no westbrook, please

[Awesome]

ok, its all been said before: he's never had a good qb, he has been injured, he hasn't been given enough opportunites...yada, yada, yada. B.S. now for the past seven years i have been as big a proponent of westy as anyone, always standing up for him when others told me he sucked. he is fast and big. but that is it. they guy disappears in big games, his hands are suspect and he runs crappy routes. now, i would hate to see him go somewhere else and become a probowler, it is possible. but it is not worth giving him a starting spot and shelling out more money for him. gardner is here to stay, at least for now, and they are too similar, though i think gardner will be the better player when its said and done. we need a burner who runs solid timing routes across from gardner, the consumate possesion guy. then, i say go with either lockett, if he's still here, or one of the second year guys, scaggs or mccants, for our third guy. but that's just my opinion

[inmate running the asylum]

I would keep Westbrook only if he signs a minimum contract plus incentives, like he did last year.<br />But i would not guarantee him a starting position. I would sign Jacques Green as the #3 or #4 receiver, cut Lockett and save $1 Mil, and sign Germane Crowell. Let Crowell and Westbrook fight it out for the other starting WR position, and the loser becomes the #3 or #4 receiver. Then we have depth if one gets hurt. McCants and Skaggs are good prospects but probably need another year.<br /> <br /> <small>[ February 17, 2002, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: inmate running the asylum ]</small>

[OrangeSkin]

I'm not sure what you mean about his hands. He seems to have excellent hands, as far as I can see. He disappeared during games because nobody ever threw him the ball and he was injured half the time. When he wasn't catching, he was blocking.

[PCS]

What you said Orange, (it's getting late, what can I say. Time for another) Everybody drops 'em every now and then. <br /><br />Hey Om, isn't this 4038 Westbrook threads now?

[baralufficus]

Everybody says he runs crappy routes , but when Grahm(whatever) was in the game ...Westbrook looked solid to me , with 12 catches in the Denver game ....<br /><br />so all this tells me is ........IF YOU PASS HIM THE DAM BALL, HE'LL CATCH MOST OF THE BALLS THROWN HIS WAY .....<br /><br />beleive me ....plz don't judge Westbrook by what he did last year, alot of the balls were thrown to other receivers , when they were thrown his way .....he caught 75% of those balls

[bulldog]

Westbrook would have made more plays in 2001 if the Redskins had a better quarterback and more coherent system, that is definitely true. And he would have made more BIG plays down the field, as that is his game.<br /><br />BUT, it is a mistake to look at Westbrook and see a 'hang your hat on him' #1 receiver.<br /><br />In case anyone has noticed, even when the team had decent quarterbacking with our old buddy Brad Johnson in 1999, Westbrook was shut down by Deion Sanders in two meetings with Dallas and by Troy Vincent of the Eagles.<br /><br />He is a guy with physical talent that is adept at taking advantage of an opponents #2 or #3 corner. Remember how well he did against Dave Thomas of the Giants?<br /><br />So, I would be in favor of keeping Westbrook IF he comes at the right price AND the team remains committed to bringing in another player slotted to be the #1 receiver.<br /><br />That might make Westbrook the #3 at some point. <br /><br />I honestly don't think his ego could handle that. <br /><br />In fairness to him, he DOESN'T have hands of stone! And comparing him to a stiff like Jacquez Green is ridiculous. Green has not proven in 3 or 4 seasons that he can even get off the line of scrimmage against #2 and #3 corners......................<br /><br />What he has is adequate hands to be an effective receiver in the NFL. He will never make catches with hands of glue like a Ricky Proehl or Tim Brown. <br /><br />But that doesn't mean he can't be productive. Isaac Bruce doesn't have as good a pair of hands as Proehl either. <img border="0" title="" alt="[big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> <br /><br />when all is said and done I expect Spurrier will go out and acquire new players for the offense when the opportunity presents itself.<br /><br />Westbrook was the pick of the old regime and he is not beholden to him. It is the same situation with Lockett if he is not selected by the Texans. I don't expect either to be back.<br /><br />Alexander right now is 50/50 to me. <br /><br />If I had to wager the only players I would put money down on right now for 2002 are Jansen, Samuels, Davis and Gardner. Probably Bryan Johnson as well who has shown some ability as a secondary receiver.<br /><br />That's about it. The others including Westbrook, Alexander, Raymer, Szott, etc....are all question marks at this point.<br /><br />You also have to factor in that Lewis is going to have some changes to make on defense as well, although not as many.

[redskinsfan71]

I think Michael showed last season when Graham was in at QB that he can be a target and go to guy, for some reason when Banks was in, he seemly looked for Gardner at all times, Michael was our leading receiver though, I think Michael will never live up to the hype coming out of college, but I also think he is a good receiver and 1 we need to resign, (I think that he wants to stay here in DC and play for us) under Spurriers offensive scheme, sign him as cheap as we can, and see what happens, (I think he's just as good if not better than any FA receiver out there this season) <br /> <img src="http://www.webskins.org/gold/players/westbrookm/capt_redskins_steelers.jpg" alt="" /> <br /><br />"I WANT TO STAY A REDSKIN"

[ace33]

I believe you have to resign him and if we dont and he goes to another team we will see the reprocussions.<br /><br />If at the least he gives us experience at the position.<br /><br />I can just see him going to philly and them lighten' us up with thrash and westbrook.<br /><br />Do you want that?<br /><br />Besides I would have to agree with the fact that he hasn't had a good QB throwing him the ball.<br /><br />Actually he hasn't had mediocre QB throwing him the ball except maybe Graham.<br /><br />...and what did he do?<br /><br />He made a differece.<br />Listen to this guy,he has every right to wanna leave!!!!!!!!!but,still wants to stay.<br /><br />That should tell us if anything that he is loyal.<br />and thats a very good thing to have.<br /><br />Specially when you consider all that money going around the league.<br /><br />I vote for keeping him!

[CT_Scott]

Aren't you guys the least bit curious as to what Westbrook can do in Spurrier's offense? <br /><br />If he brings in a decent QB I'd love to see Westbrook in the Fun n Gun.<br /><br />We have too many other glaring needs at this point.. if we don't sign Westbrook you can add threatening receiver to the list.<br /><br />SS will do everything he can to keep him in a Redskin's uniform.

[NavyDave]

Sign Westy to an incentive laden contract Waive bye bye to Lockett and upgrade Skagss.<br /><br />Cromwell is coming back after being out with a season ending injury which normally takes a year to recover from. <br /><br />We have 4 (if we keep westy) big 6.2 to 6'3 Receivers with good speed that if coupled with a fairly accurate QB can be very effective

[redskinsfan71]

the main reason to resign Michael is the x factor, he wants to stay here and play for us!, and I think he finally has gotten his head on straight now!!!!(he's grown up and matured)<br /> <img src="http://www.webskins.org/gold/players/westbrookm/westbr_12069.jpg" alt="" />

[Rat_Boy]

As long as he can stay healthy and make plays like:<br /><br /> <img src="http://personal.atl.bellsouth.net/atl/g/_/g_lafoon/westbrook.jpg" alt="" /> <br /><br />I am all for him staying at a decent price.

[Dr. D]

Only reason Westbrook caught crap in the Denver game is THE COVERAGE guys.<br /><br />they were playing waaaay off. Thanks to several injuries to the DB's of Denver, they were in dire straights.<br /><br />Don't look to that happening again anytime soon.<br /><br />Westbrook can't beat coverage period. (well maybe in practice)<br /><br />WESTY can take his attitude somewhere else.

[PCS]

Whoa, another Westbrook thread with both sides represented (doesn't seem to be any grey area here). Dr.D Wow. Never not once beating coverage in a game? Hey, you still hungover from the other day? <img border="0" title="" alt="[big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

[PennState11]

The bottom line is Michael Westbrook is an overpaid headcase who ever since the incident with Stephen Davis has been a cancer in the locker room.

[JonBlaze]

Keep Westy!

[OrangeSkin]

Nathan - A cancer in the locker room? Where do you get that from? Sure he beat the hell out of Stephen, but that was seven years ago. As far as I know Michael is a well-liked by his teammates and handled himself very well last year when he wasn't getting the touches that he should have. We'll once again look like idiots if he goes on to be successful with another team.

[Brave]

I'm as tired of Westbrook's endless reasons for not performing as the next guy, but the simple fact is we may need him. He probably won't command a prohibitively large contract and if he WANTS to stay for a reasonable amount we'd be stupid to cut him loose. If anyone will know how to use the guy, Spurrier will. And he does not have bad hands.<br /><br />One last point. To call Gardner "the consumate possession guy" ... where does THAT come from? Hey, I like the guy and I think he'll be a fine WR for us, but Gardner had more than his share of drops in his rookie season. The term "possession guy" does infer that he possesses of ball ... something Gardner had trouble with at times. He has a lot of potential, but if he was the "consumate" anything last year, it was the consumate rookie.

[indyskinsfan]

Let's see here. Westbrook hasn't been given the thumbs down by Spurrier, like he has Lockett, and some others. He has given Banks an invite to the mini-camp. Same for Graham. He hasn't told Mendes, let him know we don't intend to sign him. Spurrier will wait until March 1 and see who is a FA and the pros and cons.<br /><br />I feel if he gives Banks AND Graham an opportunity to let HIM see how they look, he will do the same for Westbrook. There may have already been a conversation, asking him to stick around so he can see how he'll fit and asked him would he give Spurrier a chance along with Mendes and Snyder to give him a contract that both can go with for at least a couple of seasons.<br /><br />Personally, I feel a re-work of his contract from last year, will do Westbrook, just fine. Yes he wants to stay and yes he was often blocking downfield, when I thought he was disappearing or he simply was shadowed by a cover corner. Yes he was open a lot and was not thrown to, because Banks excuse was he was on the run (more like happy feet), and yes most of the time, it was Lockett, that Raye was slyly trying to get the ball, but he was hopeless a lot in getting open, thus Banks ate the ball on other occassions, because when Lockett's or Gardner's number was called, he'd stay with them too long. This combo didn't justify what Spurrier probably saw on tape. That if Banks was a decent "timing" passer, Westbrook may have had the ball. Thus in order to say it up close and personal like, Banks will be allowed to show up and have Spurrier break it to him that he holds his looks too long and he is indecisive in the pocket. This allows corners to close on open receivers.<br /><br />Westbrook WILL be in mini-camp.

[Gamebreaker]

Actually, the reason why Westbrook had his ONE GOOD GAME last season aganist Denver was because Jimmy Raye finally adjusted to what the defense was doing.<br /><br />Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE, even the announcers, were begging the Skins to start hitting Denver will quick slants and screens since all they were doing was blitzing up the middle. Even sorry Kent Graham could look good when it took Rhodes forever to realize he needed to change the defense.<br /><br />By the way, Westbrook going to Philly doesn't bother me. McNabb isn't that great passer, and I doubt Westy could light up Champ or Smoot. Let those two play man aganist him and watch Westbrook choke in yet another big game.

[PCS]

You know, many a receiver has benefited from the coaches making adjustments in order to take advantage of something the other team is doing. Even Raye did it. It still takes (and I know I'm stating the obvious here) the players on the field to execute that adjustment,(throw and catch). Perhaps Raye did make in adjustment, maybe he didn't. Maybe Kent Graham saw something on the sidlines and brought it with him off the sidlenes.<br /><br />Maybe Michael made adjustments in his route running to ensure he would get open. Maybe a little of all the above. Do we know this? I can't say everyone, but when one really thinks about it, how many times did we hear announcers wondering why M.W. was not being thrown at? I heard several times myself. Just out of curiosity, how does one define a "big game" and how many have the Redskins had since M.W. has been here. Indy, couldn't agree with you more. Whew! It's time. <img border="0" alt="[pint]" title="" src="graemlins/pint.gif" />

[Fitz]

Nathan, the Davis incident has been rehashed any number of times. The instigator (and the real locker room cancer) was Leslie Shepherd, who despised Westbrook and tried to turn as many teammates against him as possible. Davis was an impressionable young guy and he allowed Shepherd to fill his head with a load of s*** about Westbrook; Robiskie himself said "if you would have heard what Stephen called Michael, you would have punched him too." The two have long since buried the hatchet, and I doubt that anyone else on the team still carries any grudge against Mike.<br /><br />When I look at Westbrook, I see a guy who took a long time to mature and who has had a lot of bad luck, first with injuries and then with some questionable coaching decisions on how to use him. He's big, strong and fast and has demonstrated that when he's healthy and has competent people around him, he has all the skills to play the position. True, he has not been able to translate those skills into being a consistent performer on field, but if anyone can use him to his full potential, it's Spurrier. If we can sign him to a decent contract, keep him.

[Terry]

I think Westbrook will be one of the first guys we lose in free agency. My guess is that he's already gone.<br /><br />Look for him to follow Norv or Robo.

[baralufficus]

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Gamebreaker:<br /><strong>Actually, the reason why Westbrook had his ONE GOOD GAME last season aganist Denver was because Jimmy Raye finally adjusted to what the defense was doing.<br /><br />Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE, even the announcers, were begging the Skins to start hitting Denver will quick slants and screens since all they were doing was blitzing up the middle. Even sorry Kent Graham could look good when it took Rhodes forever to realize he needed to change the defense.<br /><br />By the way, Westbrook going to Philly doesn't bother me. McNabb isn't that great passer, and I doubt Westy could light up Champ or Smoot. Let those two play man aganist him and watch Westbrook choke in yet another big game.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">i bet you felt the same way about Thrash too huh ....and another thing is , i remember the anouncers in every other game discussing why Banks never threw the ball to Westbrook...Never ...i remember at least 5 different games when the announcers were befuddled at why Marty was not calling Westbrook's number .....<br /><br />i am convinced that if Westbrook leaves , he will become a Pro Bowler somewhere else ....<br /><br />we have to at least give him a shot with Spurriers offence ..

[Riggo-toni]

Terry, <br />You're probably right when you say Westy is most likely already gone, but I can guarantee he won't go anywhere near Norv. Those 2 didn't mince words when Turner was ousted. Definitely no lovefest there!!!