Confidence in Campbell

[Guest sith lord]

Actually, a DAMN GOOD O-LINE is the excuse. The guy doesn't get touched. It's incredible.

12 sacks says otherwise. I know that's not as many as JC, but he does get hit and he's a ROOKIE. JC's problem is because he doesn't know how to move away from the pass rush. I was at the Bills/Browns game last night and Brady Quinn avoided numerous sacks.

[Critz1407]

you cant because if he was playing well with those players, you wouldnt say they were bad. try again

Well if they are playing well then thier O-line, would atleast be blocking? either you aren't watching the game or you just don't like Campbell, either way your knowledge means nothing to me.

[Critz1407]

So now Atlanta is a force. In one year? New coach, new system rookie QB, etc etc etc.

I actually agree with you here. Well atleast with one point. ryan is a better quarterback than Campbell. His O-line is better too, but still a better Quarter back.

Then only real gripe I have with the FO right now is getting JT. Though we did so we had we could compete, we were thinking right we just made the wrong choice.

[Critz1407]

12 sacks says otherwise. I know that's not as many as JC, but he does get hit and he's a ROOKIE. JC's problem is because he doesn't know how to move away from the pass rush. I was at the Bills/Browns game last night and Brady Quinn avoided numerous sacks.

Atleast Quinn had space to run away. campbell is hit from all angles and is most times left no where to run.

[Da Truth]

I agree. When Campbell has time to throw, he finds the open receiver and he gets the ball to that receiver. Campbell has the accuracy and arm strength to get the job done. Just needs time, and that is not his fault.

Yea man, give JC a break

[Campbell4Clipboard]

if JC has a good game against seattle you won't hear a peep out of sith

Look, he may very well have a good game against Seattle because they're a terrible team that doesn't mean anything. We're not beating good teams with JC at QB because they'll take away the run and blitz him. Campbell is too slow in making reades and has a slow release therefore he gets happy feet and sacks.

[Guest sith lord]

Look, he may very well have a good game against Seattle because they're a terrible team that doesn't mean anything. We're not beating good teams with JC at QB because they'll take away the run and blitz him. Campbell is too slow in making reades and has a slow release therefore he gets happy feet and sacks.

Exactly. Let me see him have good games against the Giants, Ravens and the Eagles.

[Critz1407]

Exactly. Let me see him have good games against the Giants, Ravens and the Eagles.

I think he has already had a good game against the Eagles if my memory serves me right

[RiggosMohawk]

Look, you can come up with an excuse for ANYTHING. JC is not getting the job done. Look at it this way if I'm hired to perform a certain function and more often then not my performance is below what is expected I can come up with 10000000000 billion excuses as to why. But guess what my boss doesn't give a flying you know what and sooner or later I'll find myself out of a job.

Please clearly define what an expected performance of our quarterback is. No joke, I'm serious. Wins/Rating/TDs/Yards/Red zone scoring %... whatever it is that should be expected of JC, spell it out here. I would love to read it.

[Voice_of_Reason]

12 sacks says otherwise. I know that's not as many as JC, but he does get hit and he's a ROOKIE. JC's problem is because he doesn't know how to move away from the pass rush. I was at the Bills/Browns game last night and Brady Quinn avoided numerous sacks.

1. Sacks are not the only stat that indicate pressure. Did you watch the Dallas game? Because if you did, you would notice that not only did JC get sacked 3 times, but he was knocked down every time he threw the ball. They had guys in his face all night, and he avoided several sacks himself, but he's not freakin' houdini. Zorn talked about this at his post game presser and the presser on Monday. I keep asking the question: If Madden during the broadcast who is past his prime but unbiased and Zorn both want to blame protection, why do you want to jump on JC? Do you honestly believe that Zorn is not criticizing JC to keep him happy? If so, there was a quote from his presser where, in relation to an incomplete 3rd down pass to Thomas, he said, "I gave Jason Campbell a big minus on that one. He popped up and threw the ball low." So Zorn is completely comfortable laying blame at JC's feet, but, that quote aside, he basically just complained about protection the entire time he was talking about the passing game.

2. Let me give you some plays where JC avoided the rush and completed a pass: New Orleans: 22 yarder to Cooley deep in their own territory. New Orleans, ducked out of one guy, hit Moss for a 60+ yard TD. Detroit: the 50 yarder to Moss for a TD. Just because it hasn't happened in the last 2 games doesn't mean it NEVER happened.

3. I am not going to take anything away from Matt Ryan, he's playing brilliantly for a rookie. But overall, his protection is MUCH MUCH MUCH better than the 'Skins. Don't forget the history in Atlanta. They were a playoff team not long ago, but had their entire season ruined last year by Mike Vick and the coach leaving killed their season, but they were not a bad team before that. Again, it's easy to foget these things, but that was a talented team 2 years ago.

[JdoubleU]

JC will be fine. Teams adjusted to what the Skins were doing. Once the dinner bell sounded & Campbell too a lot of hits, he seems to be more aware of the rush. Now it's up to the coaching staff to adapt. Get the line issues resolved NOW and JC will return to the QB that looked like a world beater the 1st 8 wks.

[Voice_of_Reason]

I think he has already had a good game against the Eagles if my memory serves me right

not a great statistical game, honestly. But he didn't turn the ball over and made plays when needed, and they won. But he didn't put up 300 yards or anything. Just being fair.

[Dick Edds]

Look, you can come up with an excuse for ANYTHING. JC is not getting the job done. Look at it this way if I'm hired to perform a certain function and more often then not my performance is below what is expected I can come up with 10000000000 billion excuses as to why. But guess what my boss doesn't give a flying you know what and sooner or later I'll find myself out of a job.

and you can come up with any excuse as to why someone else would be better, who has never proven otherwise. Whether or not JC is living up to your standards of what an NFL QB should be is subjective, but regardless of the environment in which he is being asked to perform in, he currently is the best option ON THIS TEAM.

You are not a coach, you do not KNOW for certain that Colt or TC would be better. You are entitled to prefer someone who has held a clipboard for 13 years, because he had one nice run in the same offensive system he ran for 10 years. That is your right, but that in no way means that you are "correct" in your evaluation. It's pure speculation on your part.

Am I taking credit away from TC for what he did last year? Not at all. Did he do anything in pre-season to show that his success wasn't directly tied to AS's system? NO, in fact he looked slow and lost in this system in pre-season.

In response to your "job" analogy as it relates to JC's performance, if I am hired to do a job, and I am not given all the tools necessary to preform at the level that my employer expects, than they can fire me and continue to go through the same issues with each new person they bring in. Until they can get me the appropriate tools to perform the job, they can't and shouldn't expect greatness.

This is a team sport, everything works hand in hand ... and until I see JC throwing stupid INT's when he has no pressure, and until I see that he is not capable of performing at the same level as the rest of his team mates, then I might agree with you. But until then, I'm gonna stick with my belief that JC is a good QB.

Id' gladly eat crow if you are correct. Save this thread and maybe one day you can "bump" it if either TC or Colt come in and run Zorn's offense to perfection and prove to be the better QB than JC.

I will give you this though, we woudn't be having this conversation if JC was lighting it up and winning games squarely by himself. So in regards to what i wrote above, this is only my opinion. And I'm not trying to sound as if it is more accurate or relevant than yours. I just think overlooking all the other variables that go into being a good NFL QB are being overlooked a bit in regards to JC. Nothing personal.

[Voice_of_Reason]

So now Atlanta is a force. In one year? New coach, new system rookie QB, etc etc etc. but we on the heels of 2 out of three years of playoffs shoudl still look freakin sick out there? Its just excuses. Plain and simple. Excuses. In one breath we hear that we got old ass dancing with the stars Jason Taylor because we were trying to compete this year and that's why we AGAIN gave away a second round draft pick for an old aged veteran that a football genius couldn't give away quick enough. In the next breath I am told that we drafted rookie recievers and not o-line or d-line because we are building for the futture sso it is OK that they never see the damn field and none of them can learn the damn plays!!

then in the next breath I hear we took Fred Davis who also can't be "trusted" to know his plays 11 weeks into the season despite already having a pro bowl tight end in his twenties instead of Calais Campell. Then we kick jansen off the line in favor of a 7th round tackle in Heyer. Then because he gets hurt we give the job back to jansen. Now jansen sucks again. What the hell are we doing? Are we building for the future or trying to win now? It looks like we are trying to do both and as a result, we are doing NEITHER!

Do me a favor, if you're going to go off on some rambling rant like that, don't start it with a quote of mine. I said that Atlanta has a damn good O-Line. You reply with a rambling tirade that never actually disputes what I said, but talk about Taylor, Heyer, Jansen, and just about everything but what I made a comment on.

If you want to disagree, I'm all for it, no worries, be happy to discuss with you. But I refuse to get drawn into the rantings and ramblings like this.

Even Sith Lord, with whom I rarely agree, made a post disagreeing with me where he quoted a fact. He had a legitimate argument, and he and I can have a legitimate discussion on it. What you wrote is all over the map. Take some drugs, calm down, think clearly, then write. Dear God. I know it's bad, but FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE!

[Dick Edds]

And what is Matt Ryan's excuse for not sucking?

he's an anomaly. hey, you won't get any argument from me on Matt Ryan, I watched the guy in college single handled beat my team 3 years in a row. I knew he was a special player.

Why don't you tell me why "Matt Ryan" doesn't suck, since you seem to know. Do the ATL Falcons play the exact same schedule as us, do they have the exact same players, do they run the same offense, etc.

Oh yeah ... like I said ... apples and oranges.

[GC8 Bunta]

Jason Campbell is a great qb.

He needs the protection.

Even coach Zorn said he saw plays opening up but JC didnt have enough time...

Our oline protects as well as a broken condom right now.

[Critz1407]

not a great statistical game, honestly. But he didn't turn the ball over and made plays when needed, and they won. But he didn't put up 300 yards or anything. Just being fair.

Your right, He didn't have a phenonminal game. He did avoid the rush in that game though and did enough to get the W.

[Skinz4Life12]

Our oline protects as well as a broken condom right now.

:applause: great analogy

[MossFan89]

Guess alot of you on here, don't seem to know what to protect the QB mean's. Holly *****.!!

[Voice_of_Reason]

Your right, He didn't have a phenonminal game. He did avoid the rush in that game though and did enough to get the W.

Careful now, I said he didn't have a great STATISTICAL GAME. I actually think he played pretty damn well. Philly's D is very good.

[Passizle]

Be prepaired for the "because he's running a simple offense" excuse.

Wrong... he has protection and all day to make his reads. How many times has Ryan been sacked this year? 12 times.

JC? 26 times... hell... close to 12 times in just the past two games. And when JC was not getting pressured contantly... we were winning games. Go figure.

[GC8 Bunta]

:applause: great analogy

thanks. i laughed a little when i wrote it too.

[pocampo]

Ok, most of the usual suspects have chimed in on this tired subject. McD5, JoeGibbsRypienClark or whatever his name is are the two that I can think of that haven't yet. We have Campbell4Clipboard and Sith Lord. SnyderMustGo also could add a comment or two, but I haven't seen him post in a while.

Basically, it breaks down like this: there are some people who think JC can succeed given the proper situation, there are others that don't. Nobody is going to convince anybody of anything at this point until JC wins a playoff game or two, and that might not even convince everybody. There were plenty of people who wanted to run Eli out of NY until February of last year, and there were even a bunch of Colts fans who wanted to run Peyton out because "he couldn't win the big one."

There are dissenting opinions. It's what makes life fun.

Personally, not only do I think JC is the answer for the next 10 years, I REALLY HOPE it is so, because if it's not, then the 'Skins are starting over AGAIN. Sorry, Colt Brennen = not an NFL QB yet. He might be, but I don't have a lot of confidence in that, and Todd Collins is like 98 years old, so he's not the future, regardless if he could help this year or not.

So if JC is not the answer, and TC is not the answer because he's old, and CB is not the answer because he's just not ready, then who is? Somebody not on the team playing in college, so we're going to have to draft another QB to develop. And I don't want to wait. Which is why I HOPE that JC is the answer.

Alright you seem have a good idea of whats taking place here. But here is the way I see it. JC has proven he can do it when everything is just right. When the WRs our wide open. When he has good time to see the field. And sometimes he makes a play when pressure is on him sometimes. I said sometimes. So unless everything is just right. We have very little chance of getting any real yards. So here is the real thing. In football and life. Things go wrong all the time. Its what we do in those times. That shows us what we are!! This is what makes a good QB or a average one. So can JC make something out of nothing. Sometimes. But most of the time. If something breaksdown. So does he. . So unless he starts making something happen. We will have these threads over and over again. Now about Brennan. Until he plays. we have no idea. But we know what we have in Campbell. Bad or good Is what this thread is all about.

[Dick Edds]

Alright you seem have a good idea of whats taking place here. But here is the way I see it. JC has proven he can do it when everything is just right. When the WRs our wide open. When he has good time to see the field. And sometimes he makes a play when pressure is on him sometimes. I said sometimes. So unless everything is just right. We have very little chance of getting any real yards. So here is the real thing. In football and life. Things go wrong all the time. Its what we do in those times. That shows us what we are!! This is what makes a good QB or a average one. So can JC make something out of nothing. Sometimes. But most of the time. If something breaksdown. So does he. . So unless he starts making something happen. We will have these threads over and over again. Now about Brennan. Until he plays. we have no idea. But we know what we have in Campbell. Bad or good Is what this thread is all about.

fair enough, I can agree with this.

[Voice_of_Reason]

Alright you seem have a good idea of whats taking place here. But here is the way I see it. JC has proven he can do it when everything is just right. When the WRs our wide open. When he has good time to see the field. And sometimes he makes a play when pressure is on him sometimes. I said sometimes. So unless everything is just right. We have very little chance of getting any real yards. So here is the real thing. In football and life. Things go wrong all the time. Its what we do in those times. That shows us what we are!! This is what makes a good QB or a average one. So can JC make something out of nothing. Sometimes. But most of the time. If something breaksdown. So does he. . So unless he starts making something happen. We will have these threads over and over again.

Good points. I would counter with this: we have seen what a QB with ALL of the athletic tools who is still young and developing can do. The question is the following: Is this the beginning of his development or the end of it? See, the way I see it, he is LIGHT years ahead of where he was last year. So lets just say that he improves from this year to next as well. What do we have to go on saying that this is the best that he can be? In football, and in life, people improve.

Personal experience, how football related to life. I am a manager in a consulting firm. Last year, we lost a big deal that I was mostly responsible for winning. It sucked. I could have been moved sideways and the next guy given the opportunity. However, my boss had faith that 1. it wasn't all my fault, there were extenuating circumstances, and 2. I would learn from that experience and do things differently in the future. So now a year later, I've won 4 big deals, more than compensated for the 1 loss last year, and am in line for a promotion. None of which would have happened if my boss would have shunted me sideways or out last year after a pretty big disappointment. I take full responsibility for that loss, but I learned from it, and now am better for it. Nobody starts as a HOFer. (And not saying that I'm ever going to be anything approaching that.) Just saying that people have to be given the opportunity to learn on the job. Part of life.

Now about Brennan. Until he plays. we have no idea. But we know what we have in Campbell. Bad or good Is what this thread is all about.

I disagree that we know what we have in Campbell. I agree that we don't know what we have in Brennan. Here's what I've seen with my 2 eyes while going to Training Camp: his mechanics are HORRENDOUS. Just awful. Zorn said that it was going to be a 2-3 year progression for him because he could only fix one thing at a time, and there was a lot to fix.

And finally, this thread is about Campbell. And part of the reason I have confidence in Campbell is because I DON'T have confidence in the other guys. That's an opinion that can be debated and is not shared by everybody.