So why did we switch to the 3-4?

[HailToTheRedskins14]

And how effective is our 3-4 at exploiting the talent on our roster. Last year, it looked like we had a defense with above-average talent. This year, it looks like we have one of the least talented defenses in the NFL.

Also, what about Carter and Haynesworth? Arguably, Fletcher is less effective in the 3-4.

Funny, before yesterday people were pimping how sick Landry was playing and I even read Peter King I think mention him as a possible DPOY candidate.

One game changes everything, huh?

Gimme a freaking break. Fact is, yall are some impatient folks who want to complain that we never rebuild, then immediately change your tune when it is obvious we are rebuilding on the defensive side of the ball (and probably offensive side, too, just by default). Buncha bipolar folks on ES.

[HailToTheRedskins14]

Then why trade two high picks for a 34 year-old QB?

Considering QB is the most important position on the team, is it really bad that we gave up a 2nd rounder and a 3rd (at most) to take care of that position for hopefully 3 years minimum?

Find me one team in the NFL with no players over 30. Yall act like this is Madden.

[Chachie]

Funny, before yesterday people were pimping how sick Landry was playing and I even read Peter King I think mention him as a possible DPOY candidate.

One game changes everything, huh?

Gimme a freaking break. Fact is, yall are some impatient folks who want to complain that we never rebuild, then immediately change your tune when it is obvious we are rebuilding on the defensive side of the ball (and probably offensive side, too, just by default). Buncha bipolar folks on ES.

I'm with this dude.

[Devastate]

We went to the 3-4 to exploit the talent we already had, i.e., Orakpo and Landry.

That's BS because they played Orakpo the first 3 or 4 games at LB last year.. It wasn't till they stuck his hand in the dirt did he start kicking some ass

[seriously]

That's BS because they played Orakpo the first 3 or 4 games at LB last year.. It wasn't till they stuck his hand in the dirt did he start kicking some ass

That's how I recall it, too. But, like mentioned in another thread talking about how Fletcher doesn't blame the 3-4 and I guess he points out that it's our nickel/dime that are ****ting the bed... That just shows our personnel simply suck.

[wilburmarshall]

To create more TO. Our top ten D the last couple of years did nothing for us. You need TO to win games. Give it time.

[IrepDC]

Look at the Green Bay game going on right now. Green Bay runs exotic blitzes with MAN coverage behind it. We have been running blitzes with soft zones all season. Just about every major defensive breakdown this season has been a blitz with a soft zone- EVERY PLAY. Yet we do not adjust.

[icbmayday]

We switched to a 3-4 because its a great scheme....we simply don't have the personnel yet.

[rk3025]

Blache did a great job with what he had and was harder on the players than they liked.

[bulldog]

The Redskins defense is dysfunctional.

Finally, the team moved Landry to SS and has Kareem Moore starting at FS. Two solid moves in the right direction

That is then counterbalanced by the decision to move to the 3-4 and place Haynesworth, Carter, Golston, Alexander, etc. out of position. Normally productive players have become unproductive.

[petedaddy]

Funny, before yesterday people were pimping how sick Landry was playing and I even read Peter King I think mention him as a possible DPOY candidate.

One game changes everything, huh?

Gimme a freaking break. Fact is, yall are some impatient folks who want to complain that we never rebuild, then immediately change your tune when it is obvious we are rebuilding on the defensive side of the ball (and probably offensive side, too, just by default). Buncha bipolar folks on ES.

What exactly are we rebuilding on the defensive side of the ball? We have virtually the exact same key personnel on defense as we did last year. Carriker and Kemo are additions, but hardly world beaters. I would be ok with a rebuilding process if I could believe that the switch to the 3-4 is going to help us in 2 - 3 years. If we had 9 new young starters on defense or something like that, then I would at least feel that the new starters would be getting 3-4 game experience. Right now we are taking NFL veterans and asking them to do things they are not comfortable with. Not brilliant coaching in my opinion.

[petedaddy]

The Redskins defense is dysfunctional.

Finally, the team moved Landry to SS and has Kareem Moore starting at FS. Two solid moves in the right direction

That is then counterbalanced by the decision to move to the 3-4 and place Haynesworth, Carter, Golston, Alexander, etc. out of position. Normally productive players have become unproductive.

Agreed - I believe if we would have just kept the 4-3 from last year combined with the move of Landry to SS and Moore to FS is enough to make us an upper echelon defense. We have made our otherwise productive players non-factors, and have kept some young depth like Jarmon on the bench, while Vonnie Holliday rots out there.

[wwSEANd]

ultimately, i think it's pretty clear that the coaches believe that the 3-4 is a fundamentally better defense to run in today's NFL than the 4-3. i agree with them. it's okay if you don't, because there is evidence to the contrary as well.

as a result, they looked at the "top 10" (but ultimately unreliable) defense we were fielding, decided it wasn't good enough, and overhauled it. that overhaul is getting messy, and it's costing us games. if the result is that our defense is championship-calibre by 2011 or 2012, then it will be worth it. will it be that good? i don't know, and neither do any of you.

i'll tell you what, though, as bad as our defense has been, i see room for improvement based on execution alone. the past several years? i saw a defense that had hit its ceiling, scheme-wise, and that ceiling wasn't high enough.

[Redskins4ever]

ultimately, i think it's pretty clear that the coaches believe that the 3-4 is a fundamentally better defense to run in today's NFL than the 4-3. i agree with them. it's okay if you don't, because there is evidence to the contrary as well.

as a result, they looked at the "top 10" (but ultimately unreliable) defense we were fielding, decided it wasn't good enough, and overhauled it. that overhaul is getting messy, and it's costing us games. if the result is that our defense is championship-calibre by 2011 or 2012, then it will be worth it. will it be that good? i don't know, and neither do any of you.

i'll tell you what, though, as bad as our defense has been, i see room for improvement based on execution alone. the past several years? i saw a defense that had hit its ceiling, scheme-wise, and that ceiling wasn't high enough.

The defense the Redskins had under Greg Williams and Greg Blache were great defenses. Maybe they didn't get a lot of turnovers, but they kept the opposing offenses to a minimum amount of yardage during games. The Redskins currently rank as the worst defense in the league only because they faced two great offense the first two weeks of the season. Dallas and Houston both have explosive offenses. What if the Redskins with Greg Blache or Greg Williams had run the 4-3 in both of those games and Dallas and Houston were still able to do what they did against the Redskins defense? London Fletcher said that most of the yardage that has been piled up against the defense occurred while the defense was in nickle and dime situations, not in basic 3-4 situations. So, it isn't the 3-4 defense at all that is failing the Redskins. It's the defense in nickle or dime in 2nd & long or 3rd & long situations and they are not stopping opposing offenses in these situations.

[scuppajones]

Considering QB is the most important position on the team, is it really bad that we gave up a 2nd rounder and a 3rd (at most) to take care of that position for hopefully 3 years minimum?

Find me one team in the NFL with no players over 30. Yall act like this is Madden.

Only problem with that theory is McNabb will be one and done here. No chance he sticks around for this rebuilding project when he will have his choice of teams to play for. Donovan will be on the first plane out of here to either Arizona or Minnesota once this debacle of the season is over, then we will be in exactly the same position we were at the start of this year looking for a QB. Only problem is now we have given up two high draft picks that could of been used to rebuild. Same old story.

[Homercles82]

The defense the Redskins had under Greg Williams and Greg Blache were great defenses. Maybe they didn't get a lot of turnovers, but they kept the opposing offenses to a minimum amount of yardage during games. The Redskins currently rank as the worst defense in the league only because they faced two great offense the first two weeks of the season. Dallas and Houston both have explosive offenses. What if the Redskins with Greg Blache or Greg Williams had run the 4-3 in both of those games and Dallas and Houston were still able to do what they did against the Redskins defense? London Fletcher said that most of the yardage that has been piled up against the defense occurred while the defense was in nickle and dime situations, not in basic 3-4 situations. So, it isn't the 3-4 defense at all that is failing the Redskins. It's the defense in nickle or dime in 2nd & long or 3rd & long situations and they are not stopping opposing offenses in these situations.

Those Blache/Williams defenses could not get stops when it mattered. Stop acting like they were so great. They did nothing significant.

[PorkSkins]

I don't care what you call the defense, 3-4, 4-3, 4-0, nickel, dime, quarter, or whatever. You make adjustments in the game and get the right personnel matchup. Kemeotu or AH at nose tackle in our 3-4, not working. Andre Carter covering a TE, not working. Carriker and Golston on the ends to rush the passer, not working. Fletcher not playing a true MLB position, not working. Defensive backs playing a lot of zones, not working. The coaches need to put their egos aside and use the personnel we have to the best of their abilities. Anything else is just plain hard headediness.

[HateYanksDukeCowboys]

We switched to a 3-4 because its a great scheme....we simply don't have the personnel yet.

Does 3-4 also mean a degradation in tackling ability?

[Homercles82]

I don't care what you call the defense, 3-4, 4-3, 4-0, nickel, dime, quarter, or whatever. You make adjustments in the game and get the right personnel matchup. Kemeotu or AH at nose tackle in our 3-4, not working. Andre Carter covering a TE, not working. Carriker and Golston on the ends to rush the passer, not working. Fletcher not playing a true MLB position, not working. Defensive backs playing a lot of zones, not working. The coaches need to put their egos aside and use the personnel we have to the best of their abilities. Anything else is just plain hard headediness.

I don't buy the ego excuse. I feel it is an execution problem. Carter I agree should not be covering a TE. He looks so out of place when doing so.

[skinsrbeast]

The problem is everyone is tryin to pin point the problem, and the real problem is a colllection of problems.

1. Shanahan has said that he believes the 3 4 is the ideal defense and this would lead one to believe he is not gonna switch it (whether for better or worse)

2. We lack the true personnel for the 3 4 defense and i believe it is beginning

3. Those saying the Williams defenses were not dominant are sorely mistaken however don't bring the blache defense into the conversation (unless saying it is better than the current scheme which is not saying much) because it was good but did not even teeter near great

4. Albert's talent is being wasted (not sayin i dont agree with him not playing and us not building our defense around him) and the amount of stock we put into him has restricted us from making a truly dominant defense (and may possibly continue in the future)

5. Finally, its early and we can hope that they work to rebuild this and produce a successful 34, or realize their faults and return to the 4 3 (but include some more blitz schemes such as williams did)

[RandyHolt]

Because shanahan thought it was more important to do than to try to build off of last years base D.

You know when you go unemployed for a year, no employer wants you because you are rusty? Shanahan gets McNabb which puts in a win now mode (dumping picks to do it) yet destroys the defense that just needed some no brainer tweaks (that poor blache and clueless Vinny couldnt figure out). Get a FS and move Landry to SS; take most all of Daniels snaps and give them to Orakpo. Copy a blitz scheme from one of the many super bowl winning 4-3 teams and we were ready.

Instead we didnt even get a single 3-4 backer?! hello.

I can hardly even watch Carter in space these days.

[NoGravity]

If Carter can't cover an everyday TE, then he shouldn't be your starting OLB.

[maskedsuperstar]

Because shanahan thought it was more important to do than to try to build off of last years base D.

You know when you go unemployed for a year, no employer wants you because you are rusty? Shanahan gets McNabb which puts in a win now mode (dumping picks to do it) yet destroys the defense that just needed some no brainer tweaks (that poor blache and clueless Vinny couldnt figure out). Get a FS and move Landry to SS; take most all of Daniels snaps and give them to Orakpo. Copy a blitz scheme from one of the many super bowl winning 4-3 teams and we were ready.

Instead we didnt even get a single 3-4 backer?! hello.

I can hardly even watch Carter in space these days.

[maskedsuperstar]

Poor execution!!!! That's it in a nutshell. I don't care what defense they play. The skins aren't doing the little things.

[SirClintonPortis]

Apparently, Mike Shanahan is determined to make AH a NT even if he was in his doghouse and ticked him off. Sadly, I have to ask what kind of moron would waste AH's agility and quickness by asking him to stand still and be a statue? AH's an instinctive player that needs a D catered to his strengths.

Andre Carter is our yearly let's make DL a LB mistake. We neutered a pass rusher we gave a contract extension to just so he can make guys like Bradford hit the highlight reel?

Kedric Golston was a serviceable DT, but by no means a world beater. Now we're asking him to be a big, strong space eater? :doh: