SI's Best and Worst Owners

[Vicious]

We won a wild card, fantastic, best owner in the business.

[Art]

Foolish spending is what got him the low rating (or at least why he deserves it). CP is a good player, but its debatable if he deserves a deal that big. ARE can't be cut because of the deal he got. Arch and Lloyd really limited our team's cap situations. Then mention the draft picks we gave up for players in addition to the spending and its not as simple as "Snyder wants to spend money". Haynesworth is a good player, maybe the best DT, but is he worth a 100 mil deal (or a 42 mil deal)? And also what about the players we didn't sign? Clark and Pierce come to mind. Then there's the Arrington situation.

No owner's batting 1.000 right now, but it seems that Snyder's made a lot of foolish choices with the big spending, and so you can't just say Snyder's better than Rooney because Snyder's willing to spend more than Rooney.

The question is how wise is the spending. And Snyder's not too wise.

For every Arch and Lloyd, there's a Washington, or Moss, or Portis, or Thomas, or Griffin. ARE's deal wasn't that bad and he could be cut. There's no reason to cut him. He's still a productive player who's probably a little out of his element in a true No. 2 role. It seems Snyder has made a lot of great choices where to put the money. So great, in fact, we've rarely been limited in what we do.

It's difficult, for example, for you to suggest we can't cut ARE because of his big deal -- the same deal Arch and Lloyd signed and they were cut -- in the same offseason you recognize we just signed Haynesworth. We can do, from a cap perspective, most anything we prioritize. If ARE was a dog, he'd have been cut. He's not, thus he's here.

[ACW]

Leonsis wasn't there for NHL best. Fail :mad:

[Art]

Yes Art. You are right on.

A losing record, a poor fan gameday experience, and a home for players to come and get paid, with no accountability puts him as one of the best owners in all of sports.

Brandon Lloyd sure is glad he met him.

Only a person with no actual desire to root for Washington would suggest Lloyd is the signature signing of the Snyder era. Lloyd was one of the players the organization missed on. Bear in mind, Snyder has no role in assessing the player's ability. He's given a list and told these players are those we want and he signs them to whatever deal is appropriate. Lloyd failed. Had Lloyd caught 100 passes, we'd have gotten him for cheap. He didn't, so we remember the blunder on the part of the personnel people and coaches, as we do with Arch.

I will agree with you that Snyder needs to allow fan input into how to improve the stadium experience. I have remarked a number of times that he has not made game day fun at Fed Ex with all the pushing and interruptions. But again, Snyder owns the team. He doesn't win or lose games unless he doesn't provide his people what they tell him they need. As he does that key duty, he accomplishes what he can in his role.

[Metskins]

I love how people are using the franchise value like that's something to be proud of. The rankings are supplied by SPORTS ILLUSTRATED, not Forbes Magazine.

[VaBeachRedskin]

This is from the website referenced on that billboard. Any of this sound familiar?

1. We are all lifelong Bengals fans who would never even consider changing allegiances.

2. We would like for nothing more than to be able to shut this website down after Mike Brown turns the Bengals into a perennially winning team, but aren't planning on closing up shop anytime soon.

3. Not having a GM works for the Patriots. After 19 seasons of failed football, it does not work for the Bengals. Without a GM that has real authority over player personnel leading the Bengals front office, the team will never see sustained success.

4. One season of Bengals success or offseason of seemingly rational decision making will not deter us from calling for whole scale overhaul of the Bengals management structure. We have history and common sense on our side.

5. While we joke that Mike Brown is cheap, we acknowledge that he does spend money on talent. Our problem is where he is spending the money (the wrong players) and where he is not spending the money (a lack of a scouting department and inadequate training and medical facilities).

6. We have never and will never purport to be experts on player personnel or in-game strategy. Readers should understand that our commentary is written by a bunch of guys who are not going to the combine and do not have an innate understanding of how to properly assess talent. The problem, in our minds, is that neither do the Bengals.

7. The Bengals have the worst winning percentage among all teams in all 4 major sports. It's OK to laugh at that every now and then.

You could substitute Redskins for Bengals and Snyder for Brown and those would be almost my exact sentiments.

[Art]

I love how people are using the franchise value like that's something to be proud of. The rankings are supplied by SPORTS ILLUSTRATED, not Forbes Magazine.

Forbes rankings are more illustrative than those by Sports Illustrated. Forbes is a factual representation of the health of the franchise financially. If people didn't like Snyder and weren't supporting him you'd see it reflected in those numbers. Sports Illustrated is simply the opinion of a person making around $45,000 a year.

Next time my Simon's Delivers guy is here I'll ask him about owners and the NFL and let you know how he ranks them. It'd be equally meaningful.

[McD5]

Only a person with no actual desire to root for Washington would suggest Lloyd is the signature signing of the Snyder era. Lloyd was one of the players the organization missed on. Bear in mind, Snyder has no role in assessing the player's ability. He's given a list and told these players are those we want and he signs them to whatever deal is appropriate. Lloyd failed. Had Lloyd caught 100 passes, we'd have gotten him for cheap. He didn't, so we remember the blunder on the part of the personnel people and coaches, as we do with Arch.

I will agree with you that Snyder needs to allow fan input into how to improve the stadium experience. I have remarked a number of times that he has not made game day fun at Fed Ex with all the pushing and interruptions. But again, Snyder owns the team. He doesn't win or lose games unless he doesn't provide his people what they tell him they need. As he does that key duty, he accomplishes what he can in his role.

I am not claiming that Lloyd is the key signing of the Snyder era.

As you are already aware, there were many more. Fortunately, they have gotten much better from the early days of his tenure.

Even Portis is a good example. The star RB.

He is already guaranteed a ton whether he plays or not. Whether he goes on the radio and blasts our HC or not. He can do what he wants. There is no accountability.

Hanging Zorn out to dry after those comments is yet another reason why Snyder and the FO continue to fail. They simply do not understand how to win in the NFL.

By your reasoning, George Steinbrenner is the single best owner in sports, bar none.

Both have the highest payrolls, and neither get results. That is the sign of incompetence.

[VaBeachRedskin]

Forbes rankings are more illustrative than those by Sports Illustrated. Forbes is a factual representation of the health of the franchise financially. If people didn't like Snyder and weren't supporting him you'd see it reflected in those numbers. Sports Illustrated is simply the opinion of a person making around $45,000 a year.

Next time my Simon's Delivers guy is here I'll ask him about owners and the NFL and let you know how he ranks them. It'd be equally meaningful.

Just because Snyder is doing his best to ruin the team I grew up with doesn't mean that I am going to stop supporting them. To say that the financial numbers reflects on how good of an owner Snyder is untrue and has very little basis in football nature of the operation (which is what we all care about in the first place).

[Art]

I am not claiming that Lloyd is the key signing of the Snyder era.

As you are already aware, there were many more. Fortunately, they have gotten much better from the early days of his tenure.

Even Portis is a good example. The star RB.

He is already guaranteed a ton whether he plays or not. Whether he goes on the radio and blasts our HC or not. He can do what he wants. There is no accountability.

Hanging Zorn out to dry after those comments is yet another reason why Snyder and the FO continue to fail. They simply do not understand how to win in the NFL.

By your reasoning, George Steinbrenner is the single best owner in sports, bar none.

Both have the highest payrolls, and neither get results. That is the sign of incompetency.

Steinbrenner has won multiple World Series trophies in multiple eras of baseball. He's a highly successful owner. Winning a title every year is not a requisite need of ownership or even your staff and players. There is accountability for what Portis says or does. It merely requires someone willing to hold him accountable.

If something he said created real internal conflict or concern you'd simply bench him. He may still get paid, but, players don't like getting paid to watch someone else. Portis does say and do things I don't happen to adore, but, he's often held up and viewed as an internal leader within the organization by the players themselves. He has been asked, at times, to carry the word of others forward, and he does so. In some ways that's a very positive trait.

The earliest days of Snyder's tenure found him faced with a playoff team he inherited that had the No. 30 defense in football and the whole world saying we'd be taken seriously if we had a defense. The next season we had the No. 4 defense in football, largely based on the strength of those signings. And when that team started off great against top competition, we felt it was going to be fine. While 2000 was a failed season, it had little to do with the offseason signings, which, for the most part, helped the team out in the key area it needed help in.

Bruce Smith, who for some reason is held as a negative signing, was actually a productive starter for three seasons before starting to really ONLY play for sacks.

[gatorskin77]

I know I'm gonna get killed for this but calling Al Davis the worst owner in the NFL is retarded yeah he's like 200 years old and out of his mind but he's won 4 championships and he bought the team for next to nothing so if he sold it he would make a ridiculous profit how many other owners have 4 championships who ever came up with this list is just as crazy as he is

[Art]

Just because Snyder is doing his best to ruin the team I grew up with doesn't mean that I am going to stop supporting them. To say that the financial numbers reflects on how good of an owner Snyder is untrue and has very little basis in football nature of the operation (which is what we all care about in the first place).

If Snyder were ruining the team you grup up with it would require you to cease your support as that is the sole way to achieve change in an area you care about. Snyder's ability to generate revenue despite robust, league-leading type spending in so many key areas like money paid to staff, facilities costs and substance, medical and training, etc., is a model for football operations.

I think Snyder runs his football business poorly. The other side of the football house of marketing and Redskins.com and all that, tends to be run with far tighter strings and with far less provision to succeed.

[Stophovr6]

Owners do not have win-loss records. Coaches do.

Steinbrenner has won multiple World Series trophies in multiple eras of baseball.

How can he win trophies if he doesn't have a win-loss record?

[VaBeachRedskin]

Steinbrenner has won multiple World Series trophies in multiple eras of baseball. He's a highly successful owner. Winning a title every year is not a requisite need of ownership or even your staff and players. There is accountability for what Portis says or does. It merely requires someone willing to hold him accountable.

If something he said created real internal conflict or concern you'd simply bench him. He may still get paid, but, players don't like getting paid to watch someone else. Portis does say and do things I don't happen to adore, but, he's often held up and viewed as an internal leader within the organization by the players themselves. He has been asked, at times, to carry the word of others forward, and he does so. In some ways that's a very positive trait.

The earliest days of Snyder's tenure found him faced with a playoff team he inherited that had the No. 30 defense in football and the whole world saying we'd be taken seriously if we had a defense. The next season we had the No. 4 defense in football, largely based on the strength of those signings. And when that team started off great against top competition, we felt it was going to be fine. While 2000 was a failed season, it had little to do with the offseason signings, which, for the most part, helped the team out in the key area it needed help in.

Bruce Smith, who for some reason is held as a negative signing, was actually a productive starter for three seasons before starting to really ONLY play for sacks.

Stephon Marbury disagrees. He wanted out of New York, but was happy to sit on the bench and just collect his paychecks.

[Art]

How can he win trophies if he doesn't have a win-loss record?

And Steinbrenner still does not have a win-loss record. He does, however, own World Series Championships as the owner of the team which won them, as does every owner. Steinbrenner provide the team capable of winning it all. MCd5 suggested he never gets results. That's absurd. Snyder gets results far less frequently than Steinbrenner, but, ultimately, it's rarely because of Snyder that results are limited. For a spell there, it was BECAUSE of George that the Yankees struggled. It is currently the case that the Raiders struggle because of Al Davis.

Davis, like Jones, are unique owners who do more than own and acquire. They rate personnel and direct personnel people toward specific traits. They are far more directly responsible for success and failure of their teams than other normal owners.

[VaBeachRedskin]

If Snyder were ruining the team you grup up with it would require you to cease your support as that is the sole way to achieve change in an area you care about. Snyder's ability to generate revenue despite robust, league-leading type spending in so many key areas like money paid to staff, facilities costs and substance, medical and training, etc., is a model for football operations.

I think Snyder runs his football business poorly. The other side of the football house of marketing and Redskins.com and all that, tends to be run with far tighter strings and with far less provision to succeed.

Some people care more about something than to let one bad egg ruin their experience. I'm young enough that I will hopefully still be around when we have another owner that cares enough about the football side of the operation to put together a team that can sustain success.

[Art]

How can he win trophies if he doesn't have a win-loss record?

And Steinbrenner still does not have a win-loss record. He does, however, own World Series Championships as the owner of the team which won them, as does every owner. Steinbrenner provided the team capable of winning it all. MCd5 suggested he never gets results. That's absurd. Snyder gets results far less frequently than Steinbrenner, but, ultimately, it's rarely because of Snyder that results are limited. For a spell there, it was BECAUSE of George that the Yankees struggled. It is currently the case that the Raiders struggle because of Al Davis.

Davis, like Jones, are unique owners who do more than own and acquire. They rate personnel and direct personnel people toward specific traits. They are far more directly responsible for success and failure of their teams than other normal owners.

[Metskins]

Forbes rankings are more illustrative than those by Sports Illustrated. Forbes is a factual representation of the health of the franchise financially. If people didn't like Snyder and weren't supporting him you'd see it reflected in those numbers. Sports Illustrated is simply the opinion of a person making around $45,000 a year.

Next time my Simon's Delivers guy is here I'll ask him about owners and the NFL and let you know how he ranks them. It'd be equally meaningful.

So the people that write about sports are in the business of knowing about sports and have sources in the sports world, etc have as much credence about writing an article on the best and worst owners in sports as a guy who delivers a magazine? Is that what you're saying?

:doh:

[darklight1216]

I was wondering if Steve Biscotti would make the list. I'm glad he did.

[TheLongshot]

I don't think he's one of the best or one of the worst owners in football. It is hard to say he's one of the worst when he gives his FO and coaches most of what they ask for. That being said, there are various aspects of things outside of the team itself that he could be doing something about but hasn't for some reason, like the stadium experience. Even with more success won't make him one of the best unless he works on those aspects.

[McD5]

And Steinbrenner still does not have a win-loss record. He does, however, own World Series Championships as the owner of the team which won them, as does every owner. Steinbrenner provide the team capable of winning it all. MCd5 suggested he never gets results. That's absurd. Snyder gets results far less frequently than Steinbrenner, but, ultimately, it's rarely because of Snyder that results are limited. For a spell there, it was BECAUSE of George that the Yankees struggled. It is currently the case that the Raiders struggle because of Al Davis.

Davis, like Jones, are unique owners who do more than own and acquire. They rate personnel and direct personnel people toward specific traits. They are far more directly responsible for success and failure of their teams than other normal owners.

It is admirable of you to defend him Art, even thought most disagree. I will stop responding so you can devote any time you choose to others.

I would say one last thing, an illustration of good ownership:

Pittsburgh: Lower payroll, Much better results. They do much more, with much less.

Redskins: Much higher payroll, and little gets accomplished.

One depicts a competent organization, where accountability rules above all else. An environment of winning flows throughout the entire organization.

The other....not so much.

[TheLongshot]

So the people that write about sports are in the business of knowing about sports and have sources in the sports world, etc have as much credence about writing an article on the best and worst owners in sports as a guy who delivers a magazine? Is that what you're saying?

:doh:

Sometimes, I think it is true, particularly when the vast majority buy into an image of Snyder that doesn't much reflect the evidence that is out there.

[Art]

Some people care more about something than to let one bad egg ruin their experience. I'm young enough that I will hopefully still be around when we have another owner that cares enough about the football side of the operation to put together a team that can sustain success.

There is no evidence anywhere that Snyder does not care about the football side of the operation. He's demonstrated that repeatedly with the people he's brought in to try to make the team successful. He spends lavishly on his facilities and the costs required to run an elite organization, beyond just player cash. Snyder loves the team more dearly than most of us here. I still recall one of many stories about Snyder's mood after wins and losses and the bad loss to New England when I told his security guys to hang in there and they smiled at me and said, "It's going to be a rough few days."

Snyder cares on the level of many top owners, as well as being a fan of the organization he owns, which makes him somewhat more committed. Snyder has never been the key problem with our organization. One day he could become that.

[LoudMouth12thMan]

I was wondering if Steve Biscotti would make the list. I'm glad he did.

Right forum, wrong message board

[darklight1216]

Right forum, wrong message board

:doh: I was wondering why there wasn't more purple.