Art Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Well, it's just too bad we aren't providing enough money to schools and all. I mean, the budget crunch is so dire, we can leave money unspent until we make a threat to take it back. This is what liberals do people. They pretend they don't have enough while not even utilizing the full amount they do have so we continue to foot higher bills for less meaningful items. http://www.cnn.com/2004/EDUCATION/06/29/school.money.ap/index.html Schools must use $2 billion or lose it Tuesday, June 29, 2004 Posted: 11:02 AM EDT (1502 GMT) WASHINGTON (AP) -- States are getting a reminder from the federal government: Quickly make plans to spend more than $2 billion in education money, or be ready to lose it. The Education Department has found that all the states, the District of Columbia and eight territories have high cash balances left from 2002, including money meant for poor children, disabled students and limited-English learners. That money must be obligated -- not spent, but at least legally earmarked toward a specific expense -- by September 30, which is 27 months after it was released to states. States then have two final years to spend the money. Ultimately, school money not committed or spent returns to the federal treasury, as happened with $155 million last year. The department's move comes as an election-year fight grows over whether states and schools have enough money to do what's demanded of them under new federal law. House Republicans announced Monday that states have $16.8 billion in unspent school money dating from the former Clinton administration, a figure that the Education Department confirmed but state school officials called misleading without context about how school financing works. GOP leaders are expanding an argument made this year by the department, the White House and congressional Republicans, that schools are flush with federal money. It's meant to counter the claim that President Bush, who championed a law demanding greater improvement in all schools, has not come close to keeping his promise to pay for changes the law demands. "We've literally flooded the system with cash, and it's time to start focusing on improving student achievement instead," said Rep. John Boehner, R-Ohio, chairman of the House Education and the Workforce Committee. The Education Department has issued letters to chief state school officers, reminding them of what appeared to be substantial cash balances with just three months before the September deadline. Meeting obligations More than $2.1 billion is unspent from 2002, or about 8 percent of the money allocated for five broad areas, including special education and adult education. The department's letters to states identified only those cash balances that seemed particularly high. Todd Jones, a department budget official, acknowledged Monday that the agency does not know how much of that money already has been obligated. He said it makes sense that some cash is not yet committed, such as money for summer reading expenses that have yet to occur. Still, Jones said, the department issued its reminder to ensure that states don't miss their chances to use the money. It's part of a broader effort this year to help states account for all the federal money available and to draw it down more quickly. "The states are telling us that they're not seeing this as a red flag at all," Jordan Cross, lobbyist for the Council of Chief State School Officers, said after leaders there reviewed the numbers with budget and top education executives from at least 10 states Monday. "They expect, by September, that almost all of that money will be obligated." Patty Sullivan, the council's deputy executive director, added: "To the department's credit, they gave us a heads-up on this. I don't think this is a `gotcha' activity. I think they really are trying to help." Still, Sullivan said, the implication that states "have a closet full of money," is misleading. Her group plans to publish a document that explains school financing for the public, knowing the issue will come up again. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Copyright 2004 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 In its last audit, the Dept. of Ed had billions of dollars it couldn't even account for - and W responded by vastly increasing its budget :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenmdixon Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Art Well, it's just too bad we aren't providing enough money to schools and all. I mean, the budget crunch is so dire, we can leave money unspent until we make a threat to take it back. This is what liberals do people. They pretend they don't have enough while not even utilizing the full amount they do have so we continue to foot higher bills for less meaningful items. ... The department's move comes as an election-year fight grows over whether states and schools have enough money to do what's demanded of them under new federal law. House Republicans announced Monday that states have $16.8 billion in unspent school money dating from the former Clinton administration, a figure that the Education Department confirmed but state school officials called misleading without context about how school financing works. GOP leaders are expanding an argument made this year by the department, the White House and congressional Republicans, that schools are flush with federal money. It's meant to counter the claim that President Bush, who championed a law demanding greater improvement in all schools, has not come close to keeping his promise to pay for changes the law demands. Uh, how is this just the liberals' fault, again? I didn't realize that the Department of Education - heck, the entire government, was just chock full of liberals and no conservatives are working there now or ever. Also seems to me that the budget got passed by a largely Republican Senate and House, right? So the conservatives OK'd the funding, or didn't they? (Whether or not they actually read it is another issue.) Isn't this also the school districts' problem since historically many are seemingly unable to budget and spend money where it is needed the most? For instance, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if the DC school system had money sitting somewhere unclaimed. Would it surprise any of you? Hard to account for things if you don't know who is taking care of what (hello, who is acting as the school superintendent today??). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJWatson3 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 give that money to my sister's school disrict in Baltimore. they would love to have adequate supplies, and she would love to have to stop spending for that stuff out of her own pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 I'm shocked the liberal media would report this obvious political move without showing the schools side of it. Anyone want to make a bet that when the promised report on how school financing works is released CNN doesn't carry it anywhere near their front page? Anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2004 Author Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by jenmdixon Uh, how is this just the liberals' fault, again? I didn't realize that the Department of Education - heck, the entire government, was just chock full of liberals and no conservatives are working there now or ever. Also seems to me that the budget got passed by a largely Republican Senate and House, right? So the conservatives OK'd the funding, or didn't they? (Whether or not they actually read it is another issue.) Isn't this also the school districts' problem since historically many are seemingly unable to budget and spend money where it is needed the most? For instance, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if the DC school system had money sitting somewhere unclaimed. Would it surprise any of you? Hard to account for things if you don't know who is taking care of what (hello, who is acting as the school superintendent today??). Jen, You didn't realize the Department of Education and heck, the entire government was chock full of liberals? Well, um, now you are I suppose. As for funding of schools, that was not directly what I was referring to in this thread, though, you can rest comfortably in the knowledge that I don't like any federal money being spent on state schools. Specifically, what I found amusing was the outcry from school districts that they don't have enough money when they are sitting on very large sums of money and not spending it. It is a fairly typical action by the liberals in charge of school districts nationwide to pretend they lack funding, taking away things that are important to parents to extort more funding, while adding to the bloat and waste inherent in the system. Yet, we continue to fund this nonsense despite billions wasted. That is a tragic symptom of my dear conservatives who are in control of the purse strings at this point. But, that's another rant that's different than this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckydevil Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 I didn't realize that the Department of Education - heck, the entire government, was just chock full of liberals and no conservatives are working there now or ever. How many liberals do you know that want to get rid of the Department of Education? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJWatson3 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 are most school districts sitting on Billions of dollars? art, you make it sound like this is the norm.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by luckydevil How many liberals do you know that want to get rid of the Department of Education? Thank god that their aren't many. Most Americans don't want 3rd world education systems in the United states. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2004 Author Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Destino I'm shocked the liberal media would report this obvious political move without showing the schools side of it. Anyone want to make a bet that when the promised report on how school financing works is released CNN doesn't carry it anywhere near their front page? Anyone? I'm not sure an article on how school financing works would be on the front page of any newspaper because the mechanisms that drive the bureaucratic mess aren't really news. News is when vast sums of money remain unspent and unallocated whether on a national or local level for years, while the people not spending that money complain they don't have enough money. But, that's not a conspiracy issue. Even the liberal media can't put out a sympathic article in defense of the bureaucracy as produced by a bureaucrat. What the liberal media can, do, however, is continue to write stories about a lack of funding without mentioning the billions that are sitting there unspent. A story you'll see a least two dozen times between now and the election while this article will perhaps be cited twice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2004 Author Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by AJWatson3 are most school districts sitting on Billions of dollars? art, you make it sound like this is the norm.... It is the norm that school districts have incredible sums of money to service the increasing bloat rather than the students. It is not always the case that they are dumb enough to leave millions and billions unspent though while complaining about a lack of funding. These are just cases that highlight their dishonesty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2004 Author Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Destino Thank god that their aren't many. Most Americans don't want 3rd world education systems in the United states. Well, considering the Department of Education can't be said to have actually changed how effectively students are educated -- and many suggest things have gotten worse since its inception -- most Americans probably wouldn't support this wasted federal spending if they understood just how inconsequential it is. But, fortunately, liberals will scream and wave flags about it as if this were the key force to preventing us from having a third world school system. As per the norm, when logic, reason and facts fail, a liberal goes to slogans intended to frighten the masses and capture the imagination of the dullest among us to retain support for the waste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckydevil Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Thank god that their aren't many. Most Americans don't want 3rd world education systems in the United states Now if you would only realize that the problem with the third world is beaurocracy, corporatism, and a lack of economic freedom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeorama Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Well, I for one can vouch that this particular system is the exception rather than the rule... Please, send some of that money over to my school district. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius J. Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Hmmm. I don't really know how much I like the department of education. After all, what do they do? Art, I think the misleading part about the article is that the federal government has earmarked this money for certain programs. School renovations are some of the most needed projects, hows that coming a long? How about funding for general school supplies? This article never mentions all five of the earmarked sections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by luckydevil Now if you would only realize that the problem with the third world is beaurocracy, corporatism, and a lack of economic freedom. And you think uneducated people are equipped to recognize and combat these problems? You think it's an accident the schools are kept bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codeorama Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 In our school district, the NEWEST school was made in the early 70's... we have 2 schools that are over 85 years old. We also have 4 over crowded high school, yet year after year, there is not enough money to replace schools. The cost of upkeep of our schools is a huge topic each year as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJWatson3 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by codeorama Well, I for one can vouch that this particular system is the exception rather than the rule... Please, send some of that money over to my school district. i am sure that a vast majority of people who work in the school systems would agree with you code. i talk to someone everyday who doesn't have billions of dollars laying around for her district. but they've got plenty of broken windows, no air conditioning, no playground and a hell of a lot of other problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted June 30, 2004 Author Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by AJWatson3 i am sure that a vast majority of people who work in the school systems would agree with you code. i talk to someone everyday who doesn't have billions of dollars laying around for her district. but they've got plenty of broken windows, no air conditioning, no playground and a hell of a lot of other problems. A.J. You tell me the school district and I'll find the public financing of schools for that area, and you'll sit there dumbfounded at what's happening. You may be right that there are broken windows, air conditioning, no playground and other problems. That's precisely what liberals in charge do. You can bet that with those problems -- those most forward facing to convince the public for more money -- wouldn't exist if schools wouldn't have bloated administrative positions in every district in the country that have cropped up over the years that do very little overall and nothing to help the children or the community. And that doesn't even touch on some in-school employees who are highly unnecessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brown 43 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Art, I agree! In my Town, there are 20 assistant Supervisors for my school district! A little much! Art, is your political website ready yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Art Well, considering the Department of Education can't be said to have actually changed how effectively students are educated -- and many suggest things have gotten worse since its inception -- most Americans probably wouldn't support this wasted federal spending if they understood just how inconsequential it is. But, fortunately, liberals will scream and wave flags about it as if this were the key force to preventing us from having a third world school system. the Dept. of Education was created to grant America access to data which allowed the government to ensure that all americans were being educated properly. Because it seems that dispite your whining certain areas weren't getting the attention they should. But yeah Art it's not important to make sure the poor or certain races don't get shafted, what matters is your hatred for liberals, that's far more important. If you really gave a damn about government waste you'd be up in arms over what our defense contractors get away with and how much the dept. of defense wastes. But forget logic you'd rather bash liberals. Originally posted by Art As per the norm, when logic, reason and facts fail, a liberal goes to slogans intended to frighten the masses and capture the imagination of the dullest among us to retain support for the waste. Like "They hate our freedom" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Punani2 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Not to get off the subject here but it isn't only the Dept of Education that does this. It's the whole friggin federal government. I remember when I was in the Air Force we had the exact same thing going on. My Group and Squadron was over funded and we either had to use the funds or lose them. Also, if you didn't use the funds the next year you would prob be under funded in the next budget. What happened was Commanders would buy luxury items and worthless crap we didn't really need so they wouldn't face cuts in the next budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJWatson3 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 i can't tell you the district, because my sister is working right now (summer job with the orioles). i know the elementary school is in baltimore city and is near bolton hill. that's the most i can do. and JPunani, the government and the military is the most disgusting example of this practice... is you don't spend the money how can you justify needing a budget increase. it is the same reason my dad got passed over for promotion after being named district engineer of the year for completing projects under budget and ahead of schedule. it's a sad way to make enemies, by doing your job well. thank god for the private sector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius J. Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Art, I think I agree with you to some extent on this topic. THE biggest problem facing the cshool system is not a lack fonding near as much as a lack of real acountability at any level. Nothing in the entire school system is merit based. Not Pay, not the retainment of employees during cuts. Nothing. It's really bad. The teachers unions must be taken to task for what they have done to our public school system. Principals must be given the power to hire and fire people who are and are not up to par. If we could give principals more power I would feel a lot better about holding them responsible for failing schools. However, this does not change the fact that this article appears to be a bit intelectually dishonest because the money is not money that the schools can use to fund whatever needs funding. It is earmarked, and that is almost always wasteful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius J. Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Destino Like "They hate our freedom" I was thinking "SAY NO TO DRUGS," but yeah, both sides have a nice slice of that pie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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