Thinking Skins Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Like it or not, we're trading the #5 pick in the draft. I know people are crying about how much we need a safety or a DE for Williams's defense, but I just can see us keeping this pick. Not gonna happen. Danny likes sure things. He doesn't mind overpaying for a guy, as long as he's getting results. U think he wants to go through another Westbrook/Schuler/Lang experience? This guy wants some results this year. We dont need to spend that kind of money on possible potential. Right now I see us getting pretty close to the salary cap for this year. So we may not trade it for a pick or player this year. Instead, I can see us getting some picks for next year so that we have a stronger option to go after the restricted free agents. Snyder hit a goldmine when he started to go after Restricted free agents. I mean look at it. These are players who have already performed in this league, so there is no question of whether or not they can compete. But also, these are guys that their team doesn't want to negotiate with because they're going after other unrestricted free agents. So Snyder gets a chance to treat these guys like royalty and make them feel all special. They're still young and have many more years left in them. The only problem is that we overpay for them, but that depends on who you ask. We've done a nice job of structuring the deals nicely so that it doesn't kill our cap, but also so that the other teams dont want to or cant match. So here's my pick. Either we trade down and give this pick to the Dolphins for their DE, or we just simply trade for more picks next year. Can you envision the days when the Redskins have zero draft picks on draft day? I can, and you'd better get used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 If Danny is such a fan of "sure things" why did he ever sign Deion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by blakman211 I can see us getting some picks for next year so that we have a stronger option to go after the restricted free agents. So here's my pick. Either we trade down and give this pick to the Dolphins for their DE, or we just simply trade for more picks next year. Going after restricted free agents was a one year shot in the dark thing, which even the Skins FO acknowledged it will not happen again. It wont work again, at least not as successful as last year, as evidenced by the Rams recent contract match for Jerametrious Butler. Other teams are protecting their players by tendering HIGHER minimums which require greater compensation. Signing the Dolphins DE requires a 1st and 3rd round pick compensation, and we don't have a 3rd round pick. So there is no way that can happen at present, unless we traded a 2nd round pick in 2005, to acquire a 3rd round pick in 2004. Thats too heavy a price to pay. Cerrato said that the Skins would not have even gone after Coles last year, if the compensation had been a 1st and 3rd round pick. The Skins may trade down their #5 pick, but they won't trade it away. This year's draft is just an aberration. Gibbs needed another quality QB and saw a chance to get a premier RB, so he agreed to give up his 2nd and 3rd round draft pick. Next year though we will have our full compliment of draft picks to use, which are a cheaper source of labor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 agree with inmate. nextyear we fill remaining gaps and add depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. D Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 look at the current composition of the roster: heavy on the TE/"h" back position (royal, chamberlin, sellers, Rock, Johnson, ware, flem, rasby) and light on the safety position(iffy, bowen) also notice our lack of pursuit of the available free agent safeties.. It is also said that Williams requires a very fast rangy free safety to work his defense correctly. ahem, this pick has Sean Taylor written all over it. Now the real wild card will be what if he is taken earlier than the 5th pick? then the pick will be KW2. if BOTh of those guys are gone then its definitely a trade down (or draft Gallery if he is there) scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kappaluvacee Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 I think Taylor is the guy at number five, or matbe we trade down around 10 and get Udeze if taylor is gone. I don't see KWII at all. TE is a featured blocker under Gibbs. We won't burn a 5 pick for a featured blocker even thought he kid has great skill and potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. S Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 i know it coulda just been something Gibbs said to silence the media/rumors, but he said we are keeping our 5th pick. I am thinking it will be Taylor, Gibbs has probably been following his college career ever since he became coach and has liked whe hes seen, i bet same as Snyder. We right now have 2 real weaknesses, safety and d-line, and I think they are going to take Taylor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbob74 Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 The Redskins may well still trade down, but I don't think they will do it for picks next year. They will only trade down if they get a great offer. You do not trade down for the sake of it. If teams above don't offer us something that really benifits us we are better using the pick. I'm sure that Gibbs and the FO have plans for both situations (using the pick and trading down) but it is unlikely we will know if they trade down until we are actually on the board and teams above us know who is left. If we stay where we are we'll take Winslow or Taylor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timdaley73 Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by blakman211 "Danny likes sure things. He doesn't mind overpaying for a guy, as long as he's getting results. ... This guy wants some results this year. We dont need to spend that kind of money on possible potential. oxyMORON... So, because Danny wants to to get results this year, he's going to trade the 5th overall pick to get lower picks which are "sure things"?? I think with the 5th pick overall, you have sure things in Sean Taylor or KW2!! oxyMORON!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsNation Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by blakman211 Like it or not, we're trading the #5 pick in the draft. I know people are crying about how much we need a safety or a DE for Williams's defense, but I just can see us keeping this pick. Not gonna happen. Danny likes sure things. He doesn't mind overpaying for a guy, as long as he's getting results. U think he wants to go through another Westbrook/Schuler/Lang experience? This guy wants some results this year. We dont need to spend that kind of money on possible potential. Right now I see us getting pretty close to the salary cap for this year. So we may not trade it for a pick or player this year. Instead, I can see us getting some picks for next year so that we have a stronger option to go after the restricted free agents. Snyder hit a goldmine when he started to go after Restricted free agents. I mean look at it. These are players who have already performed in this league, so there is no question of whether or not they can compete. But also, these are guys that their team doesn't want to negotiate with because they're going after other unrestricted free agents. So Snyder gets a chance to treat these guys like royalty and make them feel all special. They're still young and have many more years left in them. The only problem is that we overpay for them, but that depends on who you ask. We've done a nice job of structuring the deals nicely so that it doesn't kill our cap, but also so that the other teams dont want to or cant match. So here's my pick. Either we trade down and give this pick to the Dolphins for their DE, or we just simply trade for more picks next year. Can you envision the days when the Redskins have zero draft picks on draft day? I can, and you'd better get used to it. The draft pix you mentioned, yeah they didnt pan out but you forgot to mention the ones that did - Lavar/Champ/Samuels/Smoot and Gardner has been more consistent than Westbrook ever was... These have been guys taken more recently than the ones mentioned earlier and by a different personnel director. These guys give Dan Snyder positive reinforcement that drafting w/the #5 pick can work out. As far as the salary cap...rookies have their own cap. They do not effect the salary cap this year. Rookie contracts are structured as to where you are drafted eg. the higher the choice the more expensive, but they are not factored into the cap in their 1st year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonsofwashington Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by panel If Danny is such a fan of "sure things" why did he ever sign Deion? Because back then, as an owner, Danny was still wearing diapers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Trade down and add a DE and some others. It's cheaper and the added cheap labor will help us keep the team together. If we sign a #5 we are one step closer to a rebuilding project. We have Lavar, Smoot, Springs, Brunell, Ramsey, Portis, Coles, and an entire O-line of talent....we can't afford any more big money players if we hope to keep a team together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonnyJ Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 RedskinNation, Rookies DO count against the cap. There is a rookie pool that is determined by the NFL that a team can't exceed, but it still counts against the overall cap. That's about all I can intelligently say about it. Destino, some of those guys you mentioned aren't big money players (at least, not yet). Smoot, Brunell, and Ramsey are pretty cheap currently. Could you be specific as to WHY adding the #5 pick would blow the team up soon? There have been numerous posts over the last few days explaining how the team can keep its players (for the most part), as long as it is successful. Certainly, you can anticipate that some will fall by the wayside over time, but that isn't the same as blowing the team up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Glory Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 There is little doubt that we are going to trade down. The question is weather we trade down once,and draft Udeze or trade down twice and draft Will Smith. I think because of cap reasons,we will trade down once and draft Udeze. Picking up a second round pick in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Danny likes sure things In that case the sure thing to do is take the best player in the draft--Taylor! Trading down for a couple of possible good players makes no sence under your argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrfriedm Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 I really have a hard time believing that we will do anything with our 5th overall pick but use it on Sean Taylor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Glory Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by Storm In that case the sure thing to do is take the best player in the draft--Taylor! Trading down for a couple of possible good players makes no sence under your argument. Taylor is no sure thing. Just like Ryan Leaf was a sure thing?? Or Tony Mandarich was a sure thing?? There is no sure thing in this draft inspite of what anybody says. So we might as well draft for our most dire needs and that's DE and/or DT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funkyalligator Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 If we can trade down and pick up a safety in the second round and a DT/DE in the first...I will be quite happy....and then get a DT/DE in the 5th..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troy Fakeman Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Sean Taylor, it is a lock.........LOCK..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Williams Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by blakman211 Like it or not, we're trading the #5 pick in the draft. I know people are crying about how much we need a safety but I just can see us keeping this pick. ?!?!?!?:insane: How many FS's came to camp so far...ok then obviously either one of the following is true: A: bowen has pro bowl playmaking ability he's not showing or B: Gibbs the potential of Taylor and williams is in his ear ___________- Gibbs never has had a GREAT FS and see's a chance to get one now. He knows there are no GREAT DLmen this draft. NEXT year maybe......This years man is taylor:tongue: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted March 15, 2004 Author Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by inmate running the asylum Going after restricted free agents was a one year shot in the dark thing, which even the Skins FO acknowledged it will not happen again. It wont work again, at least not as successful as last year, as evidenced by the Rams recent contract match for Jerametrious Butler. Other teams are protecting their players by tendering HIGHER minimums which require greater compensation. Signing the Dolphins DE requires a 1st and 3rd round pick compensation, and we don't have a 3rd round pick. So there is no way that can happen at present, unless we traded a 2nd round pick in 2005, to acquire a 3rd round pick in 2004. Thats too heavy a price to pay. Cerrato said that the Skins would not have even gone after Coles last year, if the compensation had been a 1st and 3rd round pick. The Skins may trade down their #5 pick, but they won't trade it away. This year's draft is just an aberration. Gibbs needed another quality QB and saw a chance to get a premier RB, so he agreed to give up his 2nd and 3rd round draft pick. Next year though we will have our full compliment of draft picks to use, which are a cheaper source of labor. Sorry, but I dont recall these words coming from Cerrrato. What I recall from this tender offer with Coles was that he kinda avoided the question by saying something like it didnt happen and we gave him what its worth. You can easily see that the Redskins have not aborted going after Restricted free agents because we went after one this year. Given we didnt go after many, but we didnt have many draft picks this year. Instead we traded draft picks for players. Thats what I'm saying that we're going to be doing in the near future. It doesn't have to be a restricted free agent, but we're going to be trading for proven young talent as opposed to getting some unproven rookie. And as far as the Dolphins DE, I think we could get at least a 1st and a third for our fifth pick in the draft. And If we deem him worth it, then I can see us going for him or making an offer to the Dolphins for his rights. Its not an open and shut case with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qb18_200400 Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by blakman211 Like it or not, we're trading the #5 pick in the draft. [/quote Gibbs said we wern't, so I don't see us doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted March 15, 2004 Author Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by timdaley73 oxyMORON... So, because Danny wants to to get results this year, he's going to trade the 5th overall pick to get lower picks which are "sure things"?? I think with the 5th pick overall, you have sure things in Sean Taylor or KW2!! oxyMORON!!! haha, funny, But here's how it works: Snyder wants results this year and doesn't want to take chances on a rookie. So his first option is to attempt to trade the pick for a proven young player who can provide immediate help at a critical positoin. However, if we cannot get such help, then we look at whats avaliable at number 5 this year compared to next year. It doesn't take a rocketscientist to figure out that when teams get scaired they'll trade much more next year for what they want this year. So if somebody offers something like a first this year, and a first through 4th next year, then we take it, and we have more firepower to go after restricted free agents and make trade offers next year. See how simple that was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted March 15, 2004 Author Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by RedskinsNation The draft pix you mentioned, yeah they didnt pan out but you forgot to mention the ones that did - Lavar/Champ/Samuels/Smoot and Gardner has been more consistent than Westbrook ever was... These have been guys taken more recently than the ones mentioned earlier and by a different personnel director. These guys give Dan Snyder positive reinforcement that drafting w/the #5 pick can work out. As far as the salary cap...rookies have their own cap. They do not effect the salary cap this year. Rookie contracts are structured as to where you are drafted eg. the higher the choice the more expensive, but they are not factored into the cap in their 1st year. Those are some nice ones, but there are many examples of people just not living up to the talent that we want. And then again, we're paying this big signing bonus for such a 50/50 chance of greatness. Nah, me and Snyder think we're better off with proven NFL talent that are just starting to reach their prime. Sorry you have a different opinion. And BTW, rookies do not have their own cap. They're included in the overall cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted March 15, 2004 Author Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by qb18_200400 Originally posted by blakman211 Like it or not, we're trading the #5 pick in the draft. [/quote Gibbs said we wern't, so I don't see us doing it. Just like Gibbs said that Brunell and Ramsey are gonna 'compete' in training camp. Stop living in a fantasy world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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