EvilMonkeyBoy Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 You impressed by Ramsey yet? Or do you have some excuse to why Spurrier still doesn't have confidence in ramsey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Yeah. Please, InstiGATOR, either come up with a non-bizarre insight into football or be gone. No one has the time for your strange attraction to Danny W and your jealous hatred of Pat Ramsey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Wuerfuell who InstiGator???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstiGATOR Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Originally posted by EvilMonkeyBoy You impressed by Ramsey yet? Or do you have some excuse to why Spurrier still doesn't have confidence in ramsey? I came here to give Ramsey his due. Ramsey made some nice passes. He made some good decisions. He showed some promise in this offense today. He still has only played a good half against the Jets and a good 2nd and third quarter against the Falcons. He needs to develop some consistency with the confidence he surely gained today. That is what happened with Matthews in 1990. In 1990 Matthews won the job but the first half of the season he threw with no authority. He just was not confident. Now with Ramsey lack of confidence is not armstrength but passe behind, to far ahead, over and at the feet of receivers. Hopefully like Matthews in 1990 in this offense Ramsey will gain confidence and become consistent. Remember I said in my post on the game thread, Ramsey should not be yanked yet in that game. But I did point out with sarcasm that Ramsey is not a 10 year NFL vet like Farve who has built up the good will not to be pulled when he is playing poorly. BTW, you do understand that while Ramsey made some nice throws, the game turned on the play of Doug Johnson not Ramsey. Johnson played just as anyone who has followed his career might have predicted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstiGATOR Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Originally posted by GhostofWoodsonReturns Yeah. Please, InstiGATOR, either come up with a non-bizarre insight into football or be gone. No one has the time for your strange attraction to Danny W and your jealous hatred of Pat Ramsey. You are so funny. Perhaps you have noticed this is an NFL board. As a board full of NFL fans, this board is full of people who are sure their team is a world beater at 2-0 and had the Skins had lost today would be sure that it was the end of the world. As I said, Ramsey played a nice game, made some good throws and some good decisions. We also learned that just like Wuerffel, Ramsey gets sacked and fumbles the ball when he is not protected. That is not a surprise to me, but given the comments I have read here, it probably surprises many of you. I do not hate Ramsey. I am meerly a skeptic, but less so after his performance today. And if he has a bad game some week, I will meerly be a skeptic here, not like some who will want to bench him immediately. I know this kind of measured observation is bizarre to you NFL fans, but so it goes for you guys who view the world completely differently from week to week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Instigator, that's just the kind of patronizing and condencending comment I would expect from a few of our Gator visitors. At least in the past. Most here now do not suffer from that. I've been to the Gator boards. Seen head coaches, and players called to task in pretty much the same fashion as on this board. Even more so, I've see a general disdain for players not from Florida. Mind you, this isn't all that uncommon in college land, I hear it alot out here as well. keeping in mind it probably isn't representative of all fans that post on those boards either. Hard to measure the frequency of negative comments about the players and coaches down in the swamp because that just isn't allowed apparently. I've also seen the world beater comments as well so please spare the holier than thou argument here. Generally your comments about football are well informed but unfortunately your bias and lack of objectivity when it comes to all things Florida tends to leak through at times. Such as here. The play of Ramsey was evry bit of a game turner as Johnsons lack of it. He got rattled and one can credit a very tough Redskins defense for that. In the face of similar adversity, Ramsey continued to play well, and actually better as the game wore on. Credit this to S.S. as well as the improved oline and the backs. But do not kid yourself. Ramsey can be credited for for turning the game every bit as much as Johnson if that is your thing, which it seems to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PediGator Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Well then let me be the first to say "you missed the point." Honestly, if after observing his play in this game, and in any other game he's played in his heretofore VERY brief career, the first thing that sticks out to you is - "Ramsey made some nice passes. He made some good decisions," - you're missing the point. Just so we're perfectly clear, Ramsey has not "only played a good half against the Jets and a good 2nd and third quarter against the Falcons." And to be perfectly frank, no matter how much you'd like to compare Patrick Ramsey to every other QB who played for Steve Spurrier, Ramsey is nothing at all analogous to Shane Matthews. What Patrick Ramsey is can probably best be summarized as a work in progress. But rest assured, those around Redskin Park are going to have a blast watching that progress. Do you really think that the reason Lavar Arrington's eyes light up when he's talking about Ramsey is because he makes some nice throws? Because he makes some good decisions? Nuh uh. Do you really think the reason Steve Spurrier has tied his own fortunes to those of Ramsey's more so than at any other point in his brilliant career to any single player is because he can make all the throws? You should know this better than anyone Insti-. Doug Johnson can make all the throws. Some better than Ramsey. Steve Spurrier would never trade Ramsey for Johnson. Why are Redskin fans excited? Not because we think 16 points a week is enough - like you so sarcastically stated after week 1 - so don't go telling us we're the only ones who like to live week to week - that's what being passionate does to fans. I'm not apologizing. No - Redskin fans are excited because we see a QB who survived last season despite our OL. Who, struggling through a half of football when seemingly nothing was going right, was able to scamper 24 yards to save the franchise from an embarrassing loss in Week 1. No excuses. Just make a play. He did. We're excited because down 17-0, on the road, with Defensive Linemen feasting on him from every corner, having already lost two fumbles, Patrick Ramsey was just getting started. In different threads today, you've called out both Spurrier and Ramsey himself as "lacking in confidence." One in his QB. The other in his own abilities. The first statement - that Spurrier lacks confidence in Ramsey - is based on some fraudulent media driven stereotype of the relationship between Snyder and Spurrier - and couldn't be further from the truth. You don't go and spend $50 million upgrading the OL and WR and RB positions if you think you have yet to find a QB. The Redskins didn't accomplish much last year. The one thing they did do was find a QB. Did you see Ramsey yelling at Spurrier after that last fumble? Did that look like a guy lacking confidence in his own abilities? To me, it looked like he was thinking "God #$^% get me some time and I'll make the plays. What's going on?" Rest assured - he can make some bad throws too - but its not for lack of confidence. Again, to be sure, Ramsey has a long way to go. But he's played less than half a season. He's beaten two teams that quite honestly, aren't as talented as the Redskins. But in the NFL, the better team doesn't always win, so you take wins anywhere you can get them. And lastly, I might suggest that the game might have turned on Iffy's pick - as you suggest - but it was sustained only because of the Redskins ability to modify their blocking scheme to buy Ramsey time. If I may get sarcastic for a moment though, for a guy who always says that Wuerffel's "sample size" of NFL opportunity is too small, you sure are a harsh critic of Doug Johnson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckydevil Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Pedi good post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 That post by Pedi might be the best post I've ever seen from a Gator fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Brown #43 Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by InstiGATOR I do not hate Ramsey. I am meerly a skeptic, but less so after his performance today. And if he has a bad game some week, I will meerly be a skeptic here, not like some who will want to bench him immediately. I know this kind of measured observation is bizarre to you NFL fans, but so it goes for you guys who view the world completely differently from week to week. On the one hand, you accuse us of "viewing the world completely differently from week to week," yet you admit that your feelings on Ramsey have changed "after his performance today?" Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NBlue Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 what pedi said. btw, the fact that so many of you seem to assume that most gators would agree with insti as a general rule is silly at best. i like reading his posts, but he rarely, if ever, hold a majority opinion on a gator board let alone here. fwiw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by PediGator Did you see Ramsey yelling at Spurrier after that last fumble? Did that look like a guy lacking confidence in his own abilities? To me, it looked like he was thinking "God #$^% get me some time and I'll make the plays. What's going on?" Rest assured - he can make some bad throws too - but its not for lack of confidence. Thanks for the reminder. I'm not sure if it was the sack surrendered by a whiff by Canidate or B. Johnson... but I was F-U-M-I-N-G after that sack. My wife actually told me to shut up because I was yelling to myself in a restaurant and drawing attention to us. It's funny now in hindsight. But when I saw Ramsey yelling at Spurrier on the sidelines... I knew that Ramsey had matured as a QB. I believe it will be the turning point in his young career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 25 for 39, 356 yards and 2 touchdowns, ZERO interceptions. Saying this game didn't turn on Ramsey is preposterous. Doug Johnson's miscues would not have been decisive IF Ramsey had had a poor to mediocre effort. Indeed there are MANY NFL quarterbacks I have seen wilt after the pressure of the first half onslaught Ramsey faced. When you have a starter who is just 23 and showed the poise in making plays to win games that Ramsey has the past two weeks, I just don't see where there is room for the kind of skepticism that InstiGator brings to the board. I am not going to go as far as to say Ramsey has proven he is going on to a HOF career by any means, but you would have to say based on what we have seen so far that the #31 choice in the NFL draft in 2002 is one that bears watching, most of all by a lot of the other 30 teams that passed on him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver00 Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 I don't know what IntiGator's hangup with Ramsey is, but as a Gator fan I'm not thinking of how Ramsey compares to former Gator QBs, I'm thinking HOW DID HE END UP AT TULANE AND NOT UF?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? If the guy can look that good in his 2nd season in the NFL (a much much faster game), then I can barely imagine what he could have done wearing Orange and Blue. And while I'm on that subject, it would have been nice to see Coles in a Gator uni as well. The Skins look like they've got a Superstar in the making with Ramsey. And Coles is probably already there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstiGATOR Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by PediGator And to be perfectly frank, no matter how much you'd like to compare Patrick Ramsey to every other QB who played for Steve Spurrier, Ramsey is nothing at all analogous to Shane Matthews. Sorry to inform you but in fact Matthews was a young inexperienced QB at one time too. I did not see him in the NFL, but I know how he threw better with more confidence as he settled into this offense in 1990. Ramsey too is a young QB in a similar but evolved and adjusted for the NFL offense. He may or may not gain confidence with playing time and make better reads or more accurate throws. He may just be inaccurate. But that is hardly fair to assume on a day he played so well. Originally posted by PediGator Do you really think that the reason Lavar Arrington's eyes light up when he's talking about Ramsey is because he makes some nice throws? Because he makes some good decisions? Nuh uh. Great quote an LB as evidence of player evaluation. Great. Originally posted by PediGator Do you really think the reason Steve Spurrier has tied his own fortunes to those of Ramsey's more so than at any other point in his brilliant career to any single player is because he can make all the throws? I don't think Spurrier tied himself to Ramsey. I think the owner went out and drafted a first round QB for his new QB oriented coach. It was reported here the own picked the 1st round pick by himself. Then the personnel guy went and signed the most sacked QB in NFL history as a backup. Then the owner and the personnel guy cut the third QB Spurrier wanted to keep. Today on a day Ramsey made progress in this offense why can't you be happy, praise him for his progress rather than pretend he made all pro today. You should know this better than anyone Insti-. Doug Johnson can make all the throws. Some better than Ramsey. Steve Spurrier would never trade Ramsey for Johnson. Originally posted by PediGator We're excited because down 17-0, on the road, with Defensive Linemen feasting on him from every corner, having already lost two fumbles, Patrick Ramsey was just getting started. You should be and I was happy on my way down to this thread to read one from a fan willing to post, why I am not completely happy despite 2-0. I did not agree with all his points, but I was happy to read his post. Originally posted by PediGator In different threads today, you've called out both Spurrier and Ramsey himself as "lacking in confidence." One in his QB. The other in his own abilities. Well if you did not see Ramsey's own lack of confidence from his play in the second half of the Jets game and the first part of this game, well sorry but it was there. Do I think it is world changing event that Ramsey yelled at SOS, if that is what happened today. I think people yell on the sideline of football games. If you think Spurrier would call the same game with a QB he was confident in, I doubt it unless what he lacks confidence in is the OL particularly the OTs who make so much money. So maybe Spurrier has complete confidence in Ramsey and is play calling like he is because of his confidence in the Skins OL? But Ramsey certainly played confidence shy at times in both early games. But he bounce back today and made plays, nice passes and some good decisions. I have seen many QBs come and go over the years. Who was it that was so great one Thanksgiving in a Skins-Cowboy game? I think it was a Cowboy QB, who never won a job consistently. [bTW, my predictions about Doug were based on what he did at UF, not in the NFL.] BTW, to the person who says I called them changing every day but admitted my view of Ramsey changed today, that is not inconsistent. Yes new information should modify your view. But one good game or one bad game should not change your view of someone completely. To the person claiming UF boards are just as bad as NFL boards. I do not think so, but heck maybe they are. I will concede there are today fans on every board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver00 Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 InstiGator: Our boards are definately as bad... if that's the way you want to see it. I think the Redskin fans have every right to complain when things go bad. And you have to see that we complain about the same things on SwampGas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Instigator...the bottom line is that those of us who really ARE Redskin fans don't need your constant lectures about how our QB may not be the second coming. We've suffered with crappy QBs for a decade. So forgive me and others if, having tasted a rare modicum of offensive success this year, we choose to tell you (as politely as possible of course) to pipe down. I really could care less what your up to the minute 'take' on our QB is, and for the most part I think the majority here have a measured and realistic view of Ramsey and where we are as a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstiGATOR Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Originally posted by Tarhog Instigator...the bottom line is that those of us who really ARE Redskin fans don't need your constant lectures about how our QB may not be the second coming. We've suffered with crappy QBs for a decade. So forgive me and others if, having tasted a rare modicum of offensive success this year, we choose to tell you (as politely as possible of course) to pipe down. I really could care less what your up to the minute 'take' on our QB is, and for the most part I think the majority here have a measured and realistic view of Ramsey and where we are as a team. 1. Tarhog, you may have noticed that I did not start this thread. It was addressed to me. Hard to answer posts addressed to me and pipe down. 2. I think it was fairly addressed to me. If you question whether or not someone will do well or not and he has a good game or two, you certainly should be adult enough to come back and credit the person. That does not mean I have to bow down and claim he is a sure fire future all pro, but I think I needed to step to the plate and say yes he did made some good throws and some nice decisions. 3. Fair enough on you not caring. I am an outsider here. Also as an outsider, I do not spend as much time here as I do on Gator boards and I have a life to live, so I will happily take your word that most have a measured and realistic view of Ramsey. That would be a view similar to mine. Culver00, I have already surrendered on the which boards are worse question a post or two ago on this thread. You are right all fan boards are naturally filled with fans and fans naturally get excited from time to time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarhog Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Look, you are welcome here as far as I'm concerned and have as much a right to post as do I. But I think Pedigator and Bulldog took you to task, and correctly so, for your lukewarm review of Ramsey's gameplay and impact so far this season. It smacked of an 'agenda'. Outsiders are welcome here. Ask anybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 And they are. The welcome mat is always out, (DH and Blade spent good money on that mat with helmet on it ), for all football fans for talking on all things football. "so I will happily take your word that most have a measured and realistic view of Ramsey. That would be a view similar to mine." Nice try, but being realistic is definately not the same as having a similar view as you, especially here. As can be seen. Hey, 1 for 2 isn't all that bad though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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