Rhodus333 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 So one of the things ive read and heard alot about is that because people have already paid for their season tickets this year, Snyder still gets his money and it seems to be hard for people to get out of their obligation to pay for them. My question is, because of all the changes that have been made DURING this season in regards to the gameday experience (like not allowing signs, tailgating changes, increased security, etc.) could a fan make the case that he wants to cancel his ticket because Snyder has changed the terms of what a season ticket holder is entitled to? I mean i think its fair to say that alot of people would not have signed up for these season tickets if these policies were in place beforehand. Basically, because of how different Snyder's new policies have made going to a game this year, is there any legal ground for a fan to stand on if he wanted to get refunded for his tickets this year? Could a fan argue that Snyder has changed the terms of the contract? I have no idea if this would hold up but it sure seems like season ticket holders aren't getting what they paid for, and their gameday experience has been modified without their consent numerous times during the season. Could this be defended as a breach of contract on Snyder's part? If so I'd love to see fans take advantage of this and get their money back for the remaining games of the season, it would sure go a long way towards damaging Snyder's income. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Anonymous Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Dude, the transaction is FINAL WHEN YOU PAY IN MARCH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark The Homer Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 First - the only people that might be making payments on their season tickets are premium seat holders. They're also the only ones who have signed contracts. The contracts are done by Snyder's lawyers, not the seat holders lawyers. Therefore, you know every possible exclusion will have already been written into the contract. So to answer your question - no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I mean i think its fair to say that alot of people would not have signed up for these season tickets if these policies were in place beforehand. i disagree. i'm pretty sure most people got their tickets os they can go watch football, not so they can show a sign. and if they decide to not renew them, it'll be mainly because of other problems, not because of the change in policy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttr77 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 My question would be...what took you so long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhodus333 Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Well then. . . i guess its back to the drawing board :shot: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttr77 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Well then. . . i guess its back to the drawing board:shot: Just don't renew next year! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss_Hogg Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I'm not canceling the tix, they have been in the family way to long. I'll just go to the tailgate then sell them for half price outside the gate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FadeToThomas Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Just don't renew next year! or the year after that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I'm not canceling the tix, they have been in the family way to long. I'll just go to the tailgate then sell them for half price outside the gate. same here, i can't give them up. i jsut talked to my dad, who used to have the tickets before i got them. he laughed, and said 'they've been worse than this, believe it or not. it happens, every team goes in cycles'. the then made comments about the 'fair weather' fans in DC. I tried to defend it, saying whats going on now is pretty bad, he still insisted DC is, and always has been, full of fairweather fans. he then tried to tell me it can't all be snyders fault, and that at the end of the day its the players who aren't playing well. (not completely agreeing with him, just sharing what a life long season ticket holder, who missed 5-6 games from the 60's to 2006 when he gave them up and i took over, had to say this morning.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfather151981 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 So one of the things ive read and heard alot about is that because people have already paid for their season tickets this year, Snyder still gets his money and it seems to be hard for people to get out of their obligation to pay for them.My question is, because of all the changes that have been made DURING this season in regards to the gameday experience (like not allowing signs, tailgating changes, increased security, etc.) could a fan make the case that he wants to cancel his ticket because Snyder has changed the terms of what a season ticket holder is entitled to? I mean i think its fair to say that alot of people would not have signed up for these season tickets if these policies were in place beforehand. Basically, because of how different Snyder's new policies have made going to a game this year, is there any legal ground for a fan to stand on if he wanted to get refunded for his tickets this year? Could a fan argue that Snyder has changed the terms of the contract? I have no idea if this would hold up but it sure seems like season ticket holders aren't getting what they paid for, and their gameday experience has been modified without their consent numerous times during the season. Could this be defended as a breach of contract on Snyder's part? If so I'd love to see fans take advantage of this and get their money back for the remaining games of the season, it would sure go a long way towards damaging Snyder's income. My seats are GA, so I go on a year-by-year bais, but you'd have to check the terms of the contract. I would suspeect that there's a claus that reads something to the effect of "terms subject to change..." and so forth. But that's a very interesting question, and there's a (small) chance that you'd have some ground on which to stand there. I will say that the bit about not allowing media to interview fans outside the stadium bothers me much more than the sign issue. Both of them are draconian measures, but I've sat behind people with signs at games before, and it can get very annoying. We all know the true reasoning behind that policy, but there are also some benefits. I guess I don't have a problem with people that make signs and hang them on the walls around the stadium, but guys that hold signs up in the stands can be very annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhodus333 Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Just don't renew next year! Oh i didn't mean for me personally. I don't have season tickets (too expensive) and was just curious about how the contract worked. Im just wondering if there is anything Snyder could do that WOULD constitute a breach in contract from his end. Is there anything in the agreement about what the season tickets entitles the fans too? Is it just the seat or does it include parking, food discounts, etc? Just thinking out loud. Like, say hypothetically Snyder tries to raise prices for parking or concessions midseason to try and cover the falling ticket sales? Are any of those things discussed in the contract? Or for people with club level packages? What would he have to do that WOULD entitle people to getting their money back? Is there anything? Again just kinda curious how the whole thing works. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 But that's a very interesting question, and there's a (small) chance that you'd have some ground on which to stand there. yeah, but the cost alone to fight the redskins in court over what, 1/2 a seasons worth of homegames? you'd have to have a lot of seats, in a good GA section, to even make that worth fighting... cause you would have to go to court... cause they know how expensive it is, and they have good lawyers.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfather151981 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 same here, i can't give them up.i jsut talked to my dad, who used to have the tickets before i got them. he laughed, and said 'they've been worse than this, believe it or not. it happens, every team goes in cycles'. the then made comments about the 'fair weather' fans in DC. I tried to defend it, saying whats going on now is pretty bad, he still insisted DC is, and always has been, full of fairweather fans. he then tried to tell me it can't all be snyders fault, and that at the end of the day its the players who aren't playing well. (not completely agreeing with him, just sharing what a life long season ticket holder, who missed 5-6 games from the 60's to 2006 when he gave them up and i took over, had to say this morning.) I agree with your Dad wholeheartedly. First of all, they have been worse than this. Take a look at the 1993-94 teams, and even Spurrier's two seasons. Those squads might have scored a few more points, but ultimately they found ways to lose games. With regard to fairweather fans, he's right on. Take a look at the Caps right now. Speaking for myself, I've been a Caps fan forever, and I've always attended a couple of games per year. Now I'm meeting people that are going totally hog wild over the Capitals, and their fandom seems to have started about two years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Is there anything in the agreement about what the season tickets entitles the fans too? Is it just the seat or does it include parking, food discounts, etc? parking has its own pass and terms. for example, i have 3 GA tickets, but no parking pass. Even the premium seats, i believe, coem with 'rights' to certain parking pass, but the pass itself is seperate. outsid eof that, no, it just says you can get in the gate and sit in seat. the extra tailgate (inside the stadium) sections require a different ticket/pass, parking requires a different ticket/pass, etc. and the way the terms of use/etc are writen...b asically you have no rights, you can be removed for the stadiumf or anything deemed appropriate (which is pretty much anything), you can have your season tickets cancled with no refund, etc etc etc. they can basically do anything they want to you.. i'm sure you could win a lawsuit against a few things, but as i said earlier, it would be an expensive and drawn out battle. it'd basically be cheaper (in most cases) to just let it go than to fight it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Why does anyone have season tickets anymore is my question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I agree with your Dad wholeheartedly. First of all, they have been worse than this. Take a look at the 1993-94 teams, and even Spurrier's two seasons. Those squads might have scored a few more points, but ultimately they found ways to lose games. With regard to fairweather fans, he's right on. Take a look at the Caps right now. Speaking for myself, I've been a Caps fan forever, and I've always attended a couple of games per year. Now I'm meeting people that are going totally hog wild over the Capitals, and their fandom seems to have started about two years ago. oh i know. i've been crucified in threads for trying to add some objectivity to whats going on here. and now everyone's turning int heir 'fan card'. whatever. i still wear my jersey on gameday around where i live, and I still fly my flag on my window on game day when i go to stores, or to the stadium. I'm still going to renew my tickets, and go to the games, and enjoy myself. i'm as pissed as the next person about whats going on, but i think we've crossed the line ourselves iwth some of the things we're doing as fans. but i guess this'll be the end of this conversation, because it'll be flooded with 'you're part of the problem' style comments here shortly.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfather151981 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 yeah, but the cost alone to fight the redskins in court over what, 1/2 a seasons worth of homegames?you'd have to have a lot of seats, in a good GA section, to even make that worth fighting... cause you would have to go to court... cause they know how expensive it is, and they have good lawyers.... Oh I would never do it...I value my tickets too much. I have fans of other teams telling me that I should unload my tickets for as much as I can get. The funny thing is that if I did that they'd say it was just another example of Redskin fans being weak and not supporting their team when they're needed most. Last year I had to miss the Eagle game at home because a relative of mine passed away out of town. A guy I know that's an Eagle fan offered me twice the face for the seats, and I refused (I sold them to my cousin-a Skins fan-for the face value). He said that the fact that I'd not go to the game due to a relative dying is indicative of the Redskins' "weak fanbase." Geeze, if there's a better reason to skip out on a game, show it to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Why does anyone have season tickets anymore is my question? why do you care? they mean more than watching a winning team to some of us. to some of us theres 30,40,50 years of family tradition wrapped up in those tickets. and when the redskins go back to having winning seasons, people will start begging for tickets again. right now, i can't get the people who said they'd go to certaing ames to answer their phone when i call. if they start out 5-1 next season they'll be aclling me non stop begging for tickets. this area has been like this for a long time. are you just figuring out that when the redskins lose, everyone makes a big fuss, and when they win, everyone's all the sudden a 'die hard fan' again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FadeToThomas Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Why does anyone have season tickets anymore is my question? I agree. It has nothing to do with being a fair weather fan. Why take time and effort to get to a game and pay to watch a team that gets dominated by teams like the Lions and the Chiefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homercles82 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Take a look at the Caps right now. Speaking for myself, I've been a Caps fan forever, and I've always attended a couple of games per year. Now I'm meeting people that are going totally hog wild over the Capitals, and their fandom seems to have started about two years ago. It is common knowledge that when a team starts to play well and contend that their fan base grows. That is how you create a large fan base. And it seems that only longtime Caps fans have a problem with the glut of new fans over the last few years. Caps players, coaches and the owner welcome everyone with open arms. Leonis has proved that if you put a great product on the field(rink in his case) you can grow fan support. The way Leonsis is building the franchise he has a potential to turn a large number of the new fans into longtime fans because he has a young team that is amazingly good at the game. They are exciting to watch. He also encourages a lot of outreach by the players to the fans and they generally enjoy it unlike when you see Redskins players at meet and greets or signings. The idea of supposed "old school" fans harnessing any negativity to the new so called "bandwagon" fans is ignorant. It is seen on these boards too. "Old School" posters, in registration date only, want to bash newer posters (in reg date only) and probably would prefer them not even post. Of course that is how all internet forums work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Oh I would never do it...I value my tickets too much. I have fans of other teams telling me that I should unload my tickets for as much as I can get. The funny thing is that if I did that they'd say it was just another example of Redskin fans being weak and not supporting their team when they're needed most. Last year I had to miss the Eagle game at home because a relative of mine passed away out of town. A guy I know that's an Eagle fan offered me twice the face for the seats, and I refused (I sold them to my cousin-a Skins fan-for the face value). He said that the fact that I'd not go to the game due to a relative dying is indicative of the Redskins' "weak fanbase." Geeze, if there's a better reason to skip out on a game, show it to me! lol, nice to see i'm not the only one. i split my tickets this seasonw ith a coworker (i actually managed to sell both preseasong ames for full price) just to help lighten the financial burden. but i already decided i'm not selling any games next year, and i'm going to them all.... some here would say i'm part of the problem, or that i'm an idiot. whatever, i enjoy goign to games. the tailgate this board throws is awesome, and the people that i sit with at the stadium are awesome as well. i can only hope they renew next year too, because they're part of the enjoyment. some of those people are coming to my wedding... i've known them since RFK when I was 14 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfather151981 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 oh i know. i've been crucified in threads for trying to add some objectivity to whats going on here.and now everyone's turning int heir 'fan card'. whatever. i still wear my jersey on gameday around where i live, and I still fly my flag on my window on game day when i go to stores, or to the stadium. I'm still going to renew my tickets, and go to the games, and enjoy myself. i'm as pissed as the next person about whats going on, but i think we've crossed the line ourselves iwth some of the things we're doing as fans. but i guess this'll be the end of this conversation, because it'll be flooded with 'you're part of the problem' style comments here shortly.. I was discussing this with a friend in a restaurant the other night, and someone at the bar overheard the conversation. He came over and had the nerve to call me a bad fan by supporting the team. Basically he's saying that if I love the Redskins I should turn them into a sacrificial lamb so that it hurts Snyder. I'd love to hurt Snyder either image-wise or in the wallet, but I'm sorry...I'm not willing to give up my love of the Redskins in doing so. It goes against everything I believe in, and furthermore it would seem somewhat superficial to just show up at the stadium again once this storm has passed. People are free to do what they want with their money, but I'll never stop supporting the Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FadeToThomas Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 People are free to do what they want with their money, but I'll never stop supporting the Redskins. more like Dan Snyder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boss_Hogg Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 why do you care?they mean more than watching a winning team to some of us. to some of us theres 30,40,50 years of family tradition wrapped up in those tickets. This is true, our season tickets have been in the family since the early 60's. I can't give them up, it would destroy a long standing tradition in my family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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