Nyt: Republicans and Medicare: Paul Krugman

[luckydevil]

A Democrat has proposed making cuts in the government's biggest entitlement program.

And the Republicans are unanimously opposing it.

Who says there hasn't been Change?

Well, I guess you missed the part about Paul Ryan plan. It's courageous and doesn't have a chance in hell of passing. But he is one republican who is for cuts.

[twa]

That's what galls you? I guess maybe we missed the point that the Republicans are the one's screaming out to scare the little old ladies about cuts to their medicare when all the while their plan cuts the medicare MORE than the plan they are screaming about.

That's the hypocrisy, and that hypocritical fear mongering should gall us more than someone's plan that saves more and cuts less.

Let me try one more time

Medicare/caid benefits will have to be cut or more money found to fund it

It is unsustainable

Cutting it and simply spending the money in another place is counterproductive .

I could care less what the Reps propose since it is not happening

You are fearmongering now about proposed Rep cuts aren't you?:evilg:

Why not have a open ,honest discussion about a needed reform ?

Don't make me break out the Death Panels dude:silly:

[AsburySkinsFan]

Let me try one more time

Medicare/caid benefits will have to be cut or more money found to fund it

It is unsustainable

twa listen to yourself, you say its unsustainable, fine...but the GOP is scaring everyone by saying the Dems are cutting Medicare when THEY are cutting Medicare too!

Cutting it and simply spending the money in another place is counterproductive.

You want cuts in the budget, fine, cut the military spending.

I could care less what the Reps propose since it is not happening

So as long as the GOP isn't in charge you don't care that they lie and fear monger?

You are fearmongering now about proposed Rep cuts aren't you?:evilg:

Not hardly, but I give you props for trying. I am joining the criticism of the GOP who want to scare people by saying the Dems are cutting Medicare and acting like the GOP is championing saving Medicare when the GOP isn't, and in reality they are cutting it more and not spending that cut money in other places to compensate for those cuts.

Why not have a open ,honest discussion about a needed reform ?

I'd love the open forum, just like the GOP asked for but then when Obama called for it they all chickened out saying it was a trap.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-february-11-2010/the-apparent-trap

[twa]

Medicare is a tax based program that I pay 2.9 % of every damn dollar I make to....cutting the benefits is fine for sustainability of the program....and needed

Stealing from it to finance something else is another matter and not cuts.

I'm fine with cutting military spending as well,BUT not to simply shift spending to some other excess.

You ought to be in congress,you would fit in just fine.:beatdeadhorse:

It is not true cuts or savings if you simply spend it elsewhere,you are simply reducing benefits to one party(that paid for them) to benefit another

Thieves:evilg:

[AsburySkinsFan]

Thieves:evilg:

If the Dems are the thieves then the GOP are hypocritical fear mongering thieves and liars. It is noted though that you still have yet to address the very fact that the GOP are being highly hypocritical as they complain about Medicare redistributions while at the same time planning to cut Medicare and not fill in the gaps from those cuts.

You keep trying to turn this into a debate about the cuts themselves in order to divert attention from the hypocrisy of the GOP, and while I appreciate the sentiment I'm not going to let you get away with it.

[twa]

If the Dems are the thieves then the GOP are hypocritical fear mongering thieves and liars. It is noted though that you still have yet to address the very fact that the GOP are being highly hypocritical as they complain about Medicare redistributions while at the same time planning to cut Medicare and not fill in the gaps from those cuts.

You keep trying to turn this into a debate about the cuts themselves in order to divert attention from the hypocrisy of the GOP, and while I appreciate the sentiment I'm not going to let you get away with it.

Perhaps because I assume ALL politicians are hypocritical fear mongering thieves and liars:beatdeadhorse:

What fill in the gaps do you propose?

The cuts and what you do with that money is critical to the discussion

Krugman is ignoring basics(a common problem)

[Riggo-toni]

This ought to be fun.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/12/opinion/12krugman.html

Nor is it even the fact that, as House speaker, Mr. Gingrich personally tried to ram through deep cuts in Medicare — and, in 1995, went so far as to shut down the federal government in an attempt to bully Bill Clinton into accepting those cuts.

Uh, speaking of hypocrisy...

Hillary Clinton and the Dems in early '94 were pushing for bigger Medicare "cuts" to finance her health care plan. Her own words were "We're not talking about actual cuts in Medicare, we're talking about reducing the rate of growth to between 6 and 7 percent." In her final defeated version of he bill, the growth of Medicare was curbed to 7.1 percent. By contrast, the Gingrich version tried to limit growth to 7.6 percent (a half percent higher), and predictably all the same Dems who voted for Hillarycare's 7.1% were suddenly decrying the GOP's 7.6% as extremist. :doh:

I'm not a Republican, but I can't stand Krugman. He is a hardcore Keynesian ideologue who still can't accept that the 70s were an economic failure

[twa]

By contrast, the Gingrich version tried to limit growth to 7.6 percent (a half percent higher), and predictably all the same Dems who voted for Hillarycare's 7.1% were suddenly decrying the GOP's 7.6% as extremist. :doh:

I'm not a Republican, but I can't stand Krugman. He is a hardcore Keynesian ideologue who still can't accept that the 70s were an economic failure

Sounds eerily similar to Medicare D and some posters here;)

I agree on Krugman,smart guy ,but major blindspots.(but don't we all:silly:)

[DRSmith]

Here is the thing I do not get, it seems more and more money is being lost trying to keep the apperance of private healthcare. Why not get rid of Medicare Medicaid and have just one program handled by the government and not a third party seller?

[SnyderShrugged]

Here is the thing I do not get, it seems more and more money is being lost trying to keep the apperance of private healthcare. Why not get rid of Medicare Medicaid and have just one program handled by the government and not a third party seller?

Why not go the other direction instead? Dump medicare and medicaid in favor of private only? Why must the solution be a Federal entity that has already proven insolvent?

Regarding Krugs and the OP: He totally ignores the fact that the supposed proposed "cuts" in medicare were only window dressing and that the Dems actually proposed a separate bill that would offset those cuts to make their reform bill appear to be cheaper than it actually would have been when both bills were looked at together.

Other than that, Krugman is correct on one point. GOP hypocracy is rampant with their desire to play both sides of the fiscal fence. Thats why they lost power and will continue to do so if they dont embrace the actual conservative principles they preach.

[DRSmith]

Why not go the other direction instead? Dump medicare and medicaid in favor of private only? Why must the solution be a Federal entity that has already proven insolvent?

Regarding Krugs and the OP: He totally ignores the fact that the supposed proposed "cuts" in medicare were only window dressing and that the Dems actually proposed a separate bill that would offset those cuts to make their reform bill appear to be cheaper than it actually would have been when both bills were looked at together.

Other than that, Krugman is correct on one point. GOP hypocracy is rampant with their desire to play both sides of the fiscal fence. Thats why they lost power and will continue to do so if they dont embrace the actual conservative principles they preach.

One both the banking problems and the latest recall only after public pressure show most often corporations do not always hold the national interest at heart. What do you expect from an insurance program that takes on the elderly and the poor?

[Special K]

Well, this has been another productive and fun-filled ES healthcare debate. The finger-pointing really gets us far, doesn't it?