bad intel" Needs to pony up and say he screwed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted August 9, 2004 Author Share Posted August 9, 2004 See perscription drug plan above.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoyler23 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 ~ I don't want the President to have ultraconservative, 'Born again' or 'Fundamentalist' Christian views. His beliefs are to conservative, especially after he ran on the 'compassionate conservative, uniter not divider' theme...bleh ~ Bush hates Gays. see:Ultraconservative ~Most of his cabinet are unelectable henchmen: See: Ashcroft, Rumsfeld. I'll let the 'WMD' issue slide. I believe the Saddam would have become a threat sooner than later anyway. ~The Patriot act. Sure, democrats approved it with patriotic splender, but that thing is some kind of MONSTER now. The abuses that the Bush presidency has taken is just as Constitutionally menacing as when Clinton had the 'line-item veto' I just don't like the man as a person or President. In a time of turmoil, economic depression and potentially false terror reports, Bush has taken more days off than any other President! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Can you please show us some proof that Bush "hates gays". This should be fun. Oh, and can any of us decide that a certain religion be banned from serving as president? How about a certain ethnic group? Or gender? The irony is that you condemn him without proof for hating gays, while at the same time practice your own type of bias and discrimination against him. And for the record, Both Rumsfeld and Ashcroft have held elected office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Originally posted by BDBuddy23 ~ I don't want the President to be a 'Born again' or 'Fundamentalist' Christian. His beliefs are to conservative, especially after he ran on the 'compassionate conservative, uniter not divider' theme...bleh ~ Bush hates Gays. see:Ultraconservative ~Most of his cabinet are unelectable henchmen: See: Ashcroft, Rumsfeld. I'll let the 'WMD' issue slide. I believe the Saddam would have become a threat sooner than later anyway. ~The Patriot act. Sure, democrats approved it with patriotic splender, but that thing is some kind of MONSTER now. The abuses that the Bush presidency has taken is just as Constitutionally menacing as when Clinton had the 'line-item veto' I just don't like the man as a person or President. In a time of turmoil, economic depression and potentially false terror reports, Bush has taken more days off than any other President! I see cut and paste from DNC talking points is still working. all heresay, talk and conjecture. No substance nor proof. I do support your right to your opinion though. Just wish you had something more meaty to base it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoyler23 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 well, it's a fact that Bush has taken the most days off. It's a fact that he's a fundamentalist Christian. As for him hating gays, well, that's an opinion. He did however try and get a CONSTITUTIONAL Amendment to ban gay unions. Not a bill, not just a law, or an act..an AMENDMENT. I know that many conservatives were up in arms becuase gay people were getting married due to ambiguity in the law. Bush also protected the 'sodomy'(which applied to gay and straight people) laws in Texas which were repealled after he left office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Why I dislike Bush.... Hmmmm...a million and one things........ --Always seems to pass the buck, he never seems to take responsibility for his actions and places the blame somewhere else..... --His administration has been spending money like drunken democrats ---I can't stand hearing him speak because he sounds like a moron...this in turn affects our standing in the world community because they don't respect the man what so ever --He has surrounded himself with big business interests and seems to follow their every advice --there are numerous other problems but then if I gave them all it would just sound like an anti-Bush rant which I don't want.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 A problem I have with Bush is he keeps saying we are actively fighting the war on terrorism in Iraq, yet he eliminates combat pay for those serving there. I guess they are in a war with no combat. His administration has determined that people who are hit by mortar fire or bombs are not counted amongst the wounded (IE there have been over 23,000 medical evacuations and people who have gone through the CASF at Andrews Air Force base for treatment, but the DOD only lists 6,000 plus injuries). Finally, he cuts vets benefits by 30%. He budgets in for half the ammount of manpower and doesn't provide monies for sufficient materials (armor, water, medicine, etc.) according to his own generals (Mc Peak and Franks). I am not sure how he is actually the war president. He certainly does as little for the troops as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Okay BD, again. If it is a FACT that he's taken the most days off. Please provide us 1- PROOF, and 2- Why this is relevant. And again, why does the fact that he's a Christian eliminate him in your mind. You're nothing but a bigot. Of course that's just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman56 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 I'm still waiting for him to capture Osama, "dead or alive." There is no reason why Bin Laden should still be alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 And Im still waiting for the left to point out where he said it would happen this fast. Or to simply acknowldge that he said it would take a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 The economy is pretty chitty right now,and he responds by giving taxcuts tothe rich people. yeah, that'll work. There are many issues which he has flip flopped on.most notably, the compassionate conservative issue and the gay marriage issue. THese are things he has totally contradicted what he said when he was originally running for president. He said F the UN. Now if I were a college kid and I saw this, I would probably say man he's got some balls. He said I'm doin this no matter what u think. But I'm not a college kid and I realize how stupid that was. Just because the congress says "we understand that America may have to go to war" doesn't mean that "America Must Go To War" as Bush made it seem. Remember Bin Laden, the guy who was behing 9/11. Why didn't we ever go after him? I mean sure, there 'may have been' connections between Hussein and Bin Laden, but why isn'y Bin Laden the main issue here? If we put the money towards going after Bin Laden that we did towards going after Saddam, we wouldn't be having this code orange thing every other week cause we could stop Al Keda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SkinsHokie Fan Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 I'll bite because there are some things I clearly do not like about Bush 1) Domestic spending. It is fricking riddiculous from No Child Left Behind, to Farm Subsidies to the Prescription Drug Bill 2) Lack of Press Conferences. I believe this is real important in order to maintain the bully pulpit and to allow you to define yourself and your agenda rather then those that oppose you 3) Calling the Patriot Act the Patriot Act. I know it sounds riddiculous but it was clear what the political motives were with it right after 9/11. I do believe in parts of the Patriot Act such as info sharing while others philosophically scare me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoyler23 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Originally posted by Kilmer17 And again, why does the fact that he's a Christian eliminate him in your mind. You're nothing but a bigot. Of course that's just my opinion. Being a fundamentalist or Born-again Christian doesn't eliminate him in my mind. It just shows how out of step he is with the general population. The notion of a president believeing in things such as creationism in 2004 is insane! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnyderShrugged Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Originally posted by BDBuddy23 Being a fundamentalist or Born-again Christian doesn't eliminate him in my mind. It just shows how out of step he is with the general population. The notion of a president believeing in things such as creationism in 2004 is insane! Is he a Christian or a fundamentalist christian? There is a difference. I don't think he should be considered "fundamentalist" It's just a tag the opposition lkike to throw around with no substantiation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Well now we KNOW you're a bigot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SkinsHokie Fan Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Believing in creationism insane? I guess I better check into the assylum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbear Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Ashcroft was voted out of office Kilmer. I believe that was the point behind putting unelectable officials in high places. It's not like he quit. My biggest hatred is that he embodies the worst of religous influence on government. At every stance, he sides with whatever the religous right presses him for. Under his administration, condums don't help prevent STDs. Gays are unequal to heterosexuals before the law (which way did his administration file a friend of the court when homosexuals were arrested for sodomy even though no heterosexual had ever been arrested for sodomy in the state?), constitutional ammendment against gay marriage/unions, creationism, school prayer, assisted suicide ect . Name a religous issue, and show me where he hasn't supported the Christian Right. Now I may even agree on some issues, but tell me/show any flexibility on his part on these issues? Second: His administraion is secretive. I intensely disliked the decision to not even admit who was in the energy meetings. I disliked the writing, and subsequent enforcement of the Patriot Act where by a citizen may be monitored and there is no judicial process for fighting it. Take ISP providers. IF the justice department says give me all your records, the ISP provider may not even go to a lawyer to see if they have to do so. To talk with anyone about the issue is illegal. THe purpose, if there is no lawyer, there is no legal recourse to challenge. That ties into my third complaint: an adminstration that tries to limit legal recourses. The example above is just one. All of the detainees held with legal status, charges, or legal recourse was the administraions policy until the Supreme court ruled a few weeks ago. I have an inherent distrust of n administration that takes such liberties with executive power and then goes to such great lengths to put itself above the law (see also drafting of how far abuses could go legally where it said we would not have ot be held to geneva convention). Finally, I hate that he has no regard for the long term impact of federal debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoyler23 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 UH-OH, Kilmer, looks like gbear (who made a similiar point) is a bigot too! So I will rephrase. It's not that I have a problem with religion, or any religious belief. If you want to worship a TREE, then go for it. I really don't care. But I dissapprove with a President who leans THAT far in with the religious right. Not becuase I oppose his religion, just that I oppose his views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 See gbear, this is where I find your argument disengenuous. You admit to hating the right wing, then use the Patriot Act to substantiate it. Completely ignoring the number of leftwingers who voted for it and the number of rightwingers who opposed it. What's worse? Agreeing with something and continuing to do so when it becomes unpopular? Or voting for it and changing your mind when the political winds change? And the point about Ahscroft and Rumsfeld was that both held office. ergo, the WERE electable. The fact that a left wing court stole an election from Ashcroft later (and his noble stance not to fight it) doesnt diminish that fact, it simply refudiates the assertion that they were "unelectable" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 That's wholly different from what you said originally BD. And those are valid reasons to dislike him. His religion, however, is not. That's the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoyler23 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Originally posted by Kilmer17 That's wholly different from what you said originally BD. And those are valid reasons to dislike him. His religion, however, is not. That's the point. ah, what I wrote is different than what I meant. It's been changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.